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Old 02-06-2012, 12:43 AM    (permalink
Halsey
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Winning >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> irrelevant opinions about what tier he's on.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:43 AM    (permalink
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One thing that is fairly obvious with Eli: there has been clear and marked progression wi him every single season. And he's one of the rare players where you can track his progression statistically as well.

Every year he gets better. His floor coming out was kinda overrated. His ceiling was kinda underrated tbh. He's every bit the coach on the field his bro is.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:45 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Jimmy View Post
in 2012, he is not on the brady, rodgers, manning (peyton variety) brees level.

he is tier 2. you tell me, is that elite?
you are right. he's not them. he just beat them both in the ******* playoffs... including brady in the damn super bowl.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:45 AM    (permalink
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robert horry never played QB. he was a complementary piece. always. eli has played 8 seasons. he's won 2 rings. and he's been prety great in all others. so basically, he's won the whole ******* thing 25% of the years he's played...

im drunk, but jeremy lin help me if im wrong in this argument.
whose to say Eli isn't just as complimentary? Seriously.

The dude has a 1.58 to 1 TD-INT Ratio for his career and has never even eclipsed a 30 TD season without throwing 25 picks. Heck, he's never thrown more than 25 TD's without a minimum 14 INT's.

Matt Schaub is a better regular season QB with as many rings as marino, and you want to put Eli in the HOF because of 2 rings?

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Old 02-06-2012, 12:46 AM    (permalink
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you are right. he's not them. he just beat them both in the ******* playoffs... including brady in the damn super bowl.
and by that logic, horry was better than every single superstar he beat in the finals. sports are a ******* team effort.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:47 AM    (permalink
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Winning >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> irrelevant opinions about what tier he's on.
yep, irrelevant opinions on what tier he's on in a thread about what tier he is on (i.e. ELITE STATUS or NOT?)
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:48 AM    (permalink
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whose to say Eli isn't just as complimentary? Seriously.

The dude has a 1.58 to 1 TD-INT Ratio for his career and has never even eclipsed a 30 TD season without throwing 25 picks. Heck, he's never thrown more than 25 TD's without a minimum 14 INT's.

Matt Schaub is a better regular season QB with as many rings as marino, and you want to put Eli in the HOF?
eli is not as complementary as robert horry. he is a quarterback. your argument loses there.

comparing him to schaub, who has ZERO playoff wins/appearances... your agrument loses again.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:48 AM    (permalink
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whose to say Eli isn't just as complimentary? Seriously

The dude has a 1.58 to 1 TD-INT Ratio for his career and has never even eclipsed a 30 TD season without throwing 25 picks. Heck, he's never thrown more than 25 TD's without a minimum 14 INT's.

Matt Schaub is a better regular season QB with as many rings as marino, and you want to put Eli in the HOF?
Ok, now you're just trolling.

You must be from the "Phillip Rivers is a top 5 qb" school of thought.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:50 AM    (permalink
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eli is not as complementary as robert horry. he is a quarterback. your argument loses there.

comparing him to schaub, who has ZERO playoff wins/appearances... your agrument loses again.
no it doesnt! people make the same argument in EVERY SPORT about EVERY PLAYER's HALL OF FAME CREDENTIALS!!! RINGS = IN according to some people. you are out of your mind.

your argument = playoffs = hof, regardless of a very pedestrian regular season career.

Justin Tuck is a hall of famer if Eli Manning is a hall of famer. 2 rings, a much better player at his position.

edit: eli plays the most important position in sports, and has done so at a very tier 2 level over his entire career. not HOF worthy. If Eli Manning doesn't win a 2nd superbowl, he isn't within a lightyear of this discussion. he wins it, and loonies start mentioning it because they had 1 too many.

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Old 02-06-2012, 12:51 AM    (permalink
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Ok, now you're just trolling.

You must be from the "Phillip Rivers is a top 5 qb" school of thought.
nice logical argument backed up with stats. exactly what i expect to see on the internet.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:51 AM    (permalink
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whose to say Eli isn't just as complimentary? Seriously.

The dude has a 1.58 to 1 TD-INT Ratio for his career and has never even eclipsed a 30 TD season without throwing 25 picks. Heck, he's never thrown more than 25 TD's without a minimum 14 INT's.

Matt Schaub is a better regular season QB with as many rings as marino, and you want to put Eli in the HOF because of 2 rings?
...................

