San Francisco 49ers Discussion - Page 410

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo? · 10-21-2011, 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

I was saying the same kind of things in years past, and was actually correct about it. This team has been bad for a while, it's not out of the question that my confidence in this team is not very high. And I really won't feel comfortable until the division is truly out of reach and the 49ers win 10 games. Not to mention once we get a passing game. We're headed in the right direction, but my eyes are on the Vince Lombardi trophy and while this team is playing well, I'm not sure they are a Super Bowl contender yet. Oh and Desean Jackson did burn us.

Don't blame you for questioning the 49ers. Like you have stated until SF qualifies questions do still arise. But I feel that you have contradicted yourself on a few occasions:

You on the Tampa Bay game:

Quote:

This is probably the 49ers season right here. If they win this game, they'll be 4-1 for the first time since 2002. If they lose they'll probably finish 8-8 or worse and miss the playoffs. Yes I know they have a two game lead over Arizona and Seattle.

You imply that if SF wins the game it puts them on the same course as our last playoff team. If they lose you believe they finish .500 or miss the playoffs. SF won that game so that would lead me to assume that you feel this team is capable of making the playoffs. I then post the playoff odds (in this thread) from football outsiders and your reply is "Meh".

Same goes for this one:

From the Cowboys game thread

Quote:

Alex didn't look awful, but he still didn't look like a megastar. Which is why his passing numbers are so pedestrian for the second straight week. I just hope he cracks 3,000 yards passing.

Someone in the Lions thread posts that Alex Smith has a chance to reach 3,000 yards and you reply:

Quote:

3000 yards is pretty pedestrian now and days. I mean really, if you aren't over 3,500 yards minimum...well...yeah...especially if you start every game in the season.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo? · 10-21-2011, 04:31 AM

COTF?
http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archiv...alth.html#more

Quote:

Regarding Chase Beeler ... The 49ers re-signed him to the practice squad this week in part because another team wanted to sign the former Stanford center to their practice squad. The 49ers like Beeler and feel that he will only get better after gaining strength during their off-season program. The feeling is mutual. Beeler didn't sign with the team that was pursing him - his agent declined to reveal that team - because he felt his long-tern prospects were best in San Francisco.

edgrenade · 10-21-2011, 04:54 AM

Here are projected numbers for Alex on the rest of the season. Don't know if they have been posted:

Pass Yards: 2907
TD: 21
INT: 5

VAfy-ya · 10-21-2011, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

Well I'm sure the passing game will evolve a little bit as time progresses. Right now, they are truly minimizing Alex's impact on the game. I'm guessing they feel that either Alex can't do what they want the team to potentially do, or that he's just not ready. In other words, our current strategy is the best way we can possibly win. Time will tell if Alex is the man for this team. I'm a little disappointed that they aren't allowing Alex to throw over the middle that much. Either that or Alex just doesn't want to.

Alex doesn't throw over the middle? My biggest gripe with Alex is his vision is limited to the middle of the field. He had a big pass over the middle to Crabs versus the Lions last week, as well as some short throws to VD. All Alex does is throw over the middle. I'd liked to see more passes to the outer hashes because alot of teams cheat when the play us, and force their coverage inside to help contain our TEs.

And I really dont believe the slow development of the passing has anything to do with Harbs not trusting Alex. If he didnt believe he was capable, I dont believe he would be our starter.

dan77733 · 10-21-2011, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49erNation85

How is the quality for that so far ?

Its good and via PS3, in 1080p. However, the game will pause here and there and then it takes a few minutes for the quality to get back to where it should be but overall, im happy and it cost me $85 for Sept. and then $113 for three more months. Add the $25 credit Sony gave everyone after week one and overall, it should cost me $198 for the entire 17 week season. NFL ST on Direct TV costs $340. Saving $142 is damn good even though I was willing to pay the entire $340 since it took me 11 years to finally be able to watch my 49er games.

Also, I was using NetZero DSL for week one which paused like every ten minutes or so. Since then, I have been using Cablevision's Optimum online which has been far better than NetZero DSL and only pauses once or twice a game if that.

