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Old 04-23-2009, 07:51 PM    (permalink
CJSchneider
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Ok, this is real fast as I am in a hurry. Lions WMD hit it on the head. Go back and look at Grand Master Flash "The Message" , MC Shan "The Bridge" and Run DMC "It's Like That". Those will give you a good example of the message that rap initially had (btw rap was originally spelled raap and it stood for Rhythmical African American Poetry). It was about the plight of the ghetto life - plain and simple. Over time, rap evolved until, more recently, rap / hip-hop has become more about putting the focus on self.
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Old 04-23-2009, 08:16 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by TitanHope View Post
What kind of an essay is this, Shahin? An opinion paper? A research paper?
an opinion essay. the main premise being how modern hip-hop lacks the defining message that embodied the oldschool hip-hop culture.
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Old 04-23-2009, 08:38 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by yourfavestoner View Post
I suppose you could say that the message changed once corporate America got it's hands on hip-hop and tried to make it more about production than linguistic talent. They've tried to make it appeal to all sorts of people in the form of shallow club music.
that's what i'm trying to get at...but at what point did corporate America take control?
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Old 04-23-2009, 09:54 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by jay cutler's #1 fan View Post
I would argue that music today is much less controlled by "corporate America" than it ever has been. You don't need a multi-million dollar studio to create commercial quality music. You might need money to get spins on MTV but you can create a big enough buzz through the internet to build a fanbase.
i agree with this. a few years ago (lets say 5-10), were people able to create commercial quality music without a great studio?

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Hate on Soulja Boy all you want, but he built his fanbase without the help of any outside financing. That's the new model and the same model that the original rappers had to use because there wasn't any money out there for rap artists. Become hot in your own community and on the internet, and the labels come calling.
i'm going to try and work this into my essay.
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Old 04-23-2009, 10:32 PM    (permalink
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Wish I can help, but it's too late for me to come up with research. Off the top of my head I'd advise to work in some underground artists, and how they have the artistic freedom to still give hip hop a message. You could also work an angle that they sacrifice bigger sales to get their message across.

This is a 5 minute vid that might help.
http://vodpod.com/watch/1531930-cee-...-and-education
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Old 04-23-2009, 10:38 PM    (permalink
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Just walk into your class room and say I made a youtube video song on the topic

use this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzeZhCt5PVA
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Old 04-23-2009, 11:14 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by RaiderNation View Post
Just walk into your class room and say I made a youtube video song on the topic

use this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzeZhCt5PVA
Unhelpful man
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Old 04-23-2009, 11:32 PM    (permalink
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Wish this was my topic.... I gotta write a paper about how Toni Morrison victimizes women in the book The Bluest Eye....

Anyway, I wouldn't say that hip hop doesn't have a message now. It's not as politically charged, as hard-hitting, or as cultural as the message older hip hop artists gave, but regardless, there is still a message.

I mean, come on, African-Americans can only put forth so many songs showing the plight of young black people. Fact is, the times have changed (not much, but nevertheless). I strongly urge you to remember those hip hop artists who still put forth such a message (The Game, T.I. come to mind).

Additionally, rappers put out what sells. If it's the club hit that sells, that's what they'll give them. And no club hits generally do not have a message, they are written simply for the money and radio play. Can you blame rappers for this? I blame us.
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Old 04-23-2009, 11:38 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Byrd430 View Post
Additionally, rappers put out what sells. If it's the club hit that sells, that's what they'll give them. And no club hits generally do not have a message, they are written simply for the money and radio play. Can you blame rappers for this? I blame us.
that's a whole paragraph for me to expand on. +rep for you sir.

edit//soon as i can
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Old 04-24-2009, 12:24 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shahin
an opinion essay. the main premise being how modern hip-hop lacks the defining message that embodied the oldschool hip-hop culture.
For one, the audiences are different generations. Like your post above me says, "I blame us." Not only do we consume what they play, but it's easier for us to do so - more specifically the internet. With resources like that, anyone can put out a song for the public. More rappers and songs, more messages and influences.

Also, you may wanna delve into the stereotype that rap music is all about sex, drugs, violence, or whatever - as I've seen that assumption. It's something all music does. The line goes, "Sex, drugs, and Rock 'n Roll," not "Sex, drugs, and Hip Hop." I think that has racial/cultural ties, but while it's a touchy subject, it's a lengthy one.

