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Old 01-19-2009, 06:25 AM    (permalink
5 Fingers of Death
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Default Stafford now, or McCoy later?

I'm trying to run through my head if there is any other options beside Stafford at QB for us. I don't agree with this scenario, but is there any chance Mayhew believes we should draft Oher at #1 this year and wait for Colt McCoy next year?

I don't see Aaron Curry or Malcolm Jenkins as the #1 pick in 2009, but i do see maybe a remote chance that Oher or Eugene Monroe as #1.

I've watched McCoy against Texas Tech and Ohio State. He does not wow me like Stafford does. I know his stats are out of this world. Colt has a 76% comppct with 34 TDs and 8 INTs. Those are some really good stats. But watching him live, he does not seem to have the same physical skills a Stafford or Sanchez does. He does not look as big or have a stronger arm as Sanchez or Stafford. When i watch Stafford or Sanchez, i see NFL written all over them. I don't see that with McCoy. I see a very good college player, probably the best next to Tebow. I see McCoy as All-American but not all NFL pro. I may be very wrong here and McCoy may turn out to be a very good NFL player. McCoy played against Big 12 defense, which are not as good as SEC defense. Florida Atlantic, Utep, Rice, Arkansas, Colorado, Oklahoma, Missouri, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, Baylor, Kansas, and Texas A&M's defense does not scare me. He did have a good game against Ohio State.

http://web1.ncaa.org/mfb/natlRank.js...eff &site=org

I believe this crop of QBs in the 2009 draft, Stafford, Sanchez, Freeman, and Davis are better than the crop in 2010: McCoy, Tebow, and Bradford. Tebow has poor throwing mechanics and runs an option offense. Bradford is a short and intermediate passer, without deep threat pass. He runs a spread offense. McCoy is the only legit prospect. I actually was more impressed with Tony Pike from the Bearcats out of all of them. Stafford faced some good pass defenses in #3 Florida, #11 Tenneessee, #14 Alabama, #21 Vanderbilt, #30 Auburn, #37 Michigan State, #42 LSU, #43 Georgia Tech. Stafford shredded MSU and Georgia Tech's pass defense for 3 TDs against MSU and 5 TDs against Georgia Tech. I could see Stafford throwing 70% in the Big 12 conference. Heck, look at Chase Daniels. He tore up the Big 12, but went to the East West shrine bowl and really looked bad going 2-9 and cementing himself has a CFL quarterback. I would avoid all spread offense QBs except for Harrell.

I still think you need to pull the trigger now this year on Stafford. If Stafford would of stayed, he still would be the #1 quarterback coming out next year as he is this year. I just don't see any other QB much better than Stafford in 2010. I felt Stafford had nothing to gain to stay one more year. He had 3 years of experience and improving every game. They way he played his last 3 games as a junior looked liked like his full potential as a senior. If you argument is for drafting an offensive tackle this year and McCoy next year, i would not have any beef with that. I just would hate to see Stafford go to the probowl, and McCoy may be a bust. Maybe, it's the other way around. Who knows.

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Old 01-19-2009, 08:01 AM    (permalink
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It all depends on what grade the front office gives Stafford. If they think he is a franchise QB then you have to draft him. Even if you have a higer grade on Colt Mccoy you can't worry about drafting a QB next year in today's NFL when you don't have a starter on your team. There is also a good chance Colt will not even be viewed as 1st round QB with Bradford,Snead, Tebow etc. Colt also seems like a guy who will not be ready to start as rookie. And I doubt many lions fan's want to wait to 2011 to even have a chance at the playoffs.
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Old 01-19-2009, 08:09 AM    (permalink
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To be honest with you, I would draft Oher this year. Next year I would draft Bradford. I think he has a good shot at winning the Heisman again next year.
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Old 01-19-2009, 08:42 AM    (permalink
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I don't care what the odds are. Stafford is the finest QB prospect since Peyton. He has Elway's arm strength with all the intangibles in the world. Yes, he's young, so what, we are lucky that a QB prospect of his stature is going to be there when we draft. Bradford cannot hold this guy's jockstrap as far as overall talent is concerned from what I see. And you want to pass on him. I say no way. Yes, he is very inexperienced but look at his talent. This kid is not going to flop no matter what the odds are. And for once in 50 years we will have a top 5 QB in the whole NFL within 3 years barring injuries. Think of it a top 5 maybe even the #1 QB in the whole league, now there is a dream worth taking a shot on.
As for Oher, he's dropping very quickly and is now the #4 OT prospect in the draft. If he doesn't have a sensational combine, he could drop all the way to round 2. He doesn't put out on every play especially on running plays, he just takes time off during a game relying on his talent to carry him. That kind of mental makeup doesn't get you into the top 10.
For me Monroe, A. Smith and Jason Smith aren't good enough to go #1 overall. They all have some spots that needs work on. AS for Curry and Jenkins on defense, I'm not preparred to pay them 60+,000 000 dollars to play their positions.
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Old 01-19-2009, 10:35 AM    (permalink
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i dont want stafford to be honest, i want OLine this year. I've already said i would like the lions to look into tebow next year, same goes for mccoy, both have the personalities to lead a team and for us i think thats as important as actually quarterbacking th team
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Old 01-19-2009, 11:57 AM    (permalink
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I don't like any of next year's QB's nearly as much as I like Stafford, or even Sanchez.

