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Old 03-08-2012, 01:19 PM    (permalink
E-Man
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Originally Posted by thule View Post
Interesting late round name that came up today when reading about texas a&m pro day. Late round DB sounds nice.


http://blogs.nfl.com/category/pro-days/

A name I have my eye on depending on what happens with Robinson in FA. Here is a guy who is going to fall because of injuries but he just went off at his proday. Besting his numbers from the combine by a lot.



Another WR to keep an eye on if Robinson goes elsewhere.



Miami Pro Day OG Brooks blew up


Name tied to a visit to us..haven't seen any others yet.


Orson Charles, Georgia didn't have a great workout but he is a guy who I think might be a decent replacement for martellus. Most polished blocked or the TE's in this class. Might fall to the 3rd with his slow proday time. He says he runs 4.5's and that is what makes him available in the 3rd round. Not a lot of size but something to think about. 3rd's probably a little too high for my taste for a backup TE anyways.
I love Greg Childs. I saw him play a lot, and I think if it wasn't for the injury that put him out in 2010 he would've been looked at as a 1st or 2nd round pick. The guy could be a really good steal. I love his balance when he runs. Since he's a decently sized guy it helps out a lot. If Robinson is gone and he's there really late it would make sense. It gives Harris some competition to keep him from getting complacent, and with the injury problems they had last year it wouldn't be a bad chip to have.
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Old 03-08-2012, 05:52 PM    (permalink
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The more I read and the more I watch clips, I think D. Hightower may end up being the best defensive player in this draft. This guy is fast and violent, and I think his pass rushing ability is very underrated.
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Old 03-08-2012, 06:33 PM    (permalink
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The more I read and the more I watch clips, I think D. Hightower may end up being the best defensive player in this draft. This guy is fast and violent, and I think his pass rushing ability is very underrated.
I'm sorry Macarthur, but whatever you do, don't become a scout lol. Hightower is a violent hitter who I would love on this team, but he isn't that explosive like you suggest. He lumbers around. I like him a lot, but he is not a pure pass rusher. Could he get a couple sacks in an odd look? Sure, but that isn't his best area. You also need to remember he was playing on Alabama with a good amount of all americans next to him to take up blockers. It won't be that easy in the NFL.
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Old 03-08-2012, 10:38 PM    (permalink
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I'm sorry Macarthur, but whatever you do, don't become a scout lol. Hightower is a violent hitter who I would love on this team, but he isn't that explosive like you suggest. He lumbers around. I like him a lot, but he is not a pure pass rusher. Could he get a couple sacks in an odd look? Sure, but that isn't his best area. You also need to remember he was playing on Alabama with a good amount of all americans next to him to take up blockers. It won't be that easy in the NFL.
Your scouting has been genius. Hey, decastro is great!
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Old 03-09-2012, 06:29 AM    (permalink
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The more I read and the more I watch clips, I think D. Hightower may end up being the best defensive player in this draft. This guy is fast and violent, and I think his pass rushing ability is very underrated.
... That is all. He's not even the best player at his position regardless if you tally him as an ILB or an OLB.

ILB: Kuechly
OLB: A TON of players are better OLBs. He's not explosive at all...
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Old 03-09-2012, 09:51 AM    (permalink
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I'm not saying he's a pure OLB. I'm saying that I think 4 years from now, he may very well be the best defensive FOOTBALL PLAYER in this draft.
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Old 03-09-2012, 11:27 AM    (permalink
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Orson Charles just got a DUI. I'm not one who cares about things like that, but I guess the NFL does so that's a good thing for us. If he's there in the 3rd, i'd have my card at the podium before they can say "Dallas is now on the clock." I know the team has bigger needs, but he may actually be the 2nd tight end that contributes. He is basically just a bit bigger and stronger Aaron Hernandez. I like John Phillips, but it's definitely something worth taking a peek at.
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Old 03-09-2012, 12:09 PM    (permalink
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Orson Charles just got a DUI. I'm not one who cares about things like that, but I guess the NFL does so that's a good thing for us. If he's there in the 3rd, i'd have my card at the podium before they can say "Dallas is now on the clock." I know the team has bigger needs, but he may actually be the 2nd tight end that contributes. He is basically just a bit bigger and stronger Aaron Hernandez. I like John Phillips, but it's definitely something worth taking a peek at.
Who's going to block? I don't care who you quote online Charles is a piss-poor blocking and that's a HUUUUGEEE responsibility at the TE2 spot. At best Charles can "redirect" but that isn't good enough in run blocking.

