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Old 02-27-2010, 03:56 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by thenewfeature06 View Post
Not that surprising, jury is still out on Bush though. He actually showed he can lower his shoulder and run physically in the playoffs this year but as high as he was drafted if he doesn't break out next year- BUST CITY
Bush will never be considered a bust, but will never live up to the hype he had leaving college.
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Old 02-27-2010, 04:39 PM    (permalink
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I would not consider Reggie a bust up to this point. Has he lived up to his potential? No. Has he produced? In four years he is averaging (almost) 1,000 yards and 7 TDs a season. While that is not what one would hope for out of a #2 overall pick, it definitely is not something to write off.
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Old 02-27-2010, 04:55 PM    (permalink
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Bush will never be considered a bust, but will never live up to the hype he had leaving college.
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Old 02-27-2010, 05:20 PM    (permalink
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I would not consider Reggie a bust up to this point. Has he lived up to his potential? No. Has he produced? In four years he is averaging (almost) 1,000 yards and 7 TDs a season. While that is not what one would hope for out of a #2 overall pick, it definitely is not something to write off.
I'm sorry, but in what universe is 1000 total yards from scrimmage and 7 touchdowns productive? Especially from the second overall pick?

No other runningback besides Mojo has been as productive, huh?

Deangelo Williams has. Joseph Addai has (hell, he actually rushed for 1000 and helped the Colts win the SB his rookie year).

His production is similar to that of Leon Williams, another utility back who was selected (appropriately) in round 4.

He gets a lot of receptions. Great. As Diab noted, the NO offense doesnt lose a beat whether he's playing or not.
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Old 02-27-2010, 06:39 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by WinslowBodden View Post
Bush will never be considered a bust, but will never live up to the hype he had leaving college.
Once again I give him next year. Showed signs of being an all around player but consistently? not so much.
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Old 02-27-2010, 09:32 PM    (permalink
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He's been injured a lot. He had a heel injury for the first 12 games of his rookie year(check the game splits) and he had knee problems in year 2-3 and was still recovering from major microfracture surgery into this year, and finally fully recovered and stayed healthy down the stretch, and into the playoffs, where he was dynamite.

It's so stupid that people say he can't run between the tackles, when it's the outside runs that get him in trouble. Did he just grow the ability to break tackles in the postseason this year? Everyone seems to think he only ran hard in the playoffs this year, when he ran hard all year, they just only saw the playoff game.

Reggie keeps getting nicked up and banged up, and even had serious knee injuries, but when he's healthy, he's a gamechanger.

If he was a bust, the Saints wouldn't be paying his 8 million dollar tag, lol.
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Old 02-27-2010, 10:42 PM    (permalink
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He's been injured a lot. He had a heel injury for the first 12 games of his rookie year(check the game splits) and he had knee problems in year 2-3 and was still recovering from major microfracture surgery into this year, and finally fully recovered and stayed healthy down the stretch, and into the playoffs, where he was dynamite.

It's so stupid that people say he can't run between the tackles, when it's the outside runs that get him in trouble. Did he just grow the ability to break tackles in the postseason this year? Everyone seems to think he only ran hard in the playoffs this year, when he ran hard all year, they just only saw the playoff game.

Reggie keeps getting nicked up and banged up, and even had serious knee injuries, but when he's healthy, he's a gamechanger.

If he was a bust, the Saints wouldn't be paying his 8 million dollar tag, lol.
He's been a bust thus far. He hasn't been able to beat out of a over the hill running back and now he can't beat out a guy that wasn't even drafted. He isn't nearly as explosive as people like to think and he has a serious fumble problem.

The record of most catches for rookie is worthless. No different than Larry Centers outstanding season where he had a 100 catches for the Cardinals.

He's been healthy plenty over the past four years and hasn't been a gamechanger yet. Exactly how many games has he really changed?
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Old 02-28-2010, 12:50 AM    (permalink
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He's been a bust thus far. He hasn't been able to beat out of a over the hill running back and now he can't beat out a guy that wasn't even drafted. He isn't nearly as explosive as people like to think and he has a serious fumble problem.

The record of most catches for rookie is worthless. No different than Larry Centers outstanding season where he had a 100 catches for the Cardinals.

He's been healthy plenty over the past four years and hasn't been a gamechanger yet. Exactly how many games has he really changed?
He's been hurt for more games than he was healthy.

Keep it coming though big guy.
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Old 02-28-2010, 12:55 AM    (permalink
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Once again I give him next year. Showed signs of being an all around player but consistently? not so much.
Bust is Mike Williams, Akili Smith, Ryan Leaf ETC.

Not living up to the massive amount of hype is Reggie, but then again he's on a team that doesn't really depend on him so how can you measure it.
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Old 02-28-2010, 01:05 AM    (permalink
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Bust is Mike Williams, Akili Smith, Ryan Leaf ETC.

