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Old 03-17-2007, 12:07 PM    (permalink
reznola
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I wouldn't mind seeing Charles Grant go to Tampa Bay, under certain conditions. The Bucs aren't going to trade the no. 4 pick for him, but you could ask for both their second round pics and a first next year. I wouldn't give him away, but I doubt you will see them give up the no. 4 this year, which defiently should be used on calvin johnson and their one next year.

What a dream trio of wideouts for brees to work with. Johnson one one side, Colston on the other, with devery in the slot, it would cause nightmares for defensive coaches.
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Old 03-17-2007, 12:37 PM    (permalink
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Calvin Johnson to the Saints. I think you might be dreaming ;)

Nice thought though :D
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Old 03-17-2007, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Saints Dome Patrol View Post
Not particularly interested in a 37-year-old wide receiver whose production has dropped off in the last few years... kind of reminds me of another wide out that we released a week or so ago... hmm...
There is a very big difference here. The big money in Joe Horn's contract was to start kicking in this year; I believe his cap number was over $5 million. The money was the primary reason we let Joe go, and his recent lack of production just made it that much easier.

McCardell could be had for a pretty cheap price. His production dropped off LAST YEAR, not the last few years. Look at his 05 season (his last season with Drew); he was a very solid starter.

Now, maybe I didn't clarify. I don't expect him to produce like a 25, 30, or even a 35 year old version of Keenan McCardell produced. That would be flat out silly to expect. What I do think he would bring to our receiving corps is a veteran presence with reliable hands for a cheap price tag. Something very much like Ricky Proehl was for the Carolina Panthers a few years ago. They signed him at age 36, and he went on to have three seasons of solid, reliable play as the #3 or #4 receiver.

I'm having a hard time understanding how anybody could be against this.
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Old 03-18-2007, 08:49 PM    (permalink
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This kind of got overshadowed, but the Carolina Panthers signed unrestricted free agent Terrence Melton to an undisclosed amount.

So who's with me and thinks that we need to draft a linebacker during day one come April?
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Old 03-18-2007, 08:59 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Saints Dome Patrol View Post
This kind of got overshadowed, but the Carolina Panthers signed unrestricted free agent Terrence Melton to an undisclosed amount.

So who's with me and thinks that we need to draft a linebacker during day one come April?
I think we have a lot more needs than expected. I'd rank the Needs like this.

1. Cornerback (s)
2. Defensive Tackle (run stuffing)
3. Complimentary Wide Receiver (crisp route runner)
4. Linebacker Depth
5. Tight End (groom for the future)
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Old 03-18-2007, 10:21 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Auron View Post
I think we have a lot more needs than expected. I'd rank the Needs like this.

1. Cornerback (s)
2. Defensive Tackle (run stuffing)
3. Complimentary Wide Receiver (crisp route runner)
4. Linebacker Depth
5. Tight End (groom for the future)
I don't disagree with you. I think that the lack of activity of the Saints so far during free agency has really made it make or break come the Draft.

Don't get me wrong, the Saints have a good core of players, but there are still positions that could use upgrading or depth, or even both.

I agree, the biggest need should be cornerback, followed by defensive tackle, but then I'd put linebacker a little higher than wide receiver (especially if the Saints sign one of the several wide outs they've brought in for visits), then tight end and finally, offensive guard, kicker and quarterback.

Again, that's my opinion, but I think that most would agree.

Definitely cornerback should be our main priority come April.
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Old 03-18-2007, 10:45 PM    (permalink
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I'm not too disappointed in the off-season. So far the Saints have made it a priority to retain most of current players they got to the NFC Championship game with. To ensure continuity, and avoid a lot of turn over. I think they've made upgrades at MLB, and TE. As well as add depth at Safety.

The CB situation is shaky right now, but I have full confidence that it will be addressed. Last year they made some Draft day moves to acquire 2 positions of need. A Center (Faine), and DT (Hollis). I wouldn't be surprised to see something similar during this Draft.

I actually think we still have a quite a bit of building to do. Just last year this was a team in full re-building mode coming off a 3-13 season, they've come a long way since then but there is still work to do.

Which is why I'm glad Payton & Co. have 9 Draft picks to work this year. I have full trust in them because this staff seems to know exactly what they are looking for in regards to bringing in players that can help the team. (Only missing on 2 picks last year Lay, and Hass) I think the Draft is where they'll shine once again and bring this team another step closer toward being top contenders.
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Old 03-20-2007, 01:21 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Auron View Post
I'm not too disappointed in the off-season. So far the Saints have made it a priority to retain most of current players they got to the NFC Championship game with. To ensure continuity, and avoid a lot of turn over. I think they've made upgrades at MLB, and TE. As well as add depth at Safety.

