Draft Countdown Forums

Go Back   Draft Countdown Forums > Draft Countdown Forums > Team Boards > Super Bowl Champion Seattle Seahawks

Super Bowl Champion Seattle Seahawks Discuss the Seahawks

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-08-2012, 12:58 AM    (permalink
gpngc
All-NFLDC
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MetLife, Clink x4, MetLife
Posts: 13,546
Reputation: 1784408
gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caulibflower View Post
In that scenario I like Fletcher Cox, Quinton Coples, Melvin Ingram, Courtney Upshaw or Luke Keuchly in the first, Doug Martin, Alameda Ta'amu or Mychal Kendricks in the second, Burfict, Martin or Trumaine Johnson in the third, and Dontari Poe in the fourth.
With ya on most. Poe in the 4th isn't happening though.

I think CB is a bigger need for us than we think. We need three starting-quality CBs.

Only guy we don't need is Ta'amu. We are in the unique position of having two guys capable of playing the nose. Most teams have one or none.
gpngc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2012, 01:41 AM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
With ya on most. Poe in the 4th isn't happening though.

I think CB is a bigger need for us than we think. We need three starting-quality CBs.

Only guy we don't need is Ta'amu. We are in the unique position of having two guys capable of playing the nose. Most teams have one or none.

Poe was a joke. I am intrigued by Trumaine Johnson. Yeah, probably not Ta'amu, as I think about it more. Especially considering how good our defense already is against the run. There'll be better players to fill more important needs at that pick. I basically think Ta'amu is what everyone wishes Poe was, except Ta'amu doesn't test out as well.
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 06:23 AM    (permalink
stlouisfan37
Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 1,230
Reputation: 163516
stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.stlouisfan37 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caulibflower View Post
In that scenario I like Fletcher Cox, Quinton Coples, Melvin Ingram, Courtney Upshaw or Luke Keuchly in the first, Doug Martin, Alameda Ta'amu or Mychal Kendricks in the second, Burfict, Martin or Trumaine Johnson in the third, and Dontari Poe in the fourth.
As talented as Burfict is, I doubt he is on your team's board in the top 100. He absolutely stunk up the combine to the point where several teams simply took him off their board. Kinda reminds me of Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh from Bull Durham..."Come on, 'rook, show us that million-dollar arm. 'Cause I got; oh yeah, I got a good idea about that five-cent head of yours."
stlouisfan37 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2012, 07:25 PM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I like the Jason Jones signing, and think it might make it a little less likely that we go for someone like Fletcher Cox or Melvin Ingram or Coples. They might be more talented, but Jones is a pretty solid player in the same role.

But - If Manning signs with the 49ers, Flynn then signs with Miami, and then there's only Kansas City and Cleveland ahead of us in the draft possibly looking for a QB. Not sure Cleveland would be willing to take Tannehill with their first pick, and Kansas City does have Matt Cassel, who might not be great but certainly isn't terrible.
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 05:01 AM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I like Jones as well. He gives us more versatility with his ability to rush the passer from the interior and back up Bryant. As for draft picks, I think it just lets them focus on a DE or whoever they are targeting at the pick.

I get this feeling that if Manning signs with Denver, Jacksonville will be pressured into making a trade for Tebow by their new owner, and with the recent signing of Henne, that might make Gabbert available. I know the optimism regarding Gabbert has gone down, but he was the #1 QB on their board last year. They might be willing to trade a 2nd or a 3rd to Jacksonville to get him.

Or another scenario if Manning signs with Denver...the Seahawks go after Tebow...*shudder*

If Manning signs with Tennessee though, look for Hasselbeck to be released and then Cleveland or Miami (if they haven't signed Flynn yet) will snatch him up. Thus ensuring Tannehill falls to 12.

I just have trouble seeing Manning signing with the 49ers. The NFC West is on the upswing while the AFC West & South are on the downswing. This year he may get to the playoffs/Super Bowl, but next year it will be much harder. It is an easier path to the Super Bowl through the AFC right now. And I think ultimately his goal is Super Bowls.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6

Last edited by summond822 : 03-18-2012 at 05:11 AM.
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 08:24 AM    (permalink
asdf1223
Veteran
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 980
Reputation: 185499
asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I think Manning knows he has maybe 2-3 good years left in him. Why not go to the best team that wants to upgrade its QB?
With the draft, I wonder if the team is willing to trade for picks next year for picks this year. If they have a QB target in mind for next year make sense.
__________________
asdf1223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2012, 11:26 PM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

