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Old 01-04-2012, 09:59 PM    (permalink
CDCB14
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Default Is football ruined for good?

I know this is the NFL thread and i'm talking about a college game, but looking at WVU vs. Clemson right now just makes me wonder if football is ruined forever. Even in the NFL, with offenses like the Saints, Packers, Patriots, etc. it begs the question as to is there even a point in playing if every game is going to be 45-41, or even higher?

With the rule changes in today's game accompanied with the increasing athleticism of players at a ridiculous rate (and obviously athletic advancements help the offensive because they are dictating play and the defense must react) is there even a point of playing defense?

I enjoy the occasional shootout, but almost every game combining to score over 70 points is starting to get old and ruins the integrity of football in my opinion. Not only this, but it makes comebacks or even worse a game winning drive in football so much easier. It's so easy to just run a spread when the opposing defense plays a prevent and go right down the field. It's sickening.

Thoughts on this? I really hope the NFL does something about this before it becomes the NBA...

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Old 01-04-2012, 10:16 PM    (permalink
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The Steelers, Patriots, Ravens, Bucs, Giants all won Super bowls in the 2000's with teams that relied heavily on how good their defenses were.

The Ravens got carried by their defense and run game to the #2 seed as did the 49ers.

On top of that, who cares if more points are scored, it's still football.
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:21 PM    (permalink
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The game will evolve. Again.
I expect to see smaller, quicker three point edge pass rushers who absolutely sell out to get to the QB and totally abandon their run responsibilities, and teams stockpiling taller corners even if it means forcing talented WRs to switch positions.

To take the legs out of these point-a-minute offenses, you need near elite defensive talent in the secondary and guys who can dominate the LOS off the edge and up the middle.

As surreal as WVU looks tonight, Alabama and LSU have the defensive personnel to lock them up.

Clemson IMO ran into the perfect storm tonight. It's rare that a team turns nearly every mistake by an opponent into a TD.

Defenses need to get smaller and quicker to handle these spread offensive attacks.
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:30 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
The game will evolve. Again.
I expect to see smaller, quicker three point edge pass rushers who absolutely sell out to get to the QB and totally abandon their run responsibilities, and teams stockpiling taller corners even if it means forcing talented WRs to switch positions.

To take the legs out of these point-a-minute offenses, you need near elite defensive talent in the secondary and guys who can dominate the LOS off the edge and up the middle.

As surreal as WVU looks tonight, Alabama and LSU have the defensive personnel to lock them up.

Clemson IMO ran into the perfect storm tonight. It's rare that a team turns nearly every mistake by an opponent into a TD.

Defenses need to get smaller and quicker to handle these spread offensive attacks.
Except for the guys that are supposed to cover the 6'6 passcatching TE's running 4.5 second 40s and jumping over everybody in the endzone.
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:33 PM    (permalink
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Ummmmm no. And the chiefs and broncos game was 7-3 didn't you get what you wanted?

Its not all because of rule changes either. A lot of defenses are just not good. Packers for example.. we get no pass rush at all and usually just leave guys wide open.
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:35 PM    (permalink
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Don't take anything involving Clemson, in any sport, seriously
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:37 PM    (permalink
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The NFL is really going to miss Bill Polian's vision and expertise when it comes to the evolution of the game. I'm not sure there is anyone ready to take up his mantle and protect the future of the NFL.
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:45 PM    (permalink
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It's woefully imbalanced right now for sure. It's not exactly headed towards getting better either. It doesn't "ruin" football for me, but it certainly isn't good for the game in my opinion.
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:50 PM    (permalink
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I don't see the league doing anything to help defenses and I don't see them not becoming more strict on player safety so........yes. :(
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Old 01-04-2012, 10:52 PM    (permalink
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I'm no big fan of grind-it-out football myself. A game here and there is fine but a league full of 13-9 puntfests would be so boring. There needs to be a balance. I think the early 00's had it about right. Hopefully it will rubberband back in the right direction soon.
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:01 PM    (permalink
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I think that's all anyone is asking for. No one is asking for old time football. The game has evolved since then and for the better....but the degree of difficulty for offenses is at an all time low right now and it kind of cheapens it. Part of that has to do with the evolution made on that side of the ball in the past 10 years, part of that has to do with rule changes, some of it is coaches stacking their best athletes on offense in response to some of those things, ect. An even playing field and just all around better defensive football would be nice.
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:03 PM    (permalink
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All I know if that SF is a hella interesting litmus test this year for this question.
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:04 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by ElectricEye View Post
I think that's all anyone is asking for. No one is asking for old time football. The game has evolved since then and for the better....but the degree of difficulty for offenses is at an all time low right now and it kind of cheapens it. Part of that has to do with the evolution made on that side of the ball in the past 10 years, part of that has to do with rule changes, some of it is coaches stacking their best athletes on offense in response to some of those things, ect. An even playing field and just all around better defensive football would be nice.
The biggest changes they could make would be making pass interference 10 yards and a first down and defensive holding just 5 yards.

Pass Interference that is completely blatant should be a spot foul, however... Although I don't know if they want to go back to that judgmental call thing that they had with facemasks.
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:06 PM    (permalink
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I doubt next year that anyone throws for 5000 yards. I wouldn't take this year as the "norm"
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:09 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, DPI needs to stay a spot foul.

