Give me Your Opinion on this come draft time...

bucfan12 · 03-28-2011, 09:44 AM

The Bucs hold the 20th pick in the 1st round. Guys like Kerrigan, Aldon Smith, Cameron Jordan and yes...EVEN Justin Houston goes off the board at 17 to New England.... WHO do we take?

I know my first option would be to trade up with Miami and snag Kerrigan before the Jags do, but if that does not happen, then what?

No teams are willing to move up to the 20th spot because there is no team that has interest in the pick, just for example. The NFL Network Charles Davis believes a sleeper who the Bucs could take is Jimmy Smith CB Colorado, where I saw this on Path to the Draft. Honestly, if that happened, I would not be 100% against it. He can form a nice CB tandem with Talib.

What do you think? I know he would be the best player on the board right there as well.

SloppyJoe · 03-28-2011, 01:59 PM

i wouldn't be against OL help in that scenario. maybe a pouncey or maybe one of the top 3-4 OT is falling because of the run on DE. heck i wouldn't be against a Wisniewski, if Marc and Dom think he's a franchise Center.

ratiffshabang · 03-28-2011, 03:06 PM

i wouldn't be opposed to Jimmy Smith the talent, but not Jimmy Smith the person. He is a huge character risk and i can see him as a cancer to the team. Lets face it we already have a lot of character issues in the secondary with Talib and Jackson. The last thing we need to do is add another. I say we need to stay away from this guy no matter what round we can get him in. Yes it would be a huge concern if all the first round grade DEs were gone by the time we picked at 20. Not sure what the best answer would be there. DE is by far our biggest need and i surely wouldn't be upset if we did what we did last draft and used our first two picks to address the position.

impactplayerx47 · 03-28-2011, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucfan12

The Bucs hold the 20th pick in the 1st round. Guys like Kerrigan, Aldon Smith, Cameron Jordan and yes...EVEN Justin Houston goes off the board at 17 to New England.... WHO do we take?

I know my first option would be to trade up with Miami and snag Kerrigan before the Jags do, but if that does not happen, then what?

No teams are willing to move up to the 20th spot because there is no team that has interest in the pick, just for example. The NFL Network Charles Davis believes a sleeper who the Bucs could take is Jimmy Smith CB Colorado, where I saw this on Path to the Draft. Honestly, if that happened, I would not be 100% against it. He can form a nice CB tandem with Talib.

What do you think? I know he would be the best player on the board right there as well.

Jimmy Smith may be the best player on the board when we pick at 20 regardless if we're talking purely about talent...but I don't think he's a good fit for us. If there was no character concerns I would be all about us drafting him, but I think our young locker room is a little too immature to be taking TOO many risks on players with character concerns.

On one hand I read about Aquib being a person of interest and think to myself "maybe it's time to draft a CB just ENCASE Aquib pulls a stunt..." with that being said...we can't turn around and draft another player with maturity questions or we may be drafting a younger version of the player we're currently hoping doesn't screw up.

brasho · 03-28-2011, 05:01 PM

Sadly, we may need a CB at that point... but still, this defense, and all defenses are built from the front 7 on back, not the other way around. We need pass rushers like nothing else.

If our chosen few of: Quinn, Kerrigan, Jordan, A. Smith, Watt, and even Houston are gone... we may trade back a bit, and we should... and take a guy like Brooks Reed... get more ammunition and go back to the DE well in round 2 and grab a guy like Bailey, Ballard, Moch, or Sheard. The key to stopping the pass in the NFL has less to do with the DBs and far more to do with the DL.... same with stopping the run.

Even if Talib were to be lost for any significant amount of time, I would rather improve the pass rush and have our top 3 CBs be Biggers, Barber, and Lewis than throw another CB in the mix and still not be able to put heat on the QB or stop the run. Besides that, Jimmy Smith is another character risk at CB and aren't we already seeing the repercussions of that?

BTW, Charles Davis is only surpassed in suckiness by Pat Kirwan. There aren't many others that are so severely lacing in insight and understanting as those two.

bucsti25 · 03-29-2011, 02:20 PM

I dont think there's a chance in heck that Bowers, Quinn, Smith, Watt, Jordan, Kerrigan, Houston and Clayborn are all gone by 20...

There's simply no way...
(MY Big Board)
1. Peterson
2. Green
3. Miller
4. Dareus
5. Amukamura
6. Jones
7. Bowers
8. Quinn
plus the QB's Newton and Gabbert

that right there proves one will fall....If all the DE's do some how disappear it's time to think about O-Line or Ingram

Legacy · 03-29-2011, 04:34 PM

Jimmy Smith?

