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Old 04-28-2012, 03:27 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Tha Wootster View Post
Greg Childs.
This times infinity! Regarding the Wilson "highlight" tape:

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Old 04-28-2012, 06:03 AM    (permalink
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If highlight tape is what we can even call it.
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Old 04-28-2012, 07:15 AM    (permalink
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That might have been the worst second day I can remember as a Patriots fan. Tavon Wilson was a massive reach and Jake Bequette is stiff, lacks moves besides the bull rush, has questionable instincts, and terrible balance. Besides that they got hosed on the trade down (276 points for 176 or so.)
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Old 04-28-2012, 07:23 AM    (permalink
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Embarrassing instincts against the run and gets demolished by Bradley Sowell numerous times:

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Old 04-28-2012, 07:39 AM    (permalink
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Bequette's ok. But yeah there were a lot better players on the board. Another reach.

If I'm BB I trade a pick from next year to move up and take Childs or Criner to salvage something and put an end to this lackluster effort.
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Old 04-28-2012, 07:40 AM    (permalink
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Bequette's ok. But yeah there were a lot better players on the board. Another reach.

If I'm BB I trade a pick from next year to move up and take Childs or Criner to salvage something and put an end to this lackluster effort.
This is going to end up like the 2008 Draft where New England drafted Meriweather in the first and then threw away all of their other draft picks on guys like Kareem Brown and Clint Oldenburg. I already look forward to the day when Wilson and Bequette are cut and we can try to repress the memories of those awful picks.
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Old 04-28-2012, 07:54 AM    (permalink
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Let's not kill this draft over the 2nd day.

Our 1st day was fantastic in my view and makes us better right away. Day 2 picks were meh but everyone thought Vollmer was a huge reach and was pissed so lets wait for some OTAs etc. before blasting it too hard.

The draft in my mind is still a B/B+ effort for the great front 7 help we just got.
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Old 04-28-2012, 07:59 AM    (permalink
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I actually liked the Vollmer pick. I thought it was way too early but with OL's they never go in the order that everyone predicts because teams are looking for very different things in OL's. And I felt like Vollmer could play.

Bequette I'm hopeful for. While I do think there were better players available, I like that they are loading up on these types of players and I think he could surprise. But I just don't know what to expect. I do know that if they were going to take somebody from Arkansas, there are three other players I would have preferred over him.
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Old 04-28-2012, 08:06 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BradysKnee View Post
Let's not kill this draft over the 2nd day.

Our 1st day was fantastic in my view and makes us better right away. Day 2 picks were meh but everyone thought Vollmer was a huge reach and was pissed so lets wait for some OTAs etc. before blasting it too hard.

The draft in my mind is still a B/B+ effort for the great front 7 help we just got.
I can't give it that high of a score because the Patriots are only going to end up with two contributors after entering the draft with six picks. Besides that, picks were traded away in the Randy Moss trade, the Ochocinco trade, and the Jarrad Page trade, none of whom contributed to the team at all. You could argue that they wasted at least five picks already. I can't think of another team which has blown five selections by this point.
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Old 04-28-2012, 08:11 AM    (permalink
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You guys got Dont'a and Chandler. Be happy!
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Old 04-28-2012, 08:42 AM    (permalink
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I can't give it that high of a score because the Patriots are only going to end up with two contributors after entering the draft with six picks. Besides that, picks were traded away in the Randy Moss trade, the Ochocinco trade, and the Jarrad Page trade, none of whom contributed to the team at all. You could argue that they wasted at least five picks already. I can't think of another team which has blown five selections by this point.
How the **** can you know that? Stop being bitter just because someone has another opinion than you. Personally I love Bequette. He plays hard and got to the passer in the best division in football. I've even read comparisons to Jared Allen. These kind of "BB hurt my feelings" reactions make me sick. If you want to ***** about something try bitching about drafting a safety that looks terrible on the film that we got instead of bitching about BB drafting a pass rusher after we've all been screaming for pass rushers for years now. Jeez...
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:02 AM    (permalink
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Early in the draft process, I recall Bequette being talked about as a possible "sleeper" pick that could go in the third round, even high in the third. So that's where the Pats got him. The sleeper talk tailed off, I suppose after all the measurables started coming out and all the athletes started moving up and pushing guys like Bequette back. I'm very anxious to see what he can do for the Pats. I don't really have high expectations necessarily, but it won't surprise me if he ends up a lot better than that.