The CB situation is shaky right now, but I have full confidence that it will be addressed. Last year they made some Draft day moves to acquire 2 positions of need. A Center (Faine), and DT (Hollis). I wouldn't be surprised to see something similar during this Draft.

I actually think we still have a quite a bit of building to do. Just last year this was a team in full re-building mode coming off a 3-13 season, they've come a long way since then but there is still work to do.

Which is why I'm glad Payton & Co. have 9 Draft picks to work this year. I have full trust in them because this staff seems to know exactly what they are looking for in regards to bringing in players that can help the team. (Only missing on 2 picks last year Lay, and Hass) I think the Draft is where they'll shine once again and bring this team another step closer toward being top contenders.
*yawn*

Oh I'm sorry, the lack of news in free agency these last few days are making me sleepy.

Now, I don't disagree that the Saints have done fairly well in signing players to add depth to some key positions, but I will say that they have 1.) done a poor job keeping several of their own players and 2.) have let several other free agents leave town without any agreements.

The former doesn't bother me as much as the latter, to be completely honest. Losing players like linebackers Terrence Melton and Danny Clark and even, and it still hurts, wide receiver Joe Horn to free agency isn't as bad as missing out on several names in free agency that could have really helped us out.

That said, I still believe (or maybe I just hope) that the Saints are not done in free agency. Both defensive tackles Anthony Adams and Ian Scott are still available and there are other players that might be able to help add depth to our team.

I also agree that even after the turnaround from 3-13 to the playoffs that New Orleans is not done rebuilding. There are still several weak spots on the team, primarily on defense, and other positions that could use quality depth.

Looking back on last year's draft, it's funny to say that at that time, I thought that the Saints had a mediocre draft at best.

I remember commenting that the Saints should have traded away their first round selection to the Jets, and gotten both their first rounders and possibly a mid round pick. Instead, the Saints stayed put and got Reggie Bush, who has shown some flashes of brilliance and could be a premier all-purpose back in a few years.

I won't go through every pick at this point (since I'm about to pass out) but needless to say, I wasn't totally big on the Saints' draft last season. There wasn't one pick I was really excited about, but boy, now it looks like the Saints came out better than expected (Marques Colston, anyone?) with not only their picks, but also trading down and picking up two big name free agents, and as it is, a few of their picks still have tremendous upside.

Hopefully, the Saints will continue to address some needs in free agency and then come April, be able to really help out our team with some solid selections in the Draft.
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Old 03-20-2007, 10:47 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Now, I don't disagree that the Saints have done fairly well in signing players to add depth to some key positions, but I will say that they have 1.) done a poor job keeping several of their own players and 2.) have let several other free agents leave town without any agreements.
I don't really think this was a strong Free Agent class. Other than Clements which high impact Free agent do you think we really missed out on? Having someone like Hood would've been very nice but he was very unproven only being a Nickelback in his career. Other than that I saw a lot of teams throwing big time money around for average players.


Quote:
The former doesn't bother me as much as the latter, to be completely honest. Losing players like linebackers Terrence Melton and Danny Clark and even, and it still hurts, wide receiver Joe Horn to free agency isn't as bad as missing out on several names in free agency that could have really helped us out.
I don't think we suffered any big losses so far. The only starters from last season we lost were Joe, and Conwell.. and neither of them played during our stretch run where we got to the NFC Championship. Melton was a good special teamer, but he was only a backup. Clark had potential but if the staff would've saw something in him they would've tried to keep him. I think if those are our only losses so far then we are fortunate, so far pretty much every starter from the NFC Championship is still on the roster. (with the exception of Bellamy)

Quote:
That said, I still believe (or maybe I just hope) that the Saints are not done in free agency. Both defensive tackles Anthony Adams and Ian Scott are still available and there are other players that might be able to help add depth to our team.
I agree with you on that point, there's still quite a while before the Draft and there are a few guys we can bring in specifically at DT, and WR.


Quote:
I won't go through every pick at this point (since I'm about to pass out) but needless to say, I wasn't totally big on the Saints' draft last season. There wasn't one pick I was really excited about, but boy, now it looks like the Saints came out better than expected (Marques Colston, anyone?) with not only their picks, but also trading down and picking up two big name free agents, and as it is, a few of their picks still have tremendous upside.

