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Old 05-09-2011, 06:09 PM    (permalink
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I doubt Light is any better than Solder at this point. More experienced? Sure. But he was abused and exploited at times last year.
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Old 05-09-2011, 07:12 PM    (permalink
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I doubt Light is any better than Solder at this point. More experienced? Sure. But he was abused and exploited at times last year.
Solder is very raw. He is more athletic than Light ever was but he is also very far behind technically wise. He also needs to bulk up or else he will get bull rushed easily. Solder might eventually become way better than Light, but as of right now he would be a liability in the OL.
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Old 05-09-2011, 07:24 PM    (permalink
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I highly doubt he can be THAT much worse than Light was in spots last year. Solder's rawness at this point is entirely overrated. He's a project for sure, but it's not like the guy doesn't know how to block at all.

I'm really not worried about Brady. He's one of the best in the league in terms of in the pocket mobility. We've gone through some real bad offensive linemen before, for years at a time at RT even.
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Old 05-09-2011, 07:46 PM    (permalink
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I highly doubt he can be THAT much worse than Light was in spots last year. Solder's rawness at this point is entirely overrated. He's a project for sure, but it's not like the guy doesn't know how to block at all.

I'm really not worried about Brady. He's one of the best in the league in terms of in the pocket mobility. We've gone through some real bad offensive linemen before, for years at a time at RT even.
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Old 05-09-2011, 08:11 PM    (permalink
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I highly doubt he can be THAT much worse than Light was in spots last year. Solder's rawness at this point is entirely overrated. He's a project for sure, but it's not like the guy doesn't know how to block at all.

I'm really not worried about Brady. He's one of the best in the league in terms of in the pocket mobility. We've gone through some real bad offensive linemen before, for years at a time at RT even.
I'm not saying he would suck. But considering the level of the opponents he is going to face I hardly think he is ready to go unscathed. And I don't think Light looked that bad last year, even on the spots you said. My biggest worry last year was the interior of our line. Koppen was the one who disappointed me the most.
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Old 05-09-2011, 08:15 PM    (permalink
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Eh..ehhhh...ehhhhhh.

Light is entirely replaceable at this point. I would say he's slightly below league average as a starter after a fairly good career. Any offensive linemen is going to look better than they actually are playing with Brady(Everyone outside of Mankins has made a name on that, even), so with those two factors in mind I'm not losing any sleep over Solder starting right away and parting ways with Matt Light. We've been complaining about Light here since the Giants showed who our offensive line really was back in 2007.
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Old 05-09-2011, 09:18 PM    (permalink
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Eh..ehhhh...ehhhhhh.

Light is entirely replaceable at this point. I would say he's slightly below league average as a starter after a fairly good career. Any offensive linemen is going to look better than they actually are playing with Brady(Everyone outside of Mankins has made a name on that, even), so with those two factors in mind I'm not losing any sleep over Solder starting right away and parting ways with Matt Light. We've been complaining about Light here since the Giants showed who our offensive line really was back in 2007.
I completely disagree with that. Light for me was slightly above average. He is indeed replaceable, but I still think Solder needs at least one year of development to make a smooth transition.
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Old 05-09-2011, 09:25 PM    (permalink
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He got shown up pretty good multiple times the past few years. The worst part about it is that it didn't show up in the stat sheet all the time because of Brady's footwork and the nature of the short pass and checkdowns in our offensive system. Search "Matt Light" in the team forum and you'll likely see a whole lot of people who disagree with your assessment.

I don't think it would be a bad move signing Matt Light to help ease the transition to Solder, but it might not be a bad move to just move on entirely and not waste a roster spot on a guy you're hoping and praying isn't playing by week four or five. Especially one that has little to not versatility.
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Old 05-09-2011, 09:41 PM    (permalink
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He got shown up pretty good multiple times the past few years. The worst part about it is that it didn't show up in the stat sheet all the time because of Brady's footwork and the nature of the short pass and checkdowns in our offensive system. Search "Matt Light" in the team forum and you'll likely see a whole lot of people who disagree with your assessment.

