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Old 03-26-2014, 12:20 AM    (permalink
niel89
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My impression was that Veldheer wanted to resign before the year as well. I don't think the Raiders were serious enough about resigning him and didn't make a full effort. He probably just moved on mentally at a certain point
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Old 03-26-2014, 12:32 AM    (permalink
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We have no idea what kind of situation RM is in, does he have a budget that is crippling his ability to sign players and thus must let them walk. Small revenue franchises face this problem all the time and it will always be a consistent theme around the low revenue franchises in the NFL. Oakland has new ownership, how committed to their franchise are they???????

Look at Buffalo and how many stars they have let go because of revenues, even a solidly run franchise like Pittsburgh is in a constant flux, because it cannot retain too many of its FA's.
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Old 03-26-2014, 12:54 AM    (permalink
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God, I hate our fanbase (with a few exceptions of course)
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Old 03-26-2014, 12:54 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
I think it's way more likely that he didn't want to go back to one of the worst teams in the league and would rather cash in somewhere else with a chance to win. And he himself has said nothing to dispel that inference of common sense, which completely jives with what McKenzie said.

I know it's fun to kill GMs, but this one is pretty obvious. Veldheer wouldn't be the first guy to want out of a stupid organization, and I don't blame him for wanting to leave.

I highly, highly doubt McKenzie let Veldheer go, then heard some outcry and read some message boards and said "DAMNIT - I didn't know Veldheer was good! I need to go to the media and tell him he wanted to leave to save my ass."
It's pretty obvious that Reggie McKenzie is an idiot. I wouldn't put finding out Veldheer is good from a mesage board past him at all. Look at what the moron did with Matt Flynn.

...and Veldheer himself HAS said many, many times that he wanted to re-sign with Oakland. Houston is the guy who never claimed that. Houston pretty clearly wanted out of town (and no one blames him, so he's not lying about it...see?).

Read this take from an Oakland blogger paying closer attention than you or I.

TL:DR version of the link: Reggie tried to sign Veldheer, lowballed him, Veldheer got a much better offer from the Cards nd agreed to sign with them, Reggie overcompensated by throwing even more money at Saffold, ***** up everything he touches, lands on the hot seat, and starts lying about Veldheer to deflect heat.

Remember: if Reggie really wanted him, Reggie would have franchised him. No player's ever been been happy about being franchised, and no GM has ever cared how the player felt about it. Why would anyone believe that Reggie is just so gosh-darned nice to players that he wouldn't franchise a pro-bowl level guy who wants out of town? That's pretty much what he's saying here.
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Old 03-26-2014, 12:58 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Iamcanadian View Post
We have no idea what kind of situation RM is in, does he have a budget that is crippling his ability to sign players and thus must let them walk. Small revenue franchises face this problem all the time and it will always be a consistent theme around the low revenue franchises in the NFL. Oakland has new ownership, how committed to their franchise are they???????

Look at Buffalo and how many stars they have let go because of revenues, even a solidly run franchise like Pittsburgh is in a constant flux, because it cannot retain too many of its FA's.
I had to re-read that like 8 times looking for a punchline. With revenue sharing, "small revenue" franchises don't even exist. Teams are REQUIRED to spend 89% of the cap over a 4 year period. Buffalo hasn't lost a single free agent because of not having enough money since revenue sharing started.

The Steelers don't let guys go because they're poor; they let them go because all of their salary cap is tied up in ancient veterans. They're spending as much as anyone in the league. When do the Steelers fail to make money? They have one of the largest fanbases in the country.

This ain't baseball. This is the communist NFL. The Raiders aren't the Athletics. When Jerry Jones, Daniel Snyder, John Mara, or Virginia McCaskey make more than your average owner, they have to hand most of it to a poorer team.

I don't think Oakland is a "small revenue" team even if revenue sharing were cut off tomorrow, anyway. They have a huge fanbase.

