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Old 02-29-2012, 11:36 AM    (permalink
keylime_5
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Originally Posted by Sloopy View Post
BAHAHAHAHAHA another stuck up kid from that program? No way. I don't believe it.

Wait he thinks he's smarter than everyone else too? Color me shocked...
seriously.....ever since they hired Hoke the number of recruits and players putting their foot in the mouths and acting like jackasses has gone out the roof.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:37 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by SRogers92 View Post
Molk played plenty tough on the field and there was never any issues with him being soft or any of the like. Don't get so defensive of your sweetheart Konz.


Fact is -- Molk can easily turn out to be the best Center in this draft when it's all said and done and I doubt anyone would be surprised.


Oh -- btw, since you wanted to point out how "small" he is -- he's just as big as plenty of the top Centers in the league:

Nick Mangold: 300lbs
Alex Mack: 307lbs
Ryan Kalil: 299lbs
Scott Wells: 300lbs

Hell Jeff Saturday only played around 296-300lbs somewhere in there. Molk doesn't have size issues, doesn't have strength issues, doesn't have athleticism issues, and doesn't "play soft". His stock was low because people thought he was too small and now, he has proven he's not so, we'll see where he goes.

I don't think his weight is really a problem. He's 6'1" and he doesn't make up for it with long arms either. There are zero starting offensive linemen in the NFL today at that height.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:40 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by TACKLE View Post
not sure if swag or little man syndrome.

Swag would have been if he told Brewster to go **** himself in the same statement.

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I don't think his weight is really a problem. He's 6'1" and he doesn't make up for it with long arms either. There are zero starting offensive linemen in the NFL today at that height.

Todd McClure, C, Atlanta Falcons. That didn't take long.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:41 AM    (permalink
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yeah, sorry. i looked it up last weekend and I must have missed him. there are maybe one or two. and they typically don't get drafted high.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:46 AM    (permalink
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Its like one of the guys out of hundreds who makes it. Kind of like Qb under 6-0, the Drew Brees arguments comes up. Look not saying they can't make it, but 1 maybe 2 out of how many qbs have made it at that height? The odds are heavily favoring the tall guy.
So there are only a few short centers around, most are 6-3/6-4, I believe.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:49 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by keylime_5 View Post
yeah, sorry. i looked it up last weekend and I must have missed him. there are maybe one or two. and they typically don't get drafted high.
I honestly don't get the height thing for offensive lineman. If you are over 300 pounds and have long, 33+ inch arms, why does it matter how tall you are? Wouldn't it probably be better to be shorter?

That way it'd be much tougher for D linemen to get under your pads and get leverage and easier to get your hands on those tiny little Mathis/Freeney types that have that ridiculous ability to dip around the corner.

That said, I have no idea how long Molk's arms are and am too lazy to go find it.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:53 AM    (permalink
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32" arms...2nd to last amongst the Cs but I don't think that's crazy bad.

I like Molk tbh. He and Martin are tough...which is why they're worth talking about despite being part of the recent fall of Michigan.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:55 AM    (permalink
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I think its if the guy is short and fat, but has long arms its not going to matter unless he can move well, which probably is rarely the case. Think of someone who is squat, wide, and can't move easily. Sure maybe able to get your arms on them, but probably not fast enough for someone with quick twitch.

Usually you think the taller guys are the more well rounded athlete. The short WR usually run really fast, but aren't strong enough. The too tall guys aren't fast enough to separate. Then you have your middle ground.

Linemen same thing, I guess. Too tall like Nate Solder can he get low enough in his stance and hands on shorter guys even though he is athletic. Shorter guys 6'0, look like fire hydrants, have strength like one, and move like them as well. Find that middle ground.
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:19 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by SRogers92 View Post
Make an argument for Konz being stronger than Molk ...... starting ..... now! GO!
i wouldnt say konz is a power house, thats not his game. molk is doug legursky though which isnt a compliment, legursky can out bench casey hampton but that doesnt mean he and his t-rex arms can block him.

konz>>>>>>>>molk and its not close

but hey at least he can bench more
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:20 PM    (permalink
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Not a fan of the critics who point to him being too short to play the position. 6'1 is bad but 6'2 and you're golden? Seems ridiculous to me especially at a position where leverage and strength is the name of the game. He's a leader, he's smart, he's tough, strong as an ox, and he has exactly the kind of mentality you want from the guy manning the middle of your OL.

