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Old 01-07-2014, 09:43 AM    (permalink
brasho
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Legacy View Post
The reverse is true, too. Drafting a quarterback only to let Penn get him murdered is pointless.

And Glennon isn't "no QB." He finished his rookie season with one of the best rookie QB ratings ever. The guy has earned the chance to play for the starting job next season.

Draft protection this year, give that protection time to mature, because rookie tackles tend to struggle, then, assuming Glennon isn't getting it done, go into the 2015 draft looking for the franchise QB.
So you didn't watch the games then? You know, when Glennon built up his ratings in garbage time continually making the safe play checking down time and time again. Glennon held onto the ball far too long instead of throwing it away and not killing drives single-handedly. Did he do a pretty good job for a rookie? Absolutely, but he did absolutely nothing to convince me he has what it takes to be a franchise QB. Having good stats while playing in the last ranked offense in the NFL should tell you something, right? Having the full support and love from a defensive minded coach, and worst minds in football, Greg Schiano, shouldn't be much of a vote of confidence either.

How did the Dolphins picking up Jake Long over Matt Ryan help them? Wonder if they wish they could go back and change their selection. Hell, Matt Ryan has had Turnstile Sam Baker as his LT.

Do you think Joe Thomas has been the huge difference maker for the Browns they were hoping for?

The fact is, the Steelers, Bears, Packers, and Falcons have won a ton of regular season games and a good number of postseason games with some of the worst offensive lines ever assembled. The Bucs Oline is/was better than their units usually were/are. The big difference is they have competent QBs, we don't.

Drafting Jake Matthews, or any other LT prospect, would be a giant mistake, if the team thinks there MIGHT be a potential franchise QB available. You don't just plan on drafting a franchise guy the next year if Glennon struggles, you plan to succeed, you play to win, next year the Bucs hopefully won't be any where close to the top of the draft and able to get an elite talent at QB. Whether they believe in Bridgewater enough to go get him, or Bortles, or Carr or Manziel are picked in their slot, it would be a major upgrade over Glennon.

And just in case there are people in NFL circles that think Glennon has a promising NFL future, I'm sure he has pretty good trade value. I would say he is worth at least as much as Matt Schaub was when the Falcons traded him to the Texans and at least as much as Kevin Kolb had. Glennon is probably worth a 2nd round pick because somebody out there probably thinks they can work with him and his noodle-armed, folding under pressure, no mobility having skinny self.

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Old 01-07-2014, 09:57 AM    (permalink
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If I took the best 5 OTs of the past 10 years and counted all of their Super Bowl wins it would take 2 fingers... both wins were OVER 10 years ago. Now if I take the 5 best QBs of the past 10 years and counted their Super Bowl wins I would run out of hands.

You give us a franchise QB and we can protect him with one of the schlubs from Manning's Colts or Big Ben's Steelers and we'll win Super Bowls.
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Old 01-07-2014, 10:30 AM    (permalink
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I agree drafting a LT with a high pick would be a big mistake, we got to give Glennon a pass though. No speed at WR with the long developing plays, no Doug Martin, not much of a TE although Wright had a few good games, swiss cheese oline doesn't really help out your rookie QB.
I'm not sold on Glennon and wouldn't mind drafting a QB early but I do think Glennon still has some potential to develop into a good QB.

I would love a Julio Jones Atlanta type of draft day trade for us this year giving us an additional number 1 next year to move up for a QB and rolling with Glennon this year.
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Old 01-07-2014, 11:54 AM    (permalink
brasho
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I would love to see Glennon packaged in a deal to move up and get Bridgewater.
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Old 01-07-2014, 10:42 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by bucfan12 View Post
Penn is not terrible.
We are talking about the same Donald Penn, right? The fat slob that usually stands to the left? That guy? Letting defensive end after defensive end trot around his wideass? That Donald Penn!?