Not living up to the massive amount of hype is Reggie, but then again he's on a team that doesn't really depend on him so how can you measure it.

This.

And relative to expectations, Reggie has been disappointing, but everything hasn't been in his favor and our "scheme" didn't do his rushing numbers any favor, until this season. Sean Payton figured out that trick plays don't get it done, stacked the line with the big boys and ran Reggie up thegut and let him slash through. Result? 5.6 yards per carry.

Oh, and Pierre Thomas is a beast, don't give me that "he can't beat out an undrafted guy" thing, he was averaging over 6 yards per carry like halfway through t he season, with his longest run being 34 yards.

Our RB situation is awesome! hate on it!
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Old 02-28-2010, 01:45 AM    (permalink
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By tge way, Pierre Thomas started over Mendenhall his entire college career right? He's no bum.
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Old 02-28-2010, 03:20 AM    (permalink
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By tge way, Pierre Thomas started over Mendenhall his entire college career right? He's no bum.
Correct. Kept Mendenhall on the bench. It'll be interesting to see if a team bites on the 2nd round tender...
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Old 02-28-2010, 03:25 AM    (permalink
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Correct. Came Mendenhall on the bench. It'll be interesting to see if a team bites on the 2nd round tender...
I'm kinda torn on that :(

A second rounder this year would be really nice for a RB... deep draft, and Pierre isn't the pillar of health, even splitting carries and being young, and his shelf life probably wouldn't be very long...

Either way, he's a beast and I love him, I'd be torn if we lost him.
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Old 02-28-2010, 03:28 AM    (permalink
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It would definitely hurt to lose PT imo. And, if we lose him and Bell (who I think is as good as gone) then I think it opens a window of signing LT. But, I wish he was tendered for a 1st rounder rather than a second. I could easily see a team needing a RB (Detroit comes to mind) signing him.
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Old 02-28-2010, 11:26 AM    (permalink
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I'll give you guys that PT has been a solid player and is an above average to very good back.

However, Bush still sat behind Duece as he was running on one wheel and averaging 3.5 yards per carry.

You can skew numbers to fit any arguement but the fact is without Payton's creative gameplans - Bush wouldn't play. A couple long runs have boasted Reggie's yard per carry average. Don't ignore the fumbles either because he seems to have two for every "big play" he makes.

The number two pick comes with high expectations and considering DeAngelo Williams, Maurice Jones Drew and Joseph Addai have had more productive seasons at less than half the cost, I am labeling him a bust. No it isn't in Ryan Leaf's category but he's still a bust to date.

Considering that guys like Sproles, Matt Forte, Jamaal Charles, Marion Barber and Frank Gore were taken in the middle rounds and guys like Ray Rice and Maurice Jones Drew were second round selection, if you are going to be a top 10 pick at running back and not be considered a bust you'd better be putting up Adrian Peterson (7th pick) or Chris Johnson (24th pick) type results.

Unless Reggie has a Benson type turnaround (which I dont see and can't see how anybody can either) he is going to be the worst top ten running back selection since Curtis Enis in 1998.

BTW, I'm not hating at all - Your offense is incredible and your on top of the world right now. Congrats. I'm just being realistic with Reggie. I not going to argue with paying 8 million since he brings so much hype, jersey sales and advertising money. But don't fool yourself thinking he is a good football player.
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Old 02-28-2010, 11:40 AM    (permalink
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Sean Peyton doesn't make the decision whether Bush stays. The GM and Tom Benson do.
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Old 02-28-2010, 01:31 PM    (permalink
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I'll give you guys that PT has been a solid player and is an above average to very good back.

However, Bush still sat behind Duece as he was running on one wheel and averaging 3.5 yards per carry.

You can skew numbers to fit any arguement but the fact is without Payton's creative gameplans - Bush wouldn't play. A couple long runs have boasted Reggie's yard per carry average. Don't ignore the fumbles either because he seems to have two for every "big play" he makes.

The number two pick comes with high expectations and considering DeAngelo Williams, Maurice Jones Drew and Joseph Addai have had more productive seasons at less than half the cost, I am labeling him a bust. No it isn't in Ryan Leaf's category but he's still a bust to date.

Considering that guys like Sproles, Matt Forte, Jamaal Charles, Marion Barber and Frank Gore were taken in the middle rounds and guys like Ray Rice and Maurice Jones Drew were second round selection, if you are going to be a top 10 pick at running back and not be considered a bust you'd better be putting up Adrian Peterson (7th pick) or Chris Johnson (24th pick) type results.

Unless Reggie has a Benson type turnaround (which I dont see and can't see how anybody can either) he is going to be the worst top ten running back selection since Curtis Enis in 1998.