Either way, good luck to ya. Procrastinators unite!...tomorrow.
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Damn Ke$ha is sexy.
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Old 04-24-2009, 12:30 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by TitanHope View Post
For one, the audiences are different generations. Like your post above me says, "I blame us." Not only do we consume what they play, but it's easier for us to do so - more specifically the internet. With resources like that, anyone can put out a song for the public. More rappers and songs, more messages and influences.

Also, you may wanna delve into the stereotype that rap music is all about sex, drugs, violence, or whatever - as I've seen that assumption. It's something all music does. The line goes, "Sex, drugs, and Rock 'n Roll," not "Sex, drugs, and Hip Hop." I think that has racial/cultural ties, but while it's a touchy subject, it's a lengthy one.

Either way, good luck to ya. Procrastinators unite!...tomorrow.

thanks man, feel free to add any more insight on the subject as it comes to you.




cuz i'm still writing the damn thing.
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Old 04-24-2009, 12:58 AM    (permalink
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Well, I'm no expert on the subject, so when that happens, I try to think outside the box - which is long for "BS" it. :D

You're being asked to define an entire musical genre. I can go to my Rhapsody account right now, look up an artist, and it will give me a main genre, a sub-genre, and then a sub-sub-genre. Rap/Hip-Hop goes into 14 different sub-genres, ranging from Christian Rap, to East Coast/West Coast/Southern, to Lyrical, to something called "Rapcore." So when you're asked why current Hip-Hop doesn't have a defining message, it's because it has expanded and evolved so much. It's commercial, and when things go commercial, they can lose the basic roots in which they were made. Now, that's not to say Hip-Hop has lost it's history - far from it. But it can be the reason why the message gets lost. Especially when it's going to a mainstream audience from all across the globe...
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Old 04-24-2009, 01:12 AM    (permalink
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dont forget to mention vanilla ice
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Old 04-24-2009, 01:15 AM    (permalink
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Vanilla Ice - Hip-Hop's identity crisis! ;)
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Old 04-24-2009, 01:19 AM    (permalink
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This is the only hip hop yall fools need

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Old 04-24-2009, 01:23 AM    (permalink
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dont forget to mention vanilla ice
His songs had the greatest message ever.
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Old 04-24-2009, 01:33 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by TitanHope View Post
Well, I'm no expert on the subject, so when that happens, I try to think outside the box - which is long for "BS" it. :D

You're being asked to define an entire musical genre. I can go to my Rhapsody account right now, look up an artist, and it will give me a main genre, a sub-genre, and then a sub-sub-genre. Rap/Hip-Hop goes into 14 different sub-genres, ranging from Christian Rap, to East Coast/West Coast/Southern, to Lyrical, to something called "Rapcore." So when you're asked why current Hip-Hop doesn't have a defining message, it's because it has expanded and evolved so much. It's commercial, and when things go commercial, they can lose the basic roots in which they were made. Now, that's not to say Hip-Hop has lost it's history - far from it. But it can be the reason why the message gets lost. Especially when it's going to a mainstream audience from all across the globe...
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Old 04-24-2009, 11:11 AM    (permalink
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Wish this was my topic.... I gotta write a paper about how Toni Morrison victimizes women in the book The Bluest Eye....

Anyway, I wouldn't say that hip hop doesn't have a message now. It's not as politically charged, as hard-hitting, or as cultural as the message older hip hop artists gave, but regardless, there is still a message.

I mean, come on, African-Americans can only put forth so many songs showing the plight of young black people. Fact is, the times have changed (not much, but nevertheless). I strongly urge you to remember those hip hop artists who still put forth such a message (The Game, T.I. come to mind).

Additionally, rappers put out what sells. If it's the club hit that sells, that's what they'll give them. And no club hits generally do not have a message, they are written simply for the money and radio play. Can you blame rappers for this? I blame us.
I can get with that. My beef with the mainstream is lack of variation, and lack of originality. Every song can't be about the same subject matter. To quote my favorite rapper Asheru, "Why don't you talk about your life and all the lessons you learned? You can't always be in the club with money to burn. We're in the last days of time, and it's starting today. I guess your whole plan of action is to party away." That's why I like a guy like Lupe Fiasco. The dude acknowledges that he grew up in a bad neighborhood, but his songs don't reflect the cookie cutter nonsense that most rappers spew out. This guy talks about meeting girls, skateboarding, being a nerd, a little bit of politics, and he even has a song about a guy coming back from the dead zombie style. I wish that most rappers would have that variation instead of doing the same thing that whoever is hot does. But as you pointed out we are the problem. We're the ones that buy it and enable it. It's a good thing that getting access to underground music is easier now. That way we all can have our cake somewhat.
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