We need to draft someone like Marty B that can actually catch. You are quite right in that dropping to the 3rd is insane value. I still think he's a late 1st or at worst mid second.
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Old 03-09-2012, 12:41 PM    (permalink
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I would like to see us get an athletic TE that is a receiving threat. I feel you can always teach these guys to block and improve their blocking technique. You cannot teach them how to catch.
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Old 03-09-2012, 01:16 PM    (permalink
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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...state-pro-day/

What a beast!!!
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Old 03-09-2012, 01:33 PM    (permalink
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What do you mean? It's really not that impressive at all. Great football player, but those numbers are pretty average.

Between 4.45 and 4.5 at 6'1'' and 207 pounds, with a 10'4'' broad and a 35'' vert, and 14 reps on the bench press? That's nothing special.

I remember the people who were saying he's better than Dez.. that's a joke lol.

Dez is over 6'2'' almost 230 pounds had way better jumps and his 40 time was pretty much the same..... AND HE WAS OUT SHAPE AND HADN'T PLAYED FOOTBALL IN ALMOST TWO YEARS. That's just disrespect.

I don't mean to sound cocky or anything, but just as a comparison I am 6'0'' 190 pounds, I can probably run a mid 4.5 and can vert over 30'' and broad jump over 10'. Now obviously i'm not saying anything by this, and Blackmon will probably become a pro-bowl receiver at some point, but those numbers are pretty pedestrian.

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Old 03-09-2012, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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Who's going to block? I don't care who you quote online Charles is a piss-poor blocking and that's a HUUUUGEEE responsibility at the TE2 spot. At best Charles can "redirect" but that isn't good enough in run blocking.

We need to draft someone like Marty B that can actually catch. You are quite right in that dropping to the 3rd is insane value. I still think he's a late 1st or at worst mid second.
What are you talking about? I openly said he is pretty much just a stronger Aaron Hernandez.

We don't need a blocking tight end. Our last 2 years we're pretty bad running the football and we couldn't get a yard to save our lives, yet we had Bennett who was a top 5 "blocking tight end" in the league...

Please. A better interior OL along with DeMarco Murray is what the running game needs. Not a blocking tight end. Give me a guy who can come in an take advantage of a matchup on a linebacker or safety on 3rd down. Orson Charles is that guy. Wouldn't mind Green or Egnew either. Enough of this "blocking" garbage. Witten and Phillips are good enough in that regard.
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Old 03-09-2012, 01:56 PM    (permalink
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What do you mean? It's really not that impressive at all. Great football player, but those numbers are pretty average.

Between 4.45 and 4.5 at 6'1'' and 207 pounds, with a 10'4'' broad and a 35'' vert, and 14 reps on the bench press? That's nothing special.

I remember the people who were saying he's better than Dez.. that's a joke lol.

Dez is over 6'2'' almost 230 pounds had way better jumps and his 40 time was pretty much the same..... AND HE WAS OUT SHAPE AND HADN'T PLAYED FOOTBALL IN ALMOST TWO YEARS. That's just disrespect.

I don't mean to sound cocky or anything, but just as a comparison I am 6'0'' 190 pounds, I can probably run a mid 4.5 and can vert over 30'' and broad jump over 10'. Now obviously i'm not saying anything by this, and Blackmon will probably become a pro-bowl receiver at some point, but those numbers are pretty pedestrian.
I don't care dude, he's a beast. Why do you always have to be combative?
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Old 03-09-2012, 01:59 PM    (permalink
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I don't care dude, he's a beast. Why do you always have to be combative?
I said he's a great football player. But you said "what a beast!" after posting those workout numbers. Those numbers aren't that impressive at all.