Hopefully, the Saints will continue to address some needs in free agency and then come April, be able to really help out our team with some solid selections in the Draft.
Yup I remember a lot of people myself included had doubts about the Saints Draft last year. A lot of people complained about reaching for Roman Harper in the 2nd round, it turns out he won the starting job at SS and played well before getting hurt. People scratched their heads in the 4th round when we passed up one of the highest rated Guards Max Jean-Gilles to take the little known Jahri Evans from Bloomsburg, and then again when we took a WR from Hofstra in the 7th round..

That is why I trust in the player evaluations, and personnel moves this Staff makes. So far they really seem to know what they're doing. I think Payton is a guy who likes to build from the Draft, like a lot of elite teams do.. (Ravens, Eagles, Chargers.)


*whew* I need a break from typing. :D
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Old 03-20-2007, 04:11 PM    (permalink
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As per NFL.com's Adam Schefter:

NFL News

Wide receiver Brandon Stokely signed an one-year agreement with...the Denver Broncos.

Just another hit and miss, eh Auron?
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Old 03-20-2007, 04:23 PM    (permalink
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Wide receiver Brandon Stokely signed an one-year agreement with...the Denver Broncos.

Just another hit and miss, eh Auron?
Eh no biggie, would've been a nice situational target / 3rd WR.

However he is 30 years old, and coming off a torn Achilles tendon injury. There are still other options available when it comes to veteran WRs.
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Old 03-20-2007, 05:59 PM    (permalink
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Some more signings of note:

Linebacker Shawn Barber was signed to a three year deal with the Houston Texans, worth about five million dollars.
story link: Free agent LB signs with Texans

*and*

The St. Louis Rams signed linebacker Chris Draft and cornerback Mike Rumph.
story link: Rams agree with two free agents
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Old 03-20-2007, 07:32 PM    (permalink
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There is a very big difference here. The big money in Joe Horn's contract was to start kicking in this year; I believe his cap number was over $5 million. The money was the primary reason we let Joe go, and his recent lack of production just made it that much easier.

McCardell could be had for a pretty cheap price. His production dropped off LAST YEAR, not the last few years. Look at his 05 season (his last season with Drew); he was a very solid starter.

Now, maybe I didn't clarify. I don't expect him to produce like a 25, 30, or even a 35 year old version of Keenan McCardell produced. That would be flat out silly to expect. What I do think he would bring to our receiving corps is a veteran presence with reliable hands for a cheap price tag. Something very much like Ricky Proehl was for the Carolina Panthers a few years ago. They signed him at age 36, and he went on to have three seasons of solid, reliable play as the #3 or #4 receiver.

I'm having a hard time understanding how anybody could be against this.
Maybe because, well, the fact that we need a true second receiver, since I don't think that either Terrence Copper or Devery Henderson could step in full-time, and that Keenan McCardell is an aging player. While I don't disagree that he could (key word: could) provide depth, I really don't know if I like him in our system.

If we sign McCardell, then what? Who's our number two receiver? Copper? Henderson? Like I said before, and I'll say it again, neither one of them is a true number two and we need one. I'd rather look to the Draft and select someone to be our second receiver and then that way we have Copper and Henderson as our slot and fourth receivers.
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Old 03-20-2007, 07:40 PM    (permalink
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Just to update, Stokely's a member of the Broncos now.

Broncos, receiver Stokely agree on one-year deal
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Old 03-20-2007, 10:30 PM    (permalink
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New news from ESPN, after the Redskins traded safety Adam Archuleta to the Chicago Bears for a sixth round selection, the Redskins turned around and signed free agent safety Omar Stoutmire to a one-year deal.

Comments?
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Old 03-20-2007, 11:11 PM    (permalink
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New news from ESPN, after the Redskins traded safety Adam Archuleta to the Chicago Bears for a sixth round selection, the Redskins turned around and signed free agent safety Omar Stoutmire to a one-year deal.

Comments?
He had his moments last season, but was generally inconsistent, and took some penalties. I think he'll be a fine backup / Special teamer for Washington.