Colt McCoy doesn't fit the profile of a QB I'd want to take with the hope of finding a franchise player at the position.

I don't want a QB from a gimmicky spread offense, nor do I want a QB who looks to run as much as he looks to pass.
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:25 PM    (permalink
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colt mccoy has just had more interviews. once stafford gets more press and camera time then everyone in michigan will start to feel better about him. up until that capital one bowl, he's been kind of invisible up here. partly because all we primarily get are big ten, big 12, and pac ten games.
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Old 01-19-2009, 12:28 PM    (permalink
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colt mccoy has just had more interviews. once stafford gets more press and camera time then everyone in michigan will start to feel better about him. up until that capital one bowl, he's been kind of invisible up here. partly because all we primarily get are big ten, big 12, and pac ten games.
Good point. McCoy gets major publicity playing at Texas, being the successor to Vince Young, and because Texas was a Top 5 team.

I only saw Stafford play a handful of times in college. Georgia games are rarely televised in Michigan.
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Old 01-19-2009, 01:52 PM    (permalink
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Stafford is so much better than McCoy, imo.
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Old 01-19-2009, 01:57 PM    (permalink
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1)Stafford is better or just as good as McCoy.
2) There is no assurance we will be able to pick McCoy. There is assurance barring Stafford refusing to play here, that Stafford can be taken by Detroit.
3)No defintie sure fire OT like Jake Long with pick number 1 is available. Many good OTs but Smith,Oher,Monroe etc, who can make that tough call.
4)QBs take the longest too devleop.
5) We've never had a QB and also never won.

We should draft Stafford. He won't solve the problem instantly but he's a definite step in the right direction.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:05 PM    (permalink
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We all sit here thinking the Lions can just pass on a QB and pick the best QB next year, but I doubt very much that the Lions organization has the same mindset. The way they see it, I'm sure they don't expect to be picking top 5 again next year . . .
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:15 PM    (permalink
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Stafford is inaccurate, that is the demise of this. Kitna is still a Lion last time I remember, and he is not bad at all. I would go Offensive lineman with Monroe, Backus is a horrible Left tackle. Cherlius deserves another chance, being a rookie last year and such.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:17 PM    (permalink
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Stafford is inaccurate, that is the demise of this. Kitna is still a Lion last time I remember, and he is not bad at all. I would go Offensive lineman with Monroe, Backus is a horrible Left tackle. Cherlius deserves another chance, being a rookie last year and such.
I disagree. Cut Gosder Cherilus. Only a weak team gives out second chances.

[I am SOOOO kidding]
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:25 PM    (permalink
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You guys are pretty weak. You just cant come along as a rookie. I agree with Otah on the board, the cherlius pick was stupid. Kevin Smith will be the only offense generated. Give him a good lineman to run behind. Oher or Monroe would be good.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:34 PM    (permalink
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You guys are pretty weak. You just cant come along as a rookie. I agree with Otah on the board, the cherlius pick was stupid. Kevin Smith will be the only offense generated. Give him a good lineman to run behind. Oher or Monroe would be good.
Gosder played fairly decent as the year went along. Best out of all the Olinemen at least. Time will tell with Otah. He's got some support along his line with other players unlike Gosder plus 2 very good RBs in Carolina. And the trade back with Gosder instead of Albert, allowed us to get Kevin Smith so I'm happy with that choice so far.

And no Kevin Smith will not be the only offense. Calvin Johnson and Kevin Smith are the only offense.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:35 PM    (permalink
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You guys are pretty weak. You just cant come along as a rookie. I agree with Otah on the board, the cherlius pick was stupid. Kevin Smith will be the only offense generated. Give him a good lineman to run behind. Oher or Monroe would be good.
Highlight my last post.

