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Old 04-01-2009, 05:28 PM    (permalink
Gay Ork Wang
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Originally Posted by njx9 View Post
because on this site, people believe there's some unassailable quality to their own personal opinion and that it's near sacrilege to EVER call them on it. especially when they demonstrate that they don't have any idea what they're talking about.
proving an argument wrong is just one step to find the real answer. but no, it really never does anything!
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:29 PM    (permalink
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because on this site, people believe there's some unassailable quality to their own personal opinion and that it's near sacrilege to EVER call them on it. especially when they demonstrate that they don't have any idea what they're talking about.
Is it the highlight of your day to attempt to assert your intellectual superiority over a bunch of high school kids? Or is just something you do out of habit now?

If your other 17,000 posts are anything like the few I've read, I feel sorry for you.
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:31 PM    (permalink
Gay Ork Wang
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Is it the highlight of your day to attempt to assert your intellectual superiority over a bunch of high school kids? Or is just something you do out of habit now?

If your other 17,000 posts are anything like the few I've read, I feel sorry for you.
how is that what he is doing any different from a normal discussion
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:40 PM    (permalink
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how is that what he is doing any different from a normal discussion
Somebody would talk to you like this without the internet protecting their anonymity?

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again, why should i make a case for a guy in a discussion with people who haven't yet demonstrated that they have the capacity to look beyond the stat sheet? at this point, i could spend half an hour discussing the broncos gameplan/offense and would literally just get "BUT ZOMG STATS" thrown back. it's frankly not worth my time.

at least you've proven you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about and are solely basing your argument on stats. thanks for the clarification. i've told you several times why that makes for a garbage argument and you've shown several times that you have utterly no ability whatsoever to think in any other terms.

yet AGAIN, i'll suggest that you actually go back and watch a few broncos games from the past few years (nfl network occasionally shows them), then come back and we can discuss why marshall doesn't catch 4.5 million tds in the red zone.
Rude and disrespectful are two words that come to mind.
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:56 PM    (permalink
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i dont see how proving someone else wrong is not adding something to the argument...
Proving someone wrong and saying someone is wrong are two different things. He has not proven me wrong, he has said I am wrong.
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Old 04-01-2009, 05:59 PM    (permalink
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i don't much care what YOUR opinion is online or off. let me know when you've posted something that suggests you should be respected. lots of posters here have. and they didn't have to whine once about how mean i am, or pretend to be the "i'm so above it" internet tough guy.

but then, you've been banned more times than i can count on one hand, so you probably already knew that.
It wasn't me you disrespected.

Anyways, it doesn't change my opinion that it is pathetic and cowardly to talk like you do. I guarantee you would not speak to people like that in real life, so why turn e-thug on the internet? Have a debate, but don't be disrespectful or rude. It's even more troubling that you're a moderator here and adopt such an attitude since it is the exact behavior which should be looked down upon here.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:02 PM    (permalink
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i'm always up for changing my opinions of players. At first I thought Stafford sucked, but now i'm okay with him, not sold on him but not gonna say he sucks. Then again this draft is pretty weak, and one of the most uninteresting in years.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:23 PM    (permalink
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no, i've that your opinion of the player is flawed, based on lack of observation. i'm still waiting for you to show you've ever seen him play. this is going on like, 6 posts where i've asked for the same thing and you've ducked and dodged the question, preferring to call me "mean" or whatever. i'm STILL waiting.

Where did I say you are mean? I really could care less. If being cool on here is your thing, go for it. I have said numerous times that he plays in a scheme designed to get him the ball in a position to make plays, but either way it doesn't matter. Top receivers don't score 6 times on over 100 receptions. And elite receivers make offenses give them the ball in the redzone, they are that good. Especially a 6'4" 230 pound receiver like Marshall.
I don't see any point in arguing with you. You haven't said anything to this point.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:26 PM    (permalink
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I don't see any point in arguing with you. You haven't said anything to this point.
I hate to jump into this "argument" but why is Marshall overrated and have you seen him play because so far you've backed up your stance with plain statistics?
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:30 PM    (permalink
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Marshall is someone defenses have to game plan for that alone makes him not overrated.

marshall didn't go to V Tech so he sucks!
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Old 04-01-2009, 08:32 PM    (permalink
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I don't see any point in arguing with you. You haven't said anything to this point.
As NJX has tried to tell you, watch Bronco games and you will realize why he doesn't have the TD's Owens or Moss have. The Broncos red zone offense has stunk for I don't even know how long, and the focus was running the ball down there, not tossing it up to Marshall.
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Old 04-01-2009, 09:37 PM    (permalink
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It's pointless to state an opinion with no statistical basis anyway, I can say that Brandon Marshall doesn't get as many TD's because his ball skills aren't as good in the red zone, and someone else can say it's the scheme. I can say he doesn't have a 14 ypc because he's not the deep threat the other guys are.