BTW, I'm not hating at all - Your offense is incredible and your on top of the world right now. Congrats. I'm just being realistic with Reggie. I not going to argue with paying 8 million since he brings so much hype, jersey sales and advertising money. But don't fool yourself thinking he is a good football player.
Thank you.

I also like how being hurt a lot is an argument FOR him and not againt him.
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Old 02-28-2010, 02:36 PM    (permalink
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Sean Peyton doesn't make the decision whether Bush stays. The GM and Tom Benson do.
You'd be absolutely foolish to think that Sean Payton does not get a say in whether Bush stays or not.
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Old 02-28-2010, 03:17 PM    (permalink
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Thank you.

I also like how being hurt a lot is an argument FOR him and not againt him.

It's not, it's just the biggest reason why he's been disappointing.

He averaged 3.5 yards per carry as a rookie. It was below 3 yards per carry in the injured games, and over 4.8 in the healthy games.

Please explain to me how I'm "skewing" numbers, do you even know what the word means?

As for the fumbles, he's only had a real issue with it in one season, and it doesn't get to us as much because a fair share of his fumbles are on stupid things like botched double reverses, and muffed punts.

Honestly though, we don't really care if other fans don't like Reggie Bush, it's clear you can see who actually watches games and who looks at box scores. I want the best players possible on the Saints, I'm not going to defend a bad player, no matter the circumstances.

I'd still like to know what these "creative" runs are that allow Bush to see the field. Is it the reverses and elaborate trick plays that drag the YPC down when it's botched and we lose like 8 yards?

Maybe you mean how he takes the most natural receiver at RB and sends him further than 10 yards like 4 times in his entire career?

I dunno, I just always felt the running scheme was really off for his skill set, and the play calling(the stuff you guys think is the runs he needs) really hurt him as a back, and this year, they just ran him like a normal runner, and he had the highest YPC on the team.

And Pierre Thomas is a STUD.
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fwiw, i amz deunks ofs myt ass. ilo vez drinmoinz befotre i post. wha t a hreat ideas.z.

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Old 02-28-2010, 03:26 PM    (permalink
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Maybe you mean how he takes the most natural receiver at RB and sends him further than 10 yards like 4 times in his entire career?
Don't get me started on that issue. It frustrates me that Bush isn't used down the field more.
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Old 02-28-2010, 03:28 PM    (permalink
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No flyboy, haven't you heard? He is used PERFECTLY and still sucks ass!!
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Old 03-01-2010, 06:30 PM    (permalink
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It's not, it's just the biggest reason why he's been disappointing.

He averaged 3.5 yards per carry as a rookie. It was below 3 yards per carry in the injured games, and over 4.8 in the healthy games.

Please explain to me how I'm "skewing" numbers, do you even know what the word means?

As for the fumbles, he's only had a real issue with it in one season, and it doesn't get to us as much because a fair share of his fumbles are on stupid things like botched double reverses, and muffed punts.

Honestly though, we don't really care if other fans don't like Reggie Bush, it's clear you can see who actually watches games and who looks at box scores. I want the best players possible on the Saints, I'm not going to defend a bad player, no matter the circumstances.

I'd still like to know what these "creative" runs are that allow Bush to see the field. Is it the reverses and elaborate trick plays that drag the YPC down when it's botched and we lose like 8 yards?

Maybe you mean how he takes the most natural receiver at RB and sends him further than 10 yards like 4 times in his entire career?

I dunno, I just always felt the running scheme was really off for his skill set, and the play calling(the stuff you guys think is the runs he needs) really hurt him as a back, and this year, they just ran him like a normal runner, and he had the highest YPC on the team.

And Pierre Thomas is a STUD.
I never said you were skewing numbers, dude.

But riddle me this? What does Reggie Bush give your team that Leon Washington (selected 4th round) wouldn't have?

Also, knowing what type of player he is now, would you guys draft him second overall again? Granted, looking back at that class, the only worthwile alternatives would be D'Brickashaw Ferguson and Haloti Ngata (the 06 class, billed one of the best in recent years, is turning out to be kinda poopy huh?).

Yes, the team has found a niche for him, finally. He's a nice player. He does some things really well. He's just not 2nd overall pick/$8 million material. He never was, and he'll likely never live up to those expectations.

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Old 03-01-2010, 07:01 PM    (permalink
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His production is similar to that of Leon Williams, another utility back who was selected (appropriately) in round 4.
Do you mean Leon Washington? Leon Williams I think is a LB on the Browns.
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Old 03-01-2010, 07:02 PM    (permalink
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Do you mean Leon Washington? Leon Williams I think is a LB on the Browns.
Leon can't do everything.
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Old 03-01-2010, 07:18 PM    (permalink
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Do you mean Leon Washington? Leon Williams I think is a LB on the Browns.
Yes, yes, Leon Washington.
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