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Old 01-10-2014, 02:12 PM    (permalink
bigbluedefense
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Gilbride has already came out and said that he scripts the entire first half, and he never deviates from it no matter what so he could call better plays in the 4th quarter.

That's why the Giants usually (outside of this year) played significantly better on offense in the 4th quarter than the first 3. Gilbride gonna Gilbride.

How about we call awesome plays starting in the 1st quarter huh Gilbride? I understand wanting to script a whole quarter to get a feel for a team, but a whole half?! Ridiculous.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:16 PM    (permalink
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Gilbride has already came out and said that he scripts the entire first half, and he never deviates from it no matter what so he could call better plays in the 4th quarter.

That's why the Giants usually (outside of this year) played significantly better on offense in the 4th quarter than the first 3. Gilbride gonna Gilbride.

How about we call awesome plays starting in the 1st quarter huh Gilbride? I understand wanting to script a whole quarter to get a feel for a team, but a whole half?! Ridiculous.
You're taking away from the Eli magic with that statement.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:18 PM    (permalink
bigbluedefense
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You're taking away from the Eli magic with that statement.
I'm probably ignoring the part where we go no huddle the entire 4th quarter to catch up to the other team after Gilbride called plays for the first 3.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:18 PM    (permalink
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You're taking away from the Eli magic with that statement.
It's the same thing. He probably let's Eli call more of the game at that point.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:19 PM    (permalink
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Where did you see that about the scripting by the way? It makes me hate Gilbride so much more right now. How can you script the whole first half. It makes no sense at all. Doesn't account for situation.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:31 PM    (permalink
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I am highly skeptical of the whole half scripting thing. Where did you read this? That doesn't make a lot of sense.
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Old 01-10-2014, 02:51 PM    (permalink
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I can't recall what article it was. I think it was an article by Vacchiano after the 2011 SB.

Gilbride was gloating about how great of a playcaller he was. It was kind of disgusting.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:17 PM    (permalink
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That doesn't make sense. If you see something from the booth that the team can adv. you can't stick to your script. That's why I highly doubt things are scripted that long, especially if Eli has the ability to change plays.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:18 PM    (permalink
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He said he maps out a script for a whole half, and he uses various formations and packages to see how the defense defends it. He likes to stick to that no matter what for the first half so he can call a better game in the 2nd half.

*shrug*

Maybe he was just giving the media some fodder, who knows. Maybe I don't remember the article correctly either. But I'm pretty confident that's what he said.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:23 PM    (permalink
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He said he maps out a script for a whole half, and he uses various formations and packages to see how the defense defends it. He likes to stick to that no matter what for the first half so he can call a better game in the 2nd half.

*shrug*

Maybe he was just giving the media some fodder, who knows. Maybe I don't remember the article correctly either. But I'm pretty confident that's what he said.

That sounds fishy. I would need to read more or hear more. Sticking to a script means that you don't change the play no matter. So if the whole team stacks the box, you don't throw it. The play says run, you call a running play. There could be no safety or both Cbs in the box. A WR could be wide open. LOL. You still call a running play because that's what the script says.

We allow Eli to change plays so that messes up that theory of it. Also, saw we are running the ball well on the script or WR screen, the CB is now moving from off man to press. I see it in the booth, and tell eli to pump fake, and have the WR to not run the WR screen but to run a go. If the play is a running play, and I saw, tell eli to run PA off that running concept, and instead of running it throw it. Even if the play is a run next play. So It sounds really odd based on that.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:24 PM    (permalink
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That sounds fishy. I would need to read more or hear more. Sticking to a script means that you don't change the play no matter. So if the whole team stacks the box, you don't throw it. The play says run, you call a running play. There could be no safety or both Cbs in the box. A WR could be wide open. LOL. You still call a running play because that's what the script says.

