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Old 04-27-2013, 03:13 AM    (permalink
Caulibflower
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I was watching some more Christine Michael highlights, and I sure hope he can put it together as a pro, because at his best he looks like LaDainian Tomlinson. That'd make us a winner for sure.

1st round pick (24): Percy Harvin (yeah!)
2nd round pick (62): Christine Michael (yeah!)
3rd round pick (87): Jordan Hill (meh.)

Edit: watched some Jordan Hill, and he can sure shoot a gap. Small, but fantastic at slipping tackles, and that's what the Seahawks needed in the middle of the defensive line. Draft is looking good.

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Old 04-27-2013, 03:22 AM    (permalink
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Christine Michael... Ladainian Tomlinson...
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Old 04-27-2013, 03:33 AM    (permalink
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Pretty happy with the Ravens so far. Not sure on Elam but the entire organization like him so I trust them. I highly enjoy Arthur Brown and Williams. Good to have a solid organization.
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Old 04-27-2013, 04:48 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by vidae View Post
Christine Michael... Ladainian Tomlinson...
Put on the tape. I know it's outrageous. Michael's lateral quickness is incredible, and he gets into the second level instantly. He's physical and elusive. They look pretty freakin' similar. Not many people will argue if someone claims Michael's the most athletic runner in this class. I know it's just numbers, but I made the comparison before looking them up. Guess who's who from their combine numbers:

5102
Weight: 221
40 Yrd Dash: 4.46
20 Yrd Dash: 2.59
10 Yrd Dash: 1.54
225 Lb. Bench Reps: 18
Vertical Jump: 40 1/2
Broad Jump:
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.21
3-Cone Drill: 6.84

5100
Weight: 220
40 Yrd Dash: 4.43
20 Yrd Dash: 2.51
10 Yrd Dash: 1.49
225 Lb. Bench Reps: 27
Vertical Jump: 43
Broad Jump: 10'05"
20 Yrd Shuttle: 4.02
3-Cone Drill: 6.69

Y'know what I mean? Michael has an incredible skillset, and it translates into his runner style. Even being in the doghouse, he was their goal line and short yardage runner all year and had touchdowns in nearly every game, which means that even if the coach preferred to let him ride the pine a little, he still gave Christine the ball when they needed critical yards. He simply couldn't keep him on the bench. But it lowered Michael's draft stock to rush for less than 500 yards in the season, and that's how he ends up at #62. That and the injuries. If he can keep it together, LT is not an unreasonable comparison.

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Old 04-27-2013, 08:43 AM    (permalink
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Sadly I have to list the Panthers as a Day 2 loser. We only had one pick and we used it to double dip at DT.

All of the talent came off the board after that. We're left with the dregs by the time we pick again. Bad day.
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Old 04-27-2013, 09:48 AM    (permalink
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Michael is definitely talented. Probably the most talented back in this class. If it wasn't for some injury and off-the-field issues he could've been the #1 back off the board and possibly even a first round pick. He has that kind of potential. Reminds me a lot of Doug Martin last year, actually.

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Originally Posted by Miaoww View Post
Sadly I have to list the Panthers as a Day 2 loser. We only had one pick and we used it to double dip at DT.

All of the talent came off the board after that. We're left with the dregs by the time we pick again. Bad day.
A bad day is when you draft bad players. Kawann Short was a really good pick and it doesn't really matter about perceived needs. You can't go wrong with drafting good players.
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Old 04-27-2013, 10:05 AM    (permalink
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I like the Panthers draft a lot. Who did they have at DT before? Fua and Edwards? I expect Lotulelei to start right away and Short to be starting maybe not week 1, but sometime this season. Solid value at both picks. I don't see any way they can be viewed as losers.
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Old 04-27-2013, 10:17 AM    (permalink
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Agreed. I think the Panthers are in contention for one of the best drafts actually. They killed their biggest need and it will completely redefine that defense. They haven't had an inside presence on the DL since Kris Jenkins.
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Old 04-27-2013, 10:36 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bigbuc View Post
It's funny that you knock teams for taking OG's. Top OG's are making 7.5 - 9 million as free agents. Both the Cards and Titans now have stud OG's locked in for at least 3 years at under 3 million. Plus what if Cooper becomes a 6 time pro bowler and Warmack a 4 time pro bowler? Were they bad picks then?

