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Old 01-29-2010, 09:52 PM    (permalink
EvilNixon
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MF DOOM should not be in the GOAT discussion. Saying he is your personal fav is perfectly fine, but GOAT is a huge stretch.
Greatest of All Time is an opinion.

Why would it be a stretch though? He's got the legendary discography(Madvilliany 1 & 2, MM Food,Operation: Doomsday)

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Old 01-29-2010, 09:57 PM    (permalink
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J.Cole is starting to become extremely overrated. Bland content and overly simplistic.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:03 PM    (permalink
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Greatest of All Time is an opinion.

Why would it be a stretch though? He's got the legendary discography(Madvilliany 1 & 2, MM Food,Operation: Doomsday)
I suppose GOAT is an opinion, but I dont think its really close between MF Doom and guys like Rakim, KRS, Pac, Nas, etc......
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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I suppose GOAT is an opinion, but I dont think its really close between MF Doom and guys like Rakim, KRS, Pac, Nas, etc......
lmaoooo

Rakim is the father of modern ryhme schemes,but he doesn't have the discography. Pac is a better artist than actual rapper. He's only a hair above Gucci Mane in terms of actual rapping ability. KRS? *dead*,Dude was the Master P of his day.

Nas,most definitely is in the convo,and up until a few months ago,I thought he was the GOAT, but his upon review, I really think DOOM, Jay Electronica are better rappers, although they aren't as well known.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:14 PM    (permalink
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lmaoooo

Rakim is the father of modern ryhme schemes,but he doesn't have the discography. Pac is a better artist than actual rapper. He's only a hair above Gucci Mane in terms of actual rapping ability. KRS? *dead*,Dude was the Master P of his day.

Nas,most definitely is in the convo,and up until a few months ago,I thought he was the GOAT, but his upon review, I really think DOOM, Jay Electronica are better rappers, although they aren't as well known.
See, I think impact on hip hop as a whole is a major criteria to be the goat.....if nobody hears your music, I dont think you can be considered the greatest. Whether you were a commercial success or changed hip hop itself, that impact has to be there. Thats just me tho......and KRS was nasty, I have no idea what your listening to.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:14 PM    (permalink
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lmaoooo

Rakim is the father of modern ryhme schemes,but he doesn't have the discography. Pac is a better artist than actual rapper. He's only a hair above Gucci Mane in terms of actual rapping ability. KRS? *dead*,Dude was the Master P of his day.

Nas,most definitely is in the convo,and up until a few months ago,I thought he was the GOAT, but his upon review, I really think DOOM, Jay Electronica are better rappers, although they aren't as well known.

Whoa. Slow down youngster. Doom is one of my all time favorite emcees but I wouldn't consider him in the top 10 all time yet. He is not in the discussion, yet. To be considered in the conversation you don't need just a few good LPs. Doom's discography is very good yes. But the thing Doom doesn't have is the IT factor. The factor in which an emcee has done more than make music. They have a resounding influence on a generation of people who listend to them. Music is not enough to be considered in the discussion. Social influence is needed. Doom has yet to do that. He has a cult following yet hasa not had that influence.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:15 PM    (permalink
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Whoa. Slow down youngster. Doom is one of my all time favorite emcees but I wouldn't consider him in the top 10 all time yet. He is not in the discussion, yet. To be considered in the conversation you don't need just a few good LPs. Doom's discography is very good yes. But the thing Doom doesn't have is the IT factor. The factor in which an emcee has done more than make music. They have a resounding influence on a generation of people who listend to them. Music is not enough to be considered in the discussion. Social influence is needed. Doom has yet to do that. He has a cult following yet hasa not had that influence.
good to know someone agrees, I can always count on BOE!
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:17 PM    (permalink
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Pac is a better artist than actual rapper. He's only a hair above Gucci Mane in terms of actual rapping ability.
You gotta me ****** kidding me
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:17 PM    (permalink
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Whoa. Slow down youngster. Doom is one of my all time favorite emcees but I wouldn't consider him in the top 10 all time yet. He is not in the discussion, yet. To be considered in the conversation you don't need just a few good LPs. Doom's discography is very good yes. But the thing Doom doesn't have is the IT factor. The factor in which an emcee has done more than make music. They have a resounding influence on a generation of people who listend to them. Music is not enough to be considered in the discussion. Social influence is needed. Doom has yet to do that. He has a cult following yet hasa not had that influence.
lol. What you said has nothing to do with actual rapping.