I don't mean to be combative, i'm just trying to get factual points across on the site. The fact is those number for someone who is 6'1'' 207 isn't that great.

Not starting an argument, just saying. We need to work on scouting among Cowboys fans. It hasn't been pretty lately.. Trogdor seems to know what he is talking about though.
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Old 03-09-2012, 02:04 PM    (permalink
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What do you mean? It's really not that impressive at all. Great football player, but those numbers are pretty average.

Between 4.45 and 4.5 at 6'1'' and 207 pounds, with a 10'4'' broad and a 35'' vert, and 14 reps on the bench press? That's nothing special.

I remember the people who were saying he's better than Dez.. that's a joke lol.

Dez is over 6'2'' almost 230 pounds had way better jumps and his 40 time was pretty much the same..... AND HE WAS OUT SHAPE AND HADN'T PLAYED FOOTBALL IN ALMOST TWO YEARS. That's just disrespect.

I don't mean to sound cocky or anything, but just as a comparison I am 6'0'' 190 pounds, I can probably run a mid 4.5 and can vert over 30'' and broad jump over 10'. Now obviously i'm not saying anything by this, and Blackmon will probably become a pro-bowl receiver at some point, but those numbers are pretty pedestrian.
I don't mean to sound cocky or anything.... :)
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Old 03-09-2012, 02:55 PM    (permalink
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I said he's a great football player. But you said "what a beast!" after posting those workout numbers. Those numbers aren't that impressive at all.

I don't mean to be combative, i'm just trying to get factual points across on the site. The fact is those number for someone who is 6'1'' 207 isn't that great.

Not starting an argument, just saying. We need to work on scouting among Cowboys fans. It hasn't been pretty lately.. Trogdor seems to know what he is talking about though.
So apparently the rest of us do not.
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Old 03-09-2012, 02:57 PM    (permalink
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I said he's a great football player. But you said "what a beast!" after posting those workout numbers. Those numbers aren't that impressive at all.

I don't mean to be combative, i'm just trying to get factual points across on the site. The fact is those number for someone who is 6'1'' 207 isn't that great.

Not starting an argument, just saying. We need to work on scouting among Cowboys fans. It hasn't been pretty lately.. Trogdor seems to know what he is talking about though.
And pedestrian is kind of off base if you ask me. A 4.45 40 time is not pedestrian. 4.5 plus is pedestrian for a WR. But what do I know, apparently I don't have the SCOUTING skills like others on this board.
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Old 03-09-2012, 06:48 PM    (permalink
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And pedestrian is kind of off base if you ask me. A 4.45 40 time is not pedestrian. 4.5 plus is pedestrian for a WR. But what do I know, apparently I don't have the SCOUTING skills like others on this board.
Hate to bust this bubble but how fast someone runs in shorts means about zip in terms of his "football athletic ability". Fast guys on tape mean a hell of a lot more than fast guys on a track.

Fun fact? Miles Austin must be slow as hell. His 40 time? 4.47. Throw out all that tape showing off his deep speed his timed speed is not perfect.

Biggest thing about scouting for the draft his to make sure the entire body of work counts. Combine/pro day numbers are nice to have but judging a player and projecting picks is insanely inaccurate unless Al Davis is involved. ;)

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Old 03-09-2012, 06:58 PM    (permalink
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Hate to bust this bubble but how fast someone runs in shorts means about zip in terms of his "football athletic ability". Fast guys on tape mean a hell of a lot more than fast guys on a track.

Fun fact? Miles Austin must be slow as hell. His 40 time? 4.47. Throw out all that tape showing off his deep speed his timed speed is not perfect.

Biggest thing about scouting for the draft his to make sure the entire body of work counts. Combine/pro day numbers are nice to have but judging a player and projecting picks is insanely inaccurate unless Al Davis is involved. ;)
Miles Austin is also near 6'3'' 220-225 pounds and had a 41 inch vert as well. All in another class than Blackmon.. and he was an undrafted free agent. Granted he went to Monmouth.

Back to the point, people aren't getting what I am trying to say. I acknowledge that Blackmon is a good football player who deserves the recognition, I am just saying those work out numbers aren't that impressive for a guy who is touted as a top 10 pick. I'm not pulling an Al Davis here, I am just stating the obvious.