And one thing that is getting overlooked I think is the fact that the Jones, Hightower, and Bequette picks should really strengthen the run defense.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:17 AM    (permalink
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We're going to have to wait and see with these picks. Mark Anderson and TBC both had a role on this team with a bunch of clean up sacks. With Chandler Jones, Vince Wilfork, and Kyle Love collapsing the pocket Bequette might put up better numbers than we think. We need a guy who can disengage and finish, and maybe Bequette can be that guy.

Tavon Wilson looks terrible though, and it is really hard for me to find some good in the pick. The only saving grace is that I haven't seen a lot of him, but in that clip that was posted above he looked like an invisible Ihedigbo type who didn't make any impact except on the 2 or 3 plays where the took terrible angles or got burnt. He didn't even look good as a gunner on special teams either. At least when the Raiders drafted Mike Mitchell he was a freak athlete who had a penchant for big hits, Wilson doesn't even have that.

I can't say I was thrilled about day 2, but they have gone all defense so far filling 3 positions we would have classified as a need. I guess it's playing the waiting game from this point until TC. This team doesn't NEED a ton of new contributors from it's draft picks, and if C. Jones becomes what we think he can, then this draft was a success. Maybe Wilson can be like BB's other reaches Vollmer, Ridley, and Mankins. We haven't ever reached this far before, but the other guys worked out pretty well.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:33 AM    (permalink
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For those of you who need to get off the ledge, this clip actually has some decent plays from Tavon Wilson. He shows a little bit of a natural nack for blitzing in it, makes a few nice plays fighting through blocks to make tackles outside the hashes, breaks up a few passes, and streaks down the field in solid coverage on a WR. He gets burnt a couple times, but not too bad. I wish I had some clips from his junior year when he played more Safety, but if he played every game like this one, I might consider him a 3rd round type guy.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:37 AM    (permalink
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How the **** can you know that? Stop being bitter just because someone has another opinion than you. Personally I love Bequette. He plays hard and got to the passer in the best division in football. I've even read comparisons to Jared Allen. These kind of "BB hurt my feelings" reactions make me sick. If you want to ***** about something try bitching about drafting a safety that looks terrible on the film that we got instead of bitching about BB drafting a pass rusher after we've all been screaming for pass rushers for years now. Jeez...
Well said razor lol.
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Old 04-28-2012, 09:53 AM    (permalink
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BB must like Illinois DB's. This is the third one he's drafted. Remember Christian Morton?
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:04 AM    (permalink
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Bequette is a 260 lb 5 tech. He is washed out of the play too much for my liking.

His pass rush (like Bruce Irvin lol) is his best weapon but he's not that good at it. He struggled against some really ****** tackles.

Worst of all, the kid thinks he's elite.

But, I could see him developing into a role player. I just worry that he's Jermaine Cunningham (minus any ability to stop the run) all over.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:06 AM    (permalink
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Usually pretty positive but Wilson looks pretty below average. Head scratcher. Of course he was on a pretty bad team and might be looking worse than he is. But still, his ceiling isnt high.
All I can tell you is that Ron Zook was banging the table for this guy. I watched every thing I could find on him and he looks like a guy whom won't make it out of training camp before being cut, but for some reason Ron Zook called him "his guy".

Belichick must feel they can coach him up quite a bit.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:09 AM    (permalink
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Tavon Wilson is unknown. I'm gonna make a bold statement right now...he is gonna be the starter at FS.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:12 AM    (permalink
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I'm looking at it this way. This is the worst safety draft I have ever seen. There's Mark Barron, then there's a couple average guys in Harrison and Taylor, then there is just piles of crap. So if you need to get a safety in this draft then you pick up your favorite piece of crap and hope you can find something good in it. That's what BB did.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:13 AM    (permalink
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If Wilson can come make the team and contribute in any way, then I won't care where he was picked. I'm taking the wait and see approach with him (since I really haven't seen him previously).
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:33 AM    (permalink
AntoinCD
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I don't think I have ever seen a draftable prospect get turned as much in coverage as I just seen from Wilson. I am really hoping BB seen a spark in something but I can not see how the pick is justifiable. I'm not as harsh as some people when it comes to reaches, because the object of the draft is to get better players than the ones currently on your team. However this was just shocking.

