why does d-unit like slow players?

pocketaces · 03-28-2007, 05:03 PM

d's favorite wideout is dwayne jarrett who just ran a 4.67 40. i cant remember a w.r thats been drafted in the first round running over a 4.6

d's favorite c.b. is daymeion hughs who just ran a 4.65 40. ive seen mocks with him in the 3rd round lately.

d's favorite r.b. is marshawn lynch who ran in the mid 4.5s compared to petersons 4.36. is also on record as saying lynch will be the better pro which is crazy imo.

so why the love for all the slow guys d?

TNewFan41 · 03-28-2007, 05:18 PM

Dude, 40 times DON'T MEAN ANYTHING. Ed Reed ran a 4.54, and I don't think anyone is complaining about his speed. Football speed matters, not 40 times.

D-Unit · 03-28-2007, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pocketaces

d's favorite wideout is dwayne jarrett who just ran a 4.67 40. i cant remember a w.r thats been drafted in the first round running over a 4.6

d's favorite c.b. is daymeion hughs who just ran a 4.65 40. ive seen mocks with him in the 3rd round lately.

d's favorite r.b. is marshawn lynch who ran in the mid 4.5s compared to petersons 4.36. is also on record as saying lynch will be the better pro which is crazy imo.

so why the love for all the slow guys d?

Slow? You just mean a slow 40 time. That's all. I'd like to see 40 times of players before a game, during a game and after a game. I would love to see that! I would love to see who's still fast after a hard fought game. Some people fail to realize that football is not a track event. There are soo many other factors involved.

DJ's 4.67 is the slower time. He also ran a 4.62... people are saying it was on an incline too, I dunno about the truthfulness, but I didn't expect him to run a 4.4 or anything. Vince Young ran a 4.6...

Quite honestly, I don't think you can just grade a player off of their 40 time. 40 times don't make a football player. You have to include it in part of their grade and make up, but you also have many other factors involved. Too much to even list and it differs for every position. Take WR for example...

Speed, Height, Weight, Upper Body Strength, Lower Body Strength, Vertical, Atleticism, Hands, Hand Size, Hand Strength, Hand Eye Coordination, Technique (a thousand variables in that alone), Instinct, Football Smarts, Route Running, Ability to Adjust to the ball, Conditioning, Endurance threshold, Competitiveness, Confidence, Clutch ability, Big game player, College Production, Signs of progression in college, Experience, Playing Style.... those are just some of the physical grades.

Then you have character/personal grades... Maturity, Life Style, Family Life, Family Surroundings, Family Genes, Intelligence, Work Ethic, Fast Learner, Good Student, Study Habits, Can he speak well, Can he communicate clearly, Good member of the community, Recommendations from others, How he was brought up, and on and on and on...

So back to 40 times... A lot of people guage a player off that 40 time alone and start talking about moving a player up and down big boards.... how he deserves to go here and there because of it... I guess you can safely say, I'm not one of those guys.

I think Calvin Johnson is the best WR prospect in the history of football and will be the greatest WR out of this draft class. DJ is just a personal favorite.

Hughes amazed me throughout his college career. What can I say? I believe what my eyes show me.

Lynch may or may not have a better career than AD, but a lot depends on the team they go to. A Lot. As far as skill set, I think Lynch has a better chance of succeeding in the NFL because of his running style, compact body, and all around game. I liken him to Shaun Alexander. I liken AD to Eddie George.

TNewFan41 · 03-28-2007, 05:42 PM

You tell them D-Unit!

Burns336 · 03-28-2007, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TNewFan41

Dude, 40 times DON'T MEAN ANYTHING. Ed Reed ran a 4.54, and I don't think anyone is complaining about his speed. Football speed matters, not 40 times.

flip flop boy is back at it again i see.

pocketaces · 03-28-2007, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D-Unit

Slow? You just mean a slow 40 time. That's all. I'd like to see 40 times of players before a game, during a game and after a game. I would love to see that! I would love to see who's still fast after a hard fought game. Some people fail to realize that football is not a track event. There are soo many other factors involved.

DJ's 4.67 is the slower time. He also ran a 4.62... people are saying it was on an incline too, I dunno about the truthfulness, but I didn't expect him to run a 4.4 or anything. Vince Young ran a 4.6...

