The 2011 Cowboys Draft Thread - Page 26

princefielder28 · 01-11-2011, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macarthur

What do you mean by project? I don't think much of backs as projects. They can either run and catch or they can't. He seems to me to be an interesting guy for us for depth, screen passes, returner, etc.

by project (as in projection) i mean his skill set suggests that he will be most similar to Darren Sproles

Macarthur · 01-11-2011, 04:30 PM

Ok. I thought you meant project in that it would take you a couple of years to get any use out of him. :)

Well hell, if he's like Sproles, why not use a 2nd on him!

xxxxxxxx · 01-11-2011, 04:46 PM

With Harbaugh in San Fran now, I really think that eliminates them from taking anything but a QB. Think about it. He is a QB guru, being a former all pro in the NFL at QB and his history with andrew luck, and the 49ers have the base if a playoff team, just need a QB.

With the QB hungry teams in the top 10, fairley, dareus, AJ green, bowers, Quinn, and you never know who else, there is a CHANCE that Peterson could fall to us, and I'm almost positive Prince will be there on the board at #9.

Macarthur · 01-11-2011, 05:06 PM

I think the chance Peterson falls to us is 0.0000001%. :)

Seriously, he won't make it to us.

E-Man · 01-11-2011, 05:46 PM

I don't think that Peterson falls to 9, but he may not time and interview well and it could cause him to slip a little. Maybe the debate over where to place him due to size causes him to slip a little. All it really takes to slip is to be on a bad trend for whatever reason. It's a long time until April, and many things could happen.

D-Unit · 01-11-2011, 08:00 PM

We need to get Peterson OR Asomough. Period.

thule · 01-11-2011, 08:03 PM

I've set my heart on this draft for Prince. Everything you want on the field and off the field. Natural born leader. He's my #2 safety prospect behind Peterson who is a more of a tweener to me.

You can't do much in the NFL without a talented safety. All the elite teams have them. We have nothing...IDC if you think he is a project...it's easy to go with the norm and say that. But fact of the matter is he is a very similar prospect to Antrel Rolle coming out and Malcolm Jenkins. Last year whispers were out about slower than advertised and wait a couple of months and you'll be hearing it again. Watch the difference of NO defense with and without Jenkins....

This isn't really fair but I feel it's worth mentioning as it proves my point more. Antrel Rolle goes to the NYG and all of a sudden he makes an impact. Farwell definitely had a huge roll in turning that defense around but Rolle was brought in and allowed them to do more things. You can't underestimate the roll of a safety in todays NFL. We haven't had a safety since Woodson and it's about time. Prince at 9 to play Balls spot. Then probably just keep Sensy unless you can get better in FA which I highly doubt.

No matter what arguments are made i'll bet the kitchen sink we go BPA. Dareus and Prince are borderline blue chip prospects and their stocks are probably as high as they are going to get. Dareus might workout ok...but his knocks are effort on the field...not exactly something he can do anything about now.

Nice mention of Jordan above....people are sleeping on him...he's a better prospect in my eyes than Aluau last year. He's a day one starter...but he's definitely not in that blue chip talk. He's a guy that I target if we move down 5 slots tho. He dominanted every front he went against this year...2nd best DL in the country imo. Close between him and JJ Watt....both guys are hell of players but they don't have those elite physical attributes that guys like Suh/Fairley have. But as far as on the field with pads on the drop off isn't as big as you would seem. Watt and Jordan might not give you as much in a big time game...but they always give their top effort....so from a consistency standpoint you grade them a little higher.

xxxxxxxx · 01-11-2011, 09:17 PM

Thule, I respect you greatly as a poster, but like I've said before, PRINCE AND PETERSON ARE CORNERBACKS. They were all americans in college at that position. They aren't like malcolm jenkins or Rolle, they CAN run.

I'm tired of all this switch them to safety crap. They are CB's. I guarantee 100% if we got one they would play as a CB. It's really starting to piss me off now. They are corners, end of story.

DMWSackMachine · 01-11-2011, 10:42 PM

So were Rolle and Jenkins. Our own AOA was also a CB and is now a S. There is a long history of taking college CBs and moving them to safety, even at the top of the draft. It seems to me that Amukamara is a little on the small side to play the safety position, but if he's capable of making that transition, I say you take him and see. We have a glaring need at safety, and a need at corner, so either way it's a win for us. You take him, get him into the facility as soon as the CBA will let you, and then fill in the other spot depending on where you think he will be best. I love the idea of adding him either way.

thule · 01-12-2011, 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CDCB14

Thule, I respect you greatly as a poster, but like I've said before, PRINCE AND PETERSON ARE CORNERBACKS. They were all americans in college at that position. They aren't like malcolm jenkins or Rolle, they CAN run.

I'm tired of all this switch them to safety crap. They are CB's. I guarantee 100% if we got one they would play as a CB. It's really starting to piss me off now. They are corners, end of story.

Jenkins improved on his 4.55 time from the combine by running in the 4.46-4.51 range during pro day.

Antrel Rolle ran 4.49 and 4.53 at the combine. Pro Day workout, he ran in the 4.4s.

