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View Poll Results: Who was better in a 4-3
Chiefs 56 50.00%
Broncos 10 8.93%
Packers 43 38.39%
All will be successful 3 2.68%
Voters: 112. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-21-2009, 05:19 PM    (permalink
Splat
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Originally Posted by BamaFalcon59 View Post
The Chiefs had all the tools to be an amazing tampa 2 defense. Huge mistake going to the 3-4.
Did you see their D last year?
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:22 PM    (permalink
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Did you see their D last year?
And? They are young. All they would need are some defensive ends and a middle linebacker. Safties are easy to find.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:24 PM    (permalink
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we won't know until 3 years from now.

the only player in KC that will be wasted in this front is Dorsey. Everyone else is either irrelevant anyway, or will fair fine in the new scheme.

Denver, what difference does it make? They all suck. I could care less if they "fit". They didn't "fit" in a 4-3 either.

The Packers are very capable of the switch. To me the big question mark will be how well Kampman transitions. Their decision in my eyes lies with that one question mark. Everyone else will be fine.
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Old 02-22-2009, 01:06 AM    (permalink
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It's a huge mistake for KC, their personnel might be able to be shoved into the scheme, but its not a good fit.
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Old 02-22-2009, 02:19 AM    (permalink
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I don't really like any of the teams that switched to the 3-4 defense. Broncos and Chiefs especially. Packers are iffy, but count me as one of the few who doesn't like Kampman as a 3-4 OLB.
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Old 02-22-2009, 08:35 AM    (permalink
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we won't know until 3 years from now.

the only player in KC that will be wasted in this front is Dorsey. Everyone else is either irrelevant anyway, or will fair fine in the new scheme.

Denver, what difference does it make? They all suck. I could care less if they "fit". They didn't "fit" in a 4-3 either.

The Packers are very capable of the switch. To me the big question mark will be how well Kampman transitions. Their decision in my eyes lies with that one question mark. Everyone else will be fine.
Dont u think Flowers is gonna suffer?
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Old 02-22-2009, 08:50 AM    (permalink
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The Chiefs have one guy who's worth keeping a 4-3 for, and he hasn't proven he can dominate in it yet. The Broncos have none. It's hardly that much of a difference that it's a great move for Denver and a horrible move for KC. I'll trust Scott Pioli's judgement over Brian Xanders, whoever the hell that is.
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Old 02-22-2009, 10:37 AM    (permalink
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Dont u think Flowers is gonna suffer?
Flowers will be lockdown in any sytem.
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Old 02-22-2009, 10:49 AM    (permalink
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Dont u think Flowers is gonna suffer?
Flowers will be fine. Especially in a Parcells style 3-4.

Flowers was always a great #2 CB in any scheme, and a great #1 in a Tampa 2.
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Old 02-22-2009, 10:50 AM    (permalink
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Flowers will be an amazing number one in any scheme. Bank on it.
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Old 02-22-2009, 10:52 AM    (permalink
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Flowers will be an amazing number one in any scheme. Bank on it.
could be, i need to see more of him.

I loved him as a safety prospect personally.
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Old 02-22-2009, 10:54 AM    (permalink
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could be, i need to see more of him.

I loved him as a safety prospect personally.
There's no reason to put him at safety. He's better suited at cornerback.
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Old 02-22-2009, 11:56 AM    (permalink
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Flowers is a stud. He did not time well but he moves better in pads than DRC, Antonio Cromartie, etc. He is a natural football player..not a track athlete. He will have a Ty Law type career.
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Old 02-22-2009, 11:58 AM    (permalink
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Flowers is a stud. He did not time well but he moves better in pads than DRC, Antonio Cromartie, etc. He is a natural football player..not a track athlete. He will have a Ty Law type career.
I can definitely see that.

Except he hits harder.
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Old 02-22-2009, 12:02 PM    (permalink
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Kansas City is built for the Tampa two so the transition might take a while.
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I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 02-22-2009, 04:11 PM    (permalink
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packers are going to get rocked in the 3-4
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Old 02-22-2009, 04:48 PM    (permalink
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packers are going to get rocked in the 3-4
And....thread.
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Old 02-22-2009, 05:52 PM    (permalink
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haven't been paying attention.. didn't know the chiefs were heading 3-4.