Also Deon Grant, FA safety that signed with Seattle was on Sirius radio earlier today.. he said the Saints, and Giants were willing to match the offer but he chose Seattle because of the Superbowl rings members of the coaching staff had, and he wanted to go to a new area in the Northwest..
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Old 03-21-2007, 02:04 AM    (permalink
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We keep losing out on free agents. I wonder why we're sitting on our hands and not doing anything other than what we have already done.
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Old 03-21-2007, 08:09 AM    (permalink
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Maybe because, well, the fact that we need a true second receiver, since I don't think that either Terrence Copper or Devery Henderson could step in full-time, and that Keenan McCardell is an aging player. While I don't disagree that he could (key word: could) provide depth, I really don't know if I like him in our system.

If we sign McCardell, then what? Who's our number two receiver? Copper? Henderson? Like I said before, and I'll say it again, neither one of them is a true number two and we need one. I'd rather look to the Draft and select someone to be our second receiver and then that way we have Copper and Henderson as our slot and fourth receivers.
Are you serious? So, you're telling me that if we bring McCardell in, that we can't sign or draft anyone else at WR? Wow, that makes, you know, so much sense!

One of the main reasons I'm pulling for McCardell to come to the Saints is to add some veteran insight and leadership to our receiving corps. Our WR's are VERY young. You, on the other hand, want to add a #2 receiver through the draft? I have so many problems with this.

- In what round do you suggest we take this #2 WR? Our biggest needs are still on defense. If we don't go defense in at least the first two rounds, I will be pissed. So, do you want a rookie 3rd or 4th round WR to step in and start? Will he really be better than our other options? I doubt it.
- Not every rookie is going to be a Marques Colston. Most struggle in their rookie year.
- I would MUCH rather start Henderson or Copper for a year. Actually, I'm really hoping Henderson gets the chance. As a former 2nd round pick entering his 4th year in the league, I would like to see what he's got as a starter.
- Did I mention how young our guys would be? 23 year old Colston, 24 year old Henderson, 25 year old Copper... not to mention the rookie you want to draft... there isn't much experience between our guys. If only we had a veteran guy who could tutor all these young guys, all the while still being able to produce in a somewhat limited role. Hmm...
- WR is NOT an IMMINENT need. We can get by next year with what we have, which is why we should just add some depth through free agency, and maybe another WR on the late second day of the draft, and focus all of our early picks on defense.

Colston / Henderson / Copper / McCardell / Jamal Jones / late Day 2 draft pick works just fine.
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Old 03-21-2007, 10:59 AM    (permalink
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They were saying on the sportstalk with bobby hebert on 870 yesterday that the Dolphins are looking to make a contract offer to Terrence Copper that it will be hard for the Saints to match.
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Old 03-21-2007, 11:04 AM    (permalink
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I wonder why the Saints haven't looked at Hartwell the ILB from Atlanta. He was a beast when filling in for Ray Lewis with the Ravens and played well for the Falcons when he wasn't injured.

I really don't see the Saints doing much more in FA this year. The class was overall weak, because a lot of teams are holding on to their guys this year since they had all the extra cap room, and also by playing your hand tight this year you set yourself up pretty well for next year when most teams will be right up against the cap like they are in most years. The Saints also have 9 picks in the draft with 6 in the first four rounds. That is a good bit of picks in what is looking like a deep draft, and the Saints have shown they aren't afraid to trade for someone and move down a few spots and pick up a guy in the last year of his contract to see what they can get out of him in his contract year.
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Old 03-21-2007, 11:40 AM    (permalink
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They were saying on the sportstalk with bobby hebert on 870 yesterday that the Dolphins are looking to make a contract offer to Terrence Copper that it will be hard for the Saints to match.
And we'd get no compensation.

Ugh.
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Old 03-21-2007, 11:54 AM    (permalink
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There really isn't too much more we need to do in free agency. I'd really only like to see us make 2 more moves:

1. Bring in a seasoned veteran at WR (Keenan McCardell would be perfect IMO; Bobby Engram would also work)

2. Bring in a younger vet DT to add to our rotation (someone like Ian Scott, Anthony Adams, or Kindal Moorehead would be nice)

I wouldn't mind us bringing in some depth at CB, but with Fred Thomas returning to the team and our being poised to draft a corner Day 1, I don't think it will happen.
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Old 03-21-2007, 03:49 PM    (permalink
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We keep losing out on free agents. I wonder why we're sitting on our hands and not doing anything other than what we have already done.
To be honest, I'm gone we haven't done too much. Eric Johnson, Brian Simmons, & KK should be solid additions and on the flipside we aren't selling the farm to sign guys like you see a lot of teams doing this offseason. We can build through the draft for the most part and probably even make some smart draft day trades.
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Old 03-21-2007, 08:12 PM    (permalink
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Maybe because, well, the fact that we need a true second receiver, since I don't think that either Terrence Copper or Devery Henderson could step in full-time, and that Keenan McCardell is an aging player. While I don't disagree that he could (key word: could) provide depth, I really don't know if I like him in our system.