I'll make a sig bet with you that you/I have to wear from the combine till the beginning of the season.

If he has two runs under 4.45 you win....I wear sig
If he has only one run under 4.45 it's a push.
If he has two runs above 4.45 I win...You wear the sig.

Lastly both people acknowledge in this thread that the person that won is better and knows more about prospects than the other haha.

xxxxxxxx · 01-12-2011, 08:27 AM

4.47 and you've got a deal. I love the flash btw, my favorite superhero.

With all the buzz lately, I really think prince will be starring us in the face at #9. He basically is Asomugha. They even have complicated names. Prince actually just has better size.

I'll say its one of the most likely scenario's at this point. He will probably be there, and be close to BPA. We'll see if they take him.

Again, 4.47 and you've got a deal.

Morton · 01-12-2011, 08:47 AM

I bet he runs a 4.8 at the combine.

xxxxxxxx · 01-12-2011, 09:38 AM

I bet you'll have some positive rep soon! It's cool to troll at 9 a.m.!!!! YEAH BRO!!!

Morton · 01-12-2011, 09:49 AM

Forum rep - something that matters alot in the end.

bigbluedefense · 01-12-2011, 12:58 PM

The way the board is shaping up, I think either Peterson or Prince should fall to #9. Chances are it will be Prince, but still, great player regardless. I'd be excited about either one.

If both are gone, I think moving back and aquiring picks is a very doable scenario. And probably the smart move if both those guys are gone.

DMWSackMachine · 01-12-2011, 01:03 PM

Tyron Smith moving up. Kevin Weidl from ESPN's Scout's Inc. just published a piece on him:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/blog?...aft&id=6014958

This after 4 consecutive tweets raving about his natural ability and upside. Dude thinks he's a top 15 pick at least, and if scouts concur and he does have the tools he's attributing to him, I can see him sneaking into the top 10. Maybe we go for him if Prince and our top DTs are gone?

LonghornsLegend · 01-12-2011, 01:20 PM

Big Smith fan here, D I think did a nice write up on him awhile back as he usually does. I think he's a great trade back option, maybe to the 12-15 range. We could get a nice package in that scenario and I really wouldn't mind getting our bookend tackles for the next 10 years.

bigbluedefense · 01-12-2011, 01:27 PM

You guys don't like Clairborne or Heyward?

I LOVE Heyward. I wouldn't even mind him on the Giants as a DT/DE hybrid in our scheme.

jbsg02 · 01-12-2011, 02:14 PM

I think Prince's 40 time determines where he goes in draft

romo4prez415 · 01-12-2011, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thule

I've set my heart on this draft for Prince. Everything you want on the field and off the field. Natural born leader. He's my #2 safety prospect behind Peterson who is a more of a tweener to me.

You can't do much in the NFL without a talented safety. All the elite teams have them. We have nothing...IDC if you think he is a project...it's easy to go with the norm and say that. But fact of the matter is he is a very similar prospect to Antrel Rolle coming out and Malcolm Jenkins. Last year whispers were out about slower than advertised and wait a couple of months and you'll be hearing it again. Watch the difference of NO defense with and without Jenkins....

This isn't really fair but I feel it's worth mentioning as it proves my point more. Antrel Rolle goes to the NYG and all of a sudden he makes an impact. Farwell definitely had a huge roll in turning that defense around but Rolle was brought in and allowed them to do more things. You can't underestimate the roll of a safety in todays NFL. We haven't had a safety since Woodson and it's about time. Prince at 9 to play Balls spot. Then probably just keep Sensy unless you can get better in FA which I highly doubt.

No matter what arguments are made i'll bet the kitchen sink we go BPA. Dareus and Prince are borderline blue chip prospects and their stocks are probably as high as they are going to get. Dareus might workout ok...but his knocks are effort on the field...not exactly something he can do anything about now.

Nice mention of Jordan above....people are sleeping on him...he's a better prospect in my eyes than Aluau last year. He's a day one starter...but he's definitely not in that blue chip talk. He's a guy that I target if we move down 5 slots tho. He dominanted every front he went against this year...2nd best DL in the country imo. Close between him and JJ Watt....both guys are hell of players but they don't have those elite physical attributes that guys like Suh/Fairley have. But as far as on the field with pads on the drop off isn't as big as you would seem. Watt and Jordan might not give you as much in a big time game...but they always give their top effort....so from a consistency standpoint you grade them a little higher.

Bingo! This is what I've been saying. Very good post and watching playoff football is making it more evident that safety is the biggest issue not corner. Prince is a pro bowl safety and I actually think he's a better safety than Peterson who I saw making some business decisions in the bowl game. We already have enough of those guys. Amukamara is the type of player and character we need on our team. Getting a safety like him and then a NT like Aubrayo Franklin or Paul Solai would make the biggest impact on our team and it could happen if either Nolan or Manusky come here as a defensive coordinator.

