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Old 03-27-2013, 03:23 PM    (permalink
Pit Bull #53
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Yeah he just did drills, not an actual full workout. He wanted to show what kind of progress he had made so far basically.
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Old 03-27-2013, 04:01 PM    (permalink
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Ok, that's kind of what I was expecting.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:31 PM    (permalink
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Most of the commentary from NFLN about Barkley's pro day was that he just looked 'solid'.

I thought Barkley might flash a stronger arm for pro scouts, but none I've read who were there thought anything he did throwing the ball was all that impressive.

Compare that to all the gushing we heard about the top QB prospects in the 2011 and '12 drafts at their pro days.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:36 PM    (permalink
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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...n-good-enough/

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Barkley completed 56 of 62 passes against a defense consisting of Manti Teos late girlfriend and 10 of her family members. Per USA Today, two were considered to be drops. The others, then, represented misfires by a quarterback who was playing catch with his college teammates.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:41 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
Most of the commentary from NFLN about Barkley's pro day was that he just looked 'solid'.

I thought Barkley might flash a stronger arm for pro scouts, but none I've read who were there thought anything he did throwing the ball was all that impressive.

Compare that to all the gushing we heard about the top QB prospects in the 2011 and '12 drafts at their pro days.
Yes, that is all I've read as well. Basically, he did not blow anyone away and did not show anything he hasn't already on tape.

Not sure what to think about that although at the moment I am still a fan.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:43 PM    (permalink
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Heard they compared his arm strength to Andy Dalton's.

Not good for Mr. Barkley.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:53 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BallerT1215 View Post
Yes, that is all I've read as well. Basically, he did not blow anyone away and did not show anything he hasn't already on tape.

Not sure what to think about that although at the moment I am still a fan.
I watched it live and actually thought he threw pretty well. he can make all the short to intermediate throws and actually showed a pretty nice deep ball into a slight wind. I think in the right situation he could be a Matt Ryan type player but he could also struggle if he ends up with a bad team where he is expected to do too much.
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Old 03-27-2013, 06:59 PM    (permalink
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Heard they compared his arm strength to Andy Dalton's.

Not good for Mr. Barkley.
I don't think that's new news...his arm has continually been compared to someone like Dalton
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Old 03-27-2013, 10:37 PM    (permalink
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I remember people were comparing him to Hasselbeck last year in talking about him as a first-round pick. I think the comparison is still pretty accurate, but after last year's rookie class I think people want to see more than competency at the position. Barkley just doesn't have high athletic upside. But he's good at playing quarterback. It's almost starting to seem like people are starting to expect quarterbacks to be a higher caliber of athlete than Barkley. I think his arm is fine. He has command of his offense and has good composure. He has the things you usually want in a first round QB... except he runs a 5.0 40. I think if he ran a 4.65 everyone would be more comfortable calling him a first round pick.

He's better than Christian Ponder at everything about being a quarterback, arm talents included, but because he worked out so well Ponder got the "athlete" label, which sort of insinuates that a team is supposed to get bonus "splash" plays out of a player. But a quarterback is never supposed to be drafted for the bonus gift. Whenever you get a bonus gift, it's usually pale in comparison to what it's a bonus of. I'm not saying Christian Ponder is a terrible player, I just think he got overdrafted by a round. Everyone in Minnesota would feel better about exactly the same team they have now if they'd gotten him for a second round pick instead. But he got drafted that high because of his athletic upside, and I think some people are making the same mistake in reverse when it comes to Matt Barkley. They're seeing that he doesn't have the bonus trait of being able to scramble (or run the read option), and think of it as a negative. Barkley can do all the things you need a professional quarterback can do, but I do wonder if it signifies that the league is changing dramatically. If in the next few years, we'll just openly be saying, "So-and-so is too slow to play quarterback."

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Old 03-27-2013, 11:50 PM    (permalink
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I think people are slightly down on Barkley not because of his foot speed,(he's a functional athlete for the position IMO since one of his 40s was in the 4.8 range at USC's pro day), but instead because he lacks any real elite physical tools for the position.

The lack of real arm strength or any special velocity on his throws makes it hard I think for people to get excited about him as a pro prospect.

Barkley's upside is borderline competent NFL starter. In fact I think Matt Ryan has a better arm than he does.
How are you going to throw at your own pro day and your deep ball floats to the point your workout WR has to slow down to nearly a stop to catch the ball?? Ugh.
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Old 03-28-2013, 01:33 AM    (permalink
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Andy Dalton seems to have really improved his arm strength from his rookie to 2nd season. Would it be so bad for Barkley to be compared to him?
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Old 03-28-2013, 05:35 AM    (permalink
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Part of me wants to compare Matt Barkley to Kurt Warner.
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Old 03-28-2013, 05:37 AM    (permalink
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Andy Dalton seems to have really improved his arm strength from his rookie to 2nd season. Would it be so bad for Barkley to be compared to him?

No. I like Andy Dalton. What he needs to do now is really make a jump in his decision making and be more aggressive throwing the football.