Oh, yeah! Let's select a moron with character issues to replace a moron with character issues who just got himself issued a felony arrest warrant! That's a winning formula for team-building!

bucfan12 · 03-29-2011, 10:20 PM

Just saw on NFL network we scheduled Prince Amukamarah for a private workout. Probably just doing their homework for some odd reason this guy slips and no DE is available, but who knows what Dominik might have up his sleeve?

If/When Free Agency starts, could the Bucs aim for DE (s) in FA and target a moveup for Amukamarah? The man has Shut Down CB potential and skills. He might be a better cover corner than Peterson.

bucsti25 · 03-30-2011, 12:29 AM

Prince is a stud, he's not going to fall to 20...We would have to jump Houston at 10(Washington) to get him...We better sign Kiwi and Edwards if that's the plan lol

bucfan12 · 03-30-2011, 04:16 PM

http://www.freep.com/article/2011031...435/1049/rss14

Hmm...some positive news regarding CB Jimmy Smith. Coach says he's a vocal leader on the field and Lions GM Mayhew came away impressed during a visit.

Could character concerns be out their for him to slip? Remember Warren Sapp? Yeah.

You have to remember, Talib is a hot head who can't control his temper. Smith's troubled past included getting caught for smoking the Ganj. Hmm..College student and Marijuana? I'm pretty sure atleast 95% of the college population has used this drug.

impactplayerx47 · 03-30-2011, 11:05 PM

Like...Aquib (allegedly), and Tanard....right?

....wait....

I think our locker room is TOO YOUNG for anything OTHER than upstanding citizens ...if we get rid of Aquib a lot is gone..but we're young..I want more leaders to go with Freeman. Ronde Barber is probably gone after this season...and we don't even know if Ruud will re-sign. Who is the leader on defense? We've gotta get some more leadership on this team...love GMC and Price..but we've got to see these (and our other young players) guys prove it.

Character guys ONLY at this point....except RARE circumstances..if Smith is around in the 3rd...maybe we talk about it ..........LOL

bucfan12 · 03-31-2011, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by impactplayerx47

Like...Aquib (allegedly), and Tanard....right?

....wait....

I think our locker room is TOO YOUNG for anything OTHER than upstanding citizens ...if we get rid of Aquib a lot is gone..but we're young..I want more leaders to go with Freeman. Ronde Barber is probably gone after this season...and we don't even know if Ruud will re-sign. Who is the leader on defense? We've gotta get some more leadership on this team...love GMC and Price..but we've got to see these (and our other young players) guys prove it.

Character guys ONLY at this point....except RARE circumstances..if Smith is around in the 3rd...maybe we talk about it ..........LOL

Thing is, Smith was the leader of that COlorado defense. Scouts questioned his character simply because he compared his talents to being better than Nhamdi Asomugah. Honestly, I don't get that. Sure he shows he's got swagger and a bit cocky, but that doesn't mean he's a hot head or trouble maker like Talib.

SloppyJoe · 03-31-2011, 02:30 PM

can someone give me a little resume.
what exatly means "character issue" in case of Jimmy Smith?

ellsy82 · 03-31-2011, 10:54 PM

I'm running an intersite mock draft over on steelcityinsider.net - I selected the Buccs to draft for.

I really like the look of Ryan Kerrigan with the 20th pick. He starts on Tampa's d-line from day one and is extremely explosive/disruptive. Quinn did not overly impress me with his combine performance. Solid, not bad, but nothing spectactular that I'd like to see in a first round pick.

SloppyJoe-
Smith had a couple underage alcohol violations as a freshman and softmore. He failed a drug test back in 2007 as well. Many people think he wants to be a celebrity more than a good NFL corner. That's the concensus, anyway. He "neglected" to mention those in his combine interviews to the teams that were asking about run-ins with the law.

bucfan12 · 04-01-2011, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ellsy82

I'm running an intersite mock draft over on steelcityinsider.net - I selected the Buccs to draft for.

I really like the look of Ryan Kerrigan with the 20th pick. He starts on Tampa's d-line from day one and is extremely explosive/disruptive. Quinn did not overly impress me with his combine performance. Solid, not bad, but nothing spectactular that I'd like to see in a first round pick.

SloppyJoe-
Smith had a couple underage alcohol violations as a freshman and softmore. He failed a drug test back in 2007 as well. Many people think he wants to be a celebrity more than a good NFL corner. That's the concensus, anyway. He "neglected" to mention those in his combine interviews to the teams that were asking about run-ins with the law.

On the draft, of course Kerrigan is my top guy I think we should get. In my opinion, he is the best DE in this draft. However, I would say we have to take Jimmy Smith if none of those guys, such as Kerrigan, Aldon Smith, or Cameron Jordan are available at 20. Smith would most likely be the BPA and would be able to replace Talib.

