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Old 11-29-2013, 11:34 AM    (permalink
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The 2nd season starting as QB is usually quite difficult because teams have the entire offseason to watch film on you. If he improves on these numbers I'm hooked, lined, and sinkered, I really hope he does btw. I remember on most his scouting reports when he came out of college, almost each and every one noted the WRs dropped a lot of passes.

As far as the draft goes I agree with DeadEagle, I was a pass rusher early and keep our fingers crossed we can get a good OT in the second or third.

The thing I can't wrap my head around now is where does the team go now as far as HC and GM. If Glennon turns out to be a player Mark Domink has brought a lot of talent to the team these past 2 seasons, however he has had some notable high draft misses which can hinder teams for years........ So what does the team do now as far GM and HC?
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Old 11-29-2013, 04:28 PM    (permalink
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I don't like Dom as a talent evaluator in terms of building through the draft. It's no surprise the drafting got here when Eric stokes took over as director of college scouting in 2012. He helped scout the legion of boom in Seattle and did extensive hw and promoted Wilson to the Seahawks before taking the promotion in Tampa.

Dude is going to be a top GM candidate some day. I hope we go with him moving forward and do what Atlanta did with McKay with Dom. Dom s a numbers guy. Not a talent evaluator.
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Old 12-04-2013, 03:21 PM    (permalink
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What I'd want to do in FA/draft:

- go hard after DE Greg Hardy. Steal him from a division rival.
- cut ties with Penn and Nicks.
- sign DT BJ Raji.

Draft:
1st: jake Matthews T. Texas am.
2nd: Austin s. Jenkins te Washington.
4th: Brandon cooks wr Oregon state
5th : Andrew norwell G Ohio state.
6th: Marcus smith de Louisville
7th : dontae Johnson cb NC state
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Old 12-05-2013, 12:01 PM    (permalink
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Assuming Mark Dominick is still the GM I don't see us taking a offensive lineman in the first round. Have we even drafted a offensive lineman since he has taken over? Now if everyone is fired I can see Matthews as the pick if we are picking at 5.
Hardy would be nice. I don't think he leaves Carolina though, they don't have a lot of pending free agents, he will be their top priority.
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Old 12-05-2013, 03:08 PM    (permalink
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Have we even drafted a offensive lineman since he has taken over?
Xavier Fulton in 2009.
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Old 12-07-2013, 12:12 AM    (permalink
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Bucs need to tank now to still have a shot at Clowney. This is not a good year for DE in this draft class. I think they roll with Glennon atleast to start 2014. Good chance they still take a QB at some point in the draft but not early.
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Old 12-07-2013, 02:21 AM    (permalink
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Good chance they still take a QB at some point in the draft but not early.
I disagree with the idea that they'll draft a quarterback at all.

They need to bring in a veteran who can challenge Glennon and push him to get better. A late round rookie isn't going to do that.
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Old 12-10-2013, 08:26 AM    (permalink
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As of this post, the Bucs would select with the #9 overall pick in the 2014 Draft.


At that point, I think the bulk of the elite players in the draft would be scooped up. Thoughts on what the Bucs might do at #9?



I have Bridgewater, Clowney, Barr, Evans, Mack, Matthews and Hundley go before we pick..... then who?
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Old 12-10-2013, 09:14 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadEagle View Post
As of this post, the Bucs would select with the #9 overall pick in the 2014 Draft.


At that point, I think the bulk of the elite players in the draft would be scooped up. Thoughts on what the Bucs might do at #9?



I have Bridgewater, Clowney, Barr, Evans, Mack, Matthews and Hundley go before we pick..... then who?
Sammy lee Watkins.
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Old 12-10-2013, 02:31 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadEagle View Post
As of this post, the Bucs would select with the #9 overall pick in the 2014 Draft.


At that point, I think the bulk of the elite players in the draft would be scooped up. Thoughts on what the Bucs might do at #9?



I have Bridgewater, Clowney, Barr, Evans, Mack, Matthews and Hundley go before we pick..... then who?
Taylor Lewan, he is war tested and that play that made Clowney famous against Michigan it appears the guard was supposed to block him. He also held Clowney sackless when Clowney was coming off that monster game against Clemson, I know he isn't a world renown run blocker but he provides an upgrade vs Penn.
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Old 12-10-2013, 04:09 PM    (permalink
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Taylor Lewan, he is war tested and that play that made Clowney famous against Michigan it appears the guard was supposed to block him. He also held Clowney sackless when Clowney was coming off that monster game against Clemson, I know he isn't a world renown run blocker but he provides an upgrade vs Penn.
He's also struggled this year and part of me thinks he's more of a RT.
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Old 12-11-2013, 04:03 PM    (permalink
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If we are picking 9 I would hope we could trade back. Then you have Trent Murphy, Ebron, Amaro, Bortles as possibilities. If we stay at 9 I'd guess Watkins, Evans or Mack.
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Old 12-12-2013, 11:04 AM    (permalink
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Its sucks we are going to miss out on Matthews and the 2 pass rushers, if we can't get some help on the D Line, Offensive line may be our biggest need next. Carolina has sacked Glennon 7 times this season(in 2 games), Atlanta 5times(in 2 games), Detroit 4 times in one game, and we still have a games against San Fran and at New Orleans. Yikes
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Old 12-14-2013, 01:30 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by DeadEagle View Post
As of this post, the Bucs would select with the #9 overall pick in the 2014 Draft.