I don't think it would be a bad move signing Matt Light to help ease the transition to Solder, but it might not be a bad move to just move on entirely and not waste a roster spot on a guy you're hoping and praying isn't playing by week four or five. Especially one that has little to not versatility.
I'm aware most people hate him. The Light bashing goes far back. He does get beat at times but I think most Patriots fans exacerbate it a lot. Brady has great, if not the best, pocket awareness, but he isn't very mobile. He can ditch one guy unblocked but after that unless he gets the ball out there quickly he'll get sacked. We haven't seen him running for his life too often, usually all it takes is for him to step up the pocket and the line holds it's own. There are several plays in which Brady, specially last season, just stands in the pocket going through his progression with more than enough time.
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Old 05-09-2011, 11:51 PM    (permalink
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No one hates Matt Light here. He's a great person and has been a solid OL (if a tad overrated by the rest of the world) for the Pats. But his deficiencies were clearly outlined when we got to see Vollmer playing LT and out-classing Light fairly easily as a rookie. And he gets beat way too much in the passing game for an OT who isn't very good in the run-blocking game.

Let's be clear here.... People overrate the New England OL. They've only had one really good year as an OL and the only elite guy they've had on the line since Bruce Armstrong (maybe Damien Woody) is Logan Mankins. The rest of the guys have been solid (Light, Koppen/Compton) to fair (Andruzzi, Neal, Kaczur) and poor (Brandon Gorin...)
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Old 05-10-2011, 08:58 AM    (permalink
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While I would love to see Solder start right away, I do think giving M.Light a one yr contract is in the best interest of the team.
To be clear, I think Light is a below avg/avg LT now but I think he Solder would benefit from him. He's a proven vet with an ass ton of experience and knows all the divisional pass rushers well
I'd love it if N.Solder could step in day one as the starter but I'm assuming they'll work him like they did Vollmer his rookie year.
Cycling in and starting when injuries occur. Taking over permantly the following year.

God, I hope M.Cannon is ready to go to start the year (long shot, I Know)... we are so thin up front.
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Old 05-10-2011, 08:23 PM    (permalink
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and the rumors begin . . .

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Old 05-10-2011, 09:11 PM    (permalink
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Let's be clear here.... People overrate the New England OL. They've only had one really good year as an OL and the only elite guy they've had on the line since Bruce Armstrong (maybe Damien Woody) is Logan Mankins. The rest of the guys have been solid (Light, Koppen/Compton) to fair (Andruzzi, Neal, Kaczur) and poor (Brandon Gorin...)
This, this, and verrrrrrry much some of this. We've never had a bad offensive line, but it's almost unbelievable how much the media and some segments of our fanbase have overrated them over the years. Nothing made me rage harder than hearing the "BRADY HAS THE BEST OFFENSIVE LINE IN THE LEAGUE HES OVERRATED" chant of a few years ago. I don't think I could even put it into words, even. Mankins is the only guy on the line that the rest of the league covets and view highly, with the rest of them being steady to pretty good guys most of the time.

I'm pretty sure the only reason Light started at LT last year was because that's where his comfort level is....which again, hurts his value in terms of coming back to the team. You're going to have to pay him starter money to bring him back, which just might not be worth it for a guy you hope isn't starting and has limited versatility. I'm much more in favor of bringing in a guy like Marshall Yanda, who you can play at tackle initially and then find a spot for as the season wears on/plug in at guard if Mankins leaves. Similar money, more value there IMO.


As far as what's out there for DE's right now;

Stephen Bowen from Dallas is an interesting option. He got time from various starters having injuries this year and look solid, albeit unspectacular at that position. He's a lengthy, big body though, which is something we're sorely missing in our rotation right now.

Marcus Spears is another guy from Dallas who has had some real good years in the past, but has been injured/inconsistent as of late. Might be the type who gets more money than he deserves on the open market, we'll have see.