We signed Flynn. I think we can count out taking Tannehill at 12. I am personally hoping that Melvin Ingram falls to us since I think his versatility at LB and as a back-up to Clemons at LEO is the best fit of the possible DE guys at 12.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 01:25 AM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Nah, we've got a good defense and Jason Jones fills the spot we needed on the line. LEO isn't a need anymore; I think Jason Jones can do that. He's a terrific athlete. (His combine numbers from a few years ago, for example, are better than Coples', Ingram's, and others'.) I remember reading some articles a few years ago about how coaches were raving about this kid from Eastern Michigan was was playing defensive tackle at 275 lbs, and running down running backs and whatnot. I'm kind of excited to see what he does, and wouldn't be surprised if he becomes a feature of our rotation, perhaps rotating outside on passing downs, and rolling in to let Bryant hold the edge on first and second. Point being, I'm still trying to think of someone we could use offensively at #12. Beyond DeCastro, now that we have Flynn... I wouldn't mind trying to trade down, if there was any interest. I keep thinking a blue chip receiver would be a nice shot in the arm for this offense, and it'd be a nice way to welcome Flynn to Seattle. Sidney Rice has had only that one good season, and that was Favre's revenge season. He hasn't been as dynamic or healthy since. Wouldn't be opposed to taking a long look at Michael Floyd. If Flynn turns out to be good, having Michael Floyd, Sidney Rice, Doug Baldwin and Golden Tate to throw to is a pretty diverse set of weapons on the outside. But without Floyd, you're talking about a pretty skinny, injury-prone guy with good balls skills playing no. 1, and everyone else trying to fulfil a role a notch higher than their skillset. Doug Baldwin led the team last year, but he's obviously a slot-type guy with his small stature, quickness and acceleration. Bringing in a guy like Floyd would let all the other receivers shift back into roles which better suit their abilities. If you made me pick defense at #12, I might take a look at which secondary guys are on the board. Especially if Manning signs with San Francisco, with the way teams play these days it doesn't hurt to bring in talented cover men when they're available. Round two I'd kind of like to grab Doug Martin. I think he'll be gone by the time we pick again, and he's the perfect running back to spell Marshawn and keep the team from running him into the ground. He runs tough, he's fast enough for his style, breaks tackles and catches the ball well. We draft him, we might not need to be too dependent on Flynn 'cause it might be a little like MJD and Fred Taylor a few years ago. Seriously think Martin can be a serious competitor in the NFL. Anyways, those are my latest draft thoughts.

Last edited by Caulibflower : 03-19-2012 at 01:47 AM.
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 01:59 AM    (permalink
gpngc
All-NFLDC
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MetLife, Clink x4, MetLife
Posts: 13,546
Reputation: 1784408
gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I don't see them taking a receiver with so many in the stable (and many of them having starting aspirations/experience/talent OR upside). It's possible I guess. But there are literally 7 that deserve a shot at playing time with our new real QB.

I think it's more likely Kuechly or a pass rusher. Jones will be used inside on passing downs. Our run defense should be solid assuming we can add a MLB somehow. But I don't know which pass rusher I like. They are all so sketchy to me.

Other possibilities include Kirkpatrick/Gilmore (fits the team's CB prototype), DeCastro (although I doubt they go OL with yet another premium pick), or a trade down (which they tried last year but failed somehow). Word is there is going to be A LOT of moving and shaking this year.

The great thing about the Flynn signing is that it opens up the draft for everything else. If they didn't add Flynn they would have 100% taken a QB at #12, higher, later in the first either on a trade-up or trade-down, or at the very latest in the 2nd round (Weeden or Ose).

I just want to sign LeRoy Hill and/or a MLB (Hawthorne/Lofton/Tulloch) because if we go into the draft needing TWO new starting LBs, that's not good. If we go in needing just one - Mychal Kendricks in the 2nd and call it a day.
gpngc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 03:29 AM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Jones is not a LEO candidate. He is a 3-tech. He was slid outside to DE this year because of his ability to generate pressure up the middle and they were hoping to captilize on that and his athleticism. It didn't work. We also only had 4 sacks combined last year from Byant, Mebane, & Branch. Jones has had at least 3 sacks every year in his career. And lets not forget we were one of the worst teams in the league in sacks (T-19th but only 5 sacks above 31st).

