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Old 03-04-2007, 10:40 AM    (permalink
derza222
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Originally Posted by 'cuse-213 View Post
Sunday, March 04, 2007
DAVE HUTCHINSON
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Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum has said he'll be patient in free agency. The team is currently around $15 million under the salary cap. There are rumors the Jets may look to trade up in the draft to select a top-tier running back but that seems unlikely because the price would be steep and Tannenbaum insists he wants to build through the draft.


^thats exactly what ive been saying, but i guess its clear i have no idea what im talking about right?

It's tough to trust the Ledger all the time, they do have some idea of what they're talking about sometimes but they're completely off at others. I read that this morning but just because the Star-Ledger says it I wouldn't exactly believe that it's a guarantee that the Jets don't trade up. Plus, if the Jets feel that Vilma is not a good fit for the 3-4 defense, the price is not actually that steep. It's a player who is not a good fit in your scheme, a first rounder, and a second rounder, for the number two pick. And if the Jets do make this trade, they obviously don't believe that Vilma is a good fit in their scheme and feel that his potential to improve is not that high.
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Old 03-04-2007, 12:11 PM    (permalink
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seems like a perfect fit, AD has injury concerns so i dont see him getting bulk of the load, and washington played great and is a different style runner then AD so i can see them splittingg carries
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Old 03-04-2007, 12:21 PM    (permalink
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It's tough to trust the Ledger all the time, they do have some idea of what they're talking about sometimes but they're completely off at others. I read that this morning but just because the Star-Ledger says it I wouldn't exactly believe that it's a guarantee that the Jets don't trade up. Plus, if the Jets feel that Vilma is not a good fit for the 3-4 defense, the price is not actually that steep. It's a player who is not a good fit in your scheme, a first rounder, and a second rounder, for the number two pick. And if the Jets do make this trade, they obviously don't believe that Vilma is a good fit in their scheme and feel that his potential to improve is not that high.
right, but i was stated earlier that i have no idea what im talking about. just shedding some light.
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Old 03-04-2007, 12:44 PM    (permalink
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Why don't they just move up to grab Lynch? It would cost waaaay less than AD and you're still getting a massive improvement at RB.
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Old 03-04-2007, 12:50 PM    (permalink
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right, but i was stated earlier that i have no idea what im talking about. just shedding some light.
No, I read your posts and they do make sense, a trade down would make more sense than a trade up for us because we are a rebuilding team with a below average talent level and we have a ton of needs. That said trading Vilma in a trade up is not that much really if we don't think he's a good fit for the scheme. But you were pretty much on point with most of the stuff you said, all I was saying was that you have to take that newspaper article for what its worth.

Anybody else think the Jets could actually be trading up for Johnson first with Peterson as more of a backup plan? The more and more I think of it, the more I'm a little skeptical about a trade up for AD.
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:13 PM    (permalink
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No, I read your posts and they do make sense, a trade down would make more sense than a trade up for us because we are a rebuilding team with a below average talent level and we have a ton of needs. That said trading Vilma in a trade up is not that much really if we don't think he's a good fit for the scheme. But you were pretty much on point with most of the stuff you said, all I was saying was that you have to take that newspaper article for what its worth.

Anybody else think the Jets could actually be trading up for Johnson first with Peterson as more of a backup plan? The more and more I think of it, the more I'm a little skeptical about a trade up for AD.
Calvin would be perfect for Pennington's game. A big target like him over the middle is an easy hit for Pennington.