If we sign McCardell, then what? Who's our number two receiver? Copper? Henderson? Like I said before, and I'll say it again, neither one of them is a true number two and we need one. I'd rather look to the Draft and select someone to be our second receiver and then that way we have Copper and Henderson as our slot and fourth receivers.
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Are you serious? So, you're telling me that if we bring McCardell in, that we can't sign or draft anyone else at WR? Wow, that makes, you know, so much sense!

One of the main reasons I'm pulling for McCardell to come to the Saints is to add some veteran insight and leadership to our receiving corps. Our WR's are VERY young. You, on the other hand, want to add a #2 receiver through the draft? I have so many problems with this.

- In what round do you suggest we take this #2 WR? Our biggest needs are still on defense. If we don't go defense in at least the first two rounds, I will be pissed. So, do you want a rookie 3rd or 4th round WR to step in and start? Will he really be better than our other options? I doubt it.
- Not every rookie is going to be a Marques Colston. Most struggle in their rookie year.
- I would MUCH rather start Henderson or Copper for a year. Actually, I'm really hoping Henderson gets the chance. As a former 2nd round pick entering his 4th year in the league, I would like to see what he's got as a starter.
- Did I mention how young our guys would be? 23 year old Colston, 24 year old Henderson, 25 year old Copper... not to mention the rookie you want to draft... there isn't much experience between our guys. If only we had a veteran guy who could tutor all these young guys, all the while still being able to produce in a somewhat limited role. Hmm...
- WR is NOT an IMMINENT need. We can get by next year with what we have, which is why we should just add some depth through free agency, and maybe another WR on the late second day of the draft, and focus all of our early picks on defense.

Colston / Henderson / Copper / McCardell / Jamal Jones / late Day 2 draft pick works just fine.
TPFKA#1SaintsFan, first and foremost, I would like to ask you to please refrain from insulting other posters, even if you disagree with them. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions on this matter.

Now, please, show me where I mentioned that if we were to sign a free agent wide receiver that we would then be unable to select a wide receiver in the Draft.

While I don't disagree that our wide receiver corps is very young, I am very wary of signing an almost 40-year-old receiver to a contract. McCardell may have been an excellent player earlier in his career, but as it is, the man is 37-years-old and his production has declined. The idea of bringing a player in for just leadership purposes is moot. We need players that can come in and be leaders, yes, but not who will just sit on the bench and provide that leadership from the sidelines. If we wanted that, we should have kept Joe Horn. Or rather, sign someone like Jerry Rice. I'm sure that he could provide adequate leadership qualities. Or how about someone like Lynn Swann? He is a former Super Bowl MVP, and I definitely know that he could provide some veteran leadership for this young team.

Give me a break. I merely stated that I was not a fan of Keenan McCardell as a member of the Saints and you have made me out to sound like I'm against any free agent acquistions. Please. I thought that I made my point perfectly clear. I'll say it again, so perhaps everyone can understand.

I am not against the Saints acquiring a free agent wide receiver during free agency.

That being said, I would much rather the Saints sign a younger, but still proven veteran receiver and then draft someone who can learn from this veteran and then possibly, step into the role as the number two or three receiver.
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Old 03-21-2007, 08:32 PM    (permalink
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I know some guys have been pointing to Keenan McCardell or Bobby Engram to come to the Saints. While these guys are decent options, they do present some problems. Like SaintsDomePatrol pointed out, McCardell is 37 years old and while he can still contribute, he is not the type of receiver that he was a few years ago and I'm uncertain as to what all he could provide for our team other than leadership.
Bobby Engram has been productive but has sat out some games over the past couple of seasons due to some serious injury concerns. He's a veteran, and that would always be good, but how good is a veteran in providing leadership to a young team if he's not on the field because he's injured? That's the same situation that we were in with Joe Horn.

I think the receiver we need to look to that is still productive despite his age, and who has the experience and leadership we are looking for is Eric Moulds. Moulds has comprable stats to Joe Horn, along with similar build and speed. He has been in the league for 11 years, the same as Horn, yet does not have the injury concerns. I think he is the receiver that we should be looking at and not McCardell and Engram.
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