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Old 12-03-2008, 07:09 PM    (permalink
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http://pa.courts.state.mn.us/CaseDet...eID=1612309023

No real information, but just kinda interesting to see.
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Old 12-05-2008, 05:56 PM    (permalink
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So, I just had a long butt convo with my boss, who was a judge at Hennepin County for 20+ yrs, and is actually still good friends with the judge who issued the restraining order yesterday against the NFL and found out some interesting things.

-the restraining order is issued on 2 merits in civil court; 1) is there irreprable (don't feel like looking it up on spelling) harm to the plantiff at this time and 2) what is the balance of harm between the 2 parties for both the issuing of it vs. not issuing it. Because the NFL does not become harmed from simply delaying the possible suspension, but because there is irreprable harm created to the team and the two players by the imposing of the suspension, the restraining order can be issued.

Now, the order itself has no effect on whether or not the suspensions actually occur. It simply means that the harm that would come to the players and the team outweighs any harm that would occur to the NFL by not carrying out the suspension at this time. It is a civil restraining order, and has no similarities at all to a criminal one, obviously. And, it ain't going away any time soon either.

-They filed in in district court because it is much faster to do it locally then to file right away at the federal level. She was telling me that she herself would get restraining orders and civil injunctions on a daily basis for legal battles that clearly needed to be in federal court, but they were issued locally first so the harmful act could be delayed right away, whereas if you went to federal court, you may have to wait weeks before you could even get the injunction to stop the act that you are filing against.

-It will go to federal court, but it is open as to which federal court it will go to because of shared jurisdictions. Also, a federal judge is going to be less likely to rule in the players' favor than a local judge as a local judge has to deal with re-election, and it wouldn't always be a good thing to rule against your local players (unless the locals actually want the players to be punished). A federal judge is on there for life and doesn't have to worry about issues such as local opinions.

-Last, they actually have a very solid legal argument. Basically, they simply need to show that their example is not the typical example of what the league's policy was aimed towards (knowingly taking an illegal substance and knowing of the consequences) and that they are not as fully culpable as what the policy envisioned one would be. Because of that, it easily could be sent from the federal court to arbitration hearings, where a judge could help to mediate the sides, or, the federal judge could either shoot down the punsihment and tell the NFL to change the punishment, or the judge could say that punishment "x" is more appropriate and say that the NFL should implement "x" instead.

Either way, it is going to an an interesting legal battle and it is not going to be done anytime soon. Federal court is heavilly backed up with criminal cases because of a rule they have regarding speedy trials that are criminal, so their civil cases end up getting back logged. So, this easily, after being transferred to federal court, likely will not be solved until after the playoffs. No joke. That would mean even if they get suspended, the legal minds here are seeing as it wouldn't be until next season.
Some interesting stuff in there.
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Old 12-05-2008, 06:35 PM    (permalink
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I don't get how the government has anything to do with this. Why do they get to step in here?
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Old 12-05-2008, 06:39 PM    (permalink
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I don't get how the government has anything to do with this. Why do they get to step in here?
They didn't "step in". The union filed a suit in federal court
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Old 12-05-2008, 06:42 PM    (permalink
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They didn't "step in". The union filed a suit in federal court
I guess I worded that poorly. What I meant was why would they be able to change the NFL's ruling? It is a league rule so the league should be able to decide what constitutes breaking it and they determine the punishment, not the government.
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Old 12-05-2008, 06:45 PM    (permalink
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I don't know why the Vikings are delaying the suspensions (other than the thought that they will win) Those two are going to be alot more important in the Playoffs then games against the Lions, Cards and Atlanta.
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 12-05-2008, 07:11 PM    (permalink
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I don't know why the Vikings are delaying the suspensions (other than the thought that they will win) Those two are going to be alot more important in the Playoffs then games against the Lions, Cards and Atlanta.
they might not make it into the playoffs without those 2
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Old 12-05-2008, 07:14 PM    (permalink
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I don't know why the Vikings are delaying the suspensions (other than the thought that they will win) Those two are going to be alot more important in the Playoffs then games against the Lions, Cards and Atlanta.
without those 2 they win 1 of the 3 games
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Old 12-05-2008, 07:57 PM    (permalink
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I guess I worded that poorly. What I meant was why would they be able to change the NFL's ruling? It is a league rule so the league should be able to decide what constitutes breaking it and they determine the punishment, not the government.
I think its good that the players can get an independent person to decide if the suspension has merits or not. Employees in other jobs can sue if they feel the grounds for a suspension/firing were wrong. The NFL is no different.