But then when I think about it, Calvin is perferct for every QB.
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:33 PM    (permalink
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This trade is just not going to happen.
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:35 PM    (permalink
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This trade is just not going to happen.
why dont post if your gonna be an pessimist. its PERFECT for both teams like its been said many times in this thread...go away
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:40 PM    (permalink
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I actually think NYJ should make this deal. The Jets got Thomas, Kassell, Shlegal, Barton, Hobson, besides Vilma at LB. The Jets would probably want to go out & get a guy like Porter before they make a deal like this. Vilma is a great player, but I think the NYJ could handle his loss. Besides, Mangini is a Mangenius. He will have the D in order. Peterson + Washington would be a dangerous 1-2 combo. If NYJ decided to go CJ, that would give Coles a legit compliment to keep double teams off of him. CJ would help Cotchery & Baker too. I think NYJ should make this deal.
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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I actually think NYJ should make this deal. The Jets got Thomas, Kassell, Shlegal, Barton, Hobson, besides Vilma at LB. The Jets would probably want to go out & get a guy like Porter before they make a deal like this. Vilma is a great player, but I think the NYJ could handle his loss. Besides, Mangini is a Mangenius. He will have the D in order. Peterson + Washington would be a dangerous 1-2 combo. If NYJ decided to go CJ, that would give Coles a legit compliment to keep double teams off of him. CJ would help Cotchery & Baker too. I think NYJ should make this deal.
Cotchery is already a legitimate compliment. The only reason we should get a WR early is if we feel Coles really will retire soon.
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:46 PM    (permalink
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Cotchery is already a legitimate compliment. The only reason we should get a WR early is if we feel Coles really will retire soon.
Why would Coles retire when he just had a really good season, and doesn't look like he's lost his speed? CJ has size & speed, many teams will want to double team him leaving Cotchery & Coles in single coverage.
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Old 03-04-2007, 01:56 PM    (permalink
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Why would Coles retire when he just had a really good season, and doesn't look like he's lost his speed? CJ has size & speed, many teams will want to double team him leaving Cotchery & Coles in single coverage.
He took a real beating, and he doesn't know if his body can hold up.
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:15 PM    (permalink
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why dont post if your gonna be an pessimist. its PERFECT for both teams like its been said many times in this thread...go away
Why do I post? Because these rumours are a dime a dozen and almost never pan out. Multi player trades are a rarity in the NFL and you have to consider salary cap space.

And it would be stupid for the Lions to trade down 23 spots just so they can get Jonathan Vilma, a very nice player, but no Ray Lewis or LT Sr.
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:26 PM    (permalink
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I don't really think this trade will happen either, oddly enough not because of the Jets but the Lions. I think they will simply not be able to pull the trigger on a move from #2 all the way down to #25.
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:40 PM    (permalink
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Wow. The last two posts have said that this would be a bad trade for the Lions.

I ask the posters... HOW!? Millen and Marinelli want a stud, "vetran" MLB for the defense, and Vilma is an incredible player. To get a player NEAR his level in the draft (or entire offseason), they'd have to take Willis in round 1.

So, the Lions could find a way to draft Willis in round 1, an unproven player but great prospect, then go about the rest of the draft as planned (with 1 second round pick [2 if they trade down]), OR they can make this trade, get their MLB of the future (a proven leader and BEAST), still have a 1st round pick and have TWO second round picks.

Believe me... this trade is perfect for the Lions. The only reason as to why this trade should NOT be had is if the Jets think Vilma can eventually work in their defense.
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:42 PM    (permalink
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I don't really think this trade will happen either, oddly enough not because of the Jets but the Lions. I think they will simply not be able to pull the trigger on a move from #2 all the way down to #25.
that wont be the reason, theyll have no qualms with moving back to #25, they solve a HUGE need with an elite MLB and this is a very deep DE class, theyd also pick up another 2nd rounder so that would cancel out the reasons for not wanting to move down.

There really is no reason for either team to not pursue this deal.
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:43 PM    (permalink
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Why do I post? Because these rumours are a dime a dozen and almost never pan out. Multi player trades are a rarity in the NFL and you have to consider salary cap space.

And it would be stupid for the Lions to trade down 23 spots just so they can get Jonathan Vilma, a very nice player, but no Ray Lewis or LT Sr.
Vilma is the closest thing to Ray Lewis, and moving down 23 spots wont matter all to much b/c theyll still be taking a DE and, once again, this is a very deep DE class
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:50 PM    (permalink
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If the Lions accepted the deal, they would have the oppurtunity to draft a young CB to help their D even more. If the trade were to happen, the Lions would have added the DE they were looking for, the MLB they needed, and the young CB they've been looking for (and we haven't even entered the 2nd round yet). I think Millen should do it. Vilma & Sims would be sick. They might even go Joe Staley if he's available & then CB in early 2nd. This trade would open up a lot of options that weren't there before.
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:54 PM    (permalink
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(to smitty and the other Lions guys)

