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Old 02-27-2012, 10:35 AM    (permalink
bucfan12
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Originally Posted by JohnCandy View Post
As a prospect coming into the draft what is the difference between Stephen Hill and Demaryius Thomas?

-How was Thomas ranked pre-combine?

-How was he ranked post combine?
The only similarity of the 2 is they both came from Georgia Tech and a very "RUN HEAVY" offense.

Demaryious Thomas has shown to be a playmaker this past season. His 1st year and part of this year, he was slowed by injuries.

Back to Hill, he seems like a different WR and a better prospect in my opinion. GT doesn't throw the ball much. Watch the film. He has the strength and speed to get seperation and down the field. His verticle and height and ability to outleap defenders is very good and he is underrated for that. He has great hands and attacks the ball in the air.
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:17 AM    (permalink
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The only similarity of the 2 is they both came from Georgia Tech and a very "RUN HEAVY" offense.

Demaryious Thomas has shown to be a playmaker this past season. His 1st year and part of this year, he was slowed by injuries.

Back to Hill, he seems like a different WR and a better prospect in my opinion. GT doesn't throw the ball much. Watch the film. He has the strength and speed to get seperation and down the field. His verticle and height and ability to outleap defenders is very good and he is underrated for that. He has great hands and attacks the ball in the air.
So you think that Hill is a better prospect than Thomas?

Does anyone remember how Thomas was rated?
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:42 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
I think Stephen Hill is gonna be taken early, like no later than the 25th pick in the 1st.

Yeah it's too high based on his production and skillset and he's completely raw, but how many times does a prospect come along who physically reminds you of Randy Moss??

EDIT:

Streeter will also be overdrafted because guys with that kind of speed/height combo are rare.

Production for Ga. Tech receivers usually has to be looked at in the context that their QBs just arent throwers.
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:44 AM    (permalink
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So you think that Hill is a better prospect than Thomas?

Does anyone remember how Thomas was rated?
Hill isn't a better prospect compared to thomas. From what i remember Demaryius was the 2nd or 3rd ranked wideout in the 2010 draft. Was considered a late first or early 2nd. He didnt even participate in the combine and was still rated as a possible first rounder. The questions on thomas was his ability to run routes. Thomas was a raw prospect with high potential to be a #1 one day; Hill is even more rawer of a prospect than thomas when he came out
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:46 AM    (permalink
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Hill isn't a better prospect compared to thomas. From what i remember Demaryius was the 2nd or 3rd ranked wideout in the 2010 draft. Was considered a late first or early 2nd. He didnt even participate in the combine and was still rated as a possible first rounder. The questions on thomas was his ability to run routes. Thomas was a raw prospect with high potential to be a #1 one day; Hill is even more rawer of a prospect than thomas when he came out
What made Thomas a better prospect?

What are the criticisms of Hill beyond route running?
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:53 AM    (permalink
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Hill is about as raw as it gets, and while I think a large amount of that is the offense he played in - not having good concentration and dropping the ball as often as he did despite the fact that Georgia Tech doesn't throw that much is a red flag.
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Old 02-27-2012, 07:29 PM    (permalink
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From what I saw at the Combine, I won't be shocked to see Hill in Mayock's top 5 ahead of Wright, Randle and Jeffery and getting 1st round talk.
Sure, he is raw but you cannot train 6'4", 215lbs and 4.36 speed.
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:22 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Iamcanadian View Post
From what I saw at the Combine, I won't be shocked to see Hill in Mayock's top 5 ahead of Wright, Randle and Jeffery and getting 1st round talk.
Sure, he is raw but you cannot train 6'4", 215lbs and 4.36 speed.
Have you heard the guy talk. Seems like a class act. I think a lot of people just dont realize that system there. He isnt Calvin Johnson but even Calvin was hindered by those QBs they have there.

