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Old 02-23-2014, 07:28 PM    (permalink
Cigaro
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Originally Posted by Babylon View Post
I feel Teddy is hurting himself by being a bystander this weekend.
Eh, temporarily. I assume he plans on throwing at his pro day/some other workout, which will suffice for the scouts. As long as he does well then, it won't matter.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:07 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
12 months from now Bridgewater is going to be called one of the biggest steals from this draft.

He's going to lead some team to the playoffs in 2014 and is on the short list for OROTY.

I still don't know why he didn't run, however.
Maybe he added the weight for the weigh in but knows he'll lose it for when he runs his 40, since he won't be weighed again. Agents are pretty clever these days about methods to maximize their prospects.
You'd be surprised just how much weight you can pack on in a meal just before the weigh in which has no time to leave your body.

I just wonder why Houston isn't jumping at the thought of drafting a guy who will " lead some team to the playoffs in 2014 and is on the short list for OROTY.", perhaps they aren't as confident as you.
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Old 02-23-2014, 08:28 PM    (permalink
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Maybe he added the weight for the weigh in but knows he'll lose it for when he runs his 40, since he won't be weighed again. Agents are pretty clever these days about methods to maximize their prospects.
You'd be surprised just how much weight you can pack on in a meal just before the weigh in which has no time to leave your body.

I just wonder why Houston isn't jumping at the thought of drafting a guy who will " lead some team to the playoffs in 2014 and is on the short list for OROTY.", perhaps they aren't as confident as you.
Your main criticism of Bridgewater is the width of his ankles and wrists and his bodyweight. Teddy weighed in at 214# and there's no reason to believe he won't keep that weight throughout the year.

If you evaluate strictly the QB we saw on the field, he's the most pro ready prospect in the draft and will be an instant upgrade for the 5 teams picking at the top of the 1st round.

Do you know who Houston is picking?? I sure don't.
Just because a team passes on Bridgewater really doesn't factor into who he will become as a pro QB.

A QB just won the SB who every team in the NFL didn't think was worth taking three times in last year's draft.

Teddy's a very good QB prospect. Whether or not the Texans select him doesn't change the fact they still don't have a QB.

Sam Bradford gained 20# before his draft. RG3 gained roughly 15# and gained three more pounds once he got to Washington.
I don't see the precedent that Teddy's weight gain is water and he'll lose it in a couple weeks before his pro day.
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Old 02-24-2014, 02:04 AM    (permalink
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Scouts will weight him at his pro day again anyway.
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Old 02-24-2014, 10:25 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by FUNBUNCHER View Post
Sam Bradford gained 20# before his draft. RG3 gained roughly 15# and gained three more pounds once he got to Washington.
I don't see the precedent that Teddy's weight gain is water and he'll lose it in a couple weeks before his pro day.
My concern with him is the lack of growth and body development the past 3 years. That should be an age where putting on weight and muscle comes fairly easily, and he is still a waif of a QB back there. Perhaps UL's S&C program is atrocious, but with their on field success the past 2 years I don't see that as likely.
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Old 02-24-2014, 11:27 AM    (permalink
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He was successful at his weight so there was no need to gain weight to play in college, now he is going to the NFL they have questioned it so he gained the weight. 215 is a fine tbh.
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Old 02-24-2014, 11:32 AM    (permalink
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He was successful at his weight so there was no need to gain weight to play in college, now he is going to the NFL they have questioned it so he gained the weight. 215 is a fine tbh.
There is no magical number for what QBs weight needs to be in the NFL, as it is very proportionate to their frame. Needless to say for his frame, 215 is not that weight for Bridgewater.
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Old 02-24-2014, 01:53 PM    (permalink
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My concern with him is the lack of growth and body development the past 3 years. That should be an age where putting on weight and muscle comes fairly easily, and he is still a waif of a QB back there. Perhaps UL's S&C program is atrocious, but with their on field success the past 2 years I don't see that as likely.
Last summer he had jaw surgery and his mouth was wired shut for several months. He supposedly lost about 15 pounds over the summer and had a hard time putting it back on during the season.
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Old 02-24-2014, 03:26 PM    (permalink
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Eh, temporarily. I assume he plans on throwing at his pro day/some other workout, which will suffice for the scouts. As long as he does well then, it won't matter.
The media always says its a mistake when someone doesn't throw at the combine and yet top prospects keep on skipping it. The media does have a bias and would prefer to be able to talk about how all the top prospects did.

I don't think QBs throwing is very important. It's a controlled environment with no pass rush, no pressure, no reading defenses or progressions. The team interviews are much more important.
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Old 02-24-2014, 03:50 PM    (permalink
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The media always says its a mistake when someone doesn't throw at the combine and yet top prospects keep on skipping it. The media does have a bias and would prefer to be able to talk about how all the top prospects did.