For me, the purchase was well worth it and my 49ers are 5-1 so im extremely happy and since I dont know how long that will last, mine as well enjoy it while I can. :)

phlysac · 10-21-2011, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VAfy-ya

Alex doesn't throw over the middle? My biggest gripe with Alex is his vision is limited to the middle of the field. He had a big pass over the middle to Crabs versus the Lions last week, as well as some short throws to VD. All Alex does is throw over the middle. I'd liked to see more passes to the outer hashes because alot of teams cheat when the play us, and force their coverage inside to help contain our TEs.

Just stats... Don't believe it includes last weeks (his worst) game.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/splits...416/alex-smith

Ness · 10-21-2011, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VAfy-ya

Alex doesn't throw over the middle? My biggest gripe with Alex is his vision is limited to the middle of the field. He had a big pass over the middle to Crabs versus the Lions last week, as well as some short throws to VD. All Alex does is throw over the middle. I'd liked to see more passes to the outer hashes because alot of teams cheat when the play us, and force their coverage inside to help contain our TEs.

And I really dont believe the slow development of the passing has anything to do with Harbs not trusting Alex. If he didnt believe he was capable, I dont believe he would be our starter.

Well Harbaugh tried to get Hasselbeck. Really, he didn't have alternative at the time. And he did have a big pass to Crabtree over the middle, but that doesn't change the fact that most of his passes aren't over the middle. Or rather, he doesn't throw that many over the middle.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo? · 10-22-2011, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

Well Harbaugh tried to get Hasselbeck. Really, he didn't have alternative at the time.

It is not like Harbaugh was stuck with Alex Smith. He spent time well before the lockout was official talking up Alex Smith. He could have easily taken the same route as Tennessee, Seattle, or Arizona but instead went with Smith. Did they make a competitive offer to Hasselbeck, yes, but Harbaugh did say he was going to bring in as many QBs as he thought was necessary.

Ness · 10-22-2011, 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?

It is not like Harbaugh was stuck with Alex Smith. He spent time well before the lockout was official talking up Alex Smith. He could have easily taken the same route as Tennessee, Seattle, or Arizona but instead went with Smith. Did they make a competitive offer to Hasselbeck, yes, but Harbaugh did say he was going to bring in as many QBs as he thought was necessary.

Well that would be a smart move knowing that Alex could potentially be your starter with the uncertain future of the NFL looming. Being a new head coach, it's a good idea to get to know your quarterback. The fact that San Francisco tried to get Hasselbeck meant that Alex wasn't the first choice to take over the reins in Jim Harbaugh's offense.

hawkeye123 · 10-22-2011, 02:19 AM

2002
QB - Jeff Garcia
RB - Garrison Hearst/Kevan Barlow
FB - Fred Beasley
LT - Derrick Deese
LG - Dave Fior
C - Jeremy Newberry
RG - Ron Stone
RT - Scott Gragg
TE - Eric Johnson
WR - Terrell Owens
WR - JJ Stokes

LE - Chike Okeafor
LDT - Bryant Young
RDT - Dana Stubblefield
RE - Andre Carter
LOLB - Julian Peterson
MLB - Derek Smith
ROLB - Jaime Winborn/Jeff Ulbrich
CB - Ahmad Plummer
CB - Jason Webster
SS - Tony Parrish
FS - Zack Bronson

2011
QB - Alex Smith
RB - Frank Gore/Kendall Hunter
FB - Bruce Miller
LT - Joe Staley
LG - Mike Iupati
C - Jonathan Goodwin
RG - Adam Snyder
RT - Anthony Davis
TE - Vernon Davis
WR - Michael Crabtree
WR - Ted Ginn Jr

LE - Justin Smith
NT - Isaac Sopoaga
RE - Ray McDonald
LOLB - Ahmad Brooks
ILB - Patrick Willis
ILB - NaVorro Bowman
ROLB - Parys Haralson/Aldon Smith
CB - Carlos Rodgers
CB - Terrel Brown
SS - Donte Whitner
FS - Dashon Goldson

Which is better?