At that point, I think the bulk of the elite players in the draft would be scooped up. Thoughts on what the Bucs might do at #9?



I have Bridgewater, Clowney, Barr, Evans, Mack, Matthews and Hundley go before we pick..... then who?
Really? All the elite players are taken after 9.

If we go with defense- Timmy Jernigan, Louis Nix III, Stephon Tuitt and C.J. Mosley will be sitting there at 9.

If we go offense- Marqise Lee, Sammy Watkins, Eric Ebron and Taylor Lewan

If we at 9 have no impact defensive players I would have no problem drafting Watkins or Lee and having the best WR core in the league and going Dline in round 2 and 4.
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Old 12-15-2013, 09:49 AM    (permalink
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Really? All the elite players are taken after 9.

If we go with defense- Timmy Jernigan, Louis Nix III, Stephon Tuitt and C.J. Mosley will be sitting there at 9.

If we go offense- Marqise Lee, Sammy Watkins, Eric Ebron and Taylor Lewan

If we at 9 have no impact defensive players I would have no problem drafting Watkins or Lee and having the best WR core in the league and going Dline in round 2 and 4.
Blake Bortles is a guy I've come to like a lot throughout the draft process. He's come along way developed as a qb prospect. I had him as a late 1st early 2nd going into this year and he really took the next step.

I've been impressed by glennon a lot. But I think bortles is a talent I'd not pass up on.
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Old 12-17-2013, 12:23 AM    (permalink
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How in the blue hell does this.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadEagle View Post
the bulk of the elite players in the draft
... get interpreted as this....

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbuc View Post
Really? All the elite players are taken after 9.
Yes. Really. Really. Most..... MOST (ie, the "bulk of") the elite prospects in the draft will get taken in the first 8 picks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbuc View Post
If we go with defense- Timmy Jernigan, Louis Nix III, Stephon Tuitt and C.J. Mosley will be sitting there at 9.

If we go offense- Marqise Lee, Sammy Watkins, Eric Ebron and Taylor Lewan

If we at 9 have no impact defensive players I would have no problem drafting Watkins or Lee and having the best WR core in the league and going Dline in round 2 and 4.

Not a bad pack.....


Seems like a forming consensus might be..... Sammy Watkins, WR, Clemson in Round 1.... followed by Trent Murphy, DE, Stanford ....and then Anthony Steen, G, 'Bama at the top of Round 4... and Cameron Fleming, OT, Stanford in Round 5.


I'd actually love to see us spend the coin in FA on the DL (say some combo of, Ziggy Hood or Jared Allen or Greg Hardy or Brian Orakpo or Jason Worilds), so that we could go get Austin Sefarian-Jenkins in Round 2 instead, and get the blocks to a truly dangerous offense to go along with a real good defense.
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Old 12-18-2013, 03:16 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
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Yes. Really. Really. Most..... MOST (ie, the "bulk of") the elite prospects in the draft will get taken in the first 8 picks.








.
In the last five drafts. Impact players taken at 9 or later.

2009- B.J. Raji, Michael Crabtree, Brian Orakpo, Malcolm Jenkins, Brian Cushing, Alex Mack, Percy Harvin, Vontae Davis, Clay Matthews, Hakeem Nicks

2010- C.J. Spiller, Anthony Davis, Earl Thomas, Jason Pierre-Paul, Mike Iupati, Maurkice Pouncey, Sean Weatherspoon, Demaryius Thomas, Dez Bryant

2011-Tyron Smith, J.J. Watt, Nick Fairley, Robert Quinn, Mike Pouncey, Ryan Kerrigan, Nate Solder, Corey Liuget, Phil Taylor, Jimmy Smith, Muhammad Wilkerson, Cameron Heyward

2012-Luke Kuechly, Dontari Poe, Fletcher Cox, Bruce Irvin, Kendall Wright, Chandler Jones, David DeCastro, Whitney Mercilus, Kevin Zeitler, Harrison Smith, Doug Martin

2013-Chance Warmack, D.J. Fluker, Sheldon Richardson, Star Lotulelei, Kenny Vaccaro, Eric Reid, Kyle Long, Cordarrelle Patterson, DeAndre Hopkins, Xavier Rhodes


Now if you said elite QB prospects would be gone in the first 8 picks I wouldn't have had a problem with it. But with what I just showed you. You can get great NFL players anywhere in the first round. Some of those names I put up just aren't good, they might be the best in the league at what they do.