Lyricism
Flow
How you convey your words
Originality

DOOM is elite in all categories.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:18 PM    (permalink
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You gotta me ****** kidding me
Pac was a great artist, but not a great rapper.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:21 PM    (permalink
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But Pac made the general public feel such a wide range of emotions with his songs. Is the the best rapper in terms of the pure criteria, maybe not (although he smokes gucci), but not considering social impact in the GOAT debate is just dumb.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:23 PM    (permalink
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Pac was a great artist, but not a great rapper.
You just compared 2pac to Gucci Mane that is pretty dumb.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:23 PM    (permalink
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lol. What you said has nothing to do with actual rapping.

Lyricism
Flow
How you convey your words
Originality

DOOM is elite in all categories.
actually it does. the influence the people in the GOAT discussion have that influence through there music. if were are talking RAPPERS that in itself is a different discussion.


nas v. doom in all time terms
Lyrics - Nas
Flow - nas
How you convey your words - Nas
Originalty - Nas



THis argument reminds me of that guy who thinks that because Kevin Durant could beat Jordan in a one on one game right now, that means he is greater all time than Jordan.
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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Like I said,he's a fantastic artist. Easily up with the Beatles,Elvis,etc. in terms of music making,but he was a below average rapper. His music and subject matter made him great, not his ability to rap.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:26 PM    (permalink
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ability to rap.
Define rap ability.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:27 PM    (permalink
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actually it does. the influence the people in the GOAT discussion have that influence through there music. if were are talking RAPPERS that in itself is a different discussion.


nas v. doom in all time terms
Lyrics - Nas
Flow - nas
How you convey your words - Nas
Originalty - Nas



THis argument reminds me of that guy who thinks that because Kevin Durant could beat Jordan in a one on one game right now, that means he is greater all time than Jordan.
Nas maybe lyrics, but flow? Nas is stagnant at times,and over rambles without delivering his words with concision. DOOM has the most unique rhyme schemes I've ever heard. His multis,delivery, voice control, all are superior to Nas.

Nas' delivery is piss poor at best.

Originality? Nas' greatest album was Illmatic, an album similar to the ones of his day. No one ***** with MM Food, Madvilliany,etc.

DOOM has been rapping longer than Nas. Your analogy doesn't fit.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:28 PM    (permalink
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Define rap ability.
Flow
Lyricism
Delivery
Voice Control
Rhyme Scheme
Rhyme Set up
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:30 PM    (permalink
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Nas maybe lyrics, but flow? Nas is stagnant at times,and over rambles without delivering his words with concision. DOOM has the most unique rhyme schemes I've ever heard. His multis,delivery, voice control, all are superior to Nas.

Nas' delivery is piss poor at best.

Originality? Nas' greatest album was Illmatic, an album similar to the ones of his day. No one ***** with MM Food, Madvilliany,etc.

DOOM has been rapping longer than Nas. Your analogy doesn't fit.
Nas been rapping since 90. Still rapping. Doom like89ish KMD style then went on like a 5 year brak in the 90s right?
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Last edited by bored of education : 01-29-2010 at 10:32 PM.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:31 PM    (permalink
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Nas been rapping since 90. Still rapping.
DOOM has been rapping since the late 80s lol
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:34 PM    (permalink
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DOOM has been rapping since the late 80s lol
yeah i know but the hiatus and lack of discography and what not. DOOM didnt become really dope til he came back from his hiatus
before it he was decent
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:34 PM    (permalink
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I think Pac really shines in his more mellowed out thoughtful songs. I'm not really a fan of Doom, I can't pass judgement because I haven't listen to nearly enough of him to do so. But from what I have listened to, IMO, he's overrated.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:36 PM    (permalink
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yeah i know but the hiatus and lack of discography and what not. DOOM didnt become really dope til he came back from his hiatus
before it he was decent
His original stuff with KMD was torch fire lol,but he definitely got better with Operation: Doomsday and Madvilliany.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:37 PM    (permalink
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I think Pac really shines in his more mellowed out thoughtful songs. I'm not really a fan of Doom, I can't pass judgement because I haven't listen to nearly enough of him to do so. But from what I have listened to, IMO, he's overrated.
Exactly. Pac made incredible songs. His music making ability is easily the best the genre has ever seen, but he was nowhere near a good rapper.

Why is he overrated?
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:37 PM    (permalink
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His original stuff with KMD was torch fire lol,but he definitely got better with Operation: Doomsday and Madvilliany.
Yeah I really think he didnt hit his musical prowess until he came back from his hiatus.
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<TACKLE> i will ngata give you a bj raji
<+BOE> Scott, with Burfict's character concerns (whether legit or not) you think Pioli would draft him. :D
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-29-2010, 10:39 PM    (permalink
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Yeah I really think he didnt hit his musical prowess until he came back from his hiatus.
He got better as a technical rapper.

Rhyme schemes were original at the times, and his production got soo much better than the early stuff.
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