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I don't know why the Vikings are delaying the suspensions (other than the thought that they will win) Those two are going to be alot more important in the Playoffs then games against the Lions, Cards and Atlanta.
Its the players decision. It might not be as good for the teams schedule, but they lose 4 games worth of pay. They also feel the suspension is wrong and would want to fight it for the principle of it.
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Old 12-05-2008, 08:12 PM    (permalink
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without those 2 they win 1 of the 3 games
Even with both Williams they won't win more than 1 of those 3. I can't see them beating two of the Giants, Falcons, and Cardinals with or without DTs. Without them I would expect them to lose all 3.
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Old 12-05-2008, 08:26 PM    (permalink
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Even with both Williams they won't win more than 1 of those 3. I can't see them beating two of the Giants, Falcons, and Cardinals with or without DTs. Without them I would expect them to lose all 3.
They play the Giants in week 17 and I doubt the Giants will play their staters the whole game. I know they will have the bye but they can't risk injury in a game that means nothing.
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Old 12-06-2008, 04:45 AM    (permalink
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doubt theyll do it. Last year it was a big spark for them not sitting (voluntarily or not). I dont think they want to jepordize their momentum
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Old 12-08-2008, 03:30 PM    (permalink
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without those 2 they win 1 of the 3 games
True but is it going to take more than a week to get a final verdict?
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oh please. as if canadians even know what beer is.
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Old 12-08-2008, 07:44 PM    (permalink
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Now that the Packers are all but finished anyway I hope they hold off until next season.
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Old 12-11-2008, 04:19 PM    (permalink
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The Breaking News on ESPN News is US District Court Judge rules in favor of 5 players suspended for violating NFL Policy on steriods and related Substances.

Ill look for a link but its at the bottom on the ESPN news Channel.

Edit: http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/...fter-playoffs/

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Temporary restraining order will remain

Posted: December 11th, 2008 | Adam Schefter | Tags: Minnesota Vikings, New Orleans Saints

Good news for the Saints and the Vikings, and bad news for their opponents.

The federal judge who blocked five NFL suspensions last week just said the temporary restraining order will remain in full effect until a full hearing, a league source said Thursday. That means the five Vikings and Saints players who tested positive for a banned diuretic are good to play for rest of the season and the playoffs.
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Old 12-11-2008, 04:29 PM    (permalink
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bullcrap!!!
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Old 12-11-2008, 05:04 PM    (permalink
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There goes the Vikings' top run defense
loli

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holy crap! christmas came early!
loli

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And the people rejoiced
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This news doesn't really surprise me.
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Old 12-11-2008, 05:05 PM    (permalink
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still think the vikings will go 1-2 at best
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Old 12-11-2008, 05:34 PM    (permalink
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arse - damn legal system that pays my salary...
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Old 12-11-2008, 06:57 PM    (permalink
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still think the vikings will go 1-2 at best
Agreed. Without them I doubt they'd win one. With them they have a chance to win one.
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Old 12-11-2008, 06:59 PM    (permalink
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so i hope we win out!
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Old 12-11-2008, 07:02 PM    (permalink
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I guarantee you the Vikings win one of these games. No chance at all we lose out.
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Old 12-12-2008, 02:25 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by *** Ork Wang View Post
still think the vikings will go 1-2 at best
Nah. I can honestly see them going 3-0 so that would be the best case scenario. Is it probable? Hell no. I don't think it will happen either. But they will have a decent shot at winning every game. At this point I am not even going to speculate at how many games they win but I think there is a much better chance they win all three than they lose them.

With Arizona they just need to put Warner on his ass every chance they have and play solid offence (which they rarely ever do) and I can see them winning. They need to give the ball to AD a lot and just let him wear down Zona's defence. That goes for every game though so I won't mention it again.

I think the Atlanta game will be the easiest of th three. That doesn't mean it will be an easy game, I just think their best shot at winning will be there. Pressure Ryan, force him to make rookie mistakes (which is going to be tough). The team has to be at their run stopping best because if they can stop the run I think they have a great shot at winning.

As for the Giants they just need to play like they did last year against them. If they aren't playing that well hopefully some starters will be resting at least by halftime. I think they will have somewhat of a mental edge knowing they beat pretty much the same team last year handidly (albeit the team had not come inot its own yet).

So really to say at best they go 1-2 is ******* ********. I am not saying you are the only one either Renji. If they get their **** together and use the advantages they have against each team properly I think they stand a great chance in each game. Those three games should be fun to watch.
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Old 12-12-2008, 02:28 AM    (permalink
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Also, the Giants might have HFA and all their **** clinched, so there is a possibility the Giants could be resting their starters in week 17.
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Old 12-13-2008, 12:01 PM    (permalink
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Also, the Giants might have HFA and all their **** clinched, so there is a possibility the Giants could be resting their starters in week 17.
The Giants don't strike me as a team that would do that.
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