I don't think an underrage drinking violation is enough to set off red flags. He did admit to the failed drug test, but neglected the underrage violations. Honestly, who doesn't drink in college as Freshman and Sophomores, or dabble in the Marijauna? I won't be hipporcrytical at all, as I'm 25 years old and I've done my fair share of drinking as a Freshman and Sophomore in college.

Some feel he wants to be a celebrity at the position because he said he would run a 4.3 40 at the combine (which he did) and had better ball skills than Scrabble (Nhmadi). SO he's got swag. So he's a bit cocky. Teams have done their homework on him, including the Lions and said they were quite impressed with him during interviews. His DBs coach at Colorado was ticked about the character issue rumors regarding Smith, as he said he's a vocal leader on and off the field and showed up for practice and meetings 15 minutes early every time and was dedicated to football.

Sorry, I just see the media blowing his attitude out of proportion. You're telling me Darrell Revis isn't cocky? Does that mean he's a troubled young athlete?

ellsy82 · 04-01-2011, 03:06 PM

I was thinking about packaging my second pick, getting an extra third rounder and moving up before Miami to get Kerrigan...but only if he makes it past Detroit.

I hear you on Jimmy Smith. I don't necessarily agree that he has character flags. A little bit of swagger never hurt any player (except maybe T.O. or that deuce Chad Johnson). If Kerrigan gets snagged before 1.14, then I'd easily go with Smith.

MidwestJimmy · 04-01-2011, 03:34 PM

There's Brooks Reed and Jabaal Sheard, but they are reaches at #20. Going away from DE, there is a need at ROT. Gabe Carimi and Nate Solder would fit the bill.

By the way, you wouldn't want Cameron Jordan as a 4-3 DE. He played 34E for Cal, which makes him a prospect for that or DT.

bucsti25 · 04-01-2011, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MidwestJimmy

There's Brooks Reed and Jabaal Sheard, but they are reaches at #20. Going away from DE, there is a need at ROT. Gabe Carimi and Nate Solder would fit the bill.

By the way, you wouldn't want Cameron Jordan as a 4-3 DE. He played 34E for Cal, which makes him a prospect for that or DT.

He has played everything at Cal...I would love Cameron Jordan on this team

Pop in the senior bowl tape and tell me he cant play 4-3 DE, Ill be here waiting for your response ;)

shabazz916 · 04-01-2011, 04:26 PM

trade down

MidwestJimmy · 04-01-2011, 05:01 PM

Pop in the senior bowl tape and tell me he cant play 4-3 DE, Ill be here waiting for your response.

I actually would have a tape of the Senior Bowl if it wasn't on NFL Network, which I don't have. I used to be on ESPN.

[Homer Simpson voice] Stupid NFL with their networks and lockouts!

Bucsti, taking to heart what you say, Cameron Jordan sounds very valuable. All 4-3 teams play at least a little 3-4 and vice versa. You can change up and keep Jordan in there without having to sub in a less talented player.

bucfan12 · 04-01-2011, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MidwestJimmy

Pop in the senior bowl tape and tell me he cant play 4-3 DE, Ill be here waiting for your response.

I actually would have a tape of the Senior Bowl if it wasn't on NFL Network, which I don't have. I used to be on ESPN.

[Homer Simpson voice] Stupid NFL with their networks and lockouts!

Bucsti, taking to heart what you say, Cameron Jordan sounds very valuable. All 4-3 teams play at least a little 3-4 and vice versa. You can change up and keep Jordan in there without having to sub in a less talented player.

Most certainly Cameron Jordan can play 4-3 LDE. However, some 3-4 team I think is going to snatch him up before we pick (Pats or Chargers). To me, he's like Justin Tuck of NYG. He can kick inside at DT on passing downs, play 3-4 and be a force at LDE in the run and pass game.

Honestly, you don't reach for guys like Sheard or Brooks Reed. Even though in my mock, I have Sheard going to us in the 2nd round and thats where he belongs. He's not worth the risk in round 1 at 20. Brooks Reed is another late 1st /early 2nd round pick and 3-4 olb. Don't reach for him. I'm really not too sold on Justin Houston right now. I've watched more film and honestly, I think he's another guy strictly meant to [play 3-4 olb.