I think it really depends on what flavor of 3-4 those teams implement.

I think KC has a solid secondary and with some weight loss Hali could be a similar SOLB to LaMarr Woodley. The rest of the front 7 is a scare. Tank Tyler seems like a nice NT to start with.. question is... what do you do with Dorsey. Johnston has 3-4 DE potential.

Denvers defense was in dire need of help, how can you have much drop off from one of the worst units? Moss/Dumerville seem like a nice OLB duo. The ILB's/DL scare me of this group.

Green Bay has had one of the better 4-3 defenses. I don't know why they're blowing this up with a team with a lot of 2-4 year talent and a top notch pass rusher and some youth. away from being a top unit again.

I voted Green Bay.
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Old 02-22-2009, 05:55 PM    (permalink
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At least the Broncos have some good potential 34 OLBs in Crowder, Moss, Dumerville. Ryan McBean and Marcus Thomas could be fits at end.
I wouldn't hold my breath on McBean. He was given 2.5 years and couldn't handle it in Pittsburghs scheme.

Like I said, it really depends on the flavor of the 3-4 they run. McBean/Thomas might be better suited in a Dallas style 3-4.
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Old 02-22-2009, 06:53 PM    (permalink
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Pendergast has no knowledge of the 3-4 i dont see why they even hired him
By that do you mean he just doesn't know what he is doing when calling for the 3-4? You guys ran a hybrid the last two years didn't you?
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I dunno even half of those guys why did we sign them jeez.
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Old 02-22-2009, 06:55 PM    (permalink
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Could Dorsey play a Darnell Dockett type role in the 3-4, lining up at end and tackle?
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Old 02-22-2009, 06:56 PM    (permalink
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Could Dorsey play a Darnell Dockett type role in the 3-4, lining up at end and tackle?
If he stays healthy I think he could do just about anything.
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Old 02-22-2009, 07:01 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BamaFalcon59 View Post
Could Dorsey play a Darnell Dockett type role in the 3-4, lining up at end and tackle?
People fail to realize that AZ played 3-4 like 35 total plays this year in non nickle situations.
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 02-22-2009, 07:03 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bored of education View Post
People fail to realize that AZ played 3-4 like 35 total plays this year in non nickle situations.
I saw Dockett playing a 0 tech often in the Superbowl. And he is not the largest guy.

That is what I meant.
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Old 02-23-2009, 12:59 AM    (permalink
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I made this write up about how well the Packers will fit the 3-4 for the Packers forum, but given its relevance to the thread and how much time I spend on it I figured I might as well post it here

In depth look at where our players fit for the transition:

Name Height Weight Age

Justin Harrell 6-4 320 25
Projection: DE

Harrell doesn't fit very well in a 3-4. He is a NT/DE tweener. I think he ends up in the starting mix at DE but he might have a future at NT, possibly being a backup at that position. Right now I'm not sure he has the ability to eat up a center and a guard, which is why he'll probably be a DE. He has to show the ability to hold the edge. On the plus side, I think he can succeed pushing the pocket at the RT side, where he won't really do much himself, but could prove to be pretty valuable by opening lanes for Kampman to make plays behind him.

Aaron Kampman 6-4 265 29
Projection: OLB

Is almost the ideal size for a rush OLB in the 3-4. He should be very successful, but will have to work at developing new instincts, adjust to playing in space and moving laterally. He will rush pretty much the same area as before, and being a bull rusher, he should be very good at generating pressure on the QB. Hitting the pocket with a running start will make him very hard to block. He may be a liability against the run, where he will have trouble shifting outside and chasing down the runner, but he can fight through blocks.

Michael Montgomery 6-5 273 25
Projection: DE

Could be a very good fit at DE for us. Has the height and arm span to hold the edge, but he might not be able to pressure the pocket very well. Needs to put on weight to stick at this position. Could do very well at containing the runner and directing him inside, but may not be able to shed the blocks and make the tackles. Needs to get stronger.

Ryan Pickett 6-2 330 29
Projection: NT

Pretty good size for a NT. Plays with decent leverage and is used to going against a guard/center. Lacks the quickness and burst to be a true playmaker NT that we could really use, but is satisfactory. Conditioning may be an issue - I could see him wearing down really fast when we stick him in the middle of the line. Won't be able to get a push like we desire, but should hold his own.