And really, even if this were baseball, having a budget reason to not sign Veldheer would make no sense. Saffold's contract was bigger than Veldheer's.

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Old 03-26-2014, 01:56 AM    (permalink
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God, I hate our fanbase (with a few exceptions of course)
LOL <3 ya Borat!!! :)
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Old 03-26-2014, 01:57 AM    (permalink
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Need isn't the right word.

They absolutely should though. I hope they don't.

Verrett is considerably better than Kyle Wilson ever was. He's also not just a nickel back.

Baalke has two 5-10 CBs along with the guys over 6foot.

But again, I hope they don't do it. I think Verrett will end up as a top-10 player out of this draft, and I highly doubt he falls to 30th.
Like I said before, if he's the pick, I support it, because Baalke has a pretty legit track record with DBs.

To me it's not his height that is the issue nearly as much as the weight. All of Baalke's CBs are 190+... Verrett is 177.
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Old 03-26-2014, 03:25 AM    (permalink
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If he does, then he's an idiot.

Make as much as you can while you can.
That's fine. Most players won't and probably shouldn't leave money on the table. He just has to realize that his chances of winning a Super Bowl diminish. If he's fine with that then so be it. Some guys, a lot of guys, maybe even most guys just play for a paycheck and winning is a bonus.
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Old 03-26-2014, 08:12 AM    (permalink
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Hahahaha Rams get a 7th round pick for Craig Dahl and NOTHING for Steven.
It could have something to do with them allowing him to opt out of his final year
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:05 AM    (permalink
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Peppers out Jared Allen in.

Bears get younger on the DL
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:19 AM    (permalink
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Seeing Jared Allen in a Bears uniform isn't going to look right.
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:24 AM    (permalink
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That's fine. Most players won't and probably shouldn't leave money on the table. He just has to realize that his chances of winning a Super Bowl diminish. If he's fine with that then so be it. Some guys, a lot of guys, maybe even most guys just play for a paycheck and winning is a bonus.
Players don't care about winning as much as fans do.
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:26 AM    (permalink
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Well that's unexpected. If we only got Allen to fix our d-line issues, I'd be upset, but getting him in addition to Houston isn't bad. Add a DT early in the draft and that's not a bad offseason upgrade to the front 4.
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:26 AM    (permalink
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Players don't care about winning as much as fans do.
I think that's mostly true.

And fans don't care about the $ as much as players do.
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Old 03-26-2014, 09:29 AM    (permalink
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This is an awful year to draft DEs so that helped Allen with his negotiations for sure.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:01 AM    (permalink
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Players don't care about winning as much as fans do.
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I think that's mostly true.

And fans don't care about the $ as much as players do.
I guarantee that 95% of the football fans who get mad about players taking money over going to a better team would do the same thing. Ideally, I'd like to stay with my team. But if they let me get to free agency, I'm deciding based on three things: 1. The money, 2. the city, 3. how much they take from me in taxes. Chances of winning a Super Bowl would be a tie breaker.
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Brilliant letting one of Scott Pioli's henchmen have his own team to ruin.  One of the premier GM jobs in the NFL and it gets handed to a stupid **** who makes three facepalm moves for every good one.  Awesome.  Just like handing a new Mercedes to a 16 year old girl who's already been in three wrecks. 
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:02 AM    (permalink
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I guarantee that 95% of the football fans who get mad about players taking money over going to a better team would do the same thing. Ideally, I'd like to stay with my team. But if they let me get to free agency, I'm deciding based on three things: 1. The money, 2. the city, 3. how much they take from me in taxes. Chances of winning a Super Bowl would be a tie breaker.
Pretty much.

It's always about money.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:04 AM    (permalink
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I guarantee that 95% of the football fans who get mad about players taking money over going to a better team would do the same thing. Ideally, I'd like to stay with my team. But if they let me get to free agency, I'm deciding based on three things: 1. The money, 2. the city, 3. how much they take from me in taxes. Chances of winning a Super Bowl would be a tie breaker.
It's hard to put yourself in the spot of a player, but I generally agree.

