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Old 02-05-2009, 03:00 PM    (permalink
Mr. Stiller
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I mean stuff like that doesn't tip off the defense, but makes things harder for them. They may have a perfect front against a certain running concept they scouted out on film, but Eli has the ability to switch directions, or even plays with the check with me system. Colleges have that too. One perfect example is Oklahoma, and how they all look at the OC to run the play or do something else.
Yeah. To be honest with You I'm not sure 100% What the deal is with Ben and Arians.

I wish they would've used a bit more of the hurry up offense this year, Ben is insane in it.

And I think we need a RT to move Colon inside and another interior lineman to groom to get the run game going.
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Old 02-05-2009, 04:58 PM    (permalink
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Honestly, I think its funny the amount people are talking up Big Ben. He's a decent QB yeah, but not extraordinary. People talk how "he just wins". Well, I think it is more the help around him than him. Defense has for the most part been outstanding, he had a fantastic running game early in his career. He never had to do a whole lot. I think crediting wins to a QB is silly because it doesn't take a QB to win a game, it takes the team, and the Steelers had solid teams around Big Ben.
It was NOTHING like what John Elway did. Elway had ZERO offensive help during his years in the 80's, and just a decent defense and found himself going to 3 Super Bowls during those years.
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Old 02-05-2009, 06:58 PM    (permalink
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Honestly, I think its funny the amount people are talking up Big Ben. He's a decent QB yeah, but not extraordinary. People talk how "he just wins". Well, I think it is more the help around him than him. Defense has for the most part been outstanding, he had a fantastic running game early in his career. He never had to do a whole lot. I think crediting wins to a QB is silly because it doesn't take a QB to win a game, it takes the team, and the Steelers had solid teams around Big Ben.
It was NOTHING like what John Elway did. Elway had ZERO offensive help during his years in the 80's, and just a decent defense and found himself going to 3 Super Bowls during those years.
OK...

1. Who would you rather have for the upcoming 2009 season besides Peyton and Brady?
2. Why?
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Old 02-05-2009, 07:20 PM    (permalink
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OK...

1. Who would you rather have for the upcoming 2009 season besides Peyton and Brady?
2. Why?
1. Phillip Rivers, because he is a damn good QB that had a horrible defense and an injured/aging LT last year.

2. Drew Brees, because he is very accurate and frankly, the Saints ask too much of him.

3. Aaron Rodgers

4. Jay Cutler, because he can be freakishly good

5. Matt Ryan, probably one of the best seasons for a rookie QB ever

6. Tony Romo, because he is very accurate, doesn't hold the ball too long and usually makes good decisions

7. Donovan McNabb, because the guy doesn't make a lot of mistakes and makes good plays

The why part should be self-explanatory. Ben, from what I have seen, doesn't have the abilities those guys do. I mean, go ahead and argue back that Ben does what all of those QB's do. I just don't think he's THAT good of a QB. Is there something wrong with people not thinking he is a top 5 QB? I would probably put him in top 10, but I just don't see GREAT in him.
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Old 02-05-2009, 08:37 PM    (permalink
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1. Phillip Rivers, because he is a damn good QB that had a horrible defense and an injured/aging LT last year.

2. Drew Brees, because he is very accurate and frankly, the Saints ask too much of him.

3. Aaron Rodgers

4. Jay Cutler, because he can be freakishly good

5. Matt Ryan, probably one of the best seasons for a rookie QB ever

6. Tony Romo, because he is very accurate, doesn't hold the ball too long and usually makes good decisions

7. Donovan McNabb, because the guy doesn't make a lot of mistakes and makes good plays

The why part should be self-explanatory. Ben, from what I have seen, doesn't have the abilities those guys do. I mean, go ahead and argue back that Ben does what all of those QB's do. I just don't think he's THAT good of a QB. Is there something wrong with people not thinking he is a top 5 QB? I would probably put him in top 10, but I just don't see GREAT in him.
I can not argue with someone if they say they want to take Rivers, Brees, or even Jay Cutler at this point.

But for one season, I am not trusting McNabb as long as he is in Philly. He has reached his max there and needs a new location to have success.

Tony Romo is the polar opposite of Big Ben; great from September to November and in the first three quarters of a close game or in a blowout. He is awful late.

I need one more year each of Rodgers and Ryan before I go too nuts about either one. Neither has really proven themselves to this point.
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Old 02-05-2009, 08:56 PM    (permalink
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I can not argue with someone if they say they want to take Rivers, Brees, or even Jay Cutler at this point.

