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Old 04-27-2009, 12:16 PM    (permalink
JPF
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Default Trading next years first rounder...

What's everyone's thoughts on that?
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Old 04-27-2009, 09:30 PM    (permalink
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Great move for you guys. 2010 is gonna be loaded with Defensive talent. Maybe you'll trade Peppers and wind up with Three first rounders!

I have a feeling that Denver's Round 1 pick is gonna be a high one. Should be able to get a very nice player or two.
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Old 04-27-2009, 09:31 PM    (permalink
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LOL. Carolina traded away their 1st round pick. They have zero first round picks for the second successive draft.
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Old 04-27-2009, 10:00 PM    (permalink
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It was a dumbass move. The DEs we couldn't have gotten next year are better than the 6'1 Everette Brown.
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Old 04-27-2009, 11:53 PM    (permalink
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My problem is that I don't feel like we got equal value for the first rounder. A 2nd & a 4th for a first rounder? I don't know, it makes me feel as though either I overvalue a first rounder or that Hurney & Fox undervalue a first rounder.
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Old 04-28-2009, 02:04 AM    (permalink
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Great move for you guys. 2010 is gonna be loaded with Defensive talent. Maybe you'll trade Peppers and wind up with Three first rounders!

I have a feeling that Denver's Round 1 pick is gonna be a high one. Should be able to get a very nice player or two.
Haha.. dammit. Don't know what I was thinking there.

Well, maybe you'll trade off Peppers and pick up a Round 1.
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Old 04-28-2009, 03:18 PM    (permalink
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As both a 49er and Saints fan, I think it was brilliant. :D
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Old 04-28-2009, 03:40 PM    (permalink
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I think it was a great move. Everette Brown is a first round talent who fell to the second round. Even tho he's only 6'1" and 1/2, he has really long arms, being short means he'll have better leverage.
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Old 04-28-2009, 04:17 PM    (permalink
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My question isn't as much about the player we took with the pick as much as it it the value we got for the 1st rounder. A 2nd and 4th seems low.
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Old 04-28-2009, 04:39 PM    (permalink
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My question isn't as much about the player we took with the pick as much as it it the value we got for the 1st rounder. A 2nd and 4th seems low.
When you're the one pressing for the deal, in this case the panthers, you have to give up more so you can convince them to make the deal with you. The first round pick of next year losses value anyway just because it is next year's first rounder and not this years. You're lucky to get what you did. The value is not supposed to be fair, in this case it's much better than what it may seem at first.
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Old 04-28-2009, 04:42 PM    (permalink
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If it makes you feel any better, we asked for a 6th as well and your GM said no.
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Old 04-28-2009, 04:48 PM    (permalink
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I think it was absolutely foolish to trade next years first round pick. You could have had that pick by trading a few picks this year and at the most next years second rounder. Furthermore Everette Brown is still not a guy who I have faith in holding up as a 43 DE. The one positive is that you don't have to pay him big bucks. Also I don't get the first round talent argument. Even with that true, it doesn't excuse you for being raped on the value of the pick. A future first for a mid 30's pick fine, but a future first for a mid 2nd in a weak draft class I'm not so sure. Again this has nothing to do with if Everrette develops into a good player, just value wise you guys kind of got screwed.
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Old 04-28-2009, 04:50 PM    (permalink
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When you're the one pressing for the deal, in this case the panthers, you have to give up more so you can convince them to make the deal with you. The first round pick of next year losses value anyway just because it is next year's first rounder and not this years. You're lucky to get what you did. The value is not supposed to be fair, in this case it's much better than what it may seem at first.
On this point we'll have to disagree. Good insight though, it's the best argument on the other side I've heard.
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Old 04-28-2009, 05:11 PM    (permalink
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On this point we'll have to disagree. Good insight though, it's the best argument on the other side I've heard.
Im just trying to show you how this doesn't look as bad as most of you make it seem as. Say Everette Brown stayed in school for one more year, which he could of. You guys then don't make this deal, and next year will be looking for a DE early. Everette Brown could potentially improve his stock by a lot this time around. Say he's bigger/stronger, more moves this time. He ends up being a top 15 pick and out of reach of the panthers. This way you were able to get him with that 1st round pick, and also got yourself a 4th in there as well.