Would love to see this guy go to New England in the second round but after this whole process that might be risky to wait till then.
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:31 PM    (permalink
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From what I saw at the Combine, I won't be shocked to see Hill in Mayock's top 5 ahead of Wright, Randle and Jeffery and getting 1st round talk.
Sure, he is raw but you cannot train 6'4", 215lbs and 4.36 speed.
I moved him up to 4th in my rankings, behind Blackmon, Wright, Floyd, and he could ascend even higher. I still have some things to look at, but I thought he was the guy who improved his stock the most at the combine. He does drop some easy passes, showing lapses in concentration, but he makes the circus catch, adjusts to the ball with very good body control while it is in the air, and catches the ball with his hands. I see alot of Randy Moss in his game, not a great route runner, but can take the top off a defense, and this guy blocks. Very raw still, but there is plenty to like and work with.
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:40 PM    (permalink
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Have you heard the guy talk. Seems like a class act. I think a lot of people just dont realize that system there. He isnt Calvin Johnson but even Calvin was hindered by those QBs they have there.

Would love to see this guy go to New England in the second round but after this whole process that might be risky to wait till then.
I think he is perfect for them, but I do not see him making it past Buffalo in the 2nd round, really not even to that spot. Im thinking he is a first round lock, maybe its a prospect crush on my part, but I loved everything I saw at the combine, and everything since. I agree 100% with your initial paragraph.
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:42 PM    (permalink
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I'm always wary of guys with limited college production but:

A) It's Ga. Tech's offense.

B) I happened to watch the UNC game this season, so...

C) He looked good in WR drills at the combine.

D) By all accounts, he's a high-character, hard-working kid.

It's hard not to absolutely love the potential. I don't see him falling out of round one.
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Old 02-27-2012, 09:28 PM    (permalink
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Dang he possibly made himself some money



6-4 and 215........supposed 4.36 40, damn that is great! And a 39.5 vert, very impressive numbers, did not think he had that kind of speed. Could make 1st round with those numbers, great to see from such a talented player.
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Old 02-27-2012, 10:09 PM    (permalink
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My real problem with him are the following criticisms,

1. He is rarely being double covered or bracketed. Because of the constant running he was in a number of one on ones, which he will not face as often in the pros.

2. He has not played against a lot of zone defense. Because of the constant running teams do not play zone and keep safeties deep so he would need to learn how to operate within that defense.

3. His hands are inconsistent and from everything I have read he has had some bad drops this season. Now with a small sample size the drops look worse.
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Old 02-27-2012, 10:30 PM    (permalink
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Mayock Comments

On Georgia Tech wide receiver Stephen Hill: “Stephen Hill killed it. I had a bunch of scouts tell me before the combine this kid might blow the roof off of it and he did. The tough thing with Stephen Hill is coming out of that option offense, he’s hard to evaluate…From a football perspective, every team in the league has a lot of homework to do. He’s a hard guy to figure out, just like Demaryius Thomas was because you don’t see real routes; all you see are verticals, crosses and play-action and jump balls. You have to do your homework on this kid and he’s kind of pushed himself right up in the forefront of this wide receivers class


http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports/...ill-killed-it/
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Old 02-27-2012, 10:50 PM    (permalink
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From another site.

Heard Carlos "Big C" Holmes, a Bengals insider, say on the radio that the Bengals loved Hill at the combine, not just the workout either. Apparently his interview was a home run.
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Old 02-28-2012, 01:05 AM    (permalink
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I don't think he is going to come close to running a 4.34 or whatever CJ ran.
Ouch. Glad I didn't put that on paper.
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:26 PM    (permalink
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‘Stephen Hill killed it,’’ Mayock said. ‘‘I had a bunch of scouts tell me before the combine this kid might blow the roof off of it, and he did.



No doubt that NFL teams will take another look at Hill’s sketchy college resume. Playing in a triple-option offense at Georgia Tech, Hill had only 49 receptions in three years, but for 1,248 yards, nine touchdowns and a 25.5 average per catch. He had 28 receptions for 820 yards (29.3 yards per catch) and five touchdowns as a junior in 2011.



‘‘The tough thing with Stephen Hill is coming out of that option offense, he’s hard to evaluate. We went through this with Demaryius Thomas. But he ran officially I think a 4.36. He [broad] jumped 11-feet-1 . His vertical … was out of the gym — it might have been 41 [inches].



‘‘But the point is his acceleration, his burst, his quickness and even more important to me. OK, now you’ve shown me you’re an athletic track star. When he got on the field and caught the football, he didn’t double-catch balls. He made hands catches out in front of him.