But I think the illegal contact rule shouldn't be an automatic first down. 5 yards like an offsides and a free play.

There isn't much we're going to do other than accept it. With Bill Polian out for now, the pendulum will at least slow down in swinging towards the "offensive" side of things. Don't know that it will even fully swing back, but I'll settle for it at least stopping.

Also, lockout. Defenses were worst early in the year for the most part. Most solidified towards the end of the season with a few obvious exceptions.

But yeah. Bummer.
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:45 PM    (permalink
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I doubt next year that anyone throws for 5000 yards. I wouldn't take this year as the "norm"
3 QBs threw for over 5000 this year but none will do it next year? After looking at the Pats 2012 schedule, if Brady stays healthy there is a very good chance for him to put up another ridiculous season like this year. /end Homer input
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Old 01-04-2012, 11:59 PM    (permalink
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Early 00's had it perfect but they have really messed it up now. Guys are getting penalized basically for being bigger and stronger than the people they hit. I don't know if they can fix it but I hope so. Three quarterbacks throwing 5000 yards in one season is absolutely ********.
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Old 01-05-2012, 12:02 AM    (permalink
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Thoughts on this? I really hope the NFL does something about this before it becomes the NBA...
I feel, the structured salary cap that's universally abides all pro football teams, prevents it from being like the NBA or MLB. Where the salaries are so ridiculous its nearly impossible to put a competitive team together if you're a smaller venue team.

However, Roger Goodsey is doing the best he can to increase revenue at the sake of ANY of the game's traditions. His passing rule changes have made it nearly impossible to cover a receiver and the VERY same hits he suspends and fines players for, he sells on NFL.com the very next day. Its ludicrous and completely hypocritical.

However, I'm a Steelers fan. I'm biased.
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Old 01-05-2012, 12:05 AM    (permalink
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Ummmmm no. And the chiefs and broncos game was 7-3 didn't you get what you wanted?

Its not all because of rule changes either. A lot of defenses are just not good. Packers for example.. we get no pass rush at all and usually just leave guys wide open.
It's possible that both offense are pretty ****** lol
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Old 01-05-2012, 12:20 AM    (permalink
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don't you remember the defensive LSU butt ******* WVU mercilessly early in the year? How about the Ravens, 49ers, Steelers and Broncos who all made the playoffs with extremely strong defenses (ok, maybe the broncs made it on divine intervention and a **** division, but their D is the reason they were in that place to do so)

let's just see how the playoffs play out
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Old 01-05-2012, 12:44 AM    (permalink
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don't you remember the defensive LSU butt ******* WVU mercilessly early in the year? How about the Ravens, 49ers, Steelers and Broncos who all made the playoffs with extremely strong defenses (ok, maybe the broncs made it on divine intervention and a **** division, but their D is the reason they were in that place to do so)

let's just see how the playoffs play out
Not to mention what I pointed out, it just so happens that two offensive power houses won it in the past two years and everyone forgets about all the amazing defenses from the past decade.
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Old 01-05-2012, 12:44 AM    (permalink
Bengalsrocket
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottyboy View Post
don't you remember the defensive LSU butt ******* WVU mercilessly early in the year? How about the Ravens, 49ers, Steelers and Broncos who all made the playoffs with extremely strong defenses (ok, maybe the broncs made it on divine intervention and a **** division, but their D is the reason they were in that place to do so)

let's just see how the playoffs play out
Bengals too, basically. It's definitely not that offense that got us in the play offs this year lol.
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:50 AM    (permalink
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Swings and roundabouts, eventually defenses will stop the spread nicely and teams will resort to power running again. The NFL is all about trends and the spread is hot right now.
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Old 01-05-2012, 05:54 AM    (permalink
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Football is great, the game is in good shape.
It's more popular now than ever, both here in the USA and abroad.

The only negative in the game itself is the violent nature which, as Colt McCoy, Adrian Peterson, Matt Forte, Darren McFadden, Jamaal Charles, Mikel Leshoure, Javid Best, Sam Bradford, Peyton Manning, etc. can all attest to.

The rule-makers try and make rules to cut down on some of these injuries, and they get ripped on for some reason.

Last I checked, most people preferred high-scoring games than the ugly types of FG games and incomplete passes and 1-yard runs.

Who's complaining about the state of football?
It's healthy as ever and growing.
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Old 01-05-2012, 06:03 AM    (permalink
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While there is undeniably some inflation, recent rule changes get too much credit/blame for the passing explosion that we've seen over the past five years. This isn't really anything new.

The latest generation of NFL coaches have simply mastered what a few people were trying to do 20 years ago, by taking existing (complex) NFL-level offenses and adding spread elements. The Houston Oilers were running a much simpler spread and posting similar results way before the latest round of rule changes.

http://pfref.com/pi/share/hsIGw
http://pfref.com/pi/share/ypNJO

The liberalization of the passing rules took place in 1978, and the potential for huge passing seasons has existed ever since. This is just a weird time in NFL history because multiple teams are running spread formations and have the QB talent to pull it off.

Last edited by WCH : 01-05-2012 at 06:25 AM.
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