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Old 01-17-2011, 05:06 AM    (permalink
Halsey
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Originally Posted by yo123 View Post
29 that weren't on 3rd downs or situations that they really needed. Not to mention that that was on 45 attempts. Come on man you have to come with more than that.
Why do I bother...

Yeah, you're right. Brady only completed passes they didn't need and 29/45 is horrible. Brady single handedly lost that game.
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Old 01-17-2011, 05:20 AM    (permalink
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Since week 15 Brady has been playing at an average level. As a Pats fan this scared me because I had never seen him finish a season that weakly(in comparison to his season play)
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Old 01-17-2011, 05:22 AM    (permalink
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Brady got much of his numbers on the final two drives. The last drive was meaningless. The second to the last drive took up half of a the 4th quarter and resulted in just 3 points, to a large degree because of Brady's inaccuracy and inability to make any type of big play. They were down two scores and needed to get on the board quickly. Instead Brady dinked and dunked all the way down the field and got stopped in money territory. Yet nearly half his yardage and half of his TDs were a result of those two drives, which were both failures. Sorry, but his numbers were largely cosmetic, and even then they weren't very impressive at all.
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He was protecting his self
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From what? His leg?
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That leg has had it out for him since day 1.
"We're the quiet guys, the guys before the storm. And then we hit you."

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Old 01-17-2011, 05:31 AM    (permalink
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Don't blame Tom!! That gorgeous hair of his was clouding his vision!!!


On a serious note, all game his accuracy was inconsistent, and for the entire duration of the game(aside from two drives) his decision making and pocket awareness was questionable. To me it seems as if he is letting his accomplishments get to him and his ego is starting to inflate to something larger than he is capable of delivering. Listen, Tom, if you don't give it all you got in the film room and on the practice field you aint got jack **** on the gridiron.
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Old 01-17-2011, 05:45 AM    (permalink
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Why do I bother...

Yeah, you're right. Brady only completed passes they didn't need and 29/45 is horrible. Brady single handedly lost that game.
Show me where I said he single handedly lost the game and then we'll talk. As a matter of fact I believe i dedicated a whole post to how I'm not completely blaming it on him. But by all means whatever you want to hear to fit you argument go ahead.
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Old 01-17-2011, 06:03 AM    (permalink
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I'll be honest.
Roethlisburger would not be much without that defense.
Couldn't be any less true. ****** comes through when they need him. Flacco has repeatedly had great defense after great defense and has **** down his leg over and over. Big Ben never had the numbers but when they absolutely need a drive he gets it.
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Old 01-17-2011, 06:37 AM    (permalink
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It's official, Aaron Rodgers is the best QB in the league going into next season! :D
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Old 01-17-2011, 06:54 AM    (permalink
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It's official, Aaron Rodgers is the best QB in the league going into next season! :D
Yes, because tearing up a Falcons defense, that was raped by Kevin Kolb, in the playoffs obviously means he is better than everyone else... Oh wait.

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Old 01-17-2011, 08:04 AM    (permalink
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I always thought rating QBs by rings alone was stupid. Terry Bradshaw and Troy Aikman are basically in the hall of fame because they won the lottery.

With that said Tom Brady is still an all time great player, It's not him thats overrated, it's the QB position in general.
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Old 01-17-2011, 08:14 AM    (permalink
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He's now 4-5 in the playoffs since then, including a mark of just 2-5 against teams that he played in the regular season. Where is his clutchness now? Where is his sense of the moment? Where is his rises-to-the-occasion ability?
I tend to agree with you, and that 4-5 record should be 3-6 if the stupid Chargers DB that picked Brady off to seal that playoff game had just taken a knee instead of gone all gangster and tried to return the Int for no apparent reason.

Where Brady's clutchness now is people fail to realize that there is always a luck factor in the NFL. How would Tom Brady's "status" be if the first year the refs didn't **** Charles Woodson and the Raiders with the ******* tuck rule?