The reason OG's stopped going in the first round was because of the crazy MONEY being paid to top 10 picks. With the CBA taking care of that it's a new day in the draft process. You're just late in the new way of thinking.
Yeah but most of those guards making all that money either came into the league as later round OTs or were drafted as guards well outside of the top 10.
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:28 AM    (permalink
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Randy Moss played for the Titans? I don't recall...
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:30 AM    (permalink
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Ravens are killing it. Arthur Brown at the end of round 2? Brandon Williams?

And who said losing those guys was going to be a challenge? As I said before, as long as Ozzie Newesome is making the calls, this team will be playoff caliber year after year.
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:33 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Robcards View Post
I like the Panthers draft a lot. Who did they have at DT before? Fua and Edwards? I expect Lotulelei to start right away and Short to be starting maybe not week 1, but sometime this season. Solid value at both picks. I don't see any way they can be viewed as losers.
As a Bucs fan, I hate to admit I like there draft as well. Loutelli I had as a top 3 prospect.

I like Short, but I thought they could have addressed the WR position.
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:35 AM    (permalink
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Yeah but most of those guards making all that money either came into the league as later round OTs or were drafted as guards well outside of the top 10.
Games are won in the trenches anymore. Sure it's a passing league, but you need to protect that QB right? That;'s why outside the QB position, OL/DL WR and CB are more heavily coveted than Rbs and LBs really.
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:55 AM    (permalink
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The 49ers have absolutely wrecked in this draft.

Patriots are losers for trading out of the first round and using the picks to draft backups. They don't need more backups.
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Old 04-27-2013, 11:58 AM    (permalink
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The 49ers have absolutely wrecked in this draft.

Patriots are losers for trading out of the first round and using the picks to draft backups. They don't need more backups.
They actually have so much talent they ain't be able to play all of it lol. The saints have killed this draft.
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Old 04-27-2013, 12:18 PM    (permalink
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The 49ers have absolutely wrecked in this draft.

Patriots are losers for trading out of the first round and using the picks to draft backups. They don't need more backups.
Everyone says Bellichik is a genius for manipulating the draft. But he's struggled despite all the picks he's aquired havent panned ou.t
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Old 04-27-2013, 12:42 PM    (permalink
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People still grading the winners and losers based on "value". The two teams are getting a ton of flack for it? The Buffalo Bills and the Dallas Cowboys.

Bills

I thought EJ Manuel pushed himself into the discussion for the top QB prospect in this class with his great performance at the Senior Bowl. If the Bills took Geno Smith @ 16, then I assume people wouldn't be as harsh? But because it was Manuel, someone the consensus didn't approve of, then it's somehow an issue?

The truth is that none of these QBs are franchise QBs. A few have potential to be starting players, but have hefty negatives that drive their grade down. Do I think Manuel was good "value"? No, not really. I thought he was an early second round prospect. Do I think he's the best QB in this draft? Barely, but yes. He has good physical tools, he has a good amount of potential and I've heard good things about his leadership. The potential for an above average QB is there. Just as much as it is with Geno Smith. If Manuel pans out, then a lot of people are going to be looking foolish because they thought the Bills should have traded down (again) to get better "value" for Manuel.

I like the Bills attitude. The Bills obviously thought Manuel was the best QB prospect in this draft. They passed up on Tavon Austin, which is the only thing that gives me pause because I thought he was the second best player in the draft, but they got their QB when they had the pick of the litter. If he works out, then they got their guy.

He has to work out. Where he was picked? What other QBs were on the board? That's all ******** and completely irrelevant. They got their guy. End of discussion. It's a bad pick if he shits the bed. Not because of where he went. It's only a bad pick if Manuel is a bad Pro. If you're going to bash the pick, bash it because you think Manuel is a terrible player and an inevitable bust. Not because he went ahead of Geno Smith or in the 1st round.

