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Old 05-02-2012, 08:14 PM    (permalink
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There might be QBs with more upside, but I think Barkley is the safest and will have a good NFL career if he has at least a halfway decent supporting cast.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:27 PM    (permalink
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As of right now, I think there's a big defining line between Barkley and the rest of the QB's in this draft class. That may change, but he's got everything you want. Had he came out this year, I find it hard to believe he wouldn't be a Cleveland Brown or maybe even a Washington Redskin right now. I don't really expect him to regress, but we'll see how this season pans out.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:30 PM    (permalink
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I think the Browns are really gonna regret taking Weeden by next year. They'll be in a position to draft Barkley, but they'll pass because they have their now-30 sophomore first round QB.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:47 PM    (permalink
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I think the Browns are really gonna regret taking Weeden by next year. They'll be in a position to draft Barkley, but they'll pass because they have their now-30 sophomore first round QB.

No they won't.
They'll do exactly what Carolina did. If there's a QB available next draft whom the Browns FO feels is a better prospect than Weeden, they'll take him.
Holmgren has never been someone who only has one QB on the roster with starter upside.
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Old 05-02-2012, 08:58 PM    (permalink
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I think the Browns are really gonna regret taking Weeden by next year. They'll be in a position to draft Barkley, but they'll pass because they have their now-30 sophomore first round QB.
I really don't think the Browns will be bad enough to be in position to draft Barkley (unless he falls from grace).

Which begs to question... which teams will be looking for new QBs? Seems like most already have the covered with young developing QBs that they invested highly in... Ponder, Locker, Newton, Gabbert, Dalton, Kaepernick all went in 2011, Luck, Griffin, Tannehill, Weeden, Osweiler in 2012... I wonder... which teams will be interested in Barkley, Wilson, Bray, Jones, Manuel...Aaron Murray? There could be GREAT value in the latter part of Round 1. Crazy good value.

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Old 05-02-2012, 09:19 PM    (permalink
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No they won't.
They'll do exactly what Carolina did. If there's a QB available next draft whom the Browns FO feels is a better prospect than Weeden, they'll take him.
Holmgren has never been someone who only has one QB on the roster with starter upside.
I'm not so sure. Clausen was a mid second round pick, Weeden was mid-late first. He went over 20 picks earlier. And since they know that Weeden will be a project, I think they give him more than one year. And in all honesty, they should. I know Clausen didn't work out and the Panthers look like geniuses for it, but not all rookie QBs explode onto the scene like Cam did.

And not every team does what Carolina did. Jacksonville didn't take Tannehill this year even though Gabbert was downright awful last year. If teams only gave rookies one year to develop, they would be drafting QBs in the first year in and year out. Cleveland should have been drafting QBs every year in the first for the past five years, but they didn't. They gave Quinn his chance, then they gave McCoy his, and now they will give Weeden his.
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:24 PM    (permalink
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I really don't think the Browns will be bad enough to be in position to draft Barkley (unless he falls from grace).
I meant having an early pick, and possibly trading up like they did for Richardson. I think they would have been far better off staying with McCoy this year and drafting another player in the first (DeCastro, Hightower, Mercilus, Perry, Zeitler) and then do what they needed to do to draft Barkley.
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Old 05-02-2012, 09:37 PM    (permalink
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I meant having an early pick, and possibly trading up like they did for Richardson. I think they would have been far better off staying with McCoy this year and drafting another player in the first (DeCastro, Hightower, Mercilus, Perry, Zeitler) and then do what they needed to do to draft Barkley.
I don't think Weeden will fail as badly as you think. He could turn out to be their QB for the next 10 years. His issue isn't age. If he pans out, he pans out. If he fails, he fails. But his age won't make him fail. ...and that's the reason why people are down on him more than anything, which I disagree with.

Talent wise, he deserved a late 1st round grade. It's too early to call it a mistake. But I agree with you about the Browns and the unlikelihood that they will draft a QB in Round 1 next year.
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:03 PM    (permalink
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yeah, Weeden isn't short on talent. He's short on years. lol. He will probably be a fine starting QB in the NFL, but his career will be roughly 5 or 6 years shorter than normal because he's so old. I would think the Browns have to have the top pick next year, Weeden will have to be Clausen bad or worse and the Browns will have to really love Barkley (who is short on physical tools and a bit overrated in the media) to take a QB next year IMO.
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:16 PM    (permalink
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OMGZ!!!