How would Brady's hero status be changed if his kicker had choked a la Scott Norwood? I believe that if his kicker was Scott Norwood, and the Bills back in the day was the clutch Vinitieri, then Jim Kelly would be thought of higher than Tom Brady.

Then you get into the whole Spygate thing.... we'll never know why Little Bill was doing that illegal activity all those times, or how much of a benefit it was for him to do that, take that big risk.

Tom Brady has now lost 2 playoff games in a row, at home, to Mark Sanchez and Joseph Flacco.
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Old 01-17-2011, 08:32 AM    (permalink
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Aaron Rodgers is the future of the position.


But i do like Ben a lot as a QB.

I said to my friend before the Atlanta game, in 3 years max he Rodgers will be considered the games best.
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Old 01-17-2011, 08:35 AM    (permalink
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who was the last qb to lose 3 straight playoff games? has Manning ever **** the bed as bad as Tom brady in 3 play off games?
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-17-2011, 08:41 AM    (permalink
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Mannings playoff record is pretty bad on its own. He's at 2 straight right now, so another loss next year and he'll have it.

Not that I wanna take anything away from Brady hating. I think its great. He's certainly earned it.
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Old 01-17-2011, 08:41 AM    (permalink
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i think it's hilarious that people are *still* repeating the patriots-draft-well meme, but that's probably another thread.

either way, i just wanted to throw in some support for DMW. nothing to add to what he's already said.
can i add support in honor of you njx, we have had out tribulations but i want to break bread with you ;)
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-17-2011, 08:42 AM    (permalink
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i think it's hilarious that people are *still* repeating the patriots-draft-well meme, but that's probably another thread.

either way, i just wanted to throw in some support for DMW. nothing to add to what he's already said.
I don't know where that comes from. Just cause Brady is a 6th rounder? Over their last several drafts they have had countless misses, even with more picks than all of the other teams.
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Old 01-17-2011, 09:03 AM    (permalink
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Wait....... so the New York Jets football team won? Thomas Brady didn't single handedly choke the game away?

I don't understand. When teams lose, its entirely the fault of the losing quarterback. That timeout with 29 seconds was called by Peyton Manning. Drew Brees was the one who couldn't tackle Marshawn Lynch. Matt Hasselback dropped all of those passes. ITS ALWAYS THE FAULT OF THE QUARTERBACK!!!!!!! ALWAYS.
Hey now, according the the Sniper School for Quarterback Analysis it's always the QBs fault and there is no such thing as extenuating circumstances.

I kind of agree with the overall theme of the thread, though. There is no doubt the QB position is vastly important. Having a great one like Brady and Manning can single handily lead you to the playoffs, as well as overcome deficits and get you wins you would have otherwise failed to achieve with a lesser QBs. However, we've seen it takes more than just one player, regardless of position, to win in the playoffs.

I don't want to turn this into a Manning vs Brady debate, because that's been over killed, but I do believe if the Colts tried to assemble a real defense like the Patriots of the mid-2000's or the Ravens of the past decade that Manning would have multiple rings by now. Instead, everyone just blames him for their failures.

It just proves in the playoffs you need more than an elite QB to win. Even for as awesome as Rodgers has been he's still great some terrific play from his defense, as well as a solid run game from James Starks.
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Old 01-17-2011, 09:30 AM    (permalink
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I was thinking about doing a write up on this as well, and was discussing the subject in the Divisional Round thread.

People think of me as either a massive Manning hater or a Brady lover. I'm neither, I just call things the way my eyes see them. And if I'm a hater, then I'm an equal opportunity hater.

Combine the poor performance in the 2007 Superbowl, the shutout/blowout last year to the Ravens, and this year's stinker against the Jets, and Brady's postseason mystique is starting to wane off - if it isn't completely gone.

But here's the thing...I'm not making any excuses for him. And you could totally make that argument for him. Look at the boxscore and stateline: 28-21, 29-45, 64%, 299 yards, 2 TDs, 1 INT. That's "good enough to win" numbers I guess. And the o-line and defense played poor, and blah blah blah (excuses, excuses).