Cowboys

The Cowboys, again, pick a player that wasn't supposed to go as high as he did. The consensus on Frederick was that he was an excellent interior linemen prospect, and the majority believed he was the best center prospect in the draft. Was it good value? Again, maybe not from a consensus point of view, but Logan Mankins was a reach at the end of round one. Frederick is going to be a good player and the Cowboys filled a serious need to assist in the running game. He's a good player, which makes it a good pick. It's just not conventional or easy to swallow. The Cowboys traded down and got him. Did someone else come off their board that they didn't think would go that high? Maybe (doesn't have the same amount of conviction the Bills had taking Manuel). But the Cowboys still got a good player, and I thought Frederick was a first round prospect myself. I think it's a good fit. Do I think a better player was on the board? Like Matt Elam or Jonathan Cyprien? Yeah, but I can't argue with it too much. Not a great pick (unless he turns into an All-Pro), but not something that I'd bash and call them a draft day loser. I also think Gavin Escobar in round 2 is a very good pick. Those are two good players they added to their roster. And I don't think the Cowboys could guarantee themselves that the best center prospect would still be on the board @ 47. Likely, but not a guarantee. They got the best center prospect in this draft. I don't know how you can argue with that.


Jets

The Jets are also getting a lot of heat, especially from the New York media. I watched their offense and I can understand why... To the knee jerk reaction. And then when I consider that they traded the best defensive player in the NFL for, basically, Sheldon Richardson... Yeah, it just goes to show how overrated draft picks are. And I love Richardson, but he's a prospect who has done nothing to prove himself in the NFL. There was obviously numerous reasons why they traded Revis, but player-for-player... It hurts the quality of the team without question.

But I look at Dee Milliner and I see a good corner. An above average one. If he turns into a stud worthy of a Top 10 pick, then it's a great start in replacing Revis. So, I think they got a good player @ 9 even if I think he's a late first rounder, but a good player no less. Then @ 13 they take Richardson. I think Richardson is the best defenisve player in the draft. Hard for me not to like the pick. It's even harder for me not to like both picks.

But everyone points to the Jets offense and says the Jets needed to address offense; that this was a Rex Ryan draft. Maybe they drafted BPA. And if they did, then I don't know how you are against that, but I look at their offense and I can understand the criticism. They are terrible offensively and they had two first round picks to address that issue (2006 - they drafted Ferguson & Mangold in round 1). Warmack, in my opinion, would have been a better pick @ 9. Better player that fills a major need on the offensive line. If Geno Smith turns into a steal in round 2, then this draft looks like a win for the Jets. If Brian Winters is a solid pro, then it's even better. But for this to me a good draft the defensive players they chose in round 1 have to become good players, and they have to hope that either their second or third round pick becomes a quality starter. I think they had more options, but it wasn't terrible because they got good players. I also believe the best players on the board at their picks were defensive players. So, in essence, they would have had to "reach" to fill needs instead of picking their top rated players.

EDIT: Not to mention they filled a hole at RB in a trade for Chris Ivory. A very good runner with good potential. For a team devoid of talent, to me, it looks like they added a lot with this draft. I don't think they were a loser, but one of the winners of 2013.