Desmond Bryant is an intriguing option out of Oakland. He's undersized at 6'5 290, but he doesn't profile as a full time starter in our defense anyway. Once you get past that, he's an interesting rotational option with his combination of length and athletic ability. Would likely be a subpackage type guy with the ability to play in the base defense occasionally.

Kenyon Coleman can likely be had for fairly cheap due to his advanced age and we don't have to worry about the Browns trying to go hard after him either because of the scheme change. Another very solid defensive end who can come in and play in the base defense and do pretty well. Might be the most realistic option if things don't work out with Marcus Stroud.
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Old 05-10-2011, 09:45 PM    (permalink
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People still argue we have an amazing offensive line, I got caught into a few arguments on here this past year with fans of other teams over that. And Solder should not be starting day one haha.
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Old 05-10-2011, 09:53 PM    (permalink
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We have more than enough bodies for rotational guys.
If we're not bringing in a hands down starter then no thank you.
We have more than enough bodies with everyone coming back healthy plus Stroud
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Old 05-10-2011, 09:56 PM    (permalink
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We have more than enough bodies for rotational guys.
If we're not bringing in a hands down starter then no thank you.
We have more than enough bodies with everyone coming back healthy plus Stroud
See, I don't think we have enough EFFECTIVE rotational linemen. We could find some space for guys that fit better in our scheme...and I'm casting my eyes directly at Ron Brace right now.
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Old 05-10-2011, 10:00 PM    (permalink
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If Brace can play more then a few games at a time before getting injured again.
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Old 05-10-2011, 10:02 PM    (permalink
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Brace is honestly a case of square peg, round hole. Drafted in case Wilfork leaves and for leverage in that situation...doesn't have a role here anymore and never really got a fair start from the start. I just don't think it's going to work out here at this point and he's clearly not a DE in a 3-4.

Another roster spot; Warren is a free agent and while I wouldn't mind bringing him back, we should be actively seeking an upgrade.
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Old 05-10-2011, 11:35 PM    (permalink
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I'm always down to upgrade. I just don't want any lateral moves.
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Old 05-11-2011, 12:10 PM    (permalink
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Actually, I think the Pats quite possibly had the worst offensive line of any Super Bowl-winning team in history when they won their first two Super Bowls. That line was garbage. The reason Weis ran the offense he ran (dink and dunk) was because they couldn't hold up long enough to run anything else... And it took power runners like Smith and Dillon to do anything running the ball pre-Mankins.
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Old 05-11-2011, 05:23 PM    (permalink
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I agree with that. Stephen Neal had some real good moments too. Damien Woody was pretty good for awhile as well....but aside from that it's all been very meh to below average. Koppen, the guy we've seen the most of over the years, could actually be placed next to the word average in the dictionary as the picture, even.
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Old 05-11-2011, 06:16 PM    (permalink
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It was funny when people were wondering how they would replace Joe Andruzzi... That guy sucked. The only reason people knew him is because of the off-field stuff he did. Losing (not replacing) Andruzzi and Brandon Gorin were the two biggest upgrades the Pats made to that OL. Losing them and having nothing at LG and RT was a bigger improvement than having Mankins and Kaczur over nothing.
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Old 05-11-2011, 11:05 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElectricEye View Post
I agree with that. Stephen Neal had some real good moments too. Damien Woody was pretty good for awhile as well....but aside from that it's all been very meh to below average. Koppen, the guy we've seen the most of over the years, could actually be placed next to the word average in the dictionary as the picture, even.
He's been down right awful at times. Average may be stretching it a little.
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Old 05-17-2011, 03:40 AM    (permalink
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I read another Chad Johnson/Ochocinco/Bullrider rumor today. I wonder how many more times his name will be connected with the Patriots before he retires.
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Old 05-19-2011, 08:31 AM    (permalink
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He's been down right awful at times. Average may be stretching it a little.
For what Koppen means to the rest of the OL's success, average is the floor for him. There's a good reason he hasn't been replaced.
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