Calling him undersized is silly.... like he's going to be tossed around like a rag doll?
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:21 PM    (permalink
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i wouldnt say konz is a power house, thats not his game. molk is doug legursky though which isnt a compliment, legursky can out bench casey hampton but that doesnt mean he and his t-rex arms can block him.

konz>>>>>>>>molk and its not close

but hey at least he can bench more
If you think the only asset molk brings is a strong bench press then you're sadly mistaken.
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Old 02-29-2012, 12:31 PM    (permalink
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If you think the only asset molk brings is a strong bench press then you're sadly mistaken.
thats not what i think, but i do think that he profiles as a backup. I go back to legursky since hes about the same exact player. Smart, super strong, stocky, and has relatively short arms. I like legursky, i think hes a fine utility lineman and actually makes versatility useful unlike some other guys who are versatile just because they arent any good at one thing but marginally servicable at others.

But guys like molk, legursky, shipley...all tough, strong, smart guys that are very good college lineamn have an uphill battle making it as a starting pro. And molk saying hes the best and anyone else is absurd is just wrong. I thought legursky was a 4th/5th round player and we got him undrafted, shipley as a 5th round pick....theres legitimacy to shying away from a center like molk. And as shopley found out theres not room on a roster for 2 of those guys and as legursky found out being plunged into the starting lineup at LG and being really terrible, its just not an easy transition for these guys. some team could probably find a starting home for molk, but id say most wouldnt have use for him as anything more than a backup. jmo, but im taking konz, brewster, a pouncey, mack, wood, unger, mangold...all the "top" centers in recent years over molk every single time in a blowout, hes just not that good of a prospect to be claiming to be the best
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:01 PM    (permalink
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thats not what i think, but i do think that he profiles as a backup. I go back to legursky since hes about the same exact player. Smart, super strong, stocky, and has relatively short arms. I like legursky, i think hes a fine utility lineman and actually makes versatility useful unlike some other guys who are versatile just because they arent any good at one thing but marginally servicable at others.

But guys like molk, legursky, shipley...all tough, strong, smart guys that are very good college lineamn have an uphill battle making it as a starting pro. And molk saying hes the best and anyone else is absurd is just wrong. I thought legursky was a 4th/5th round player and we got him undrafted, shipley as a 5th round pick....theres legitimacy to shying away from a center like molk. And as shopley found out theres not room on a roster for 2 of those guys and as legursky found out being plunged into the starting lineup at LG and being really terrible, its just not an easy transition for these guys. some team could probably find a starting home for molk, but id say most wouldnt have use for him as anything more than a backup. jmo, but im taking konz, brewster, a pouncey, mack, wood, unger, mangold...all the "top" centers in recent years over molk every single time in a blowout, hes just not that good of a prospect to be claiming to be the best
Molk is a 3rd-4th round guy in my mind, so just because I'm defeding him here, let's not get carried away into putting him in the Pouncey, Mack, Mangold conversation.

He could be very wrong about his self-assessment compared to what scouts think, but that's really besides the point. The point is that he's got the confidence. You always want guys who back up their words with hard work. Since Molk does put in the work, you can appreciate that. If he was a slouch who only put up 18 lifts on the bench then you'd have to raise some flags about his commitment to being the best he can be.

Konz is very much a boom or bust player in his own right. He's been surrounded by top shelf OL talent which makes it easier for him to look good at doing his job. Not to mention Wisconsin's other weapons on offense. I wouldn't put Konz in the same breath as Pouncey, Mack, Mangold... that's for sure.

Thing I think will drop Molk is his injury history.
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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I don't blame him for thinking it. He's a two time "best center in college football" award winner.

