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Old 07-10-2013, 06:31 PM    (permalink
mightytitan9
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Originally Posted by stlouisfan37 View Post
You want insight? He has yet to win 2 games in a row. He has yet to complete 60% of his passes 2 weeks in a row. He made a splash his freshman year and it has been this way since. He has some physical tools; but as far as accuracy goes, he's horrible. His instincts are very mediocre. All he has going for him is this image emblazoned in everyone's mind of "what he could become." I've got a $20 bill that says he doesn't reach career milestones of 12000 yards and 80 touchdown in his first 5 years.
Seeing as though their is 3 games that qualify under that, that's not an impressive stat.

If you want to look at stats, Locker completed more % than Andrew Luck. Luck completed 50% or less of his passes in 7 games.

Your stats don't mean anything. Talking about him 5 years ago means nothing. Say something worthwhile please
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Old 07-10-2013, 06:33 PM    (permalink
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What are you basing that on? Bradford has looked mediocre since he's been in the NFL.
He's a biased Rams fans, that's what.
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Old 07-10-2013, 06:36 PM    (permalink
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Wouldn't be surprised if Ryan Fitzpatrick starts a few games for the Titans this season if Locker continues to struggle.
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Old 07-10-2013, 06:51 PM    (permalink
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What are you basing that on? Bradford has looked mediocre since he's been in the NFL. Yeah he hasn't had the best roster, but at the same time he hasn't shown flashes of brilliance either.
This is the first time in his career that Bradford has had the same OC in consecutive seasons. He has a better offensive line than last year, and more talent around him (although less experienced).

In his last 8 games of 2012 he put up 1905/15/6. My projection of 4100/28/10 seems like a natural projection. Really, it wouldn't be a huge breakout compared to his production the last half of 2012, except that he has never put it together for a whole season.
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Old 07-10-2013, 07:02 PM    (permalink
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He's a biased Rams fans, that's what.
I think I am quite objective, actually. Bradford is definitely at a make-or-break point in his career, but he made great strides last year, and all signs are pointing up. I think you're just a bit bent because Locker is never going become the great QB that his "potential" suggested he would be, and deep down in your heart you know that I'm right.

And, for what it's worth, I'm not just talking out my ass. I live in Seattle and watched Locker for his entire college career. He didn't get better, his numbers didn't improve, he didn't win, he didn't get more accurate, and he has yet to do any of those things in the NFL. Maybe I'm totally off the mark and he goes on to have a brilliant career. That would be really cool, because I have met him and he is a really nice guy. But I'm not betting on him.
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Old 07-10-2013, 07:32 PM    (permalink
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This is the first time in his career that Bradford has had the same OC in consecutive seasons. He has a better offensive line than last year, and more talent around him (although less experienced).

In his last 8 games of 2012 he put up 1905/15/6. My projection of 4100/28/10 seems like a natural projection. Really, it wouldn't be a huge breakout compared to his production the last half of 2012, except that he has never put it together for a whole season.
In his last eight games. What about his last 11 games? What about the entire season?

As for his offensive coordinator, yeah it isn't great to have change every single season. But then sometimes that might not even been the main issue. It might be the player. Alex Smith finally had the same offensive coordinator two years running in Jimmy Raye. It didn't make him a better player. I'm not saying that will be the same fate for Bradford, but I am saying don't necessarily bank on that to being an instant turnaround.

Also, the Rams don't have any established threats at the skill positions. And they just lost Steven Jackson.
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:36 AM    (permalink
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It's not a terrible list so far.
Also Jaws has been pretty complimentary on all the players, he certainly has tried to accentuate the positives.
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Old 07-11-2013, 07:31 AM    (permalink
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Also Jaws has been pretty complimentary on all the players, he certainly has tried to accentuate the positives.
He's been pretty spot on with his analysis too. It's hard to critique his points bc they're all valid. I like what he's done so far.
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Old 07-11-2013, 07:55 AM    (permalink
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Bradford is due for a breakout year...4100 yards/28 TD/10 int
he always is
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

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Old 07-11-2013, 08:33 AM    (permalink
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Also Jaws has been pretty complimentary on all the players, he certainly has tried to accentuate the positives.
This is what I like most about Jaworski's analyses.