We allow Eli to change plays so that messes up that theory of it. Also, saw we are running the ball well on the script or WR screen, the CB is now moving from off man to press. I see it in the booth, and tell eli to pump fake, and have the WR to not run the WR screen but to run a go. If the play is a running play, and I saw, tell eli to run PA off that running concept, and instead of running it throw it. Even if the play is a run next play. So It sounds really odd based on that.
I honestly never understood the whole script thing. Is it even necessary? Why waste plays just to see what the other guy is doing?

Wouldn't you want to put yourself in the best position to score every time you step on the field? I don't get the logic behind it.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:36 PM    (permalink
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10-15 plays makes sense because of film review. After that everything needs to be taken in context. You're trying to exploit the weaknesses and holes you saw on film before they realize what you're doing and adjust.
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:38 PM    (permalink
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That's not what a traditional script is though. From my understanding, a script is using various plays and personal packages on the field with no rhyme or reason, you just want to see how your opponent lines up vs that look to know what kind of personal packages they'll put on the field when you go A, B, C or D.

And you see if they want to blitz or play zone etc out of those packages. Am I understanding that correctly?
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Old 01-10-2014, 03:41 PM    (permalink
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That's not what a traditional script is though. From my understanding, a script is using various plays and personal packages on the field with no rhyme or reason, you just want to see how your opponent lines up vs that look to know what kind of personal packages they'll put on the field when you go A, B, C or D.

And you see if they want to blitz or play zone etc out of those packages. Am I understanding that correctly?
Could be both but it's evolved. I'm sure some OC's still do it like that but the way I explained makes a lot more sense to me and I know I've read OC's do it that way also. If you can get an opposing D to tip their hand on a certain formation it can help later in the game though.
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Old 01-10-2014, 06:32 PM    (permalink
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Gilbride helped us win 2 SBs. Relax.


He wasn't perfect but we had success with his system.

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Old 01-10-2014, 09:06 PM    (permalink
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I honestly never understood the whole script thing. Is it even necessary? Why waste plays just to see what the other guy is doing?

Wouldn't you want to put yourself in the best position to score every time you step on the field? I don't get the logic behind it.


Yeah I always liked it. You are studying film on defensive looks. I would do this and I would want to script everything I saw from studying film. This includes fronts and coverage. For me, I cared about the SAM position or DE near the TE. After the first series we ask each group if what we studied was holding true.

If it was then we move on. If my guys came back and said no, then we make in game adjustments. The crux if the issue which I wanted to know if I am upstairs is if my game plan can work and are they showing me what I expected. If not, they added tendency breakers.

So in order for me to see if everything is status quo I will script and cycle through every formation installed for the game. I want to know right away how they play each.

15-20 plays around there.
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Old 01-10-2014, 09:24 PM    (permalink
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Yeah I always liked it. You are studying film on defensive looks. I would do this and I would want to script everything I saw from studying film. This includes fronts and coverage. For me, I cared about the SAM position or DE near the TE. After the first series we ask each group if what we studied was holding true.

If it was then we move on. If my guys came back and said no, then we make in game adjustments. The crux if the issue which I wanted to know if I am upstairs is if my game plan can work and are they showing me what I expected. If not, they added tendency breakers.

So in order for me to see if everything is status quo I will script and cycle through every formation installed for the game. I want to know right away how they play each.

15-20 plays around there.
Kind of what I tried to describe as well. This makes sense to me.
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Old 01-10-2014, 10:26 PM    (permalink
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Scripting plays is nothing new, but what happened to scripted plays like we did a few years ago? What about when we had Plax? We scripted plays that caught the defense off guard and although sometimes it may have backfired, it seemed to have a decent success rate because of the element of surprise. The offense seemed deflated as soon as they hit the field; no swagger, no confidence.

This wasn't just a matter of scheme, the team wasn't inspired. If you aren't confident in the plays or playcalling, how do you expect to execute well? I hate to say it, but a lot can be said about the loss of Ahmad Bradshaw. He wasn't reliable, he wasn't flashy, but man oh man did he get the other players going. Eli is not a leader on offense, not in a way that inspired anyone this year.