Borat · 10-22-2011, 02:29 AM

2002 .......

abaddon41_80 · 10-22-2011, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

Well that would be a smart move knowing that Alex could potentially be your starter with the uncertain future of the NFL looming. Being a new head coach, it's a good idea to get to know your quarterback. The fact that San Francisco tried to get Hasselbeck meant that Alex wasn't the first choice to take over the reins in Jim Harbaugh's offense.

I don't think we really tried to get Hasselbeck all that hard. IIRC, we said we wouldn't mind trading for him if he came cheap enough but we weren't aggressive in pursuing him.

binary · 10-22-2011, 06:59 AM

There's a cool thread on 49erswebzone where you can see all the defensive/offensive snaps for the last three games. It really gives me an appreciation for our playcalling so far. We really did destroy TB with the pass; they thought we were going to run and the pass opened everything up...when's the last time we had a staff that used the pass to open up the run game? It's been ages.

In the detroit game, it looked like our first play was going to be a bomb too, but vandenbosch killed that real quick lol...goddamn there were a lot of penalties, it was absurd.

binary · 10-22-2011, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Borat

2002 .......

Our D seems way better right now, we have legit pass rushers and linebackers. Plus Fangio >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mora Jr. Derek Smith starting was not a good look either. Garcia, Owens, Hearst, and that oline is a lot of talent to overcome on Offense.

VAfy-ya · 10-22-2011, 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phlysac

Just stats... Don't believe it includes last weeks (his worst) game.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/splits...416/alex-smith

Im curious to know, if screen passes are considered to be sidine passes because I watch every game, several times even, and I dont recall Alex throwing that often to the outside. Intersting stuff though.

A poster on another board had a very intelligent post about Alex and our offense that I thought echoed my sentiments as well....

Quote:

behold the impact of fantasy sports on analysis.

This used to be called "football". you kept your opponent guessing. when he thinks you will run, you pass. when he thinks youll go deep, you throw a screen. when he thinks you are spreading the field, you run up the gut. this was your strategyuntilyoutook the lead. after taking the lead, you focused on controlling the ball and not giving it back to your opponent until you add to your lead.

but today value is judged on the number of fantasy points you generate (300 yds, 40+ attempts) instead of the impact you have when your number is called.

the first play of the game last week, in a tough road game, harbaugh called a deep pass. how in the world is this "trying to hide" alex smith?

phlysac · 10-22-2011, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VAfy-ya

Im curious to know, if screen passes are considered to be sidine passes because I watch every game, several times even, and I dont recall Alex throwing that often to the outside. Intersting stuff though.

I'm sure the RB and WR screens are, indeed "sideline passes."

Quote:

behold the impact of fantasy sports on analysis.

This used to be called "football". you kept your opponent guessing. when he thinks you will run, you pass. when he thinks youll go deep, you throw a screen. when he thinks you are spreading the field, you run up the gut. this was your strategyuntilyoutook the lead. after taking the lead, you focused on controlling the ball and not giving it back to your opponent until you add to your lead.

but today value is judged on the number of fantasy points you generate (300 yds, 40+ attempts) instead of the impact you have when your number is called.

the first play of the game last week, in a tough road game, harbaugh called a deep pass. how in the world is this "trying to hide" alex smith?

^Rationality???? Nonsense ;)

Verloren · 10-22-2011, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ness

Well that would be a smart move knowing that Alex could potentially be your starter with the uncertain future of the NFL looming. Being a new head coach, it's a good idea to get to know your quarterback. The fact that San Francisco tried to get Hasselbeck meant that Alex wasn't the first choice to take over the reins in Jim Harbaugh's offense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by abaddon41_80

I don't think we really tried to get Hasselbeck all that hard. IIRC, we said we wouldn't mind trading for him if he came cheap enough but we weren't aggressive in pursuing him.