I don't think QBs throwing is very important. It's a controlled environment with no pass rush, no pressure, no reading defenses or progressions. The team interviews are much more important.
Yea but coaches would like to see the arm strength and foot work and how they can throw to different wide outs. I still all QB should some how be forced to throw given a fine or suspension of a game or something small just to get them to work out and throw.
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Old 02-24-2014, 03:55 PM    (permalink
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Yea but coaches would like to see the arm strength and foot work and how they can throw to different wide outs. I still all QB should some how be forced to throw given a fine or suspension of a game or something small just to get them to work out and throw.
If you did that you'd all of a sudden have an absurd number of untimely injuries around the time of the combine. I still don't understand why people obsess so much about seeing these guys throw like 20 passes to random WRs in controlled drills when they can go and find 20+ games worth of throws against an actual defense. I do like it when a top QB says "I'm going to show you that I'm the best QB" like Cam Newton did but I really don't care if these guys choose not to throw.
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Old 02-24-2014, 04:04 PM    (permalink
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Yea but coaches would like to see the arm strength and foot work and how they can throw to different wide outs. I still all QB should some how be forced to throw given a fine or suspension of a game or something small just to get them to work out and throw.
You cannot fine them or suspend them, they aren't pros at this moment, all you could do is threaten to not draft them and that is hardly ever going to happen.

In truth, the NFL could just pay them to perform but that would open a can of worms that I doubt the NFL wants to open.

In truth, nobody really cares if they show up as long as they perform at their Pro Days.
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Old 02-24-2014, 04:10 PM    (permalink
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You cannot fine them or suspend them, they aren't pros at this moment, all you could do is threaten to not draft them and that is hardly ever going to happen.

In truth, the NFL could just pay them to perform but that would open a can of worms that I doubt the NFL wants to open.


In truth, nobody really cares if they show up as long as they perform at their Pro Days.
Adidas just gave Brandin Cooks $100k for having the fastest 40 time in their shoes. Nothing says the NFL or its teams need to be the ones writing checks.
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Old 02-25-2014, 12:47 AM    (permalink
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Not throwing at the combine means nothing. I'd like a guy to do it for fun and to be competitive but honestly there is very little to gain and there is the risk of looking bad for no reason. It's not like skipping the senior bowl or anything.
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Old 03-17-2014, 01:56 PM    (permalink
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The Houston Chronicle reports Teddy Bridgewater was "less accurate than expected" during Monday's Louisville Pro Day, as "several" of his passes were "clearly off target" and his ball "often fluttered."
The workout was held indoors. Bridgewater (6'2/208) also weighed in six pounds lighter than his Combine measurement and proceeded to make numerous underthrows and overthrows. Per the Chronicle, "more than ten" of Bridgewater's 65 Pro Day throws were "either misses or drops." Conceded Bridgewater afterwards, "it was nowhere near where I wanted it to be." Added NFL Network's Kurt Warner, "I think he missed a few more throws than you expect at a Pro Day." Bridgewater ran a 4.78 forty-yard dash. He threw without gloves after donning them throughout his high school and college careers. Bridgewater's draft stock has seemingly been falling since the end of the college season.
Source: Houston Chronicle Mar 17 - 2:39 PM
Yikes.

He's a good prospect, but the No. 1 overall stuff was always wrong. He's got plenty of question marks, and I'm not surprised he struggled in this setting - his mechanics are inconsistent, he throws all-arm, and his deep ball is horribly inaccurate. And we've discussed his frame issues also.

I like literally everything else about his game, but propping him up with the "if the Texans pass on BW they are sooo stupid" was all lazy people following the draftnik consensus with too much put on stats and college highlights. In a way kind of like Geno Smith last year (perception of them, not them themselves, BW is way better). When you actually sit down and study BW, he's simply not the guy the internet makes him out to be.
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Old 03-17-2014, 02:40 PM    (permalink
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Yikes.

He's a good prospect, but the No. 1 overall stuff was always wrong. He's got plenty of question marks, and I'm not surprised he struggled in this setting - his mechanics are inconsistent, he throws all-arm, and his deep ball is horribly inaccurate. And we've discussed his frame issues also.

I like literally everything else about his game, but propping him up with the "if the Texans pass on BW they are sooo stupid" was all lazy people following the draftnik consensus with too much put on stats and college highlights. In a way kind of like Geno Smith last year (perception of them, not them themselves, BW is way better). When you actually sit down and study BW, he's simply not the guy the internet makes him out to be.

I still think looking back it will be a mistake for Houston to pass on Bridgewater.
All depends how he develops and who the Texans select to be their QB and if he works out.

I don't think it was lazy projecting Bridgewater to the Texans.
He's not a physically imposing QB prospect, but you never came away from watching his games thinking Teddy was limited as a signal caller because of his frame or arm strength.

