The Coaching Change Thread - Page 108

fenikz · 01-15-2013, 11:33 AM

The main problem with Horton is he doesn't have the connections to surround himself with good assistants he was a mere DB coach 2 years ago

Cigaro · 01-15-2013, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeerBaron

No, you can't. The only job they can't block is for head coach. A lot of teams will allow guys to interview for promotions like they, but they aren't required to.

The Bucs in the early 2000s were notorious for refusing to let position coaches interview for coordinator spots. Otherwise, guys like Marininelli and Tomlin would have gotten them sooner.

Yeah I went back and looked after posting that, apparently they can only block lateral moves, but the NFL doesn't differentiate between a position coach and a coordinator position, thus the block.

BeerBaron · 01-15-2013, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cigaro

Yeah I went back and looked after posting that, apparently they can only block lateral moves, but the NFL doesn't differentiate between a position coach and a coordinator position, thus the block.

Seems like every year, one of the rumblings for a possible rule change is to make teams unable to block position coaches from becoming coordinators, but it never gains much traction.

One big problem there vs. hiring for head coach is that coordinators are often ill defined.

For a team where the head coach calls the offensive plays for instance, what does the offensive coordinator really do there? He might just be a glorified position coach with a nicer title. So teams want to prevent losing their position coaches to such situations.

Brown Leader · 01-15-2013, 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by y.f.s.

He won't ever get a HC offer until he cuts his hair. It sucks, but no NFL owner is hiring a HC with braids.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuperPacker

I was thinking this the other day. If I was hiring him one of my conditions would be that he has to cut his hair. It looks stupid.

bigbluedefense · 01-15-2013, 12:03 PM

The problem for Horton is the recent trend in the NFL. More and more teams are realizing that the key to success in the NFL is developing the qb position, and who better to develop the qb than a OC? So everyone wants an offensive HC to develop a qb for them.

Look at all the HC candidates this offseason. 90% of them were offensive minded coaches. Teams are concerned that a defensive coach won't develop a franchise qb the way an offensive one would, so they rather have stability on offense.

So guys like Horton get screwed bc of it. This also screws a lot of black coaching candidates, bc most of the black candidates are defensive guys.

Gay Ork Wang · 01-15-2013, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrdrylie

I'm really not liking this Emery guy. His first draft annoyed me. Let's ignore our terrible line and instead draft a situational pass rusher, a tweener DB with serious injury issues, and a fullback. Then he continues the trend of failing to get a decent coordinator. Then he fires Lovie after a 10 win season. Now he's letting the top ST Coordinator in the league leave on a lateral move.

What exactly did you expect him to draft?

Also, how do we know Emery wants him to leave? Maybe its Toub?

Jeez some people really overreact here.

I HATE to see Toub go. But it is not like Emery is running him out of town

bigbluedefense · 01-15-2013, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by *** Ork Wang

What exactly did you expect him to draft?

Also, how do we know Emery wants him to leave? Maybe its Toub?

Jeez some people really overreact here.

I HATE to see Toub go. But it is not like Emery is running him out of town

The Guard from Wisconsin thats looking like a pro bowler for Cinncy would be pretty sweet.

Splat · 01-15-2013, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Coach Andy Reid confirmed he will call the offensive plays in 2013. Offensive coordinator Doug Pederson will learn at the foot of Reid.

Via Rotoworld.

Gay Ork Wang · 01-15-2013, 12:23 PM

I mean we did need a player at pass rushing. Lance Louis looked fine, Rachal was horrible. But it is not like he picked horrible people. Most of the picks contributed. Peppers and Idonije were both 31+ and our defense depends on a pass rush.

He just makes it sound like we have the next Matt Millen drafting for us.

mqtirishfan · 01-15-2013, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Splat

Via Rotoworld.

So, Doug Pederson is basically a backup OC. Perfect.

bigbluedefense · 01-15-2013, 12:25 PM

KC fans, for what it's worth, your new DC is pretty average. At least he was when he was the Jets DC under Mangini.

For what it's worth. He never had a great pass rusher with the Jets so take it with a grain of salt.

iowatreat54 · 01-15-2013, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by *** Ork Wang

I mean we did need a player at pass rushing. Lance Louis looked fine, Rachal was horrible. But it is not like he picked horrible people. Most of the picks contributed. Peppers and Idonije were both 31+ and our defense depends on a pass rush.