Jeremy Thompson 6-4 270 23
Projection: DE

True tweener between a OLB and DE (in 3-4). May not last long on the team. However, he has potential to be a good DE for us, if he really hits the weight room and add 15 pounds of muscle and some bulk. Could be a DE that can not only hold the edge, but shed some blocks and generate some pressure, but if he doesn't get bigger he'll just be a waste that gets pushed around. Could project to OLB, but he's not fast enough and won't be able to adjust to playing in space. Not a good enough natural rusher. Seeing as how he is young, he has a much better chance at adding bulk and playing DE than slimming down and playing OLB. Just not fast or agile enough.

Desmond Bishop 6-2 238 24
Projection: ILB

Could end up being a solid ILB thumper for us. Better fit in the 3-4 than 4-3. Can't cover well, but he could be a very solid run stuffer. Can make the tough tackles inside if traffic is directed towards him. Not sure how well he can shed blocks, but plays with power. Probably ends up being a backup, but might end up seeing significant playing time, particularly rotating in at short yardage situations or could be a good backup for both Hawk and Barnett.

Brandon Chillar 6-3 243 26
Projection: OLB

Should be a versatile backup for us, but lacks the natural edge rushing ability to be a true starting OLB. Plays well in space and can cover, but isn't explosive enough to get to the quarterback as an OLB rusher, and is undersized for the position. Could also play inside, but should be better playing OLB against the run and in coverage, where he can move laterally and read running plays well, and chase down stretch running plays.

A.J. Hawk 6-1 248 25
Projection: ILB

Good size for a 3-4 ILB and has excellent instincts that should help him. However he needs to get stronger and do a better job shedding blocks. Might struggle making tackles inside. Could end up being very good for us if he can play with more power and make tackles, because then we might really see him making plays all across the LOS as well as being a rock solid cover LB. But could also get pancaked going against big interior lineman, and be a big failure. Don't see him as an OLB - just not big enough and not a natural edge rusher.

Brady Poppinga 6-3 247 29
Projection: OLB

Decent fit as an OLB with good power and pretty good edge rushing skills. Lacks ideal speed and over pursuits at times, but should generate pressure and can stuff the run, albeit inconsistently. Good size for the position, but could stand to add a few pounds and his frame may be maxed out. Almost useless in coverage and doesn't play well laterally. Needs to develop better instincts and vision.

Nick Barnett 6-2 236 27
Projection: ILB

Should really excel at ILB. Has good speed and plays with the explosiveness that we need for an inside backer. Should bulk up and at 5-10 pounds. Can shed blocks well and a good tackler inside. Good instincts and should do very well when traffic is directed his way. Shouldn't have much of a problem going against the bigger interior lineman and can even cover if needed. Only potential problem is if he can't add weight and gets pushed around.

Cullen Jenkins 6-2 305 28
Projection: DE

Excellent fit at DE. Good size, but ideally would be a little taller with better wing span. Should be very good at holding his position as well as getting some penetration. Decent quickness and first step which should really help him. Needs to adjust to being more self sacrificing, and try to direct traffic rather than make too many plays.

Johnny Jolly 6-3 320 26
Projection: DE

Could be a pretty good DE for us, but might need to lose some weight. Could be both a good space eater for the linebackers that can also generate pressure. May struggle holding the edge and pushing traffic inside. Has decent strength, may not be quick enough. Should do well except against off tackle runs, where he could get pushed inside. Note: I think his legal troubles are overblown and they won't affect his career that much.

Projected depth chart:
RDE: Cullen Jenkins, Michael Montgomery, Jeremy Thompson
NT: Ryan Pickett, Justin Harrell
LDE: Johnny Jolly, Justin Harrell, Michael Montgomery
ROLB: Brady Poppinga, Brandon Chillar
RILB: AJ Hawk, Brandon Chillar
LILB: Nick Barnett, Desmond Bishop
LOLB: Aaron Kampman, Brandon Chillar*

*Chillar is listed as a backup for 3 linebacker spots - it's obvious we need to draft another OLB. I want Orakpo, Brown would be a good choice as well. We can put Chillar at OLB and be OK as long as we have a blitz threat on the other side like Kampman or Orakpo, but the defense will really struggle if we have Chillar and Poppinga both on the field.
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