But for one season, I am not trusting McNabb as long as he is in Philly. He has reached his max there and needs a new location to have success.

Tony Romo is the polar opposite of Big Ben; great from September to November and in the first three quarters of a close game or in a blowout. He is awful late.

I need one more year each of Rodgers and Ryan before I go too nuts about either one. Neither has really proven themselves to this point.
My argument would be he's judging Rodgers, Cutler and Ryan based on Potential. If we're only judging over 1 season of work, lets just use Bens 2007 season.

Rivers and Brees can be made. Brees was on a damn good San Diego team and couldn't take them over the hump.

Same with Rivers.
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Old 02-05-2009, 09:42 PM    (permalink
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1. Phillip Rivers, because he is a damn good QB that had a horrible defense and an injured/aging LT last year.

2. Drew Brees, because he is very accurate and frankly, the Saints ask too much of him.

3. Aaron Rodgers

4. Jay Cutler, because he can be freakishly good

5. Matt Ryan, probably one of the best seasons for a rookie QB ever

6. Tony Romo, because he is very accurate, doesn't hold the ball too long and usually makes good decisions

7. Donovan McNabb, because the guy doesn't make a lot of mistakes and makes good plays

The why part should be self-explanatory. Ben, from what I have seen, doesn't have the abilities those guys do. I mean, go ahead and argue back that Ben does what all of those QB's do. I just don't think he's THAT good of a QB. Is there something wrong with people not thinking he is a top 5 QB? I would probably put him in top 10, but I just don't see GREAT in him.
I can't see someone how like Matt Ryan can be put over Ben...he had 1 season he played good. Apparently thats the argument for Ben on why he sucks...32 tds and 11 ints two years ago and a pro bowl...

You can take Romo, Donovan, Rivers and Aaron Rodgers...no disrespect they are all talented QBs. The game is more than stats IMO.
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Old 02-05-2009, 10:04 PM    (permalink
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My argument would be he's judging Rodgers, Cutler and Ryan based on Potential. If we're only judging over 1 season of work, lets just use Bens 2007 season.

Rivers and Brees can be made. Brees was on a damn good San Diego team and couldn't take them over the hump.

Same with Rivers.
In Brees' defence though, his top receiver was Keenan McLeod, who was about a century old by then (I swear, I think he's a highlander). Vincent Jackson and Chris Chambers weren't there (or much help, in Jackson's case) when Brees was throwing in SD, he just had Gates (not bad, but still).
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Old 02-05-2009, 11:36 PM    (permalink
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In Brees' defence though, his top receiver was Keenan McLeod, who was about a century old by then (I swear, I think he's a highlander). Vincent Jackson and Chris Chambers weren't there (or much help, in Jackson's case) when Brees was throwing in SD, he just had Gates (not bad, but still).
Brees had LT and Gates IIRC.. which is what Rivers has been relying on until this past season and a half.
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Old 02-06-2009, 01:05 AM    (permalink
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I'll agree with some of the posters here. I think Ben is good, but not great (yet). But I think it has very little to do with his ability.

On a somewhat related topic, has anyone noticed Pittsburgh's play calling lately? I don't want to knock it, because they win a lot of games, including a championship. But it seems to me they run a lot of 3-4 receiver sets which is a dead give away that they're going to pass, and usually eliminates the play action (or at least, I don't see them using it often).

I don't watch every Pittsburgh game (though I do watch a lot of them, especially division games against the Ravens, Browns and obviously the Bengals) but when I do, I feel like I can generally predict if it's going to be a run or a pass before the ball is snapped.

Anyways, it could be because of their less-than-stellar offensive line doesn't block long enough for the play action to work, or that they've had so many RB's injured they decided to give up on it, or maybe it's even just my imagination and none of this is true. But if it is true, I think Ben would have much better stats if they switched it up a little bit more.
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Old 02-06-2009, 12:26 PM    (permalink
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I'll agree with some of the posters here. I think Ben is good, but not great (yet). But I think it has very little to do with his ability.

On a somewhat related topic, has anyone noticed Pittsburgh's play calling lately? I don't want to knock it, because they win a lot of games, including a championship. But it seems to me they run a lot of 3-4 receiver sets which is a dead give away that they're going to pass, and usually eliminates the play action (or at least, I don't see them using it often).