D-Unit · 01-12-2011, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMWSackMachine

Tyron Smith moving up. Kevin Weidl from ESPN's Scout's Inc. just published a piece on him:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/blog?...aft&id=6014958

This after 4 consecutive tweets raving about his natural ability and upside. Dude thinks he's a top 15 pick at least, and if scouts concur and he does have the tools he's attributing to him, I can see him sneaking into the top 10. Maybe we go for him if Prince and our top DTs are gone?

That's MA BOY!!!! :D

Smith is a player that this team won't look at because our OL philosophy is stuck in the 90s. Our team will probably rank Marcus Cannon ahead of Tyron Smith seeing as we prefer bulk over athleticism.

BAM1988 · 01-13-2011, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D-Unit

That's MA BOY!!!! :D

Smith is a player that this team won't look at because our OL philosophy is stuck in the 90s. Our team will probably rank Marcus Cannon ahead of Tyron Smith seeing as we prefer bulk over athleticism.

I think Doug Free's success this past year might finally break that mold of the mammouth lineman. Free consistently showed the ability to shed lineman and work up to the second level, while also having the strength to maintain blocks when the play was designed to go his way.

The problem in this past year was the ability of "Quicker" defenders to penetrate the interior lineman and stop the play before it could develop. Im sure the coaches and scouts are in the process of reviewing the the tapes of the season and should notice the same problems. At this point I personally see the interior lineman as more of a liability then Colombo. Yes, the position could use an upgrade, but the offense is stacked with well blocking TE's and backs who can help chip of the edge.

Unfortuately, the scouting department never seems to value the o-line as first round value. If they were to target a tackle I would prefer Nate Solder in the lower first round. He is similar prospect to what Doug Free was coming out; both former tight ends with quick feet and above average athlecism. Solder does need to continue to add bulk and play with better leverage, but has the ability to start at RT from day one. Plus trading down lower would provide the team with a better package of picks while still filling a need.

Interior wise Mike Pouncey makes alot of sense, the scouting department graded his brother Maurkice as the 19th overall prospect on the big board last year, and Mike is very a very similar player. Pouncey has the versatility to play either guard or center and could potentially challenge Kosier/Gurode for their jobs.

D-Unit · 01-13-2011, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BAM1988

I think Doug Free's success this past year might finally break that mold of the mammouth lineman. Free consistently showed the ability to shed lineman and work up to the second level, while also having the strength to maintain blocks when the play was designed to go his way.

The problem in this past year was the ability of "Quicker" defenders to penetrate the interior lineman and stop the play before it could develop. Im sure the coaches and scouts are in the process of reviewing the the tapes of the season and should notice the same problems. At this point I personally see the interior lineman as more of a liability then Colombo. Yes, the position could use an upgrade, but the offense is stacked with well blocking TE's and backs who can help chip of the edge.

Unfortuately, the scouting department never seems to value the o-line as first round value. If they were to target a tackle I would prefer Nate Solder in the lower first round. He is similar prospect to what Doug Free was coming out; both former tight ends with quick feet and above average athlecism. Solder does need to continue to add bulk and play with better leverage, but has the ability to start at RT from day one. Plus trading down lower would provide the team with a better package of picks while still filling a need.

Interior wise Mike Pouncey makes alot of sense, the scouting department graded his brother Maurkice as the 19th overall prospect on the big board last year, and Mike is very a very similar player. Pouncey has the versatility to play either guard or center and could potentially challenge Kosier/Gurode for their jobs.

I'd like to think that Free's success could open eyes, but I think that's more hopeful than realistic. I'll need to see it before I believe it.

As for Solder, cross me off as a fan. I agree that he is similar to Free coming out. So yeah, if we could get him in the 4th round, then I would do it. But he's severely overrated right now. He's got a steep development curve.

I'd like Pouncey a lot. But he's not coming here either. Too athletic for our tastes. I see us going for Moffitt in the 3rd to play C/G.

D-Unit · 01-13-2011, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baghdadbob

Ya think so?

So tell us about yourself baghdadbob. I'm interested to hear your story. The reason why some of the members here may seem to put words in your mouth is because we had a previously banned member who went by the name bob. He was banned multiple times with different usernames, but we always knew it was him the way he spoke. So you've got to know that by creating your username, folks here will easily think of you as the old bob. Especially when there are times that you sound like him. ... like your post above. Sarcastic.

DMWSackMachine · 01-13-2011, 08:25 PM

You guys are talking as if Dallas has been positioned--both slot and need wise--to draft a top OT and has passed. Name me a year when need and opportunity crossed paths and we said "Nah, I don't think so..." You can't. Until this year, we'd had a great OL since 2007, plus we'd been drafting in the bottom 10 picks basically every year. In 2006 there wasn't one worthy, in 2005 we got DeMarcus and in 2004 we traded back with Buffalo...and nabbed the biggest draft bust in Parcells entire regime: Jacob Rogers, OT.

I can absolutely see Dallas going after either Pouncey (in the event of a trade back), Smith (probably have to stay put to get him after its all said and done), or Solder if the board shakes out the right way. I still think that best case for us is if Prince falls, and I'm starting to fall in love with Cam Jordan as the next best alternative. But don't count us out from taking a stud OT if that's the best option available. I don't think we have any such hangups.