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Old 05-06-2009, 04:18 PM    (permalink
Pat Sims 90
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Default Roy Williams Signed

Just saw on NFL and on Bengals.com that Roy Williams has reached a agreement.

Now do we keep him a S or move him to LB

Either way i like this signing more depth for a Def i see in Top 10 next year
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Old 05-06-2009, 04:25 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Pat Sims 90 View Post
Just saw on NFL and on Bengals.com that Roy Williams has reached a agreement.

Now do we keep him a S or move him to LB

Either way i like this signing more depth for a Def i see in Top 10 next year
Given who the Bengals have drafted at LB the past two years, why not keep him at safety?
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Old 05-06-2009, 04:27 PM    (permalink
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Will be watching from afar to see how this story unfolds. Good Luck.
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Old 05-06-2009, 04:50 PM    (permalink
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Is ay keep him at S
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Old 05-06-2009, 04:56 PM    (permalink
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Seems like a very unnecessary signing, but I guess you can never have enough bodies.
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Old 05-06-2009, 04:59 PM    (permalink
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Seems like a very unnecessary signing, but I guess you can never have enough bodies.
How is it unnecessary we have had Injury problems at S for last couple years this is a great signing for Depth
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Old 05-06-2009, 05:02 PM    (permalink
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I think it is a very good signing. It might seem excessive but we do add depth to safety and with recent injury plagued years, its worth having the bodies. Plus on running downs he would make for a studly S to put in the box with Ndukwe in the back roaming. Adds a lot of flex to our secondary IMO
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Old 05-06-2009, 05:02 PM    (permalink
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Well, you're guaranteed at least one Pro Bowler this year..
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Old 05-06-2009, 05:03 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Lions WMD View Post
Well, you're guaranteed at least one Pro Bowler this year..
And on defense no less lol.
I think he could really return to his former self under Zimmer.
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Old 05-06-2009, 05:03 PM    (permalink
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Well, you're guaranteed at least one Pro Bowler this year..
The SS, not the WR :P


If Roy Williams makes the Pro Bowl, all hell will break lose..
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Old 05-06-2009, 05:25 PM    (permalink
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The SS, not the WR :P


If Roy Williams makes the Pro Bowl, all hell will break lose..
Both Roy William the safety and the receiver have made the probowl. The Safety has actually made 5 probowls, most of which hardcore football fans thought he was undeserving of, there in lies the joke "at least you've got a guaranteed probowler"
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Old 05-06-2009, 05:39 PM    (permalink
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How is it unnecessary we have had Injury problems at S for last couple years this is a great signing for Depth
First off, when I made my original post, I said 'you can never have enough bodies' in reference to the fact that depth can be useful.

Unfortunately for us, we can't predict where our injuries will occur. It's possible every safety on the roster becomes injured this season. It's also possible that no one on the roster becomes injured.

However, right now we have 5 capable safeties, who can more than likely play both FS and SS, in Lynch, White, Ndukwe, Crocker, Hebert. Adding Roy Williams takes that number to 6. Which means there will most definitely be a position battle for the starting safety jobs. In said battle, it's possible we stunt Ndukwe, White, Hebert and Lynch's growth as they get pushed out of the starting / immediate back up positions.

Right now it looks as if Hebert and Lynch will see very little play time outside of special teams. Both of which would be more than adequate to sit in on defense as back ups / for certain packages, meanwhile growing as players.

Now, instead of these players learning the game on the field, they're going to sit behind a strong safety who is 7-8 years into his career and still doesn't know how to cover. Ask any Dallas fan why Roy Williams was let go, and undoubtedly they will tell you how terrible he is at coverage.

The fact that this signing is getting praised so much is direct evidence to how little our fans watch other teams play. At this point, I can only assume that you went on Wikipedia, typed in Roy Williams, saw that he went to 5 Probowls and then rushed back here to tell everyone how great of a signing this was.

Sometimes, one man's trash is another man's treasure. In this case, The Cowboy's trash is now the Bengal's trash, disguised as a golden package.
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:00 PM    (permalink
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Roy's coverage issues came mostly due to lack of secondary help and that he didnt fit well into the new scheme. I am not saying he is a stud in coverage but he is competent. Lynch and Hebert would probably be nothing more than back-ups anyways. White will benefit from having Williams here I think (they both play for big hits).
Systems can have a lot to do with a players success. Maybe the change back to when he did his best will help him.

