Burfict or Kuechly?

[PossibleCabbage]

Originally Posted by ellsy82

I don't think its even a question. Kuechly's above and beyond the better prospect. Perhaps not as athletic, but his instincts are almost supernatural. He's ALWAYS in the right place.

I worry greatly that this sort of thing doesn't really translate that well to the NFL.

[ellsy82]

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage

I worry greatly that this sort of thing doesn't really translate that well to the NFL.

How so? A smart, instinctive player that's always around a play? To me, intelligence is just as important as physical ability. Disagree?

[FUNBUNCHER]

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage

I worry greatly that this sort of thing doesn't really translate that well to the NFL.

Combined with film study, it's what separates the merely good to average Mikes from the special ones.

Guys like Kuechly have a much higher play recognition before and after the snap, which should allow him to play a few tenths of second faster than many ILBs.

He could end up being a JAG in the pros, but if Kuechly turns into a pro bowl Mike, I won't really be shocked.

[Saints-Tigers]

Burfict is so violent, and the damage he does to piles is really just rare. He's so explosive in closed quarters, I'd be hard pressed not to take him.

[DraftSavant]

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER

Combined with film study, it's what separates the merely good to average Mikes from the special ones.

Guys like Kuechly have a much higher play recognition before and after the snap, which should allow him to play a few tenths of second faster than many ILBs.

He could end up being a JAG in the pros, but if Kuechly turns into a pro bowl Mike, I won't really be shocked.

Look at what a career Antonio Pierce had, and I think I'm faster than he is. Same for Zach Thomas.

[ellsy82]

Originally Posted by Saints-Tigers

Burfict is so violent, and the damage he does to piles is really just rare. He's so explosive in closed quarters, I'd be hard pressed not to take him.

Maybe if you had another backer that could cover his deficiencies. I don't think he can be relied upon for 3-4 inside backer duties or any kind of 4-3 backer duties. Question I have for you, even if he would he hard to pass on, would you still take him over Kuechly?

[coltsarenumber32]

Hi guys, first post here, just wanted to hit up this topic to start because I love Burfict and think he's going to be a stud at the next level.

I'm with the notion that Burfict would be ideal for the 3-4 and Kuechly for the 4-3, but I think Burfict is the bigger impact player. someone said they're scared of Kuechly a bit because he reminds them of Barrett Ruud. I don't know if he's Ruud but it's close.

Burfict isn't a very good wrap-up guy, but in today's 3-4, he doesn't really have to be. he just needs his instincts and that power. the guy explodes on the ball carrier and can just crush people. he's an impact defender that will only get better as he learns angles and improves his tackling.

[JBCX]

Originally Posted by coltsarenumber32

Hi guys, first post here, just wanted to hit up this topic to start because I love Burfict and think he's going to be a stud at the next level.

I'm with the notion that Burfict would be ideal for the 3-4 and Kuechly for the 4-3, but I think Burfict is the bigger impact player. someone said they're scared of Kuechly a bit because he reminds them of Barrett Ruud. I don't know if he's Ruud but it's close.

Burfict isn't a very good wrap-up guy, but in today's 3-4, he doesn't really have to be. he just needs his instincts and that power. the guy explodes on the ball carrier and can just crush people. he's an impact defender that will only get better as he learns angles and improves his tackling.

How would Burfict look in a 4-3, specifically behind a Wide-9 scheme (such as the ones run in Philly and Detroit)?

[FUNBUNCHER]

Burfict has developed a reputation as being borderline uncoachable.
Dennis Erickson has experience coaching stud LBs from his U. days, and I don't ever remember a case where he had a falling out with a top player like Burfict.

IMO is immature and that's going to to downgrade his with some GMs.
Right now I don't know where Burfict's head is at, and taking a guy who might melt down in the locker room or on the playing field would make me leery of taking him in the first.

[PossibleCabbage]

Originally Posted by ellsy82

How so? A smart, instinctive player that's always around a play? To me, intelligence is just as important as physical ability. Disagree?

The NFL game is faster, so a player who is smart and instinctive enough to always find himself around the play in college may be a step or a beat slow in recognition in the NFL.

There's nothing wrong with being smart, but "instinctive, always around the play" is something that has described numerous "safe" LB picks that didn't really turn out to be much in the NFL.

[Roddoliver]

I guess the right answer is... Kuechly?

[FUNBUNCHER]

Originally Posted by PossibleCabbage

The NFL game is faster, so a player who is smart and instinctive enough to always find himself around the play in college may be a step or a beat slow in recognition in the NFL.

There's nothing wrong with being smart, but "instinctive, always around the play" is something that has described numerous "safe" LB picks that didn't really turn out to be much in the NFL.

If a player is 'smart and instinctive' in college, why would he be a step slower in his recognition in the NFL??