Right now Barkley's deep ball IMO looks like an INT waiting to happen in the NFL.
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Old 03-28-2013, 10:30 AM    (permalink
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Part of me wants to compare Matt Barkley to Kurt Warner.
Why ?
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Old 03-28-2013, 10:44 AM    (permalink
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People were fallin in love with Dalton predraft despite his arm...they're doing the opposite with Barkley. Hell, Colt McCoy got more love from GMs/scouts predraft and he was a 3rd round pick.
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Old 03-28-2013, 01:00 PM    (permalink
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Part of me wants to compare Matt Barkley to Kurt Warner.
When people compare Barkley to recent guys who have had success like Newton, Wilson and Kaepernick he doesnt look all that promising.

What people should do is compare his skills to guys like Warner, Ryan and the two best in business in Brady and Manning. Not that he'll be as good as those guys but in terms of playing style.
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Old 03-28-2013, 01:50 PM    (permalink
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Any QB prospect with a slightly below average NFL arm, is going to get criticized by scouts and GM's no matter what other attributes he has. Dalton is an average NFL QB, nothing special, but satisfactory and that is Barkley's upside. He'll fit in a WCO which doesn't ask him to throw a deep ball all that often, so when he does, it will surprise defenders giving him the advantage of shock over talent.
Like Dalton, you will always be asking if he can take a team all the way and that is why he won't go too high in the draft unless a team is absolutely desperate and has to have somebody.
If your best comparison is Dalton, it cannot be that good.
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Old 03-28-2013, 02:04 PM    (permalink
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I personally find comparisons to be lazy.

Guys stand out on their own. We try to pigeonhole prospects so that they become more of a 'known quantity'. But there are just so many moving parts to what makes a QB good. We awkwardly try to fit round pegs in star shaped holes because they are roughly similar. But even guys with virtually identical physical characteristics can be wildly dissimilar in how they perform due to non physical factors.
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Old 03-28-2013, 02:17 PM    (permalink
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Any QB prospect with a slightly below average NFL arm, is going to get criticized by scouts and GM's no matter what other attributes he has. Dalton is an average NFL QB, nothing special, but satisfactory and that is Barkley's upside. He'll fit in a WCO which doesn't ask him to throw a deep ball all that often, so when he does, it will surprise defenders giving him the advantage of shock over talent.
Like Dalton, you will always be asking if he can take a team all the way and that is why he won't go too high in the draft unless a team is absolutely desperate and has to have somebody.
If your best comparison is Dalton, it cannot be that good.
If the level of QB that Barkley is compared to is Dalton that is going to get you drafted late first or early second.

In Barkley's case it's going to really matter where he ends up.
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Old 03-28-2013, 02:53 PM    (permalink
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I personally find comparisons to be lazy.

Guys stand out on their own. We try to pigeonhole prospects so that they become more of a 'known quantity'. But there are just so many moving parts to what makes a QB good. We awkwardly try to fit round pegs in star shaped holes because they are roughly similar. But even guys with virtually identical physical characteristics can be wildly dissimilar in how they perform due to non physical factors.
i think considering comparisons to be lazy is pretentious. Its like not owning a phone, its way to impractical to even be a decent fashion statement
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Old 03-28-2013, 03:51 PM    (permalink
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Andy Dalton seems to have really improved his arm strength from his rookie to 2nd season. Would it be so bad for Barkley to be compared to him?
No, he hasn't improved his arm strength and neither will Barkley. Players don't improve their arm strength in their early 20's when they are full mature.
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Old 03-28-2013, 03:52 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Black Bolt View Post
No, he hasn't improved his arm strength and neither will Barkley. Players don't improve their arm strength in their early 20's when they are full mature.
bulllllllshittttt

tom brady and drew brees both grew into their arm after a few years

Dalton has definitely improved his arm strength
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 03-28-2013, 03:56 PM    (permalink
SuperPacker
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When people compare Barkley to recent guys who have had success like Newton, Wilson and Kaepernick he doesnt look all that promising.

What people should do is compare his skills to guys like Warner, Ryan and the two best in business in Brady and Manning. Not that he'll be as good as those guys but in terms of playing style.
When has anyone...ANYONE...compared Matt Barkley to Newton, Russell Wilson or Kaepernick?
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Old 03-28-2013, 04:14 PM    (permalink
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bulllllllshittttt

tom brady and drew brees both grew into their arm after a few years

Dalton has definitely improved his arm strength

Indeed. I am a Bengals fan and Dalton definitely had more zip on the ball in Year 2. He is still struggling with accuracy on deep balls and going through progressions. But his arm improved year over year, I imagine a lot of that was refining technique. I played a bit of QB when I was younger (a very bit..lol) but my best friends Dad was a Div III QB and he gave me some technique help and the difference was unbelievable.
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Old 03-28-2013, 04:34 PM    (permalink
Black Bolt
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bulllllllshittttt

tom brady and drew brees both grew into their arm after a few years

Dalton has definitely improved his arm strength
Really? I bet your source is the clear blue sky. Those guys you mentioned could always throw the ball hard. Brady was a baseball player. I watched Breeze a million times in college and his arm strength appears to be the same if not a little weaker at this point.
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