We still haven't upgraded the speed in our front 7 like Carroll said he wanted to. I think that we are looking at DE/LB being the pick there unless someone falls on draft day (Blackmon or Richardson).

Really the reason I love Ingram and have focused on him is because of his versatility. He can stand up and play LB. He can put his hand on the ground and rush the QB. Pretty much defenses have to account for where he is coming from. And if his primary responsibility next year is to just rush the passer, it could be like Aldon Smith this year.

The other two there (Coples & Upshaw) have more red flags to me. Coples for work ethic, Upshaw for his speed. The rest of the DE's I don't like in the Top 15.

And honestly taking OG at 12 (for any team) seems ridiculous. Maybe later 1st, but top 15? That isn't a G that's a tackle.

WR I could see, but I don't think Floyd deserves to go that high and Wright raised flags for me with his 40 time at the combine. I know focusing on the 40 is bad when I've seen his speed on the field, but that is precisely why it has me so worried.

This turned out longer than I thought but last point. I agree with gpngc, we need to sign at least 1 LB before the draft. Starting 2 rookie LB's makes me very nervous.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6

Last edited by summond822 : 03-19-2012 at 03:42 AM.
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2012, 04:31 PM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Michael Floyd, Keuchley, DeCastro are my top guys for #12 right now. Whether or not Jason Jones can play LEO remains to be seen... but you really think Ingram is better suited for the role? Why, because you saw him do it last year in college? I think Jones is just as good of an athlete, he just hasn't had the press coverage Ingram's gotten this year. He's already basically been doing in the NFL what Ingram is supposed to; move around the line, rush the passer and also stop the run. I really don't think Ingram would be all that much of an upgrade. I like him, but I'm not eager to draft him at #12.
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2012, 12:41 AM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I am not saying that we use Ingram exclusively as a LEO this year. What I am saying is that with Ingram we have someone who can spell Clemons and get pressure without having to sacrifice our base formation.

Other than Clemons, we had no pressure anywhere from our front 7.

The reason that Jones was available is because his stock was shot. His stock was shot because he played DE this past year. He is a 3-Tech DT not a LEO. Even John Clayton said that today. He also explains why Jones picked Seattle over St. Louis and Tennessee.

Jason Jones comments are at 14:15

And yes I would rather have Ingram for that spot because he did it in college. The difference between Ingram and Jones is that Ingram is a DE/OLB hybrid whereas Jones is a DE/DT hybrid.

The LEO position is a pure pass rushing position. If they wanted to just fill the LEO position they could take some one like Mercillis, Bruce Irvin, or Vinny Curry later and plug them in behind Clemons.

We are a team that blitzes a lot. It is a necessary evil with our defense. By having someone who can move around the formation and rush from different spots, we improve our defense. Of the pass rushers who I think worth the #12 pick (Coples, Upshaw, and Ingram), I think that Ingram has the greatest versatility. If I had to compare these 3 to pro's, I would probably say:

Ingram = Justin Tuck (smaller I know, but similar play styles)
Upshaw = James Harrison (mentally and playing, just mean SoB's.)
Coples = Richard Seymour when he wants to play

Would I rather have Kuechly? Yes actually I would. He reminds me of Brian Urlacher. But the reason I don't focus on him is because he doesn't rush the passer. And ultimately I think that this front office doesn't value LB's very highly.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6

Last edited by summond822 : 03-23-2012 at 02:49 AM.
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2012, 02:26 AM    (permalink
gpngc
All-NFLDC
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MetLife, Clink x4, MetLife
Posts: 13,546
Reputation: 1784408
gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Two new drafts (after the last two FA signings):

*Re-sign LeRoy Hill. PLEASE.

1) Luke Kuechly, MLB, Boston College
2) Vinny Curry, DE, Marshall (trade-up perhaps)
3) Omar Bolden, CB, Arizona State
4) Davin Meggett, RB, Maryland

Or

*Hopefully sign a MLB

1) Melvin Ingram, DE, South Carolina
2) Mychal Kendricks, LB, Cal
3) LaMichael James, RB, Oregon
4) Travis Lewis, LB, Oklahoma

I think our needs are as obvious as it gets:

