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Old 01-30-2014, 11:07 AM    (permalink
Forenci
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Looks good to me. Also, hasn't Jimmy Smith been kind of a bust?
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Old 01-30-2014, 11:09 AM    (permalink
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I think he started off bad but was really good this past season after a successful playoff run. Kind of like Corey Webster.
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Old 01-30-2014, 11:15 AM    (permalink
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I thought he'd been injured/pretty mediocre most of his career. I was never a huge fan of him coming out, personally.
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Old 01-30-2014, 11:35 AM    (permalink
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Yeah he started out looking terribad, but the light really came on this year and he was lockdown the rest of the season. I think he got hurt toward the end of the season and that effected him a little but he was lights out the majority of the season.

He probably did a better job on Calvin than anyone in the league other than Revis. He held him in check the entire game. And they put him on TEs as well, he's very versatile.
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Old 01-30-2014, 09:18 PM    (permalink
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I did a cliff notes version of what I generally expect over the offseason.

This is what I expect from the draft

Round 1 (12) - OL Zack Martin, Notre Dame

- Round 2 (43) - WR Brandin Cooks, Oregon State

- Round 3 (74) - LB Christian Jones, Florida State

- Round 3* (comp/Nicks) - RB Carlos Hyde, Ohio State

- Round 4 (109) - CB EJ Gaines, Missouri

- Round 5 (140) - DE Aaron Lynch, South Florida

- Round 6 (171) - RB James White, Wisconsin

Note: I am expecting a 3rd round compensation pick for Nicks.
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:01 PM    (permalink
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I currently have it narrowed down to 3 guys:

Greg Robinson - OT Auburn
Kony Ealy - DE Missouri
Darqueize Dennard - CB Michigan State


I think if Robinson is on the board he's most likely the pick. He's a more athletic Fluker. At the very worst I can see him being a dominant Guard at the next level, I think he has potential at LT, and can probably play RT as well.

He actually reminds me of Cordy Glenn a lot and I was a fan of Glenn's.

If he's off the board, or if we address OL heavily in FA, I think Kony Ealy is the next in line. He's a freak athlete DE, he's 6 5" 275, long, fast, athletic, and very productive. His athleticism jumps out on the tape and he's a great DE to build opposite of JPP.

I feel he can play both sides of the DL as LE or RE, and can kick inside to 3 tech in nickel. Pass rusher is a major need for us and I think he'd be a great pick.

And I'm just a big fan of Dennard. We desperately need a CB as well and I think Dennard has the skills I prefer in a shut down CB. Long, rangy, can press and chase, he's the kind of CB I like.

I'd be thrilled with any 3 of these guys, with Robinson being the most likely of the 3 at the moment.
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:45 PM    (permalink
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We wouldn't get a pick for Nicks till after next year Pete. We should a later round one this year though.

BBD, I'd love Robinson, but I seriously doubt he will be there, which is quite unfortunate. Not as high on Ealy as you are.
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Old 02-03-2014, 02:56 PM    (permalink
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yeah there's no way Robinson is there at 12. And I agree with Damix. I don't really like Ealy. At all.

However, this is actually a pretty deep LB draft. We might grab one in the middle rounds that could be good value.

Let's face it, we've got a lot of holes. Depending who we lock up and who we sign could be a huge factor
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Old 02-03-2014, 05:16 PM    (permalink
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So far I've viewed 2 games of Ealy. His burst off the line stands out, and I like his versatility.

I still need to see more. I'm concerned with his ability to set the edge, and when he gets engaged he struggles to get off the lock, and I want to see more pass rush moves. But his athleticism intrigues me, he's very explosive.

I also want to see his arm length. I'm not sure if he has long arms or not. I'm a big believer in long arms for pass rushers, so if he's a T-Rex I could change my opinion of him.

But so far his burst and versatility intrigues me.
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Old 02-03-2014, 07:41 PM    (permalink
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I want a super stud defense. Outside of OL, lets get defense. I think last night proved that a great defense will ALWAYS win out against a great offense. Seattle shut down the best offense in NFL history without blinking twice. And they made them look bad. Really bad.