‘‘He’s a hard guy to figure out, just like Demaryius Thomas was because you don’t see real routes. All you see are verticals and crosses and play-action and jump balls. From a football perspective, every team in the league now has a lot of homework to do. He’s kind of pushed himself [to] the forefront of this wide receiver [class].’’
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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So you think that Hill is a better prospect than Thomas?

Does anyone remember how Thomas was rated?
Thomas was thought of more highly. He was considered probably the next best WR in his draft after the awesome Dez Bryant.

As someone mentioned he didn't even workout, he had injury problems, and still went in the first.

BTW: That 2010 first round looks pretty damn good. Pretty gd good.
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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From another site.

Heard Carlos "Big C" Holmes, a Bengals insider, say on the radio that the Bengals loved Hill at the combine, not just the workout either. Apparently his interview was a home run.

Total side note, and I half apologize for making a post like this, but I'd take Holmes with a grain of salt. I'm sure he knows folks, but it's hard to buy him after the semi-rant (see link below) he went on a few years ago on Ryan vs. Brohm and how he claimed, post-combine, that Brohm was a safe top 10 pick and still perhaps the favorite for the Falcons pick. The reality that year was that it was fairly clear before the combine that Brohm's stock was no where near where it had been speculated and that Ryan was the clear-lock for top QB spot.

http://www.daytondailynews.com/s/con...1008bigc2.html
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:37 PM    (permalink
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I love WRs like this guy, I know it's stupid, and it's prolly not the smart football choice, but when you've got a guy who doesn't know how to run routes, honestly, who cares? In the NFL he's going to get better coaching than he's ever received anyway, and if you don't have a coaching staff that can work with such a gifted prospect, you may need to be looking for new coaches.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:48 PM    (permalink
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I have a hard time justifying this guy any higher than the late second. I get that he is athletically gifted, but it's on the film- the kid drops easy passes as much as he makes spectacular grabs.

If he had ****** hands and 4.36 speed, he'd still be a 3rd round pick, at the very least. Yet, since he has one good showing at the combine and does well in the drills, we are to assume that he ALWAYS has great hands? How about a little consistency? How about catching a ball with a helmet on, while a defender is about to knock your lights out? I agree that the 40 shocker should send his stock up quite a bit, but the notion that this kid is suddenly a first round pick because he dominated the gauntlet is laughable to me. He does not have consistent hands, I don't care how many youtube clips you can muster up in a 60 second interval.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:59 PM    (permalink
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It's tough to not like the potential. I agree w/Th30ry that the route running question is one I can see teams ignoring. There's a learning process for all WRs. Then again, concentration and route running as negatives adds up to a bigger flag than just one or the other for any given prospect.

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I really hope the Pats don't some how get this kid.
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Originally Posted by Vaylor View Post
Agreed. Im tired of this team drafting the 'High-Upside Project Receiver' and cutting him 2-3 years later because they can't learn the system.
lmao . . . I was thinking the exact same thing. Does Larry hope the Pats don't get him b/c he likes the kid and doesn't want to see his development stunted? lol

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I've come to learn that the number one sign someone is going in round 1 is when literally everyone in a thread says they'll take him in round 2. He's going round 1.
100% agree. Then again, there was plenty of similar love for Hankerson last year.
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Old 02-29-2012, 03:03 PM    (permalink
Scotty D
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I find it kind of funny that Georgia Tech keeps putting out these WRs with that offensive system.
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Old 02-29-2012, 03:20 PM    (permalink
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I find it kind of funny that Georgia Tech keeps putting out these WRs with that offensive system.
Seriously. Why are WRs even signing there?
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Old 02-29-2012, 04:17 PM    (permalink
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Seriously. Why are WRs even signing there?
I know it's a crazy concept, but maybe some kids want to get an excellent education and play football. That's why Calvin went there, he's not just a physical freak, he's got a great mind and he really wanted to take advantage of the scholarship and get the best education while still being at a good school.

Not that there aren't better educational choices, but if you're wanting to do engineering or anything like that, there is an exceptionally short list of schools that can get you on a national stage for football and offer that level of education.

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