Instincts and game film fluency allow a player to play faster than his measurables.
Instinctive is the ability to diagnose a play before it fully develops. If you recognize a screen pass before a QB makes his pivot to throw, your play making ability is going to be faster than a LB who doesn't recognize the play until the RB catches the football behind 3 or 4 lineman.

Kuechly could be AJ Hawk. Or he could be Urlacher. I lean towards the latter because his tackle production in college was off the charts and he frequently made plays that weren't his responsibility.
If a guy 'steals' tackles from his teammates in college, he's going to be productive in the pros IMO.

[AntoinCD]

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER

If a player is 'smart and instinctive' in college, why would he be a step slower in his recognition in the NFL??

Instincts and game film fluency allow a player to play faster than his measurables.
Instinctive is the ability to diagnose a play before it fully develops. If you recognize a screen pass before a QB makes his pivot to throw, your play making ability is going to be faster than a LB who doesn't recognize the play until the RB catches the football behind 3 or 4 lineman.

Kuechly could be AJ Hawk. Or he could be Urlacher. I lean towards the latter because his tackle production in college was off the charts and he frequently made plays that weren't his responsibility.
If a guy 'steals' tackles from his teammates in college, he's going to be productive in the pros IMO.

That's a big thing there. He averaged something like 180 tackles a year. Teams aren't stupid enough to run straight at him or throw underneath to guys running across his face all the time.

Kuechly made plays all over the place because while his teammates were still finding their keys he had already started running towards the play.

Instincts > timed speed, unless you're real slow

[bitonti]

Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER

Kuechly could be AJ Hawk. Or he could be Urlacher. I lean towards the latter because his tackle production in college was off the charts

Urlacher was a free safety at New Mexico and returned kicks. They used him at WR at times. there were teams all set to draft him as a safety before the Bears took him as a cover2 MLB. Kuechly is not quite that athletic.


The real question is Kuechly 4.5 at 242 or Don'ta Hightower 4.6 at 265?

[AntoinCD]

Originally Posted by bitonti

Urlacher was a free safety at New Mexico and returned kicks. They used him at WR at times. there were teams all set to draft him as a safety before the Bears took him as a cover2 MLB. Kuechly is not quite that athletic.


The real question is Kuechly 4.5 at 242 or Don'ta Hightower 4.6 at 265?

Depends on the scheme for me. Hightower can play any LB except WLB in a 43. I love his versatility and is a guy I would really look at for the Pats. Kuechly for me would be better suited for a 43. I don't really want to see him bang hats with interior linemen too often. Maybe use him in a Jerod Mayo/Lawrence Timmons type role but I'd definitely rather him in a 43.

[FUNBUNCHER]

Originally Posted by bitonti

Urlacher was a free safety at New Mexico and returned kicks. They used him at WR at times. there were teams all set to draft him as a safety before the Bears took him as a cover2 MLB. Kuechly is not quite that athletic.


The real question is Kuechly 4.5 at 242 or Don'ta Hightower 4.6 at 265?

Urlacher was over 245# the months before the April draft. He was slotted as a LB by most scouts well before the end of the season. He was a 'safety' at New Mexico who basically played a rover position, both rushing the passer and covering intermediate and downfield.

I also meant as a pro, he could be one of the best ILBs in the game in 5 years, or a guy who struggles to find his level in the NFL.

[killxswitch]

Well this is an easy question to answer now.

[descendency]

Woops. I guess everyone is allowed one mistake every once in a while . . .

Personally, I still think Burfict should be better than Kuechly, physically, but something tells me he has given up. On the other hand Kuechly has really stepped his game up and proved he's the best ILB in this draft, bar none.

[holt_bruce81]

Originally Posted by descendency

Woops. I guess everyone is allowed one mistake every once in a while . . .

Personally, I still think Burfict should be better than Kuechly, physically, but something tells me he has given up. On the other hand Kuechly has really stepped his game up and proved he's the best ILB in this draft, bar none.

Proper coaching and he could be a beast. Ravens still would be a great spot for him, in the 3rd round.

[diemertsdawgs]

Kuechly in a heartbeat.

[jimmylishis]

Originally Posted by diemertsdawgs

Kuechly in a heartbeat.

Lol after taze runs the worst 40 at the combine

[freeupfreeney]

Originally Posted by holt_bruce81

Burfict shouldn't go in the first round, the only reason he does IMO is because he's got a crapload of potential.

But he would get a 3rd round grade from me.

I Think Kuechly goes anywhere from 20-35. And IMO the only reason he doesn't go higher is because he's not a great athlete.

Are you guys Joking.

He ran a 4.58 fourty and was in the top three of Every timed Combine event.

How is it that it is January 3rd and I've heard 5 people say Kuelchy is not an athlete.

I think he proved how much an athlete he is on Sunday.