While yes, you can win without a super great defense, the notion that defense is dead clearly is not true. Seattle won with mediocre/subpar QB play in the playoffs, a good run game, and a stud defense.
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Old 02-03-2014, 08:25 PM    (permalink
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You won't hear any arguments from me. I've always preached defense over offense.

That's why ideally I'd like to address the OL in FA so we can rebuild the defense through the draft.

A pass rusher, linebacker, and CB.

As much as you hate linebackers Forenci, you can't deny how much of an impact they made in that game. They flew all over the place, they're tackling machines, and they prevented YAC. So important in today's NFL.
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Old 02-03-2014, 10:00 PM    (permalink
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Uh...that team is amazing because of that secondary. Earl Thomas is why that defense is so good. They have some good linebackers but that secondary is what makes them so good. That and they improved their D-Line SIGNIFICANTLY last season. That's why they were so good. I mean, every bit of their defense is good but the secondary is what makes that D is truly special.

Also, pretty sure none of their LBs were early picks. Just sayin'. LBs are a dime a dozen. You should not be wasting top picks on LBs. They're the RBs of the defense. We just happen to miss a lot on late round LBs.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:06 AM    (permalink
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That's not my point. I was pointing out how important linebackers are to their defense as well. The majority of the tackling and YAC prevention in that game was because of stellar linebacker play. I'm stressing that linebackers are still very important to the game and their impact was very noticeable in that tackling clinic they put on in the SB.

They had LBs covering Wes Welker at times and he was blanketed. They had linebackers covering Julius Thomas and he was blanketed. You're discrediting the stellar LB play in that game which is inaccurate to the actual game plan. The DL and secondary are loaded too obviously but it's not like they have scrubs at LB. They play a big part in that defense.

The notion that you can get away with mediocre LB play in today's NFL is a myth. Just because they weren't first round picks doesn't mean that LB play isn't important. Wagner was a 2nd round pick btw. An early 2nd round pick.

You can't just have gap fillers in at LB. The ability of WRs to get YAC in today's NFL and speed RBs ability to hit the edge is why LB play is so important.

The 3 best defenses in the NFL are Seattle, SF and Carolina and they all are loaded at LB. That's not coincidence.

While I want a DE and a CB before a LB, I think we'd be incredibly mistaken if we ignore LB and just assume we can get gap fillers in the middle rounds and it's all good. It's still a major need.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:19 AM    (permalink
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I wouldn't mind someone like Telvin Smith, only 220 or so but can really run. Our DL played like studs against the run last year, if we can get Joseph and Tuck back, we can afford to have lighter LB's.

Malcom Smith is only 225, Wagner 235.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:22 AM    (permalink
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Ryan Shazier is a guy who comes to mind when looking at smaller athletic linebackers with good form tackling in college. He's a 2nd round talent.

I like Skov a lot too but he's not necessarily a speed guy. He's more of a Stewart Bradley type. Good Stewart Bradley, not washed up Stewart Bradley.

I still have to look over LBs. I'm concentrating on OL, DE, and CB right now and I'll work my way to LB after those positions.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:31 AM    (permalink
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I hope someone drops to 12 so we can move back to 16-20 area and pick up an extra 2nd.

Ideally for me we can pick 1 of the 2 tier OT's there, a LB and CB in the 2nd and an OG in the 3rd. Damix's ideal draft.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:57 AM    (permalink
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I really want Robinson. Is it that crazy for him to slide to 12?

How many teams in the top 11 will select an OT?

I have the Rams and Atlanta as 2 possible teams, but Atlanta could very well take a pass rusher and the Rams could very well take a WR after moving back in the draft (Watkins).

So is it really that crazy to think that he might be available at 12?

Other than Atlanta and the Rams, all the teams selecting in the top 11 are pretty set at LT. In fact, if the Rams believe that Long can come back from his ACL, you'd have to think they are also solid at OT and may pass on it as well.