Yeah, but you guys are forgetting the way the Lions have relied on the PR boost of a big-name pick to ease the fanbase's annual anger and disgust. Also I think Millen is a believer in solving problems with impact draft picks. Now, Marinelli is more of an overall-program guy, as shown by last year's pick of Sims instead of Leinart. Maybe, if the franchise is really going to operate more in that patient way, a move like this could be made, but I still think that for this year, they want to stay in the top 10 and won't move down to #25 unless they were getting the steal of all time.
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Old 03-04-2007, 02:59 PM    (permalink
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If the Lions accepted the deal, they would have the oppurtunity to draft a young CB to help their D even more. If the trade were to happen, the Lions would have added the DE they were looking for, the MLB they needed, and the young CB they've been looking for (and we haven't even entered the 2nd round yet). I think Millen should do it. Vilma & Sims would be sick. They might even go Joe Staley if he's available & then CB in early 2nd. This trade would open up a lot of options that weren't there before.
I think the Lions are still looking for a stud DE, but that player can be found with one first and two second round picks. I hope that DE, CB and S are the focuses of the first two rounds, but, if Stanton falls to round 2, they'll take him there.
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Old 03-04-2007, 03:01 PM    (permalink
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(to smitty and the other Lions guys)

Yeah, but you guys are forgetting the way the Lions have relied on the PR boost of a big-name pick to ease the fanbase's annual anger and disgust. Also I think Millen is a believer in solving problems with impact draft picks. Now, Marinelli is more of an overall-program guy, as shown by last year's pick of Sims instead of Leinart. Maybe, if the franchise is really going to operate more in that patient way, a move like this could be made, but I still think that for this year, they want to stay in the top 10 and won't move down to #25 unless they were getting the steal of all time.
Getting Vilma for the defense and STILL having a 1st round pick (and two 2nd round picks) may be the steal of all time.

The trade would be priceless for the Lions, and would give the Jets whichever stud they'd like... as Peterson and CJ will be dominant.
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Old 03-04-2007, 03:15 PM    (permalink
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Getting Vilma for the defense and STILL having a 1st round pick (and two 2nd round picks) may be the steal of all time.

The trade would be priceless for the Lions, and would give the Jets whichever stud they'd like... as Peterson and CJ will be dominant.
Or 3 2nd rounders, depending on if we give you #25 or #37.
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Old 03-04-2007, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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Or 3 2nd rounders, depending on if we give you #25 or #37.
Nah... we'll take your #25 and your second. Moving from #25 to #2 for only your first and second is insane... and, if you're willing to trade Vilma, your admitting that he doesn't fit the defense. So, for you, if Vilma doesn't fit, the trade is a steal. He will fit for us, so it works well for both.
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Old 03-04-2007, 03:27 PM    (permalink
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Nah... we'll take your #25 and your second. Moving from #25 to #2 for only your first and second is insane... and, if you're willing to trade Vilma, your admitting that he doesn't fit the defense. So, for you, if Vilma doesn't fit, the trade is a steal. He will fit for us, so it works well for both.
I'm not sold on Vilma not fitting yet, he would be an excellent player with a solid NT, but just nothing what he could be in a 4-3. Vilma on the Lions is better than anyone you can draft.
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Old 03-04-2007, 03:28 PM    (permalink
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Why would Coles retire when he just had a really good season, and doesn't look like he's lost his speed? CJ has size & speed, many teams will want to double team him leaving Cotchery & Coles in single coverage.
Coles actually stated in January that he believes he may retire soon because he takes a beating and training camp takes a toll on him.

"At this point I'm starting to realize, with the way I'm feeling, that I'm getting pretty close to the end"

Here's a link.

http://www.rototimes.com/nfl/player/3388

He probably has around 2 or 3 years left I'd guess, which is enough time for Calvin to develop if he needs any time. If not, CJ is an immediate spark for our offense and when Coles retires we have a fairly polished elite #1 receiver and a very solid #2 who we just locked up for another 5 years in Cotchery. I've said it a couple times in this thread, a trade up for CJ makes enough sense that you cannot assume that the trade will be for Peterson. And I would not be surprised if Tangini fell in love with the guy and decided that he's the guy they want on this team, what is there not to like about Calvin Johnson?
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