Ted Thompson

Ozzie Newsome is commonly known for his drafting, and considered the best GM in the NFL. Newsome is certainly in the discussion, but Thompson is his equal. Thompson completely revamped their atrocious defense with youth last year (and may have found a future star in Casey Hayward). It was a terrific draft that got a lot of production from the rookie class. This year, sitting at 26, they address the defensive line with the best 34 front seven prospect in this draft. I consider Datone Jones a Top 10 player. I am in no way comparing him to JJ Watt, but if Watt has shown us anything it's that elite speed and quickness from the inside combined with strength and power can makeup for an absolute terror in the 34 defense (that allowed its ends to get up the field). That's exactly the type of player Jones is. He's solid in a 43 front, but he excels in the 34. He was dominant at the Senior Bowl and was the only player to beat Eric Fisher all week long. He has violent hands and incredible quickness off the ball. His upside and potential is through the roof. I was shocked that one of the elite players in the draft simply fell right into the Packers laps. And then in round 2, once again, they draft Eddie Lacy when everyone thought he was an option in round 1. Thompson finds players from all over the country. Small schools, big schools, great players who slip in the draft, developmental gems... Thompson is one of the best in the business.
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I would like it if there were more successful black Quarterbacks in the NFL...
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I could possibly see Matthew Stafford Dropping out of the 1st round
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Originally Posted by GoRavens View Post
Tahj Boyd has the best fundamentals of any QB in this class, I think his game translates great to the NFL.

Last edited by BigBanger : 04-27-2013 at 03:32 PM.
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Old 04-27-2013, 04:47 PM    (permalink
AcheTen (Thumper)
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Originally Posted by nepg View Post
The 49ers have absolutely wrecked in this draft.

Patriots are losers for trading out of the first round and using the picks to draft backups. They don't need more backups.
The only good pick the 49ers made was Carradine.

I don't see why everyone is slobbering over what the 49ers did.
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Old 04-27-2013, 04:54 PM    (permalink
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The only good pick the 49ers made was Carradine.

I don't see why everyone is slobbering over what the 49ers did.
Lattimore and Patton were great picks
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Old 04-27-2013, 05:20 PM    (permalink
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The only good pick the 49ers made was Carradine.

I don't see why everyone is slobbering over what the 49ers did.
lolwut?

I was going to break it down, but it's very simply that: Every single pick they've made has been a great pick.
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Old 04-27-2013, 05:29 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Bert Macklin View Post
They actually have so much talent they ain't be able to play all of it lol. The saints have killed this draft.
if you mean killing their rare opportunity of selecting an impact defender and wasting it on vaccaro then yes
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Old 04-27-2013, 05:39 PM    (permalink
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AcheTen hates the 49ers, therefore their draft was horrible.
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:47 PM    (permalink
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Rex Ryan sounds like a dead man walking.
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Old 04-27-2013, 06:53 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by nepg View Post
lolwut?

I was going to break it down, but it's very simply that: Every single pick they've made has been a great pick.
I really didn't like the Eric Reid pick, but after finding out they only gave up a 3rd to make that move it didn't look as bad.
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Originally Posted by 49erNation85 View Post
I wouldn't be sir prized if he passed McCoy on the depth chart. I think he might have a better arm and accurate arm then him from the highlights I thought. He also got some wheels too help us prepare for QB's as Wilson , RG3 and other runners etc.
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Old 04-28-2013, 11:16 AM    (permalink
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Now understanding the big picture, I'm pretty happy about Dallas' draft. We just locked up our franchise QB and this draft was all about protecting him (Frederick) and adding weapons (Williams, Escobar, Randle).

Romo has a really tough time with interior pressure, so it was essential for us to address that early. Everyone wants to kill us for taking Frederick at 31 but this was the same team that trotted out Phil Costa as their starting center in 2011 and Ryan Cook in 2012. And outside of the upgrade he provides as a rock in pass pro, we added one of the best mauling Center prospects in the past 5 years to the worst rushing team in the league in 2012. Was he ideal value at 31? Probably not. But looking at who else was on the board, and the early run on OL, there was a good chance he was gone before our 2nd rounder. We couldn't afford to gamble on that.

So now that Romo has a new best friend at Center, we went ahead and loaded up his options:

WR:
Dez
Miles
Terrance Williams
Dwayne Harris

TE:
Witten
Escobar
Hanna

RB:
Murray
Randle

We now have one of the deepest groups of playmakers in the league, and the personnel to become extremely diverse and multiple within our formations.


Even with doing that, we were able to land some high upside DB prospects in J.J. Wilcox(SS) and B.W. Webb(Slot)... both of whom will have a chance to challenge for serious PT sooner rather than later.
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