I think Baalke tried for Hasselbeck because the team wanted a vet QB in case something went wrong. Salary and what Hasselbeck saw for himself were probably some of the things preventing him from signing/further interest from Baalke.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo? · 10-22-2011, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VAfy-ya

A poster on another board had a very intelligent post about Alex and our offense that I thought echoed my sentiments as well....

Quote:

behold the impact of fantasy sports on analysis.

This used to be called "football". you kept your opponent guessing. when he thinks you will run, you pass. when he thinks youll go deep, you throw a screen. when he thinks you are spreading the field, you run up the gut. this was your strategyuntilyoutook the lead. after taking the lead, you focused on controlling the ball and not giving it back to your opponent until you add to your lead.

but today value is judged on the number of fantasy points you generate (300 yds, 40+ attempts) instead of the impact you have when your number is called.

the first play of the game last week, in a tough road game, harbaugh called a deep pass. how in the world is this "trying to hide" alex smith?

[

]

Agree there are so many more advanced stats out there that show the true value of how an offense is running. Total yardage rankings and stats are basically the equivalent of the RBI stat in baseball. It takes zero into account of situational football.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/info/FO-basics

Quote:

Standard team rankings based on total yardage are inherently flawed.

When you open your newspaper on Sunday morning, you'll see that the little agate-type previews of each game list team rankings by total yardage. That is still how the NFL "officially" ranks teams, but these rankings rarely match up with common sense. That is because total team yardage may be the most context-dependent number in football.

It starts with the basic concept that rate stats are generally more valuable than cumulative stats. Yards per carry says more about a running back's quality than total yardage, completion percentage says more than just a quarterback's total number of completions. The same thing is true for teams; in fact, it is even more important because of the way football strategy influences the number of runs and passes in the game plan. Poor teams will give up fewer passing yards and more rushing yards because opponents will stop passing once they have a late-game lead and will run out the clock instead. For winning teams, the opposite is true. Did Detroit really have a better passing game than San Diego or New England in 2006, or did the Lions have more passing yards because they went 3-13 and thus threw the ball more than any team except for Green Bay, while the Chargers and Patriots were a combined 26-6 and spent a lot of time killing the clock with the running game?

Total yardage rankings are also skewed because some teams play at a faster pace than other teams. In 2009, Houston had 320 more total yards than Indianapolis, but that's not because Houston had the better offense. The Colts ran only 164 offensive drives that year, compared to 180 offensive drives for the Texans.

Pro Football Prospectus 2005, Cleveland chapter
Pro Football Prospectus 2005, New York Jets chapter

Ness · 10-22-2011, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hawkeye123

2002
QB - Jeff Garcia
RB - Garrison Hearst/Kevan Barlow
FB - Fred Beasley
LT - Derrick Deese
LG - Dave Fior
C - Jeremy Newberry
RG - Ron Stone
RT - Scott Gragg
TE - Eric Johnson
WR - Terrell Owens
WR - JJ Stokes

LE - Chike Okeafor
LDT - Bryant Young
RDT - Dana Stubblefield
RE - Andre Carter
LOLB - Julian Peterson
MLB - Derek Smith
ROLB - Jaime Winborn/Jeff Ulbrich
CB - Ahmad Plummer
CB - Jason Webster
SS - Tony Parrish
FS - Zack Bronson

2011
QB - Alex Smith
RB - Frank Gore/Kendall Hunter
FB - Bruce Miller
LT - Joe Staley
LG - Mike Iupati
C - Jonathan Goodwin
RG - Adam Snyder
RT - Anthony Davis
TE - Vernon Davis
WR - Michael Crabtree
WR - Ted Ginn Jr

LE - Justin Smith
NT - Isaac Sopoaga
RE - Ray McDonald
LOLB - Ahmad Brooks
ILB - Patrick Willis
ILB - NaVorro Bowman
ROLB - Parys Haralson/Aldon Smith
CB - Carlos Rodgers
CB - Terrel Brown
SS - Donte Whitner
FS - Dashon Goldson

Which is better?

The offense goes to the 2002 team for sure. I feel better about this defense though. A lot better. Overall I'd have to say 2002 though.