We take Jimmy Smith in round 1. We have a ton of cash for when FA starts and will and should target Ray Edwards or Mathias Kiwanuka. Romeus in the 3rd/4th round will be a steal (mark my words). But seriously, if a guy like Kerrigan or Aldon Smith or Cam Jordan are not there, we take Smith. No need to reach. Don't trade down because there isn't any real value in the mid-late 20's at DE. Smith has been compared to Nhamdi Asomugah and is very talented. I don't know where these character issues and comparisons to Talib's character are coming from. I definately do not see it at all.

brasho · 04-01-2011, 06:13 PM

Trade down, get more picks... land Brooks Reed DE of Arizona then come back with another solid DE prospect in round 2. WIth or without Talib, this defense HAS to pressure the QB. I'm not at all opposed to taking Dontay Moch in round 2 to have him put his hand on the ground in passing situations. He reminds me a bit of Dwight Freeney when he came out of college and has similiar build and workout numbers.

brasho · 04-01-2011, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucfan12

Most certainly Cameron Jordan can play 4-3 LDE. However, some 3-4 team I think is going to snatch him up before we pick (Pats or Chargers). To me, he's like Justin Tuck of NYG. He can kick inside at DT on passing downs, play 3-4 and be a force at LDE in the run and pass game.

Honestly, you don't reach for guys like Sheard or Brooks Reed. Even though in my mock, I have Sheard going to us in the 2nd round and thats where he belongs. He's not worth the risk in round 1 at 20. Brooks Reed is another late 1st /early 2nd round pick and 3-4 olb. Don't reach for him. I'm really not too sold on Justin Houston right now. I've watched more film and honestly, I think he's another guy strictly meant to [play 3-4 olb.

We take Jimmy Smith in round 1. We have a ton of cash for when FA starts and will and should target Ray Edwards or Mathias Kiwanuka. Romeus in the 3rd/4th round will be a steal (mark my words). But seriously, if a guy like Kerrigan or Aldon Smith or Cam Jordan are not there, we take Smith. No need to reach. Don't trade down because there isn't any real value in the mid-late 20's at DE. Smith has been compared to Nhamdi Asomugah and is very talented. I don't know where these character issues and comparisons to Talib's character are coming from. I definately do not see it at all.

The character concerns for Smith are legit.

I agree with everything else, except I think Houston is definitely a better DE prospect than OLB.

bucsti25 · 04-02-2011, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MidwestJimmy

Pop in the senior bowl tape and tell me he cant play 4-3 DE, Ill be here waiting for your response.

I actually would have a tape of the Senior Bowl if it wasn't on NFL Network, which I don't have. I used to be on ESPN.

[Homer Simpson voice] Stupid NFL with their networks and lockouts!

Bucsti, taking to heart what you say, Cameron Jordan sounds very valuable. All 4-3 teams play at least a little 3-4 and vice versa. You can change up and keep Jordan in there without having to sub in a less talented player.

Yeah, I moved out of my old house and didnt have NFL Network before the game, and had to get it for the Senior Bowl...Dang NFL Network nazi's!

Just look at the numbers for Jordan though at the combine. His 10 yard split are on par with Robert Quinn and Ryan Kerrigan who are both 20 lbs less then him. He wasnt asked to go get the QB in Cal, as alot of his job was anchoring down and holding his edge. I would and I know Raheem would absolutely love Jordan in a Bucs jersey, realistically though he isnt going to come close to falling to us. I think he is gone by 16 without a doubt

impactplayerx47 · 04-02-2011, 12:41 PM

I think our team is too young to be taking on guys who MAY POSSIBLY not be great for our locker room. I love the talent, but our locker room is too young. We've really got to get some high character guys in the locker room.

Aquib had similar criticisms when he came out (maturity questions, people questioning how he'd be in the locker room, is he a leader etc) and it's blown up in our face. Now I'm NOT SAYING JIMMY IS AQUIB ...what I'm saying is why take the risk? We have other needs and we SHOULD address other positions in round 1.

If we HAVE TO TAKE A CB in round 1, then we're saying we don't have the depth at the position now. Even though Aquib is prob. facing some sort of suspension outside of cutting him outright our depth should be fine for this coming season. AFTER 2011 I think we have to find a replacement because I'm not sure we're going to extend him after his deal expires in 2012, too many question marks and he'd be (that's IF Goodell doesn't do it now) looking at a long term suspension with any other off field incident.

I like Jimmy Smith but I think there should be other options at 1.

If Kerrigan, Aldon Smith, Cameron Jordan, Justin Houston, Bowers, and Quinn are off the board I'd be INTERESTED in the following players assuming we can't trade down and they are available at 20.

Akeem Ayers - OLB - UCLA
Mike Pouncey - OG - Florida
Cameron Heyward - DE - Ohio ST (I know i know..gonna get some haters for that one lol)

If Jimmy Smith had the reputation of Tim Tebow or Sam Bradford I'd take him ahead of all of those guys lol...but right now I just can't do it.

Not a fan of Brooks Reed, or Adrian Clayborn in 1.