Quite honestly, I don't think you can just grade a player off of their 40 time. 40 times don't make a football player. You have to include it in part of their grade and make up, but you also have many other factors involved. Too much to even list and it differs for every position. Take WR for example...

Speed, Height, Weight, Upper Body Strength, Lower Body Strength, Vertical, Atleticism, Hands, Hand Size, Hand Strength, Hand Eye Coordination, Technique (a thousand variables in that alone), Instinct, Football Smarts, Route Running, Ability to Adjust to the ball, Conditioning, Endurance threshold, Competitiveness, Confidence, Clutch ability, Big game player, College Production, Signs of progression in college, Experience, Playing Style.... those are just some of the physical grades.

Then you have character/personal grades... Maturity, Life Style, Family Life, Family Surroundings, Family Genes, Intelligence, Work Ethic, Fast Learner, Good Student, Study Habits, Can he speak well, Can he communicate clearly, Good member of the community, Recommendations from others, How he was brought up, and on and on and on...

So back to 40 times... A lot of people guage a player off that 40 time alone and start talking about moving a player up and down big boards.... how he deserves to go here and there because of it... I guess you can safely say, I'm not one of those guys.

I think Calvin Johnson is the best WR prospect in the history of football and will be the greatest WR out of this draft class. DJ is just a personal favorite.

Hughes amazed me throughout his college career. What can I say? I believe what my eyes show me.

Lynch may or may not have a better career than AD, but a lot depends on the team they go to. A Lot. As far as skill set, I think Lynch has a better chance of succeeding in the NFL because of his running style, compact body, and all around game. I liken him to Shaun Alexander. I liken AD to Eddie George.

very nice response. i was just giving you a hard time anyway. interesting that you compare lynch to alexander because alot of the sites/mags ive seen compare A.D. to alexander.

D-Unit · 03-28-2007, 08:57 PM

Adrian Peterson = Shaun Alexander??? I'm dumbfounded.

thule · 03-28-2007, 10:12 PM

It's just d=unit's pity for west coast players :P

LSUALUM99 · 03-29-2007, 12:39 AM

The real crux of the issue is that D-Unit values College Production more than measurables.

Thule and I tend to value measurables more than many people here.

To me, there are just so many variables trying to equate one player's production in college to another that it's almost impossible. Measurables however are by definition impartial characteristics.

That being said, you can't just go on measurables. The skill set must meet a 'minimum standard' to even matter, but after that it's more about what the player can do on the football field.

I do think that Hughes in the third round is a reach now too. His 40 time is absolutely below the 'minimum standard' for starting CB's in the NFL. I can't see spending anything more than a 6th round pick on him.

Jarrett, I wouldn't draft him before round 3 now. His 40 time is approaching the 'doesn't meet minimum standards'.

Lynch's 4.5 is still good enough for minimum standards so his times don't bother me.

thule · 03-29-2007, 07:08 AM

Ya if I had to factor the three main characters it would go

1)Character
2)Raw Potential
3)College Production

For instance...guys like Lynch/Meriweather/Lendale White last year...all scare me because of their thug appeal. Don't get me wrong...I'm more than willing to draft a player with issues..but that is what the late round picks are for. Ramonce Taylor is someone I really like...on the second day...I was even mildly intrigued by Ryan Moore before the combine.

But you look at the best players in the NFL and what do they have in common...Character. You look at the Patriots who always seem to be drafting on character to some point. Teams that succeed in the NFL have great work ethic and willingness to work together for one goal.

Caddy · 03-29-2007, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pocketaces

d's favorite wideout is dwayne jarrett who just ran a 4.67 40. i cant remember a w.r thats been drafted in the first round running over a 4.6

Larry Fitzgerald ran a 4.63 but I would take him on my team any day of the week.

JJJ888 · 03-29-2007, 08:49 AM

With a wide receiver like Jarrett specifically, speed is not the all-important factor. Jarrett is able to use his body to creat separation, whereas lots of other wide receivers have to use their legs. Furthermore, Jarrett may not need the separation that other wide receivers get because of his tremendous hands.