It's hard to hear that someone else is a better center.
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:15 PM    (permalink
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Its not like hes going to play against any of the other centers, it can't completely bite him in the ass.
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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I just wish the Jets would draft him to replace Mangold, so Wilfork could get sacks by throwing him (Molk) onto Sanchez...
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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I just wish the Jets would draft him to replace Mangold, so Wilfork could get sacks by throwing him (Molk) onto Sanchez...
You have him on your dream patriots draft.
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:28 PM    (permalink
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I just wish the Jets would draft him to replace Mangold, so Wilfork could get sacks by throwing him (Molk) onto Sanchez...
I realize you're joking but Antonio Garay got a sack by doing this to Peyton Manning via Jeff Linkenbach.

video: http://www.nfl.com/videos/san-diego-...sack-6-yd-loss

Look at the slow motion replay starting at :30. Both of Linkenbach's feet off the ground.
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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You have him on your dream patriots draft.
As a backup center, I think he'd be OK. Plus, NE loves their developmental lineman. Though, T-Rex arms are not usually "developmental"
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:49 PM    (permalink
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Molk is a 3rd-4th round guy in my mind, so just because I'm defeding him here, let's not get carried away into putting him in the Pouncey, Mack, Mangold conversation.

He could be very wrong about his self-assessment compared to what scouts think, but that's really besides the point. The point is that he's got the confidence. You always want guys who back up their words with hard work. Since Molk does put in the work, you can appreciate that. If he was a slouch who only put up 18 lifts on the bench then you'd have to raise some flags about his commitment to being the best he can be.

Konz is very much a boom or bust player in his own right. He's been surrounded by top shelf OL talent which makes it easier for him to look good at doing his job. Not to mention Wisconsin's other weapons on offense. I wouldn't put Konz in the same breath as Pouncey, Mack, Mangold... that's for sure.

Thing I think will drop Molk is his injury history.
see id love konz as a Center to move pouncey to LG and watch the magic happen

and i wasnt saying you were putting him in that tier of conversation, just saying i dont think he even comes close to the second round guys like unger and kalil as prospects...neither of which were that great of prospects imo even though kalil is amazing. im not saying the short arms and height is an automatic killer to his career, and i fully agree that the difference between 6-1 and 6-2 being the difference maker is evaluating a C is ridiculous, i just dont really like lineman like molk unless hes a career backup which can still be a valuable asset to the team....just like legursky, not a starter...tried it but failed, but hes certainly a better stop gap guy than some of the misfits on the steelers roster.
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 02-29-2012, 01:50 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by killxswitch View Post
I realize you're joking but Antonio Garay got a sack by doing this to Peyton Manning via Jeff Linkenbach.

video: http://www.nfl.com/videos/san-diego-...sack-6-yd-loss

Look at the slow motion replay starting at :30. Both of Linkenbach's feet off the ground.
"We're sorry, but this video is no longer available."

:/
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:25 PM    (permalink
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see id love konz as a Center to move pouncey to LG and watch the magic happen

and i wasnt saying you were putting him in that tier of conversation, just saying i dont think he even comes close to the second round guys like unger and kalil as prospects...neither of which were that great of prospects imo even though kalil is amazing. im not saying the short arms and height is an automatic killer to his career, and i fully agree that the difference between 6-1 and 6-2 being the difference maker is evaluating a C is ridiculous, i just dont really like lineman like molk unless hes a career backup which can still be a valuable asset to the team....just like legursky, not a starter...tried it but failed, but hes certainly a better stop gap guy than some of the misfits on the steelers roster.
You keep harping on Molk-Legursky comparison, but that's a far stretch out of left field. Similar heights, don't make similar players. Molk is way more battle tested against tougher competition. Legursky came from Marshall and was more of a project. ...and that's just a small factor... there are so many other ways they are different. Player comparisons in general never really work.

I can see the underlying factor here though... your favortism on Konz to be a Steeler.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:26 PM    (permalink
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I just wish the Jets would draft him to replace Mangold, so Wilfork could get sacks by throwing him (Molk) onto Sanchez...
There's a reason why Wilfork commands a double team. That guy is insane.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:30 PM    (permalink
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Molk is more than just a strong Center. He's very athletic, too. Michigan had him pull out on the perimeter a lot last year and he did a great job of it. His low 40 time was a 5.04. He's not just a body builder standing in front of the QB.
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Old 02-29-2012, 02:30 PM    (permalink
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"We're sorry, but this video is no longer available."

:/
I don't understand. I just watched it like a half hour ago.

edit: I just tried it again and it worked.
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