He just makes it sound like we have the next Matt Millen drafting for us.

I hated the Shea pick at the time, but have come to not hate it, but not love it.

However, pass rushing was really not a huge need in the first round, especially OL perceived as good prospects dropping like flies. OL was wayyyyy more of an immediate need than planning for a couple years from now at DE. That's like saying this draft LB is our top need.

That said, I have no issues with Emery right now and if we do end up with Trestman I won't be overly excited. I'd want to see who the coordinators are first.

Splat · 01-15-2013, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

For what it's worth. He never had a great pass rusher with the Jets so take it with a grain of salt.

He now has Tamba Hali and Justin Houston.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mqtirishfan

So, Doug Pederson is basically a backup OC. Perfect.

I don't think it's such a bad thing he has never been an OC before.

Gay Ork Wang · 01-15-2013, 12:34 PM

http://sulia.com/channel/chicago-bea...source=twitter

Marinelli could stay, Bevell and Trestman are open to the idea, nothing is set at all, decision has yet to be made on the head coach.

Job Reborn · 01-15-2013, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

The problem for Horton is the recent trend in the NFL. More and more teams are realizing that the key to success in the NFL is developing the qb position, and who better to develop the qb than a OC? So everyone wants an offensive HC to develop a qb for them.

Which is kind of dumb. Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Joe Flacco, Carson Palmer (back when he was good), Ben Rothlisberger, Philip Rivers, Tony Romo, Drew Brees, Matthew Stafford and Matt Ryan were all developed by Head Coaches with a defensive background.

Then, out of all the starting quarterbacks in at least their third year, Aaron Rodgers, Jay Cutler, Matt Schaub and Eli Manning are pretty much the only QBs developed by offensive HCs who aren't total scrubs.

Job Reborn · 01-15-2013, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeerBaron

No. Not even close. Have you not heard of what offensive coordinators do or what?

Might not have been worded properly, but did they or did they not develop while they had a HC who had a defensive background? It was in response to the perceived need to have an offensive HC so your QB can develop, which BBD brought up.

Edit : How did that post disappear?

y.f.s. · 01-15-2013, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brown Leader

I think it sucks too, but that's life.

mqtirishfan · 01-15-2013, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Splat

I don't think it's such a bad thing he has never been an OC before.

See: Doug Pederson's entire career.

49ersfan_87 · 01-15-2013, 01:48 PM

So basically it this?

Chargers- Mike McCoy
Chiefs- Andy Reid
Browns- Rob Chudzinski
Bills- Doug Marrone

Bears- Either Trestman, Bevell, or Arians

Eagles- Could be Gus Bradley
Jaguars- Could be Greg Roman
Cardinals- Could be Ray Horton

If it shook down like this, who do you think will have gotten the best new HC?

I think Roman will be the best HC of the bunch, so if the Jags can hire him thats a major coup.

Splat · 01-15-2013, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mqtirishfan

See: Doug Pederson's entire career.

They are holding his hand in 2013 and will take the training wheels off in 2014 it's not a big deal.

bigbluedefense · 01-15-2013, 02:35 PM

So San Diego essentially chose Mike McCoy, a guy who's famed career accomplishments were:

1. Ride a great defense and run game to the SB while reminding Jake Delhomme not to screw it up along the way.

2. Letting Tebow do his read option offense while scoring 10 points a game on a mini hot streak while backdooring your way to the playoffs

3. Let Peyton do his thang

Over Andy Reid, who is a known qb guru, been to the playoffs almost every year, went to a SB, 5 NFC Championship games, almost always had a competitive team, is one of the best drafters and evaluators of talent in the business, and was some McNabb vomit, a TO injury, and spygate away from having a SB ring

????

Good call Chargers.

georgiafan · 01-15-2013, 02:37 PM

Was it a $ issue?

bigbluedefense · 01-15-2013, 02:43 PM

I think it was a power issue. They didn't want to give Reid GM authority.

YotoJets007 · 01-15-2013, 02:55 PM

Chargers have talents in offense so McCoy can let a true OC runs it. Rob Ryan is available for DC duty.

Mike McCoy does not have any system crap so he will tap on players' talents instead of forcing them into awkward system.

YotoJets007 · 01-15-2013, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbluedefense

I think it was a power issue. They didn't want to give Reid GM authority.

Money issue is likely.