But you know what? My eyes don't lie. He had zero command of the game today. He was oblivious to pressure in the pocket. Once he lost his rhythm, he couldn't get it back. He played pretty terribly.

On the other hand, you still can't take the three rings away from him. He's still one of the best quarterbacks of all time. The old argument against him was that he wasn't a dominant statistical passer, but he's turned into that in recent seasons. But, like DMW said, this has also coincided with embarrassing playoff losses.

In regards to him vs Manning, I don't see how you can (or will) be able to chalk it up to anything other than a draw. They've both still got some time left, but I both have their best days behind them. Looking at the matchups on Championship weekend, we're seeing a changing of the guard at the quarterback position.

And for the money, I'm probably going to start touting Big Ben as best QB in the league. Especially if they go to (and/or win) the Superbowl with a practice squad offensive line.
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What's with the hate on Ricky Stanzi? Those youtube clips of him with the hulk hogan theme music instantly make him better than Luck.
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Old 01-17-2011, 10:19 AM    (permalink
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Couldn't be any less true. ****** comes through when they need him. Flacco has repeatedly had great defense after great defense and has **** down his leg over and over. Big Ben never had the numbers but when they absolutely need a drive he gets it.
Ben Roethlisberger has become the most overrated player on these boards with all this "best quarterback in the game" talk. He's top 10, close to top 5, I have him at 6th. But Brady, Manning, Rodgers, Brees, and Rivers are all significantly better than him.

Accuracy, reading a defense, getting the ball out quickly, pre-snap adjustments, etc. Ben is getting all this love because his team literally carried him kicking and screaming to a Superbowl in the worst officiated game of all time, and then because he made one big drive where his receiver made one of the nicest ALL TIME catches in the endzone. If that catch isn't made, Ben is nowhere NEAR consideration for the best. If your career is based essentially on one incredible catch, GTFO with this "BEST IN THE LEAGUEEEZZZZ" talk.

Now, since I'm NOT supporting Ben as best in the league, this invariably means that everyone is assuming I think he is trash. As that is how these discussions go. Ben is a great quarterback in this league. He's just not the best, or really even that close to it.
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Old 01-17-2011, 10:21 AM    (permalink
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Ben is an above-average QB who's won Super Bowls because of his team's stifling defense.

He's basically McNabb with a much better defense.
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Old 01-17-2011, 10:43 AM    (permalink
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I don't know where that comes from. Just cause Brady is a 6th rounder? Over their last several drafts they have had countless misses, even with more picks than all of the other teams.
Not to mention trading out of the spot in 2009 with the Packers so that we can select Clay Matthews.

And don't forget, they traded up with GB in 2006 so they could select WR Chad Jackson, which allowed the Packers to then select WR Greg Jennings.
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Old 01-17-2011, 11:13 AM    (permalink
RealityCheck
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Guys, I thought you all realized Brady's been a regular season guy since the SB loss.
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Old 01-17-2011, 11:53 AM    (permalink
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Really that 3rd round pick for Moss was a genius deal in hindsight. Say what you want about trading down constantly but Moss is a bona fide useless player now. You never even heard the guys name once he was with the Titans.
He was a run blocker in Tennesee thats why, he was brought in to run block
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Old 01-17-2011, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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He was a run blocker in Tennesee thats why, he was brought in to run block
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Old 01-17-2011, 12:51 PM    (permalink
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I'm verrrry close to saying Ben Roethlisberger is the best qb in the league. If he wins ring #3, he will be the best in my eyes.

He's already #3 on my list.
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Old 01-17-2011, 12:51 PM    (permalink
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He was a run blocker in Tennesee thats why, he was brought in to run block
It's strange, but yeah, that's what Randy Moss did in Tennessee. That's ALL he did there. He was a run blocker. Why they couldn't just use an extra TE, I don't know.
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