So I don't know if it's out of the question for Robinson to fall to us. Let's pray.
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Old 02-04-2014, 11:23 AM    (permalink
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That's not my point. I was pointing out how important linebackers are to their defense as well. The majority of the tackling and YAC prevention in that game was because of stellar linebacker play. I'm stressing that linebackers are still very important to the game and their impact was very noticeable in that tackling clinic they put on in the SB.

They had LBs covering Wes Welker at times and he was blanketed. They had linebackers covering Julius Thomas and he was blanketed. You're discrediting the stellar LB play in that game which is inaccurate to the actual game plan. The DL and secondary are loaded too obviously but it's not like they have scrubs at LB. They play a big part in that defense.

The notion that you can get away with mediocre LB play in today's NFL is a myth. Just because they weren't first round picks doesn't mean that LB play isn't important. Wagner was a 2nd round pick btw. An early 2nd round pick.

You can't just have gap fillers in at LB. The ability of WRs to get YAC in today's NFL and speed RBs ability to hit the edge is why LB play is so important.

The 3 best defenses in the NFL are Seattle, SF and Carolina and they all are loaded at LB. That's not coincidence.

While I want a DE and a CB before a LB, I think we'd be incredibly mistaken if we ignore LB and just assume we can get gap fillers in the middle rounds and it's all good. It's still a major need.
I had typed up a large response to this but my browser messed up. I will summarize:

Economics dictate that there is always an opportunity cost, or lost, and this is true in the NFL salary cap era. If you spend more time/money/draft picks on LBs that means less for DBs/DLinemen, and offense of course.

Funny how you mention Carolina, Seattle, and SF...all of who either have both or one of an AMAZING secondary or AMAZING DLine. And teams like SF are going to suffer for paying so much to their LBs. I would argue they already have with a solid/okay secondary and an aging DLine.

Similarly, did we not win two Super Bowls will mediocre/crappy LBs? Crap, we went against one of the BEST offense in NFL history that first Patriots Super Bowl and shut them DOWN with what...Reggie Torbor? Gerris Wilkerson? Kawika Mitchell? That was a stud defense with terrible LBs.

Also, you keep saying that I want to ignore LBs. You're putting words in my mouth. I have never, ever, said that. I have said it's less important. Which it is. Doesn't mean we should not look to improve it, but we have too many holes in our defense as it is. Nevermind the offense. But hey, if a stud LB is in the second round and we don't like any of the OLine/DBs/DEs at that pick then hell yes take the LB.

Again, you have to pick and choose. Seattle just happens to be a freak of nature who has some really late, cheap, LBs who turned out to be studs. That will change when guys need to get paid.
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Old 02-04-2014, 02:35 PM    (permalink
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We also had a different system under spags, and under fewell in the second super bowl he did seem to change quite a bit. Personnel need to fit playcall. I feel like our defense needs a middle linebacker of some quality like Beason. We need corners, a safety and a DE. Every draft matters, and I feel like the past two drafts prior to winning the superbowl we got key contributions from those rookies.
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Old 02-04-2014, 02:42 PM    (permalink
bigbluedefense
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Go away Forenci!
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Old 02-04-2014, 03:18 PM    (permalink
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I wonder if teams can do a money ball approach. If a QB takes a lot of cap space, I wonder if teams can draft mid round QBs, and have a system and plug and chug. You can invest more on other positions or keep the same mentality.

Seattle and the niners aren't paying much for their Qbs. I wonder if they get more QBs and when these QBs want big time contacts you let them go.

Just curiously thinking about that idea.
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Old 02-04-2014, 03:21 PM    (permalink
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If it was that simple with the qb position, everyone would be doing it NYG.

There's no such thing as plug and chug qbs.
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Old 02-04-2014, 03:25 PM    (permalink
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I don't know would they? If the mantra was you don't win without a Qb, how does that change? What if the model of business for so long is no longer efficient due to a salary cap and rising costs of 1 position, QB?

It still works but I am talking maybe changes to the model could be better.
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Old 02-04-2014, 03:31 PM    (permalink
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Go away Forenci!
Stop having always wrong opinions and I won't have to correct your terribleness as much!
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Old 02-04-2014, 04:36 PM    (permalink
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hahah! BBD does have wrong opinions a lot. Well played Forenci, well played.
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