2007 Cleveland Browns Draft:
#3 Overall: Joe Thomas
#22 Overall: Brady Quinn

2012 Cleveland Browns Draft:
#3 Overall: Trent Richardson
#22 Overall: Brandon Weeden

But honestly I don't completely hate the Weeden pick but I really really like Barkley and it's hard to see him going to Cleveland next year. But then again, Brady Quinn had less than a year as a starting quarterback and Colt McCoy had little over a year and look what happened. I see Weeden starting Week 1. He's 28, he should be ready, right?!?!
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Old 05-02-2012, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by kalbears13 View Post
OMGZ!!!

2007 Cleveland Browns Draft:
#3 Overall: Joe Thomas
#22 Overall: Brady Quinn

2012 Cleveland Browns Draft:
#3 Overall: Trent Richardson
#22 Overall: Brandon Weeden

But honestly I don't completely hate the Weeden pick but I really really like Barkley and it's hard to see him going to Cleveland next year. But then again, Brady Quinn had less than a year as a starting quarterback and Colt McCoy had little over a year and look what happened. I see Weeden starting Week 1. He's 28, he should be ready, right?!?!
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:23 PM    (permalink
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I really don't think the Browns will be bad enough to be in position to draft Barkley (unless he falls from grace).

Which begs to question... which teams will be looking for new QBs? Seems like most already have the covered with young developing QBs that they invested highly in... Ponder, Locker, Newton, Gabbert, Dalton, Kaepernick all went in 2011, Luck, Griffin, Tannehill, Weeden, Osweiler in 2012... I wonder... which teams will be interested in Barkley, Wilson, Bray, Jones, Manuel...Aaron Murray? There could be GREAT value in the latter part of Round 1. Crazy good value.
I won't put Cleveland much better than 4 wins, they could even be worse.
On paper I would tend to agree but GM's and HC's will have made up their minds on a lot of these QB's and a few older QB's will open up drafting one as well.
I still can easily see a scenario where at least 3 top QB's get drafted early so I wouldn't count on great value latter in round 1.
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:32 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by kalbears13 View Post
OMGZ!!!

2007 Cleveland Browns Draft:
#3 Overall: Joe Thomas
#22 Overall: Brady Quinn

2012 Cleveland Browns Draft:
#3 Overall: Trent Richardson
#22 Overall: Brandon Weeden

But honestly I don't completely hate the Weeden pick but I really really like Barkley and it's hard to see him going to Cleveland next year. But then again, Brady Quinn had less than a year as a starting quarterback and Colt McCoy had little over a year and look what happened. I see Weeden starting Week 1. He's 28, he should be ready, right?!?!
Romeo Crennel refused to play Quinn because he could see in practice that he was just not a NFL starting QB and that got Savage fired eventually which suggests Holmgren/Heckert need Weeden to be successful, anything else and they are likely fired as well.
I like Weeden a lot but at 28, he has at most a 6 year window for real success so he will definitely start week 1.
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:38 PM    (permalink
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No they won't.
They'll do exactly what Carolina did. If there's a QB available next draft whom the Browns FO feels is a better prospect than Weeden, they'll take him.
Holmgren has never been someone who only has one QB on the roster with starter upside.
Not a chance. Lerner fired Savage for Quinn's total failure so Holmgren/Heckert will live or die by Weeden's success. There is no way they can justify drafting another QB in round 1 next draft.
Carolina drafted Claussen in round 2 and round 2 QB's don't make or break a GM, however round 1 QB's do.
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:55 PM    (permalink
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I won't put Cleveland much better than 4 wins, they could even be worse.
On paper I would tend to agree but GM's and HC's will have made up their minds on a lot of these QB's and a few older QB's will open up drafting one as well.
I still can easily see a scenario where at least 3 top QB's get drafted early so I wouldn't count on great value latter in round 1.
I wouldn't say count on there being great value in the latter part of Round 1, but I wouldn't put it out of the realm of possibility either. This draft is loaded with non-QB talent. It's not the year you want to be taking a QB unless you really need one.
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Old 05-03-2012, 01:45 PM    (permalink
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I'm not so sure. Clausen was a mid second round pick, Weeden was mid-late first. He went over 20 picks earlier. And since they know that Weeden will be a project, I think they give him more than one year. And in all honesty, they should. I know Clausen didn't work out and the Panthers look like geniuses for it, but not all rookie QBs explode onto the scene like Cam did.