Not even an argument, but just something to throw out there about value and how where players are drafted is way overrated to how they may actually perform in their respective nfl careers.
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Old 04-28-2009, 06:30 PM    (permalink
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I'm not even talking about the player that was selected, to me that's a totally separate transaction. I'm talking about the value of the picks that they got back for the future 1st rounder.
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Old 04-28-2009, 09:42 PM    (permalink
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I am not to upset about it. At first I was shocked, but after hearing the grade that hurney and many draft sites had on Brown I feel ok with it. If we has fans have confidence our team will be in the playoffs this upcoming year than we will be getting a low first rounder. Plus they can save a little money has they will pay a guy they had a first round grade on 2nd round money instead of a 1st round guy next year. I'm kinda in the middle with this, hopefully it works out.
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Old 04-29-2009, 11:04 AM    (permalink
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After researching it a little and comparing it to other similar trades the past few years, we actually got pretty good value. A lot of teams have only gotten the second rounder, but we got a 4th rounder as well out of it.
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Old 04-29-2009, 07:01 PM    (permalink
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Speculating right now is almost pointless. If Brown does well, no one cares because we essentially got a first round player but we can pay him second round money. If he doesn't, it was a big mistake.

Time will tell.
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Old 05-14-2009, 12:39 PM    (permalink
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Am I the only person who thought this was a pretty good trade for Carolina? If they trade Peppers, they need an end anyways. Even if they don't trade him, he's probably out after this year and the Panthers are spending a first round pick on a defensive lineman. I think most people would agree that on NFL Draft Countdown, he was pretty much a consensus first-round pick. The team is a contender and they just chose to get their young, talented defensive end this year instead of next. If they had traded their 2010 first round pick for say #20 and took him, I bet no one would be complaining. Also, keep in mind the amount of money you pay a first-round pick compared to a second-rounder is generally a good deal higher.
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Old 05-14-2009, 12:52 PM    (permalink
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A panthers fan had posted the last 6 or 7 players picked by Carolina in round 1 and the list was all studs. Based on that I don't really like the trade, simply because it looks like Fox & the FO have done exceptionally well over the years in round 1.

Stictly based on the values I don't mind the deal. But it's hard to look at any deal without considering all the factors.

I'd say it's a decent trade overall because it was a good deal by the numbers (1st for a 2nd & 4th), gained a quality player with high potential at an inexpensive pick, but cost a 1st rounder for a team that has been very successful in round 1.
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Old 05-14-2009, 09:28 PM    (permalink
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If they had traded their 2010 first round pick for say #20 and took him, I bet no one would be complaining.
I agree with that. though i still think they could have gotten a better DE next year then this year but even so they had to draft something and Brown was the best value where they got him in the second round in this draft class
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Old 05-14-2009, 11:08 PM    (permalink
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If you read my posts above ROP, you'll see I was saying the exact same thing. Panthers fans should not be upset over this. Good trade, good value.
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Old 05-14-2009, 11:20 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by JPF View Post
My problem is that I don't feel like we got equal value for the first rounder. A 2nd & a 4th for a first rounder? I don't know, it makes me feel as though either I overvalue a first rounder or that Hurney & Fox undervalue a first rounder.
"Next year" picks don't carry the same weight. All picks have a numerical value attached to them, but "next year" picks are rated at a full round lower.
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Old 05-16-2009, 01:13 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by RavenOfProphecy View Post
Am I the only person who thought this was a pretty good trade for Carolina? If they trade Peppers, they need an end anyways. Even if they don't trade him, he's probably out after this year and the Panthers are spending a first round pick on a defensive lineman. I think most people would agree that on NFL Draft Countdown, he was pretty much a consensus first-round pick. The team is a contender and they just chose to get their young, talented defensive end this year instead of next. If they had traded their 2010 first round pick for say #20 and took him, I bet no one would be complaining. Also, keep in mind the amount of money you pay a first-round pick compared to a second-rounder is generally a good deal higher.
Right, we basically did this with Otah, I just see it was getting our guys a year early, and in this specific case, we get him a lot cheaper.

I kind of view this as Brown IS our '10 first round pick, and that we just get him early.
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Old 05-17-2009, 02:36 AM    (permalink
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It is the kind of move contenders make if they believe that this prospect increases their chances of winning the SB. After all if Carolina wins 10 or 11 games, they will draft pretty late in round 1 so it really didn't cost them that much giving up next year's 1st rounder. I think it was a solid trade as long as next season isn't a disaster.
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