As for people acting like he is gold, you're acting like he is completely and total trash. I would agree if we ran out a base 3-4 like Dallas has in the past few years.
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:13 PM    (permalink
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1. He was a pro bowler under zimmer...
2. Zimmer says he can do both(cover and run defense)
3. Roy is coming to a run first division so even if he is lacking in coverage, he's in the right division
4. In Zimmer I trust
5. Lynch and Herbert(sp?) are backups...White is coming off a knee injury...
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:15 PM    (permalink
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I don't think Cincy uses a lot of zone blitzes so he could probably play rush end. Anything to keep him out of coverage.
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:16 PM    (permalink
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Roy's coverage issues came mostly due to lack of secondary help and that he didnt fit well into the new scheme. I am not saying he is a stud in coverage but he is competent. Lynch and Hebert would probably be nothing more than back-ups anyways. White will benefit from having Williams here I think (they both play for big hits).
Systems can have a lot to do with a players success. Maybe the change back to when he did his best will help him.

As for people acting like he is gold, you're acting like he is completely and total trash. I would agree if we ran out a base 3-4 like Dallas has in the past few years.
I agree. Terence Newman, Anthony Henry and Ken Hamlin were not good enough support. The scheme change from the 4-3 to the 3-4 completely altered the responsibilities of everyone in the secondary.
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:22 PM    (permalink
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Newman spent a lot of time out.
Hamlin hasn't been there the entire time.
Being in college (without NFL Network) I haven't been able to watch many out of market games. (Lots of Browns and Lions here) so maybe I am wrong. But he was at one point in time, under Zimmer, a really good safety.
I am not calling him the Golden Knight to save our franchise and lift us to a SB, but he is a good signing and will be better than what we have, Lynch hasn't proven anything, Crocker was good but is he a full time guy? Hebert needs to play smarter and not taking as many penalties as I saw him take. (might not have been that many but from the games I saw)

On a side note; D-Unit, who you taking Penn or Florian?
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:50 PM    (permalink
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Newman spent a lot of time out.
Hamlin hasn't been there the entire time.
Being in college (without NFL Network) I haven't been able to watch many out of market games. (Lots of Browns and Lions here) so maybe I am wrong. But he was at one point in time, under Zimmer, a really good safety.
I am not calling him the Golden Knight to save our franchise and lift us to a SB, but he is a good signing and will be better than what we have, Lynch hasn't proven anything, Crocker was good but is he a full time guy? Hebert needs to play smarter and not taking as many penalties as I saw him take. (might not have been that many but from the games I saw)

On a side note; D-Unit, who you taking Penn or Florian?
Is that even a question??? PENN BABY! :)

I hope Roy works out for you guys. He's a good guy. You can't tell me the excuses he has. I've thought of every single one in the book and even made up some in trying to defend him many a time. Happy to wash my hands clean of that. Funny how we as fans will stick up for any player our team acquires. It's a natural born homer characteristic. Roy made many highlight plays for us. He honestly, didn't make the Pro Bowl with zero creditability despite what the haters will say. It's those highlights that will keep you guys happy. At the same time, he gives up too much to keep you happy long enough with those highlights.

He had plenty of time with Newman and Hamlin and still failed. Saying he had a weak supporting cast is not a good excuse. Saying he is slow, slightly overweight and lacking in good coverage instincts is a good excuse.
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Old 05-06-2009, 06:56 PM    (permalink
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Roy's coverage issues came mostly due to lack of secondary help and that he didnt fit well into the new scheme. I am not saying he is a stud in coverage but he is competent. Lynch and Hebert would probably be nothing more than back-ups anyways. White will benefit from having Williams here I think (they both play for big hits).
Systems can have a lot to do with a players success. Maybe the change back to when he did his best will help him.

As for people acting like he is gold, you're acting like he is completely and total trash. I would agree if we ran out a base 3-4 like Dallas has in the past few years.
I think it's to easy of an excuse to blame the entire Dallas secondary for Roy's problems in covering TE's and slot receivers.

As far as Lynch and Hebert go, of course they're back ups, that's the whole point. The reason guys like TJ Houshmanzadeh or Tom Brady come out of late rounds is because you allow them to become back ups. Depth players have to climb the ladder. if you keep adding another rung after each step they take, they'll never finish the ladder.

As far as Zimmer goes, I trust him. He's clearly a very smart man who knows how to get things done. I have extreme doubts that he can do all that much with Roy now, but he's already stated that Roy isn't guaranteed the starting job. Also, Bengals.com said that the deal was short term with a lot of incentives.