And not every team does what Carolina did. Jacksonville didn't take Tannehill this year even though Gabbert was downright awful last year. If teams only gave rookies one year to develop, they would be drafting QBs in the first year in and year out. Cleveland should have been drafting QBs every year in the first for the past five years, but they didn't. They gave Quinn his chance, then they gave McCoy his, and now they will give Weeden his.
Barkley >>>>>>>>>>> Tannehill
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Old 05-03-2012, 02:31 PM    (permalink
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Sanchez is a better athlete but the difference is college experience. Barkley has way more game experience going into the draft.

I'd say he's safe as QBs go...Good prospect.
you think sanchez is a better athlete?

I think barkley is A LOT like drew brees in mechanics and pocket presence and i dont think hes super athletic but ive never considered sanchez to be a good QB athlete
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 05-03-2012, 02:56 PM    (permalink
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you think sanchez is a better athlete?
Better athlete? Yes. Better prospect and QB? No.
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Old 05-03-2012, 03:32 PM    (permalink
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He's a shorter Matt Ryan.
Very good QB with not elite tools.
If you need a starting QB, IMO Matt Barkley will be an upgrade. And IMO he's a 5x better QB than Mark Sanchez.

Safe pick.
I hate you. Only because this is so true.
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Old 05-03-2012, 04:09 PM    (permalink
SenorGato
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Better athlete? Yes. Better prospect and QB? No.
Exactly this. Sanchez is really a good athlete at QB, and more loose/flexible than Barkley from what I've seen.

Barkley is a better prospect because in a QB prospect experience is pretty damn key. Barkley will have what...over 3 full seasons worth of starts?
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Old 05-04-2012, 08:49 AM    (permalink
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ive just always looked at sanchez as being slow and looking dumb when he runs...never really considered him an athletic QB
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 05-04-2012, 10:32 AM    (permalink
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I think the Browns are really gonna regret taking Weeden by next year. They'll be in a position to draft Barkley, but they'll pass because they have their now-30 sophomore first round QB.
I just think if they have a Chance at Barkley and pass on it to build around a guy like Weeden they better hope Weeden becomes Great and Barkley sucks because if it's the other way around and Weeden is gone within Three Years and Barkley is one of the Best Young QB's in the NFL then everyone associated with the Cleveland Browns right now will be Fired.
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Old 05-04-2012, 11:24 AM    (permalink
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Exactly this. Sanchez is really a good athlete at QB, and more loose/flexible than Barkley from what I've seen.

Barkley is a better prospect because in a QB prospect experience is pretty damn key. Barkley will have what...over 3 full seasons worth of starts?
Barkley will be a four year starter once this season is done.

I just hope he measures in at 6'2".
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Old 05-04-2012, 07:07 PM    (permalink
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Btw literally the only unlike able quality about Brandon Weeden is that he's the ancient age of 28. I think he can be a fine player. Not exactly a non-athlete here...He's got the physical tools/ability despite having to use a walker.

Not to mention that Thomas - Mack - Schwartz is a pretty nice group of OL talent, and that will open something up for Richardson. Sure it's not a 21st century offense but not exactly new in the NFL...
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Old 05-05-2012, 07:59 PM    (permalink
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Btw literally the only unlike able quality about Brandon Weeden is that he's the ancient age of 28. I think he can be a fine player. Not exactly a non-athlete here...He's got the physical tools/ability despite having to use a walker.

Not to mention that Thomas - Mack - Schwartz is a pretty nice group of OL talent, and that will open something up for Richardson. Sure it's not a 21st century offense but not exactly new in the NFL...
Well that... And he ran a Ryan Leaf offense at Ok. State. BTW I always read your posts, because I married into a latino family and your username is my actual real-life nickname they gave me... lol
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