It's lazy saying there's any real comparison on any level between Bridgewater and Geno Smith.

Have there been any reports on how his arm looked?? I don't mind necessarily that Bridgewater had passes that fluttered if his arm strength looked decent.

You know, the more I hear about Teddy NOT wearing his gloves during his pro day, something he's done since HS, makes me think the move was calculated on the part of his agents.

Maybe there are teams his reps don't want to draft him and he'd prefer to be considered towards the end of the top 10 if not later.

Has anyone heard an explanation about why Teddy declined to wear his gloves?? Was it a request by NFL personnel??
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Old 03-17-2014, 02:47 PM    (permalink
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I didn't compare him to Smith.

I compared the situation of last year people calling for Smith to go No. 1 with no regard of glaring red flags because of his good production/tools to this year of people calling for BW to go No. 1 with no regard of less-glaring-but-easily-visible red flags because of good production/tools and top-notch intangibles/signature highlights.

BW is a much, much better prospect.
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Old 03-17-2014, 02:50 PM    (permalink
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I didn't compare him to Smith.

I compared the situation of last year people calling for Smith to go No. 1 with no regard of glaring red flags because of his good production/tools to this year of people calling for BW to go No. 1 with no regard of less-glaring-but-easily-visible red flags because of good production/tools and top-notch intangibles/signature highlights.

BW is a much, much better prospect.
Okay, just saying I think it's more plausible for someone to argue for Bridgewater to go #1 than Geno Smith.

(Understand this is coming from someone who thought Andy Reid was an idiot for passing on Geno so hell what the F do I know?? )

Just comparing the two prospects, if they both came out in the same year, there's no way I'd have Geno ahead of TB.
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Old 03-17-2014, 02:56 PM    (permalink
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I fully agree, BW is a far superior prospect than Smith ever was, however, he does have warts. For any team drafting a QB this year, the home fans must just pray their GM knows how to appraise talent and takes the right one, whoever that may be, for their team. We likely won't fully know the complete results till their 2nd or 3rd year is complete.

I'm a Browns' fan and am expecting the Browns to draft a QB, I'm hoping for Manziel because I like what I have seen on the field about his leadership and intangibles, will he be great, good, average, fair or a bust, I cannot guarantee, but at least he'll be exciting and with this morbid franchise, that's at least a step up.
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Old 03-17-2014, 03:16 PM    (permalink
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ESPN just showed some throws... wow.

But again, I'm not really all that surprised. On tape he didn't transfer his weight, his footwork was inconsistent, he threw all-arm, and his deep ball was bad because of it. And he made at least one WTF throw every game.

ESPN just showed three of those WTF throws against air, which is unfathomable indoors.

I'd blame it on nerves/gloves/thinking too much, but it's not like I haven't seen bad mechanics and habits out of him on tape. He was just always able to get it done because his arm is a gift and he's definitely a gamer and really smart.

But even I didn't expect him to get reports this bad...
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Old 03-17-2014, 03:43 PM    (permalink
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"Before, I was an all-arm passer."

About working with Weinke. Confirms what I saw. At least he knows it and is working on it.
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Old 03-17-2014, 04:54 PM    (permalink
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I'm looking at Minnesota as the earliest TB might hear his name called.
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Old 03-17-2014, 05:04 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Babylon View Post
I'm looking at Minnesota as the earliest TB might hear his name called.
Bridgewater will still likely workout for a # of teams and may well recover from this bad showing, at least he has the extended time frame before the draft to workout again if necessary.
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Old 03-17-2014, 06:25 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by gpngc View Post
"Before, I was an all-arm passer."

About working with Weinke. Confirms what I saw. At least he knows it and is working on it.
If he is adjusting his mechanics (even if they are positive adjustments), that could impact his accuracy. Long term, it should prove beneficial. I still wouldn't label Bridgewater a poor pick for the Texans. I'd go for Clowney or Manziel, but Bridgewater is in the mix. His level of competition is much lower than Manziel's, but Bridgewater you can't get much more efficient than Bridgewater was in 2013. He's smart, instinctive, very accurate within 25 yards (during games, at least). I think he has enough physical tools to be a warrant the #1 pick - given his strengths.
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Old 03-17-2014, 06:30 PM    (permalink
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"Before, I was an all-arm passer."

About working with Weinke. Confirms what I saw. At least he knows it and is working on it.
I have to admit that you were right about this. I'm pretty sure we got into an "argument" about his mechanics and clearly I was wrong. I'll chalk this one up to a lack of experience with scouting. Basically, I need to follow the advice of listening to those who know more than me....

I still like him a lot as a prospect but I think his weaknesses are a little more of a concern than I originally thought. I still think it's mostly things that can be worked out though.
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