As for Bequette, this is just such a undervalued Patriots style player. He isn't flashy but the guy is flat out relentless. I personally love this pick and think our front 7 could be down right nasty. If Andre Carter comes back I love it even more as a mentor for Jones and Bequette and the flexibility on passing downs

Carter-Jones-VW-Bequette
Hightower-Mayo


Jones-VW-Fanene
Hightower-Mayo-Spikes-Bequette

It also pushes guys like Deaderick, Ninkovich etc plus with the inclusion of guys like Trevor Scott it could be brilliant. I love our front 7 right now and the back end has talent but it needs to be developed.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:44 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Razor View Post
How the **** can you know that? Stop being bitter just because someone has another opinion than you. Personally I love Bequette. He plays hard and got to the passer in the best division in football. I've even read comparisons to Jared Allen. These kind of "BB hurt my feelings" reactions make me sick. If you want to ***** about something try bitching about drafting a safety that looks terrible on the film that we got instead of bitching about BB drafting a pass rusher after we've all been screaming for pass rushers for years now. Jeez...
I might not agree with Matt(specifically right now on Bequette, I like the guy quite a bit), but his opinion has clout with me because I've been reading the guys stuff for years. Matt presented his case as to why he doesn't feel like Bequette was a good pick(let's not pretend that the amount of time he spends on the ground is healthy) and you freak out and tell him to stop bitching. Some of you guys have a major problem with the whole concepts of how this thing works.


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Originally Posted by cmarq83 View Post
For those of you who need to get off the ledge, this clip actually has some decent plays from Tavon Wilson. He shows a little bit of a natural nack for blitzing in it, makes a few nice plays fighting through blocks to make tackles outside the hashes, breaks up a few passes, and streaks down the field in solid coverage on a WR. He gets burnt a couple times, but not too bad. I wish I had some clips from his junior year when he played more Safety, but if he played every game like this one, I might consider him a 3rd round type guy.
I saw that after I posted last night. It's better than what I had been seeing, but I'm still not seeing it. One thing to keep in mind when watching him is that he played with one of the better pass rushes in the country last year.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:49 AM    (permalink
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How the **** can you know that? Stop being bitter just because someone has another opinion than you. Personally I love Bequette. He plays hard and got to the passer in the best division in football. I've even read comparisons to Jared Allen. These kind of "BB hurt my feelings" reactions make me sick. If you want to ***** about something try bitching about drafting a safety that looks terrible on the film that we got instead of bitching about BB drafting a pass rusher after we've all been screaming for pass rushers for years now. Jeez...
The "put all your faith in Belichick and completely disregard your own film study" approach is ridiculous. We don't follow the draft all year and study the players in the draft only to blindly support any pick that the team makes.

Bill Belichick has missed on a number of draft picks over the years and any pick in the draft is fair game for criticism. We're allowed to have our own opinions on the picks; go ahead and worship every pick the Patriots make if you want but I'm going to trust my own work on this one.

Bequette's film is just as bad as Tavon Wilson's; Jake's size, motor, and workout numbers are appealing but on tape he fails to locate the ball, falls for misdirection, misses tackles in space, lacks counter moves, and blows containment on the run.

The pick is reminiscent of when Belichick drafted Jermaine Cunningham in the second round; Belichick was blinded by size, workout numbers, and pedigree on the Bequette pick.

Rob Ninkovich is a much better player than Bequette; I would argue that based on instincts as well as reliability.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:55 AM    (permalink
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This is going to end up like the 2008 Draft where New England drafted Meriweather in the first and then threw away all of their other draft picks on guys like Kareem Brown and Clint Oldenburg. I already look forward to the day when Wilson and Bequette are cut and we can try to repress the memories of those awful picks.
They did that because the roster was already set and they were just trying to get rid of the picks. With the ones they couldn't get rid of, they drafted players that could make it to the PS.
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