He's a positive critique kind of guy, yet he still has a very high standard for what defines great QB play.
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Old 07-11-2013, 10:58 AM    (permalink
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Bradford has a chance, we'll see soon.

Last year, Locker was, BY FAR, the worst QB I saw the Packers face (and we played against Arizona and Jacksonville).

After playing against Locker in week 16, Christian Ponder was Montana-like in week 17.
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Old 07-11-2013, 11:41 AM    (permalink
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I still don't get the fascination with Locker.
He never wowed in college, coming off a disaster of a sophomore NFL season and barely played his rookie year. I always saw an inaccurate QB who had a good arm. Basically what a lot of people talked about some of the QB's in this class who went in the middle rounds, not 8th overall.

As for Bradford, this is definitely a make or break year for him. Either he establishes himself as a franchise QB, or he goes the route of David Carr and becomes a perennial backup. Personally, I see him establishing himself. He improved upon his poor sophomore season last year, 3700 yards, 21 TD's and 13 INT's isn't too shabby. Does he need to further improve? Yes, but he's heading the right way.

I gotta say I think he's rating Andrew Luck a little too high.
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Old 07-11-2013, 11:59 AM    (permalink
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Bradford has a chance, we'll see soon.

Last year, Locker was, BY FAR, the worst QB I saw the Packers face (and we played against Arizona and Jacksonville).

After playing against Locker in week 16, Christian Ponder was Montana-like in week 17.
I've tried to stay out of the Locker debates because I only really saw him in the Packer game last season, but holy crap was he ever terrible in that game. He was the worst QB I've seen in a long time. I hope that was by far his worst game of the season, because he looked like a guy who didn't even belong in the NFL. Just terrible.
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Old 07-11-2013, 12:16 PM    (permalink
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I'm so sick of talking about Sam Bradford, he is what he is and anyone who is expecting anything more is fooling themselves. If he has a perfect pocket every time, all pro weapons on the outside, a stud RB, a great play-caller, the same offensive coordinator for 5 years in a row, and stays healthy he'll show that he's an above average QB. Sounds like #1 overall QB stuff right there


He gets more excuses then a top QB prospect that I've ever heard in my life. He doesn't make anyone better, ever. Not the line, not the weapons, not the offense. He needs everything around him to go perfectly well and then he looks like a functional QB. He's not Jake Locker bad, and he's starter quality, but he's average and he'll only become slightly above average when his surrounding parts make him better, and for the good QB's it's the other way around.
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Old 07-11-2013, 12:25 PM    (permalink
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Ive always compared Bradford to Alex Smith...always
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 07-11-2013, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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I've tried to stay out of the Locker debates because I only really saw him in the Packer game last season, but holy crap was he ever terrible in that game. He was the worst QB I've seen in a long time. I hope that was by far his worst game of the season, because he looked like a guy who didn't even belong in the NFL. Just terrible.
That game and the Texan game were both pretty bad. Both games he got sacked 6 and 7 times respectively. Not entirely on the O-Line but not entirely on Locker either. Either way he needs to do better about picking up the blitz and getting the ball out sooner, but it's no coincidence his two worst games are the two games he got sacked the most and under the most pressure
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Old 07-11-2013, 01:10 PM    (permalink
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honestly the addition of warmack and levitre will be a big factor in how locker does and if hes going to improve. Hes got some decent WRs, he'll regain a running attack that isnt wildly sporatic. It isnt now or never, but now is certainly better than later
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The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 07-11-2013, 01:37 PM    (permalink
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I don't buy that Levitre/Warmack is going to improve the running game so drastically that it will be a key reason Locker improves.

Their RBs need to play better for that to happen.
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Old 07-11-2013, 01:38 PM    (permalink
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I'm not giving up on Locker yet. He showed some flashes his rookie year and actually looked quite good against the Patriots in the first game until he hurt his shoulder. He really didn't seem the same when he came back later in the year so we'll see what will happens if he can stay healthy for a full season. It also didn't help that the Titans OC was a joke, they need someone who knows how to develop a quarterback especially considering how raw Locker is.
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Old 07-11-2013, 02:38 PM    (permalink
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I don't buy that Levitre/Warmack is going to improve the running game so drastically that it will be a key reason Locker improves.