You can make a similar argument that if we get a QB to open up the offense, then Kevin Smith will have less guys in the box to run against.

There is no correct way to build an offense.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:39 PM    (permalink
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Stafford is a hell of a prospect and Detroit cannot afford to pass him up. They will have picks at 20 and 33 (assuming they don't trade back up) to address Oline and defense. If they manage to grab a top 4 LT and slide Backus to LG, the line is instantly better.

Detroit probably should've grabbed Otah, but the fact is they didn't. Cherilus will be fine with more experience and a better line around him.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:47 PM    (permalink
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i'd rather put a physical freak of nature like 'the baby' herman johnson next to backus. let backus stop the edge and have herman put his huge mitts into anyone who wants to rush inside. i don't trust backus inside anymore but unfortunately oline technique isn't my strong point so i hope the lions don't draft based upon my suggestions. i'm not sure about our oline techniques and how well backus can pull or if they kind of play a zone. all i know is having somebody who was 15lbs 14oz at birth should make backus at least feel bigger and tougher.
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Old 01-19-2009, 02:57 PM    (permalink
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You think Herman would be available in round 3? That would be a sweet roll of the dice if he was....
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Old 01-19-2009, 03:01 PM    (permalink
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as of right now, with us picking at the top of round 3...maybe. but i think he'll move up the boards with scouts just measuring his arms/hands/size.
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Old 01-19-2009, 03:25 PM    (permalink
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The thing with Herman Johnson is it depends on the scheme. I don't know how Herman would do in a zone blocking scheme, which is what we have right now. If we change into a power run team, then he'd be a good choice. But then Kevin Smith might not be used properly because he is more of a one cut runner. LeVitre and Canfield seem like good choices that fit right now.
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Old 01-19-2009, 03:33 PM    (permalink
sunnyintheD
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I'm hoping we can nab a FA like Jason Brown. He's a quick guard and would fit nicely with the current system. We've tried bringing in OL with experience, but they tend to be guys on the way out. Even it means throwing a little more money at someone it would be nice to get a proven NFL blocker that's not up there in years(like Mulitalo).
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Old 01-19-2009, 03:50 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Iamcanadian View Post
I don't care what the odds are. Stafford is the finest QB prospect since Peyton. He has Elway's arm strength with all the intangibles in the world. Yes, he's young, so what, we are lucky that a QB prospect of his stature is going to be there when we draft. Bradford cannot hold this guy's jockstrap as far as overall talent is concerned from what I see. And you want to pass on him. I say no way. Yes, he is very inexperienced but look at his talent. This kid is not going to flop no matter what the odds are. And for once in 50 years we will have a top 5 QB in the whole NFL within 3 years barring injuries. Think of it a top 5 maybe even the #1 QB in the whole league, now there is a dream worth taking a shot on.
As for Oher, he's dropping very quickly and is now the #4 OT prospect in the draft. If he doesn't have a sensational combine, he could drop all the way to round 2. He doesn't put out on every play especially on running plays, he just takes time off during a game relying on his talent to carry him. That kind of mental makeup doesn't get you into the top 10.
For me Monroe, A. Smith and Jason Smith aren't good enough to go #1 overall. They all have some spots that needs work on. AS for Curry and Jenkins on defense, I'm not preparred to pay them 60+,000 000 dollars to play their positions.

I agree, I dont think the question is who's #1 rather who's #20. I still think you can get one of the top 5 tackles there and if not you can get a good defensive player.
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Old 01-19-2009, 04:07 PM    (permalink
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Agreed. Having said that, I really think that there's a strong chance that the Lions trade up with either the 2oth or 33rd pick coupled with the Dallas 3rd rounder (ie 33 and second 3rd to move to #18 or #19). Three picks in the top 20 would be flat out sick.
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Old 01-19-2009, 04:32 PM    (permalink
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Agreed. Having said that, I really think that there's a strong chance that the Lions trade up with either the 2oth or 33rd pick coupled with the Dallas 3rd rounder (ie 33 and second 3rd to move to #18 or #19). Three picks in the top 20 would be flat out sick.

May happen, you would have to have two players you wanted at that spot (19 and 20) because you know you'd get one. A tackle and a LB would be the obvious choices wouldnt you say?

I'd trade up to get DJ Moore, Eben Britton and dont shoot me for saying this, Percy Harvin.
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