So drafting 9 they'll still be at least 10 players that are going to be very good to great. It's up to our front office to find them. But they will be there.
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Old 12-18-2013, 08:49 AM    (permalink
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There is a major difference between "elite prospect" and "impactful NFL player". I suggest you inform yourself before going any further.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbuc View Post
In the last five drafts. Impact players taken at 9 or later.

2009- B.J. Raji, Michael Crabtree, Brian Orakpo, Malcolm Jenkins, Brian Cushing, Alex Mack, Percy Harvin, Vontae Davis, Clay Matthews, Hakeem Nicks

2010- C.J. Spiller, Anthony Davis, Earl Thomas, Jason Pierre-Paul, Mike Iupati, Maurkice Pouncey, Sean Weatherspoon, Demaryius Thomas, Dez Bryant

2011-Tyron Smith, J.J. Watt, Nick Fairley, Robert Quinn, Mike Pouncey, Ryan Kerrigan, Nate Solder, Corey Liuget, Phil Taylor, Jimmy Smith, Muhammad Wilkerson, Cameron Heyward

2012-Luke Kuechly, Dontari Poe, Fletcher Cox, Bruce Irvin, Kendall Wright, Chandler Jones, David DeCastro, Whitney Mercilus, Kevin Zeitler, Harrison Smith, Doug Martin

2013-Chance Warmack, D.J. Fluker, Sheldon Richardson, Star Lotulelei, Kenny Vaccaro, Eric Reid, Kyle Long, Cordarrelle Patterson, DeAndre Hopkins, Xavier Rhodes


Now if you said elite QB prospects would be gone in the first 8 picks I wouldn't have had a problem with it. But with what I just showed you. You can get great NFL players anywhere in the first round. Some of those names I put up just aren't good, they might be the best in the league at what they do.

So drafting 9 they'll still be at least 10 players that are going to be very good to great. It's up to our front office to find them. But they will be there.

None of those guys you listed were "elite prospects" at the time they were drafted.



And yes. There will be very good players available when we pick. Always are.
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Old 12-18-2013, 11:28 AM    (permalink
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Elite prospects if I were to use the term would be for guys like John Elway, Andrew Luck, Orlando Pace, Calvin Johnson, Herschel Walker etc etc etc....

Sometimes drafts don't have that type of player. The only two players that could hold a elite prospect grade in this draft would be Jadeveon Clowney and maybe Anthony Barr. And I don't know if I'd put them in that " Elite " area.
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Old 12-19-2013, 07:03 AM    (permalink
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Now the train is back on the tracks. The elite players in this draft consist of Matthews, Clowney and maybe Barr as a 3-4 OLB.

And back to the original statement..... we're gonna miss out of them picking at 9. Granted now were a little closer, but we'd still miss on them..... which was the point of the question.
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Old 12-19-2013, 11:37 AM    (permalink
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Barr falls to us in espn mock that's up now. Wishful thinking but you never know with the draft.
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Old 12-19-2013, 12:14 PM    (permalink
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Is Barr too raw? He has elite quickness and athleticism but what's the difference between he and say a Gholston and a Von Miller.

Both were very athletic with good measurables and minus Miller's issues off the field, it seemed that they were going to excel in the NFL pre NFL Draft. We know VG flopped, VM dominated. How can you tell which one Barr is more similar to or is that the whole science of the draft?

Also the kid from Mizzou Ealy has pretty good quickness and I like his frame but I want to see his 40 and more so the 1st 10 yards than anything.

(Always with the DL this guy *points to self*)
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Old 12-22-2013, 01:27 PM    (permalink
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My desire for an offensive tackle in the first round climbs with each passing week. Donald Penn is ******* horrible.

At this point, I don't understand how any sane person can say we need a defensive end more than we need a tackle, because any starting quarterback we end up trying to groom is going to end up like David Carr with this joke of a line.
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Old 12-22-2013, 03:04 PM    (permalink
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Just to drive the point home... Donald Penn was responsible for 6 sacks, 8 hurries and 4 hits. And that's just from today.

Defensive end my ass. If we don't draft an offensive tackle, I am going to be so angry.
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Old 12-22-2013, 09:01 PM    (permalink
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You're right. Quinn is a beast, but Penn is an absolute slob. Da'Quan Bowers could have run through Penn for 3 sacks today.


Jake Matthews vaulted to a nearly ironclad lock at the top of the Bucs' draft big board.
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