Maybe this is just the fan in me, but if we're talking a big enough deal and there is only a few million dollar difference, I'd choose to go to a contender over a bottom dweller. But if the difference in money is big, it'd be hard to turn it down. Sure it would be great to win a Superbowl, but you've got a lot of life left to live after your playing career and the Raiders money would be just as good as say, the Patriots or Broncos, especially if there is more of it.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:05 AM    (permalink
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A couple of million of dollars is a **** ton of money no matter how rich you are.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:08 AM    (permalink
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A couple of million of dollars is a **** ton of money no matter how rich you are.
If it's $60 million to go to a Superbowl contender or $65m to go to a crappy team, I'd lean toward the former. Either way, if you're even remotely careful with your money, you're set for life.

But if you're toward the bottom end of the scale, a JAG just trying to make teams and playing for whatever you can get, you take the biggest offer no matter what. There, the difference between $1.5 million and $2 million is astronomical.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:11 AM    (permalink
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I think players care more about winning than fans think they do, but fans care more about winning than some players do, if that makes sense.

Anyone who has a competitive bone in their body does NOT want to lose... The difference between good and great players normally is the amount of work they put in to get themselves in prime position to win.

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Originally Posted by BeerBaron View Post
If it's $60 million to go to a Superbowl contender or $65m to go to a crappy team, I'd lean toward the former. Either way, if you're even remotely careful with your money, you're set for life.
I think this is nice to put in perspective. $65 million dollars and being miserable or $60 million dollars and being part of something memorable.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:11 AM    (permalink
bigbluedefense
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Dude...I'm taking the extra 5 million and buying more real estate with it.

Life after football >>>> football life.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:15 AM    (permalink
MidwestJimmy
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Quote:
And fans don't care about the $ as much as players do.
That's obviously because the players are getting the money and the fans are paying it. Fans care about money in a contract, but that's because it affects their favorite team's salary cap situation, which affects the chances of them winning.

If I'm a free agent, I would be more likely to chase money from a bad team if I already have at least one title ring (like Justin Tuck, who has two rings, going to Oakland). Football isn't like the NBA, where you have to have at least three championship rings or you're considered a failure (and conference titles mean NOTHING if you lose in the Finals series), since the NBA is based on dynasties.

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Old 03-26-2014, 10:19 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense View Post
Dude...I'm taking the extra 5 million and buying more real estate with it.

Life after football >>>> football life.
Eh, depends on the person.

ASSUMING I am ridiculously good, and that's why I am getting offered the huge salary, I am taking the $60 million instead of the $65, because I am too competitive of a person and would want to be remembered as THE BEST, or as close to THE BEST as I can be. Losing takes its toll on me in damn beer league hockey, can't even imagine what it would do to me in the NFL.

With 60 million, you could drop 5 million, and then spend a million a year until you were 75, assuming you never made another cent in your life, and somehow made no interest on the savings you did have. And I mean, thats not even including endorsements, broadcast work, etc.

I can completely SEE the side of "take every cent possible", I just think once I got past the "set for life" stage, an extra 5 million wouldnt make me okay with having a ****** career.
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Old 03-26-2014, 10:22 AM    (permalink
Nikolas
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You are forgetting one of the caveats of football players. They all think they are impact players who will turn a team around. Many of them (especially the starting quality players) feel that as soon as they get to the new team, things will be different, dammit!

That being said, I don't blame any player who goes where the money is. I hate seeing good players leave in free agency, but this game takes an enormous toll on their body, and they can't afford to leave money on the table. Just look at guys like Earl Campbell, who was my hero when I was growing up; the poor guy can barely walk now.

I remember one player's quote about dealing with the front office people: "Whenever I say it's a game, they tell me it's a business. Whenever I say it's just business, they tell me it's just a game".
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