If you can't see that guy has turned into one of the league's absolute bums at LT.... you have no business evaluating, or even discussing, football. That simple. Take off the rosy glasses, and call the spade exactly what it is. In this case, a giant pile of crap.

More than the mental lapses, the poor footwork, rapidly declining quickness.... the thing that bothers me about Donald Penn.... is that he doesn't even care to compete anymore. That pile of crap has lost the will to stink.


I, for one, am done with him.


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So you didn't watch the games then?
And I'm wonderin' the same thing about your cocky ass in regards to Penn. WTF are you looking at?



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How did the Dolphins picking up Jake Long over Matt Ryan help them? Wonder if they wish they could go back and change their selection. Hell, Matt Ryan has had Turnstile Sam Baker as his LT.

Matt Ryan looked like a rookie out there.... because he had no protection. Sam Baker allowing heat on Ryan is a major reason that franchise hasn't won a Super Bowl the last 4 years. And Matt Ryan would not have turned around the Dolphins due to David Carr syndrome there. Jake Long was a good prospect, not a decade-type. 2014 is a totally different situation. Your flaccid point.... is moot.

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Do you think Joe Thomas has been the huge difference maker for the Browns they were hoping for?

I can't tell if that's a rhetorical question, because it's so idiotic, or if you really don't know. Given the state of the rest of your posts around here lately, I'm defaulting to the latter.

Joe Thomas is off to a Hall of Fame-esque career at LT.

What the shame in Cleveland has been, is that they haven't had anyone in that zip code be able to evaluate and find a QB to play behind this guys' excellent play.


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Drafting Jake Matthews, or any other LT prospect, would be a giant mistake
...... there you have it folks, in black and white. I can't even make that up.

Let me translate, for those late to the party.....

"Do not draft a potential Hall of Fame type prospect at LT, because mediocre QB's are better for the team. "



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Originally Posted by brasho View Post
, if the team thinks there MIGHT be a potential franchise QB available.

There are no franchise QB's available in this draft. Period. End of discussion.


And for you homers about to bring out your flame throwers..... don't bother. Deep down, you know that is a true statement. Bridgewater, Bortles, Manziel and whatever other QB you wanna throw out there from this draft....... is not going to be in the top half of QB's in this league in 2014.... 2016..... or 2018 or later. Their ceilings are much lower. Do the math. Or bite on this, and make me ram that fact right down your throat. Try me.


Matthews? Well..... he's one of the most technically sound LT's to come around in awhile.

Here is the league Jake is in..... the other OT's I'd have taken ahead of him the last 15-16 years:

Orlando Pace
Walter Jones
Chris Samuels
D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Joe Thomas

.... and he's on par with these two, grade wise, and I'd could argue one over the other, but they're close:

Matt Kalil
Bryant McKinnie


When you have a chance to add a player to your roster..... that has a chance at being one of the league's best at his position for a generation..... especially at one of the premier positions (ie - QB, LT, DE & CB).... YOU DO IT!! Matthews is going to be a top LT in the NFL for a decade, and none of the QB's are even Pro-Bowl material. This..... is what we like to call a no-brainer.


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The fact is, the Steelers, Bears, Packers, and Falcons have won a ton of regular season games and a good number of postseason games with some of the worst offensive lines ever assembled. The Bucs Oline is/was better than their units usually were/are. The big difference is they have competent QBs, we don't.

You don't just plan on drafting a franchise guy the next year if Glennon struggles, you plan to succeed, you play to win, next year the Bucs hopefully won't be any where close to the top of the draft and able to get an elite talent at QB. Whether they believe in Bridgewater enough to go get him, or Bortles, or Carr or Manziel are picked in their slot, it would be a major upgrade over Glennon.

And just in case there are people in NFL circles that think Glennon has a promising NFL future, I'm sure he has pretty good trade value. I would say he is worth at least as much as Matt Schaub was when the Falcons traded him to the Texans and at least as much as Kevin Kolb had. Glennon is probably worth a 2nd round pick because somebody out there probably thinks they can work with him and his noodle-armed, folding under pressure, no mobility having skinny self.