LB (maybe two)
DE
RB
CB
OG

In that order.
gpngc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2012, 11:52 AM    (permalink
villagewarrior
Pro Bowler
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Independence, Missouri
Posts: 3,788
Reputation: 103262
villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.villagewarrior is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I've got Melvin Ingram and David DeCastro sitting there at 12, who do the Seahawks take?
villagewarrior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2012, 09:36 PM    (permalink
asdf1223
Veteran
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 980
Reputation: 185499
asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.asdf1223 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Ingram for me. They spent consecutive first round picks on OL. 3 is way too much.
__________________
asdf1223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2012, 01:59 AM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

But... David DeCastro is better, and we have a starting spot at G, and not necessarily at defensive end. Ingram would probably be rotating. It's all about adding talent, and especially where you need it - can't just get bored with drafting guys who don't post stats. They're important, and DeCastro could really take our run game up another notch - Gallery might've been the weakest point at an already pretty decent rush attack.
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-24-2012, 07:14 PM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Your still talking about spending 3 consecutive 1st round picks on OL. That is unprecedented, when really, how much of an upgrade is DeCastro going to be over a McQuistan? Not that much based on how well he played at the end of last year.

As opposed to Ingram being an upgrade over Raheem Brock (3 sacks last year).

Elite pass rushers are harder to find than elite interior linemen. Most really good center/guard prospects aren't even considered 1st round picks.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-26-2012, 04:36 PM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Do you want a starter or a rotational player with the 12th pick? Do you want a player who's going to make an impact throughout the game, or just on particular plays? I agree the pass rush needs to be upgraded, but I'm just not big on Ingram for our team, considering the guys we already have. I'll say it again - Jason Jones is capable of playing a role very similar to what we'd be having Ingram do. We did address the position. He'll be replacing Raheem Brock, if not pushing Red Bryant, too. As for the draft, a guy like Mychal Kendricks can add pass rush blitzing up the middle - he was terrific at that in college, and fills a LB need. There's going to be guys like Whitey Mercilus and Nick Perry in round 2 (I think they're more second-round types), and if not them, Vinny Curry and others. I'm talking specifically about need and value at #12, and if it's Ingram vs. DeCastro, with the departure of Robert Gallery and the addition of Jason Jones, DeCastro makes more sense to me. Particularly in light of the fact that some people hold the opinion that he's one of the best guards to come out in awhile. People just expect Ingram to be a solid player. Id rather have the better player, and then fill other needs as necessary later. You can't just say, "I'd rather have a pass-rusher than a guard."
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 12:04 AM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

You bring up good points and I agree with some of them (we'll have to agree to disagree on Jones).

The thing is, most rookies (DE, WR, & QB's especially) do not come into the league and make an impact. I look at Ingram and I see us using him like the 49ers used Aldon Smith (the type of player I think they really want for the LEO) this last year. He is a situational pass rusher early in his career. I think eventually Ingram can develop into a 3-4 rush backer where when he is on the field you have to account for him, but he may not be rushing every play.

I actually see Ingram as a LB down the road as opposed to a DE. But I am willing to take the gamble on him developing (key word here) into an impact player and a starter.

DeCastro comes in day 1 and starts. I think he is almost maxed out, so what you see year 1 is going to be slightly less than what he should be in his prime. I mean people point to the fall off after Hutchison left as the sign of what an All-Pro guard can do, but honestly, to even begin to be worth the #12 pick DeCastro has to be playing at a level of a perennial Pro Bowler.

I just can't see how we could take an OG at 12. I just can't. This team is based on defense and running the ball. DeCastro helps with running the ball, but our defense is not elite yet. We can't win Super Bowls without an elite defense. We need talent to help this defense take that next step. Sacking the QB.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-27-2012, 02:14 AM    (permalink
gpngc
All-NFLDC
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MetLife, Clink x4, MetLife
Posts: 13,546
Reputation: 1784408
gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I have struggled with both sides of the DeCastro/DE argument.

The main reason I think ultimately I side with DeCastro, despite how crazy it would be to spend yet another premium pick on OL is that I simply don't love any of these DEs.

I don't know about Kuechly though. Why not just take him?
gpngc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2012, 05:25 PM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
I have struggled with both sides of the DeCastro/DE argument.

The main reason I think ultimately I side with DeCastro, despite how crazy it would be to spend yet another premium pick on OL is that I simply don't love any of these DEs.