VAfy-ya · 10-24-2011, 06:00 AM

Interesting......strength of schedule through week 6 for all the one loss teams(Packers included)

49ers (5-1) Strength of schedule: .559 (19-15) Opponents: Seahawks, Cowboys, Bengals, Eagles, Buccaneers, Lions

Patriots (5-1) Strength of schedule: .516 (16-15) Opponents: Dolphins, Chargers, Bills, Raiders, Jets, Cowboys

Lions (5-1) Strength of schedule: .500 (17-17) Opponents: Buccaneers, Chiefs, Vikings, Cowboys, Bears, 49ers

Ravens (4-1) Strength of schedule: .444 (12-15) Opponents: Steelers, Titans, Rams, Jets, Texans

Chargers (4-1) Strength of schedule: .346 (9-17) Opponents: Vikings, Patriots, Chiefs, Dolphins, Broncos

Packers (6-0) Strength of schedule: .353 (12-22)

Obviously week 7 games changes things but it was worth noting.

phlysac · 10-27-2011, 12:34 PM

Hype machine through week 7.

Borat · 10-27-2011, 12:40 PM

I'l try and have the new gameday thread up tonight.

49erNation85 · 10-27-2011, 12:59 PM

phlysac,

did you make that? if t so nicely done.We so should have won that Dallas mess.

VAfy-ya · 10-27-2011, 05:21 PM

A look at the 49ers roster and contract status of all 53 players.....

EFA (Exclusive rights free agent) -- Club owns rights to player, and player is not allowed to negotiate with other teams.

RFA (restricted free agent) -- Player can negotiate with other clubs, but original team owns right of first refusal and team would receive draft-pick compensation if it decides not to match offer.

Signed through 2011
OT Alex Boone (EFA) CB Tramaine Brock (EFA) LB Ahmad Brooks LB Blake Costanzo WR Braylon Edwards WR Ted Ginn S Dashon Goldson LB Tavares Gooden LB Larry Grant (RFA) WR Joshua Morgan, injured reserve TE Justin Peelle RG Chilo Rachal CB Carlos Rogers FB Moran Norris QB Alex Smith S Reggie Smith OL Adam Snyder DB C.J. Spillman (RFA) WR Brett Swain DT Will Tukuafu, injured reserve (EFA) S Madieu Williams

Signed through 2012
P Andy Lee NT Ricky Jean Francois DE Isaac Sopoaga CB Shawntae Spencer TE Delanie i

Signed through 2013
K David Akers WR Dontavia Bogan, injured reserve (RFA) LB NaVorro Bowman CB Tarell Brown TE Nate Byham, injured reserve RB Anthony Dixon DT Demarcus Dobbs (RFA) C Jonathan Goodwin LB Parys Haralson DE Justin Smith QB Scott Tolzien (RFA) S Donte Whitner DT Ian Williams (RFA) WR Kyle Williams

Signed through 2014
RB Frank Gore WR Michael Crabtree CB Chris Culliver OT Anthony Davis CB Curtis Holcomb, injured reserve RB Kendall Hunter G Mike Iupati LS Brian Jennings DB Colin Jones QB Colin Kaepernick OL Daniel Kilgore FB Bruce Miller OL Mike Person OLB Aldon Smith

Signed through 2015
TE Vernon Davis DE Ray McDonald

Signed through 2016
LB Patrick Willis

Signed through 2017
OT Joe Staley

http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/niner...36&feedID=5936

Who should be a priority, who should not? Who's most likely to bolt once they hit the market(my guess is Delaine, he's good enough to be a starter in this league and I'm sure he knows it)? Who's dead weight? Let the discussion begin....

abaddon41_80 · 10-27-2011, 06:10 PM

Morgan and Ginn should definitely be the top priorities this offseason, and possibly Alex and Rogers. Morgan is not great but he is consistent and reliable plus a good blocker, like a better Arnaz Battle, and Ginn is incredibly valuable to our special teams. We have to see if Alex and Rogers keep it up before we make a decision on them. I would like to lock Delanie up before the end of next season as well.