What kind of video game circle logic is this!? Has fantasy football warped minds this badly? Holy **** Batman. It's decisions like that, that land franchises like this, in situations that we're in.


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Well, we could trade, then we could shine up real nice, Madden says 98 rating, then Super Bowl.

Stop typing. For our damn sanity.... stop your fricken' typing.


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That all said....... we probably have no shot at acquiring Matthews, or the pick needed to get him. But if we could..... no brainer. Anyone saying otherwise.... you question his head.
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Old 01-08-2014, 08:44 PM    (permalink
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Sammy Watkins in round 1. Zach Mettenburgh or Brett smith in round 2?

Btw dead eagle, glennon had one of the best pass protections in the league. His avg time of drop back was 4.25 seconds. So much for a terrible oline right? Makes me think it's the signal caller holding the rock too long.
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Old 01-08-2014, 10:47 PM    (permalink
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Flawed stat.

And if you can't figure out why, it's a waste of my time making you see the light.
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Old 01-09-2014, 05:30 AM    (permalink
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Flawed stat.

And if you can't figure out why, it's a waste of my time making you see the light.
Glendon's avg sack happened at 4.25 seconds drop back. You're telling me that's a flawed stat?

Penn is not great but not terrible. You can win with him another year til you either replace him or move Dotson over. We need a qb. Plain and simple. Glennon isn't the answer. When your team is too 7 in TO ratio and your offense isn't capitalizing you have a problem. Yes sully sucked but he's not a football idiot. A lot of the times it reflects on what he has to work with.

Glennon is a great back up. He just didn't wow me. He'll get his chance to compete but 9/10 chance it's a new drafted rookie.
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Old 01-09-2014, 09:01 AM    (permalink
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Glendon's avg sack happened at 4.25 seconds drop back. You're telling me that's a flawed stat?
That's exactly what I'm telling you. Think about why that might be, and maybe you'll get it. It requires taking off the rosy glasses, if that's even possible for you, to understand.


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Penn is not great but not terrible. You can win with him another year til you either replace him or move Dotson over. We need a qb. Plain and simple. Glennon isn't the answer. When your team is too 7 in TO ratio and your offense isn't capitalizing you have a problem. Yes sully sucked but he's not a football idiot. A lot of the times it reflects on what he has to work with.

Glennon is a great back up. He just didn't wow me. He'll get his chance to compete but 9/10 chance it's a new drafted rookie.

Again, you're wrong, and seeing the wrong things. Sit down, son, you're going to get an education.


The major reason you think you see what you see, is.... well, was...... Sullivan's offense and playcalling. His book calls for a lot of 5 and 7 step drops in the passing game with the QB taking a lot of snaps directly under center, so to give time for deep crossing routes, 9 routes and double moves. Those dropbacks, even at first set (when the QB plants his back foot), is 3 to 4 seconds. That means pressure is arriving at the set. You watch Manning/Brees, and why is seems they do so well..... not 7 step drops. Their calls are a lot of 2 and 3 step drops. Cripes, Manning is notorious for a 3 step drop, lasting all of 2-2.5 seconds and ripping a pass for 30 yards. Why? Quick move by the WR, a soft touch on the pass and yards after catch. Back to the Bucs.


Glennon's passer rating, with a clean pocket, is over 110. With pressure in his face, or forcing him to scramble, 75. For the year, a rating of 83. with 60% completions and a 6.4 YPA. You know what case study that actually compares to, and why I am right? Nick Foles. In 2012, Nick Foles had a similar set of drop backs in that offense that resulted in a 115 to 75 rating gap on clean pocket v. pressure that resulted in a rating of 79 with 60% completions and a 6.2 YPA. His team then drafted an OT and picking up 2 TE's is a similar path to what many are saying we need to do. Myself included. The result? The new offense, fresh with quick passes, slants, screens and a lot under 10 yards with 3 step drops from center and 2 steps from the gun resulted in a rating of over 119 for the season with 64% completions and a YPA of over 9.