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Old 02-06-2012, 12:52 AM    (permalink
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Guys, stop talking about how much Eli wins. We need to discuss his passer rating in 2004-2006 to really come to reasonable conclusion.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:52 AM    (permalink
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I don't even know what to say at this point.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:53 AM    (permalink
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robert horry
matt schaub
tom brady
jeremy lin
eli manning
joseph addai's foot fungus

GOT IT
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:54 AM    (permalink
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Yes, and the only reason people even consider him not to be is because of the other all-time great QB's playing in today's NFL. You have Brady and Peyton who will be seen as definite Top 5 QB's of all time, Drew Brees who has a SB and gaudy stats, Aaron Rodgers who has a SB and just won an MVP, Roethlisberger who has two SB's and three appearances, and all of the other great QB's such as Rivers, etc. He shouldn't be punished because he's playing with 2 GOAT candidates, one first ballot HoF'er, and a young stallion. He's the 4th best QB in the NFL on Feb. 6th, 2012, and Top 5 if you don't project Peyton's injury to really set him back. I'd say being Top 5 at your position is elite.

He's got the championships. He's got the talent. He has the clutch aspect. He's UNSTOPPABLE. Hell, he's even got the pedigree. You can't even argue he's not putting up amazing numbers, since this year he had nearly 5,000 yards and completed 61% of his passes at 8.4 Y/A while throwing 29 TD's and 16 INT's. If we're talking about right now, then throw out career numbers. What he did as a rookie or sophomore QB has little bearing over whether he's an elite QB in 2012.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:54 AM    (permalink
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By the way, has anyone mentioned this little detail: He's never missed a game.

Kind of important.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:57 AM    (permalink
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Guys, stop talking about how much Eli wins. We need to discuss his passer rating in 2004-2006 to really come to reasonable conclusion.
I'm serious. Your only argument is that he has won 2 superbowls as a quarterback. That is it. That is it. Why isn't Jim Plunkett in the HOF? Jim McMahon? Ben Roethlisberger? Oh yeah! Because we have to consider his whole body of work! God, I'm wasted.

*Big ben won't get in unless he wins a 3rd or has a few amazing seasons that i don't expect
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:58 AM    (permalink
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Roethlisberger is going to be a HOFer too.

the 04 qb class might end up being the GOAT. Especially if Rivers wins a ring in the future. Or Schaub.
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Old 02-06-2012, 12:59 AM    (permalink
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I'm serious. Your only argument is that he has won 2 superbowls as a quarterback. That is it. That is it.
False. I said he wins. I wasn't just talking about Super Bowls. And I also pointed out he never misses games.
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Old 02-06-2012, 01:00 AM    (permalink
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He's got the championships. He's got the talent. He has the clutch aspect. He's UNSTOPPABLE. Hell, he's even got the pedigree. You can't even argue he's not putting up amazing numbers, since this year he had nearly 5,000 yards and completed 61% of his passes at 8.4 Y/A while throwing 29 TD's and 16 INT's. If we're talking about right now, then throw out career numbers. What he did as a rookie or sophomore QB has little bearing over whether he's an elite QB in 2012.
Nobody's yet to present me proof he has the talent! He has the championships. He doesn't have HOF talent, though. Like I keep saying to nauseous levels, 2 great seasons, and that's it. His whole career. 2 seasons. And as for elite talent, if he's elite the tier 1 list looks like this:
-------------------Brady, Manning


-------------------Rodgers

-------------------Brees


















-------------------- Eli
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Old 02-06-2012, 01:01 AM    (permalink
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False. I said he wins. I wasn't just talking about Super Bowls. And I also pointed out he never misses games.
Collectively, no he doesn't. He has a 57% career winning percentage as a starter.
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Old 02-06-2012, 01:05 AM    (permalink
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this is what makes me not call eli elite...

today i watched brady and was wowed by his throws and disappointed by his receivers.

today i watched eli and was disappointed by his throws and wowed by his receivers' abilities to still catch them.

if i took the rest of the season into consideration...he would be "elite" for this season. if i took his whole career into consideration...he has to play next year like he has played in the regular season this year for me to call him elite.
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Old 02-06-2012, 01:06 AM    (permalink
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Elway: 57% passer. 1.3 TD:INT ratio. Only 2 SBs.

Not elite.
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Old 02-06-2012, 01:08 AM    (permalink
whatadai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halsey View Post
False. I said he wins. I wasn't just talking about Super Bowls. And I also pointed out he never misses games.
Tebow wins too.

Last edited by whatadai : 02-06-2012 at 01:16 AM.
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Old 02-06-2012, 01:08 AM    (permalink
Jimmy
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Ben Roethlisberger vs. Eli Manning

Rings: 2 each
Win % regular season: 70% Ben 57% Eli
Career Rating: 92.9 Ben 84.something Eli
4th quarter comebacks: 20 for ben, 19 eli
GWD: 23 eli, 26 for ben.

Ben is better stats wise, a better regular season qb, and a more clutch player. and has as many rings. and he is certainly not in the HOF equation without another ring or a few lights out seasons past what we have seen from his thus far.

so tell me why eli deserves it over ben?
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