I can't prove it though, and someone can just say "lol no" and we'll go in circles forever arguing our opinions. It's just funny that I have this opinion from watching him and stats just HAPPEN to back it up.
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Old 04-02-2009, 02:21 PM    (permalink
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He is a big play receiver, and a threat in the redzone, just not the threat of the other guys.(I'm thinking of Calvin in particular).

Bush is hard to compare because he's used so differently from other backs. Can you honestly say Marshall is used so differently from other guys?
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Old 04-02-2009, 07:50 PM    (permalink
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2 yards is a big deal. That's like saying the difference between 4 yards per carry and 5 yards per carry isn't big. It is.
You obviously don't watch any Broncos games. Last year, Marshall was hampered by a hip injury which took away some of his explosiveness. But, in 2007, he was by far the best receiver in the NFL after the catch. Stats don't say everything, you have to actually watch the games..
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Old 04-02-2009, 09:10 PM    (permalink
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Old 04-02-2009, 09:53 PM    (permalink
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okay, who would u rather have on ur team: the Texans OL and David Carr or Dan Orlovsky and the Lions Line
wait, are you saying we had a line?
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Old 04-02-2009, 10:23 PM    (permalink
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You obviously don't watch any Broncos games. Last year, Marshall was hampered by a hip injury which took away some of his explosiveness. But, in 2007, he was by far the best receiver in the NFL after the catch. Stats don't say everything, you have to actually watch the games..
Reading helps also.

I said he is great after the catch. That doesn't make him have a more diverse route tree or excel at deep to intermediate passes.

I could argue all day, but there's no point. Noone is going to change his or her mind.
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Old 04-02-2009, 10:28 PM    (permalink
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You obviously don't watch any Broncos games. Last year, Marshall was hampered by a hip injury which took away some of his explosiveness. But, in 2007, he was by far the best receiver in the NFL after the catch. Stats don't say everything, you have to actually watch the games..
Uh, no. That'd be Greg Jennings.
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Old 04-02-2009, 10:36 PM    (permalink
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Old 04-02-2009, 11:15 PM    (permalink
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no, you can quote stats all day, which is why you've failed utterly to respond to an actual argument. but it's not like i'm surprised. i knew you had no idea what you were talking about when you hit submit the first time.
ouchhhhhhhhh
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Old 04-02-2009, 11:17 PM    (permalink
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Dennis Northcutt and Mike Walker
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Old 04-02-2009, 11:39 PM    (permalink
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Uh, no. That'd be Greg Jennings.
Boldin would wipe his ass with Greg Jennings, and then use Brandon Marshall as his wet wipe.

Then he'll run you over, even if he has a broken face.
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fwiw, i amz deunks ofs myt ass. ilo vez drinmoinz befotre i post. wha t a hreat ideas.z.
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Old 04-02-2009, 11:43 PM    (permalink
BamaFalcon59
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no, you can quote stats all day, which is why you've failed utterly to respond to an actual argument. but it's not like i'm surprised. i knew you had no idea what you were talking about when you hit submit the first time.
Haha. There hasn't been an actual arguement.

All you've said, in essence, is that Marshall doesn't have touchdowns because the playcalling was bad and they passed constantly in the redzone. Not a good reason. Please, get off the nutsack. The guy gets a TD every 15-20 receptions. That is pathetic.

And elite receivers dictate the offense towards them. If he was amazing enough at the fade, for example, the offense would go to him in the redzone. He obviously hasn't shown that capability to this point.
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Old 04-02-2009, 11:52 PM    (permalink
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Another knock on Marshall- for a guy with his size he should catch more passes in the middle. Could be his fault, could be the playcalling. Either way Moss and Welker are better then he and Royal.

And screw Northcutt and Walker, give me Schilens and Higgins.
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Old 04-03-2009, 12:11 AM    (permalink
BamaFalcon59
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and you've refuted NONE of that. you've simply shouted about stats, which you once again, don't actually understand at all because you have no idea how they originated. it's cool, i understand that you're scared of responding directly to the "ZOMG STATS" counter arguments, but you should just admit that you're a coward, and stop posting in this thread, instead of repeatedly making yourself look bad. better to simply walk away from an argument you're not actually capable of having than to continue to post the same garbage that was discredited pages ago.


It hasn't been proven wrong. The fact remains that he touched the ball more than all but two receivers, yet was tied for twenty second in touchdowns with six other players.

The guy is good on short routes where he can create on his own, but the other parts of his game just aren't there. Not an overwhelming deep threat, not a redzone threat, decent over the middle but not what he should be, and average (at best) hands. He's overrated. He plays in a system that plays perfectly into his best attributes and looks better because of it.
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