I don't know about Kuechly though. Why not just take him?
I know Keuchley's highly-rated and no one would rag on the Seahawks for taking him, because he fills a need, too - But he's never impressed me. I haven't watched a ton of tape, but I've watched some, and he doesn't pop out at me. I know who he is because of the little scouting circle that pops up over him before the play starts. He gets washed out by blockers and doesn't look particularly violent to me. He's a tackling machine with speed. To tell the truth, I feel a little Aaron Curry about him. Respected teammate, great athlete... I don't know. I don't really see the fire about him I like in my MLB. I actually like Mychal Kendricks a lot better. I'm low on Keuchly and high on Kendricks. From what I've seen, I'd be totally ok with Kendricks in the second, and would be thrilled if we nabbed him in the third.

To breifly reiterate my DeCastro argument - it's as simple as this:

DeCastro profiles as a Pro Bowl guard. He would start from day 1 and be an upgrade, not only because our starter wasn't great, but because our starter left.

Ingram profiles as a rotational player who gives you positional versatility. He's 6'1", 270 and runs about a 4.8. We just signed a guy who was picked in the second round only a few years ago after measuring out at 6'5", 275 and running mid 4.7 forties. He offers positional versatility and pass rush. He's also a much better fit for our 4-3 than Ingram is. With prospects you can always speculate that they'll be great, but the fact is we just signed a freak athlete with a reputation as a very solid player for the same role Ingram would hypotheticall hold. I just don't see why you'd double-dip with a position you just addressed when there's a superior player (held against his peers at the same position) available on the board that addresses a more pressing need.

Other than DeCastro, if we're going to pick a lineman, I'd be much more inclined to go Michael Brockers or Fletcher Cox. Both pass-rushing defensive tackles, but with better size than Ingram - both of these guys are true defensive tackles. If we want to go "pure pass rusher," I think you also have to be thinking of trading down. I just don't like any of the guys on the board at #12. If you want a fast edge rusher, you'll be reaching at #12. I suppose if you ask me, the only edge rusher who even really intrigues me this draft is Nick Perry, and he's a second-rounder in my eyes. This is a bad year for rush ends. I'd rather not force a pick.

I wouldn't be terribly unhappy if we took Michael Floyd. I think Seattle's got a locker room that's pretty cohesive, and might be willing to take a gamble here. Rice has had persistent health problems, and getting a no. 1, big-bodied wideout with speed, and the addition of Matt Flynn, could take this passing attack up TWO levels. We have a great cast of supporting receivers, but unless Sidney Rice suddely reverts to his 2010 form, and can stay healthy, that's going to remain a need. When your number one has several "ifs" about him, you're not out of line to be thinking of taking a top wideout in the draft. Problem with Floyd is there are "ifs" about him, too.

And I'll finish with someone I'm certain will get poo-poo'd -

I still really like Tannehill. Flynn is no sure thing, and his contract is flexible. Tannehill has huge upside, and having the QBs we do gives us a really good situation to draft the high-upside guy, let him learn for a year or two, and then re-evaluate the position - Developing QBs can be an investment that provides fantastic returns, as starting-caliber QBs are already in demand. I don't love most of the picks that make sense at #12, but I've been high on Tannehill for a long time. But you all probably know that. I don't think there's anything about Flynn that should make our front office pass on a QB if one they really like comes around, but of course you always have to be thinking about what benefits your team now as well as later. Tannehill would certainly be a "later"-minded pick, but like I say - if there's not a guy at #12 I'm excited about, I'd be the crazy GM who's sort of waiting to see if Tannehill makes it through the Cleveland-Kansas City-Miami gauntlet.
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2012, 01:23 AM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Actually the more tape I watch of my 3 top pass rushers (Coples, Upshaw, and Ingram), the more I am starting to want Upshaw. He makes plays in space, he is violent with his hands, has good speed (4.7 at 280), and is just plain nasty.

That said, if Coples is there at 12 (which I doubt) I think the Seahawks take him (not my preference). Physically he is everything you want in a pass rusher, but I keep thinking Vernon Gholston every time I see him. Pete probably thinks that he can force him to buy into the system and get greatness out of him.

Again we'll disagree on Jones, who I feel is purely a DT. Sliding him out to DE is what resulted in him having a bad year this year. We also know I don't feel like DeCastro is worth a Top 15 pick.

Brockers is just another Mebane/Branch (especially when he shows up at the combine with NT weight). He is a big guy who clogs the interior of the line but isn't going to add much to the pass rush. Cox however does intrigue me. I think he could add to the pass rush, I'm very unsure if it is going to translate to the NFL however.