4.48, 35 inch vert and a 10'4'' in the broad isn't that special for a dude who is only 6'1'' 207. He's still a good football player. Relax.
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Old 03-09-2012, 07:53 PM    (permalink
crisco0710
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Hate to bust this bubble but how fast someone runs in shorts means about zip in terms of his "football athletic ability". Fast guys on tape mean a hell of a lot more than fast guys on a track.

Fun fact? Miles Austin must be slow as hell. His 40 time? 4.47. Throw out all that tape showing off his deep speed his timed speed is not perfect.

Biggest thing about scouting for the draft his to make sure the entire body of work counts. Combine/pro day numbers are nice to have but judging a player and projecting picks is insanely inaccurate unless Al Davis is involved. ;)
Blackmon has shown on film many times his ability of outrunning defenders. But I'm getting the vibe you are talking about in general and not just about Blackmon.
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Old 03-09-2012, 08:53 PM    (permalink
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Blackmon has shown on film many times his ability of outrunning defenders. But I'm getting the vibe you are talking about in general and not just about Blackmon.
Yeah it was more of a general tone just aimed at this time of the year :) Combine and pro day times get waaaay too much stock in a prospect's rating and typically closer to draft days it'll fall more in line. I'm not the biggest Blackmon fan but I doubt his timed speed will affect his stock at all.
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Old 03-09-2012, 09:14 PM    (permalink
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Yeah it was more of a general tone just aimed at this time of the year :) Combine and pro day times get waaaay too much stock in a prospect's rating and typically closer to draft days it'll fall more in line. I'm not the biggest Blackmon fan but I doubt his timed speed will affect his stock at all.
I agree, running in shorts is much different than in a uniform. Blackmon's timed speed simply solidified him going in the top 10. If he would've clocked a 4.6, he may have dropped out of the top 10. I stress MAY
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Old 03-09-2012, 09:27 PM    (permalink
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So why is Stephon Gilmore's stock rising so much?
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Old 03-10-2012, 07:41 AM    (permalink
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So why is Stephon Gilmore's stock rising so much?
People are finally getting a hold of his tape. Kirkpatrick's stock is slipping hardcore due to questions about whether he's a CB or a FS in the pros. Gilmore has been floating in the 3rd/4th best CB spot for a while. He's got the ability to press, tackles extremely well, and plays just as fast as his timed speed (~4.4 - seen a couple 4.37s).

If we are scouting for a corner to play opposite Jenkins I LOVE both Gilmore and Minnifield. If we are looking for a slot guy (at least to start off with) then targeting Jenkins or Boykin.

I think whether or not we sign someone like Brandon Carr is REAAALLLY going to affect the type of CB prospect we grab. Personally I want to see Carr signed and then a quick twitch inside guy drafted.
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Old 03-10-2012, 07:51 AM    (permalink
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People are finally getting a hold of his tape. Kirkpatrick's stock is slipping hardcore due to questions about whether he's a CB or a FS in the pros. Gilmore has been floating in the 3rd/4th best CB spot for a while. He's got the ability to press, tackles extremely well, and plays just as fast as his timed speed (~4.4 - seen a couple 4.37s).

If we are scouting for a corner to play opposite Jenkins I LOVE both Gilmore and Minnifield. If we are looking for a slot guy (at least to start off with) then targeting Jenkins or Boykin.

I think whether or not we sign someone like Brandon Carr is REAAALLLY going to affect the type of CB prospect we grab. Personally I want to see Carr signed and then a quick twitch inside guy drafted.
I dont think that Kirkpatrick's stock is slipping as much as you think... I read that he really had a nice work out at his pro day and was pretty smooth in positional drills. I do agree that teams are spilitting hairs on whether they see him as a corner or FS but its team preference.

I've said it before that he is more of a #2 corner in Ryan's scheme because he has some limitations in man coverage. I also think that he would be a nice fit next to Sesy at safety where he can be effective in zone coverage.

as a slot guy I really like Asa Jackson... I commented about him in D-units mock... his size and athleticism translates nicely.

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