Their RBs need to play better for that to happen.
I really don't think RBs are the problem. Many sources graded them out as the 2nd worse run blocking offensive line next to only the Cardinals last season.

They started 11 guys on the O-Line last season, and started 6 different O-Line combinations. If you count the same player starting at 2different positions, they had 14.

I know I read somewhere that if you take out many of Chris' long runs, he averaged somewhere around 3.2 ypc. I can't tell you how many times Chris would get jackknifed in the backfield due to the offensive line and not himself.

Sometimes Chris dances and gets 1-3 yards when he could have gotten 4-5, but he almost always gets positive yards. If he gets stopped for negative yards, it's usually the offensive line. Through the first 6 games of the season, they had a whopping 29 runs for loss.

I know this clip is a couple years old, but this is what he's been facing quite often the past few years. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF5ht6uUIGA

The FB was absolutely horrible for the Titans RBs last season as well.

Not directed at you gpngc, but it amazes me how blind people are to just how bad the Titans offensive line has been the past few seasons. No matter how good the RB is, you can't do much with poor play calling and getting tackled 3-4 yards in the backfield right when you get the ball.
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:09 PM    (permalink
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I'm not giving up on Locker yet. He showed some flashes his rookie year and actually looked quite good against the Patriots in the first game until he hurt his shoulder. He really didn't seem the same when he came back later in the year so we'll see what will happens if he can stay healthy for a full season. It also didn't help that the Titans OC was a joke, they need someone who knows how to develop a quarterback especially considering how raw Locker is.
I thought juice williams died when i read your name and saw your avatar
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:13 PM    (permalink
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I thought juice williams died when i read your name and saw your avatar
Haha well I don't know about that but I do know his football career died several years ago.
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:34 PM    (permalink
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I really don't think RBs are the problem. Many sources graded them out as the 2nd worse run blocking offensive line next to only the Cardinals last season.

They started 11 guys on the O-Line last season, and started 6 different O-Line combinations. If you count the same player starting at 2different positions, they had 14.

I know I read somewhere that if you take out many of Chris' long runs, he averaged somewhere around 3.2 ypc. I can't tell you how many times Chris would get jackknifed in the backfield due to the offensive line and not himself.

Sometimes Chris dances and gets 1-3 yards when he could have gotten 4-5, but he almost always gets positive yards. If he gets stopped for negative yards, it's usually the offensive line. Through the first 6 games of the season, they had a whopping 29 runs for loss.

I know this clip is a couple years old, but this is what he's been facing quite often the past few years. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF5ht6uUIGA

The FB was absolutely horrible for the Titans RBs last season as well.

Not directed at you gpngc, but it amazes me how blind people are to just how bad the Titans offensive line has been the past few seasons. No matter how good the RB is, you can't do much with poor play calling and getting tackled 3-4 yards in the backfield right when you get the ball.
I'll put it this way - I've yet to see adding two guards as the reason a RB, let alone a QB - take it to the next level.

Well blocked plays are few and far between in the NFL because of how good defenses are - ESPECIALLY when teams don't fully respect your passing attack.

Johnson's regressed because of his lack of vision and tendency to dance in the backfield. I won't argue that his OL is good - but it's silly to blame linemen when we see with our own eyes how indecisive and easy to tackle he is. I'm sure PFF's run blocking metrics have to do with the gain of each play, so of course the Titans OL ranked poorly with him dancing and not taking 3-4 yard gains. He's also going to lose the half step that made him special if he hasn't already.

I'll put it this way - if CJ becomes 1.5K this year it will be because Locker steps up - not because of Warmack/Levitre. 8-man boxes on every 1st and 2nd down are almost impossible to run on with any consistency in today's NFL.

It's not as simple as dominant OL on paper = offensive success. The Seahawks line isn't anything special but their RB takes what the defense gives him and punishes them to wear them down. CJ is an easy tackle and his inability to wear down defenses, while being the workhorse is another negative.