Edit: Eli completely lost Hakeem, that was evident. You can point the finger at a lot of people, but fact of the matter is Gilbride is gone and there still will be problems as long as Eli doesn't light a fire under his teammates' asses
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Old 01-10-2014, 10:27 PM    (permalink
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Kind of what I tried to describe as well. This makes sense to me.
Yup, I typed that on my phone. I hit submit and then read yours. You were right on the money.
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Old 01-10-2014, 10:38 PM    (permalink
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Yup, I typed that on my phone. I hit submit and then read yours. You were right on the money.
You explain things 100% better than I ever could so glad you agree.
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:29 PM    (permalink
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I believe in Pugh as a LT and Beatty as a capable RT. That still puts the three interior linemen in question.

Alex Mack is a guy I'd love to bring to town. He is a leader for his offense and thats something we don't have on the line...at all. Sad to say, but we need to cut Snee and Diehl, too much money and the injuries are only prerequisites to the writing on the wall. As for the guards, they will be dictated by our OC.
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Old 01-11-2014, 09:47 PM    (permalink
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I think the status of our offensive assists has to be up in the air

Sure traditionally we would be certain to retain most if not all of them with continuity and stability with our offensive system. That is largely how things have happened in the past. If we were going to go with that Mike Sullivan would likely have been hired already as offensive coordinator.

What is clear is that Reese and Mara are keen to look to change the offensive philosophy to some degree. While still under Coughlin's game plan, the new OC is basically going to be handed the keys to run the offense.

With changes to the offense system, it will be interesting to see how much change the front office will go with, will they allow the new OC to bring in some of his own guys?
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Old 01-12-2014, 10:41 AM    (permalink
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I think the status of our offensive assists has to be up in the air

Sure traditionally we would be certain to retain most if not all of them with continuity and stability with our offensive system. That is largely how things have happened in the past. If we were going to go with that Mike Sullivan would likely have been hired already as offensive coordinator.

What is clear is that Reese and Mara are keen to look to change the offensive philosophy to some degree. While still under Coughlin's game plan, the new OC is basically going to be handed the keys to run the offense.

With changes to the offense system, it will be interesting to see how much change the front office will go with, will they allow the new OC to bring in some of his own guys?

The new OC has to have a lot of latitude otherwise there is no appeal to take a job and run another persons system. I would never do it at any level. I would take it if I am using my system or at worst have a lot of say to add concepts to someones system. But if the HC won't let me, then I am not going to take the job.
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Old 01-12-2014, 04:27 PM    (permalink
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The new OC has to have a lot of latitude otherwise there is no appeal to take a job and run another persons system. I would never do it at any level. I would take it if I am using my system or at worst have a lot of say to add concepts to someones system. But if the HC won't let me, then I am not going to take the job.
I totally agree, particularly in this case where the front office seems to want change things up.

One point I noticed was that all of the candidates come from systems with Zone Blocking Schemes. Considering our Oline is also going to be getting a shake up, it seems like a decent chance that we move to a ZBS.

If we do, should we retain Pat Flahrety or should we bring in a guy who has more experience in ZBSs?
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Old 01-12-2014, 04:42 PM    (permalink
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Here is a very interesting article from fieldgulls on zone blocking schemes. It is a very good read.

http://www.fieldgulls.com/football-b...marshawn-lynch


and some info from another article

Quote:

In a power blocking scheme, size and power is everything. You want large athletes with top-end strength. Long arms are ideal in this scheme to reach all blocks and make up for limited athleticism. Power blockers typically identify their block pre-snap and must be able to drive block at every position.

The zone blocking scheme is the exact opposite. You are looking for lighter, more athletic individuals. Strength is not as important, and neither are long arms, as angled blocks help nullify most of the need for both. A zone blocker's most important characteristics are quickness and the ability to work as a unit to identify defenders on the go.

Is the power scheme becoming out-dated due to the size/speed freaks the NFL Draft churns out every year? Is the zone scheme the weaker scheme because of its drawbacks in the redzone? Which one helps the passing game more?

http://www.hogshaven.com/2013/6/4/43...-do-you-prefer

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