I don't watch every Pittsburgh game (though I do watch a lot of them, especially division games against the Ravens, Browns and obviously the Bengals) but when I do, I feel like I can generally predict if it's going to be a run or a pass before the ball is snapped.

Anyways, it could be because of their less-than-stellar offensive line doesn't block long enough for the play action to work, or that they've had so many RB's injured they decided to give up on it, or maybe it's even just my imagination and none of this is true. But if it is true, I think Ben would have much better stats if they switched it up a little bit more.
You know its going to be a run on first or second down... that's what Pitt does. And inside the 10 yard line? Of course they take it out of Bens hands. The play calling is both terrible and great. Usually its great when Ben is making most of the calls... like the final drive.

That's why Ben doesn't have the stats of these "elite" QBs. The offense takes the ball out of his hands. There was no reason for them to start running the ball heavily in the second and third QT of the SB after the dominance of the passing game in the first QT. Ben drove that team down the field twice in the first and then they sit on the clock and put all the pressure on the defense because they have the lead. That's what the Steelers do. I have no idea how they won this SB.

It makes no sense. No running game. At times they have some of the worst protection in the game (and of you team has any kind of quickness up front, you already of them at a huge disadvantage, then you add some stunts and blitzes, then the Steelers are screwed). The WRs aren't over 6'0''. Hines is a short yardage guy. Great at what he does, but they don't get the ball to him enough. Santonio didn't do much all year long and was running routes like a pansy. Finally he woke up fro the playoffs. They have no real TD threat at any skill position. Nate Washington is the only vertical threat, and much like the Super Bowl, he's only good for one shot deep in the game. Maybe Limas Sweed will develop into the big target they lack, but I wouldn't put money on it. If Big Ben had a true #1 target instead of possession WR and an inconsistent #2 WR, then I'd harp on his stats, but he doesn't.

Offensively... all they really had was Big Ben making plays in clutch situations. That's it. They didn't have one consistent threat on offense. Not one. I think this is one of the worst offenses to ever win a Super Bowl, but for one game they are capable of putting up 30+ points. That's if they decide to put the ball in Ben's hands and let him run an up-tempo like offense like he did against the Ravens in that comeback win or the final drive of the SB.
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Old 02-06-2009, 12:35 PM    (permalink
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There are always naysayers who want to put down any QB who wins as a product of the people around him. It's football. Every player in the NFL needs other good players around him to win. You can argue that this or that QB is better for whatever reason, but the bottom line is winning a Super Bowl. A Super Bowl ring matters more than being the winner of people's biased opinions.
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Old 02-06-2009, 03:21 PM    (permalink
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I'll agree with some of the posters here. I think Ben is good, but not great (yet). But I think it has very little to do with his ability.

On a somewhat related topic, has anyone noticed Pittsburgh's play calling lately? I don't want to knock it, because they win a lot of games, including a championship. But it seems to me they run a lot of 3-4 receiver sets which is a dead give away that they're going to pass, and usually eliminates the play action (or at least, I don't see them using it often).

I don't watch every Pittsburgh game (though I do watch a lot of them, especially division games against the Ravens, Browns and obviously the Bengals) but when I do, I feel like I can generally predict if it's going to be a run or a pass before the ball is snapped.

Anyways, it could be because of their less-than-stellar offensive line doesn't block long enough for the play action to work, or that they've had so many RB's injured they decided to give up on it, or maybe it's even just my imagination and none of this is true. But if it is true, I think Ben would have much better stats if they switched it up a little bit more.
To put it Mildly...

Tomlin is trying to run a balanced attrition style offense (Do what they want at will)..

Arians Thinks he's Mini Mike Martz and is pushing Ben to try to be like Peyton Manning.

atleast thats how I see it.


The thing is... they pre-decide the first 15-25 offensive plays... Thats why we normally jump out to a lead early.

Then Arians starts calling plays on the way the game is running. His "Non-Scripted" Playcalling is terrible. He never uses Parker on a RB Screen (Or Memo for that matter though). Which is ********. He never tries to get Parker in space. If you watch Parker they run him 2 places. Off the left ass cheek of the center or the RG/RT split with the LG coming through there.

Also Parkers a guy that just turns the jets on and flies into the gap he's supposed to rush in. Arians eradication of the Fullback (Atleast a good one.. which Carey Davis and Sean McHugh are not...) is killing us on the goalline.


But Arians sets it up to get the lead early passing then he drops into predictable mode.

Which is why when you see Ben lead the no huddle, it's rare he gets stopped.
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