And lastly, I don't think Roy is trash, I think the signing is trash. Roy could, and still may be, a productive safety in this league. I just think that his skills could be better utilized on a team with better defensive backs and a better pash rushing unit that can disguise his lack of coverage skills.
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Old 05-06-2009, 07:32 PM    (permalink
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Saying he is slow, slightly overweight and lacking in good coverage instincts is a good excuse.
Now you're just naming things me and Roy have in common and making me like him more. lol
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Old 05-06-2009, 07:53 PM    (permalink
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First off, when I made my original post, I said 'you can never have enough bodies' in reference to the fact that depth can be useful.

Unfortunately for us, we can't predict where our injuries will occur. It's possible every safety on the roster becomes injured this season. It's also possible that no one on the roster becomes injured.

However, right now we have 5 capable safeties, who can more than likely play both FS and SS, in Lynch, White, Ndukwe, Crocker, Hebert. Adding Roy Williams takes that number to 6. Which means there will most definitely be a position battle for the starting safety jobs. In said battle, it's possible we stunt Ndukwe, White, Hebert and Lynch's growth as they get pushed out of the starting / immediate back up positions.

Right now it looks as if Hebert and Lynch will see very little play time outside of special teams. Both of which would be more than adequate to sit in on defense as back ups / for certain packages, meanwhile growing as players.

Now, instead of these players learning the game on the field, they're going to sit behind a strong safety who is 7-8 years into his career and still doesn't know how to cover. Ask any Dallas fan why Roy Williams was let go, and undoubtedly they will tell you how terrible he is at coverage.

The fact that this signing is getting praised so much is direct evidence to how little our fans watch other teams play. At this point, I can only assume that you went on Wikipedia, typed in Roy Williams, saw that he went to 5 Probowls and then rushed back here to tell everyone how great of a signing this was.

Sometimes, one man's trash is another man's treasure. In this case, The Cowboy's trash is now the Bengal's trash, disguised as a golden package.
I can see you don't watch a lot of our games because when Hebert was in he looked worst then Williams every did in Dallas plus White has yet to have a season where he is healthy Nduke has had 1 healthy season since being here Lynch was hurt all last year. So yes i am in total agreement with this signing i figure he will be starting sometime this season because i know from the last couple i can tell we are going to be short at S
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Old 05-06-2009, 07:55 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by lost33cause View Post
1. He was a pro bowler under zimmer...
2. Zimmer says he can do both(cover and run defense)
3. Roy is coming to a run first division so even if he is lacking in coverage, he's in the right division
4. In Zimmer I trust
5. Lynch and Herbert(sp?) are backups...White is coming off a knee injury...
1. He was a Pro Bowler with Darren Woodson beside him and group of quick agile LB (Nguyen and Coakley) in front of him who were very good in coverage. Since there departure, Roy's PB selections were from cowboys homers who don't know any better.

2. Love Zimmer for what he did for the Cowboys when he was here, but he isn't getting the same Roy of 4 years ago. He's less confident, less productive and about 20 lbs heavier.

3. His "run stopping ability" is purely based on reputation. For a guy who is famous for game changing hits and ability in the box, I can't even recall the last time he made a play behind the LOS. But I guess you could call his horsecollar tackles game changing in a way.

4. Zimmer is indeed the man.
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Old 05-06-2009, 10:15 PM    (permalink
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I'm going to get destroyed with finals tomorrow so I can't ramble on tonight... I will say this, they are signing him because they think he can be at least close to his old self. Safety obviously isn't a need really and we also have depth so this is a quality signing in their eyes. Zimmer much still be affectionate about him.

Zimmer is yet to let me down so I'm not really against it. I will say our depth on defense is pretty nasty at this point (less CB), way better off than the offense.
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Old 05-06-2009, 11:52 PM    (permalink
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I believe one of our S's will be playing a bit of nickel this season hence the Williams signing. I like the Williams signing because it gives us a Vet on the defense.
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Old 05-07-2009, 12:09 AM    (permalink
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At first I didn't like the signing. The defense is better with Ndukwe in there and I didn't want them to bring in Williams and take snaps away from Chinny.

However, they know what they're doing. This front office has had one hell of an offseason. I trust that they'll make it work.

Plus if he could knock that smile of Hines' face, that would make the signing worth it right there.
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