I think the Seahawks are trying to make sure teams know they are interested in Tannehill if he is at 12. I think they would like to trade down, and if Tannehill is still on the board, they may get an offer. Just keep in mind that they showed up to Mallett's pro day last year and worked out Clausen even though they had no interest in either QB so being at Tannehill's pro day may not mean anything. Also they could have been scouting Fuller.

And finally I think we may be surprised with who they pick we do in fact trade down this year. I am actually thinking that they may be targeting Colby Fleener. Pete has said he wants to use 2 TE sets, and with the success of Gronk & Hernandez in NE, it could add value to having that second TE. At his pro day they took him off to the side for a private conversation. I don't remember who the Seahawks personnel were, but when I find it I'll link it.

EDIT: Found it
Pic of Fleener + Seahawk Coach

Can't be confirmed but speculation is that it's Pat McPherson our TE coach. Only other possible match for that head of hair is Darrel Bevell. Can't confirm since they don't have height/weight for the coaches.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6

Last edited by summond822 : 03-31-2012 at 01:37 AM.
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2012, 08:46 PM    (permalink
Caulibflower
Pro Bowler
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Seahawks Diaspora
Posts: 4,994
Reputation: 1639510
Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.Caulibflower is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

After watching Ingram's pro day workout and hearing Mike Mayock gush about him (including his apparantly terrific hands), I'm starting to think he may be physically talented enough to warrant the pick as BPA, which had been my problem with taking him up to that point. I suppose I'd thought of him as more of an "effort player" being undersized, but I feel like I'm realizing he could play DT, DE and OLB (And take direct snaps on special teams, etc.) because he's a terrific athlete at 270 lbs. He's a bit shorter than I like for his position (height and arms), but if you are telling me I could be getting a (possibly) more athletic version of LaMarr Woodley or Adalius Thomas for our defense, that doesn't sound too bad. I do still wonder how he'd fit into our defense, though. Would the Seahawks gameplan specifically around his skillset? I guess if he's that good, I want him, but if he's not... where does he fit?

Haven't watched a whole lot of Upshaw, but he'd basically be a pure 4-3 base end, right? Essentially Red Bryant's position? The problem I have with that is that Red Bryant is 1. good, and 2. a run-stuffer. I don't really have the impression that Upshaw is a dynamic pass rush threat, so if you're rotating a guy with Bryant I'd want to be sure that's what Upshaw can bring.

So Ingram's stock is on the rise for me. I really didn't think I'd be saying this a few months ago, but Brock Osweiler in the third doesn't sound like too bad of an idea to me anymore. I'm not thrilled about him, but we're nowhere near set at the position and I'd feel better about a third for Osweiler than I was when I learned we were trading one for Whitehurst, that's for sure. The only reason I suggest Osweiler is because our current projected starter, Flynn, is a totally unknown commodity and by the time we know what he is, we can have groomed another QB as a backup plan. If Flynn is good, we keep the QB in the fold and we've got a good backup, or we trade him. If he's bad, the formerly raw prospect who's been groomed for a year or two, or whatever, gets a shot.

Still would rather draft Kendricks a round or two later than Keuchly at 12. Still want Doug Martin to end up on the team. For what we need and what we're looking at, trading down sounds good, too.

Last edited by Caulibflower : 04-01-2012 at 08:49 PM.
Caulibflower is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2012, 11:37 PM    (permalink
summond822
Veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 864
Reputation: 15399
summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.summond822 is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

Actually of the 2, Upshaw is better in space right now because he did it at Alabama. He isn't as fast/quick as Ingram, but he makes reads quicker and is more instinctive and that makes up for it. He also has a great bull rush.

As for how we use them, think of how Pete used Clay Matthews at USC. I think that is how he wants to use them. Someone who can blitz, rush with their hand on the ground, and cover. I think that they already have it built into the defense, they have just been looking for the right guy to plug in there.

Upshaw vs LSU NC

I like this tape because it shows Upshaw having to react to LSU's run game instead of just rushing the passer. I think my favorite is when he stops the option by himself at around 0:50.
__________________
Video games keep me sane

University of Washington Huskies: 7-6

Last edited by summond822 : 04-02-2012 at 11:45 PM.
summond822 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2012, 02:28 AM    (permalink
gpngc
All-NFLDC
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: MetLife, Clink x4, MetLife
Posts: 13,546
Reputation: 1784408
gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.gpngc is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
Default

I think we may take Kendricks at 12. Or trade down and take him.
gpngc is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:00 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.