I seriously doubt that if you timed a number of the "big-time" wide receivers in the NFL right now that they'd run faster than Jarrett.

bigmac076 · 03-29-2007, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thule

Ya if I had to factor the three main characters it would go

1)Character
2)Raw Potential
3)College Production

For instance...guys like Lynch/Meriweather/Lendale White last year...all scare me because of their thug appeal. Don't get me wrong...I'm more than willing to draft a player with issues..but that is what the late round picks are for. Ramonce Taylor is someone I really like...on the second day...I was even mildly intrigued by Ryan Moore before the combine.

But you look at the best players in the NFL and what do they have in common...Character. You look at the Patriots who always seem to be drafting on character to some point. Teams that succeed in the NFL have great work ethic and willingness to work together for one goal.

hmmmmm Ramonce Taylor, doesn't ring a bell really. How good is this kid?

FinChase · 03-29-2007, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigmac076

hmmmmm Ramonce Taylor, doesn't ring a bell really. How good is this kid?

He spent two years at Texas before he got thrown off the team. He's got some definite character issues to consider. But the guy is a real talent, and can play both RB and WR, although I think RB is his natural position. I would definitely be in favor of spending a 2nd day pick on him.

FinChase · 03-29-2007, 09:07 AM

D-Unit, you're probably Jarrett's biggest supporter on this board. I've been intrigued by him also; he really impressed me in the Rose Bowl last year. I'm not concerned by his 40 time 'cause I don't think that's his football speed, but I am concerned by his struggles with press coverage against guys like Houston. You've no doubt watched him more than I have; is this a legitmate criticism?

LSUALUM99 · 03-29-2007, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 24cadillac24

Larry Fitzgerald ran a 4.63 but I would take him on my team any day of the week.

Yes, and for every 1 player that ran a 4.63 that succeeded there are many that didn't.

LonghornsLegend · 03-29-2007, 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigmac076

hmmmmm Ramonce Taylor, doesn't ring a bell really. How good is this kid?

he'd be great if we werent sticking with jones, he would do the same things except catch alot better out of the backfield, with amazingng quickness....jones is just more bulky and probably stronger

he's not worth a first day pick, but whoever scoops him 2nd day will have alot of talent to work with

TNewFan41 · 03-29-2007, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burns336

flip flop boy is back at it again i see.

that makes no sense, but ok.

bigbluedefense · 03-29-2007, 01:29 PM

Everything I wanted to say has already been said.

Me personally, I value college production more than 40 times. They play with pads on, so you have to see how fast they are with the pads. Instincts are more important than speed anyway. You can be fast as hell, if youre running the wrong way it doesn't mean anything.

Achilles33 · 03-29-2007, 01:43 PM

The way I see it, you can value 40 times if you would like, but only to a certain degree. Now some players just turn it on during the game and time horribly in shorts, some time great in shorts and play slow on the field, and some just aren't fast but have other attributes that make up for it, and in this case Jarrett does. I think he would be a great addition to this Dallas team even with a 5.0 40. Speed is not his game, and it never will be. His ability to go up and get the ball, his incredible hands, and his ability to shield defenders from the ball is remarkable.

bigmac076 · 03-29-2007, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LonghornsLegend

he'd be great if we werent sticking with jones, he would do the same things except catch alot better out of the backfield, with amazingng quickness....jones is just more bulky and probably stronger

he's not worth a first day pick, but whoever scoops him 2nd day will have alot of talent to work with

and we are sticking with Jones right? So no need to speculate on Lawrence Phillips v2.0. YEAH I WENT THERE.

TNewFan41 · 03-29-2007, 01:50 PM

I wish we weren't sticking with jones.........oh well.

TNewFan41 · 03-29-2007, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burns336

flip flop boy is back at it again i see.

Whatever. I am done with this site. No one listens to me, so forget it.

thule · 03-29-2007, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TNewFan41

Whatever. I am done with this site. No one listens to me, so forget it.

Hip Hip Hooray!!! What a beautiful day.

thule · 03-29-2007, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigmac076

hmmmmm Ramonce Taylor, doesn't ring a bell really. How good is this kid?

I would compare him to a poor man's Reggie Bush. He has versatility out of the backfield like fins said. He also would be an asset in the return game. There is room for him on the roster however he would have to outperform Thompson. He has potential to be a spark plug type player for our offense.