And Shonn Greene is not going to help that.

In the surprise team thread, a Titans fan argued for them. I would bet against that but any argument for them needs to start with Locker taking a huge step forward - not managing the game while two stud guards kickstart a bad running game. Stud guards can enhance a running game but only quarterback and running back play can kickstart it in terms of winning games.

EDIT: And everyone is "blind" because of how bad the OL has been... how many players have gone in and out of the lineup? 20+? So all 20 of those pro players are really, really bad? What did all of those linemen have in common - ****** skill players and Chris Johnson in the backfield. Teams pickup sub pro linemen all the time and in many cases they make a near seamless transition. The fact that NO Titans linemen has played well the past few seasons should spark the question - why, what is it about this team that doesn't allow linemen to look good? Answer: in part, possibly large part - CJ and your QBs/receivers.

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Old 07-11-2013, 03:34 PM    (permalink
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I enjoyed watching Juice play in his early years at Illinois, I thought he had a lot of promise early on
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Old 07-11-2013, 03:44 PM    (permalink
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I'll put it this way - I've yet to see adding two guards as the reason a RB, let alone a QB - take it to the next level.

Well blocked plays are few and far between in the NFL because of how good defenses are - ESPECIALLY when teams don't fully respect your passing attack.

Johnson's regressed because of his lack of vision and tendency to dance in the backfield. I won't argue that his OL is good - but it's silly to blame linemen when we see with our own eyes how indecisive and easy to tackle he is. I'm sure PFF's run blocking metrics have to do with the gain of each play, so of course the Titans OL ranked poorly with him dancing and not taking 3-4 yard gains. He's also going to lose the half step that made him special if he hasn't already.

I'll put it this way - if CJ becomes 1.5K this year it will be because Locker steps up - not because of Warmack/Levitre. 8-man boxes on every 1st and 2nd down are almost impossible to run on with any consistency in today's NFL.

It's not as simple as dominant OL on paper = offensive success. The Seahawks line isn't anything special but their RB takes what the defense gives him and punishes them to wear them down. CJ is an easy tackle and his inability to wear down defenses, while being the workhorse is another negative.

And Shonn Greene is not going to help that.

In the surprise team thread, a Titans fan argued for them. I would bet against that but any argument for them needs to start with Locker taking a huge step forward - not managing the game while two stud guards kickstart a bad running game. Stud guards can enhance a running game but only quarterback and running back play can kickstart it in terms of winning games.
lol i hate when people bring in PFF. PFF slogan should be "we watch the game so you dont have to!"

The interior line got pummeled last year, running games suffer because of that. When the steelers had sean mahan, or justin hartwig, or darnell stapleton, or trai essex, or any combination of them playing on the interior the RB was met in the backfield much more often than not, the titans had the same exact problem and they addressed it. Are the going to make locker better? no, but they will help. Chris johnson can still play, locker can move and he has WRs to grow with But not having a DT in your face or the RBs face instantly off the snap goes a long way towards learning how to go through your progressions and reading defenses.

You say great blocking is a rarity, it is, but im not talking about brick wall blocking here. Im saying ONE SECOND longer or 2 or 3 can make a huge difference in not being trigger happy, having sloppy feet, and poor decisions. Those guys can give him more time than what he was provided last year, thats all that matters. locker has to improve but having better blocking certainly doesnt hurt his chances of that

EDIT to respond to your edit: Stewart and Roos have definitely played well when they are healthy, but playing well on the end doesnt much for helping out the interior, while playing well on the interior usually makes life easier for the tackles. They obviously saw the hole and addressed it with a high price FA (arguably top 5 guard) and one of the best guard prospects to come around in a while as a top 10 pick.

I cant see how CJ and Locker dont have their best season together (no CJ wont get 2000, but hopefully for them they wont be in a position where they can play just to get him to that 2000). If it doesnt help them and they both suck, ill admit i was wrong, i just think that line had the potential to be GREAT which allows you to do a lot on offense
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"He won't be able to just use his arm power to throw defenders around at the next level!"

The hell he won't, lol.

Last edited by K Train : 07-11-2013 at 03:49 PM.
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