So how do you allow a cleaner pocket? Quick passing. No long drop backs. Let your athletes at WR & TE get the yards. They get paid too. It worked wonders for Foles, and can for Glennon.


If Tedford is truly a genius, this offense will revolve around the quick pass, slants, 5-10 hooks, outs and crossing, putting the WR's, TE's and backs in position for yards after catch. Glennon has the ability to have that kind of turn around, but it's up to Tedford to put him in the position to do it.


But we need to get a whole new left side of our OL. Penn's only redeeming quality is in the run game, but even that's mediocre. His pass pro, is amongst the bottom 7 LT's in the game. He can be replaced. He should be replaced. He needs to be replaced. And we need consistent guard play on that left side. I know we tried with Carl Nicks, but that ship has sailed. He's done too.
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Old 01-09-2014, 09:07 AM    (permalink
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Carl Nicks and Davin Joseph are all but gone. Nicks with the injury looks done and Joseph is horrible, I got sucked into the Joseph pro bowl hype but he really is a below avg guard. Not to mention both are among the highest paid guards in the league. Penn had a down year but he still graded out middle of the pack, like brasho and bucfan have said he's not great but not bad either.
The top 4 LT's from last years draft have all struggled (granted Joekel was hurt most of the year) this years draft is deep at LT, no need to take one with the first pick.
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Old 01-09-2014, 09:32 AM    (permalink
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Deadeagle you are making the case why LT is an overvalued position. If we are going to have a lot of quick short underneath plays in Tedford's offense then why spend a first round pick on a LT when there are gaping holes at DE, TE, OG and speed at WR (a WR who can actually run short/underneath routes and get YAC)? And you want to trade up to number two to get one? At what cost? LMAO at "sit down son you are about to get an education"...

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Old 01-09-2014, 11:30 AM    (permalink
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[quote=DeadEagle;3540450]
Stop typing. For our damn sanity.... stop your fricken' typing.


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QUOTE]

Cocky attitude? Just described yourself, buddy. You are so full of yourself it is ridiculous... so full of yourself that you intentionally atrributed a completely incorrect quote to me:

HTML Code:
Well, we could trade, then we could shine up real nice, Madden says 98 rating, then Super Bowl.
You have ZERO integrity.

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Old 01-09-2014, 11:32 AM    (permalink
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Glendon's avg sack happened at 4.25 seconds drop back. You're telling me that's a flawed stat?

Penn is not great but not terrible. You can win with him another year til you either replace him or move Dotson over. We need a qb. Plain and simple. Glennon isn't the answer. When your team is too 7 in TO ratio and your offense isn't capitalizing you have a problem. Yes sully sucked but he's not a football idiot. A lot of the times it reflects on what he has to work with.

Glennon is a great back up. He just didn't wow me. He'll get his chance to compete but 9/10 chance it's a new drafted rookie.
Glennon took a sack once on a little over 10 pass attempts. By comparison, much better QBs, Manning for instance, in their rookie years, took far fewer sacks. Manning had nearly half as many sacks on over 150 more throws. More importantly, Manning led the 12th ranked offense in the NFL, Glennon the 32nd. Why? Because he knew when to get rid of the ball. He didn't take sacks constantly.
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Old 01-09-2014, 12:25 PM    (permalink
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There are no franchise QB's available in this draft. Period. End of discussion.
.
Maybe so, in your not at all humble opinion. I feel Bridgewater is a definite franchise QB in the future. I like his ceiling. I think he's going to be excellent. I think Bortles has a ton of potential and could certainly be very good. Manziel and Carr I'm not so sure about, but they both have talent and could be excellent down the road. For you to attempt say anything definitely about the QBs in this draft just further illustrates how truly pompous and arrogant you are.... it is, simply because you say so... whatever.

I didn't say Matthews isn't a great prospect, only that you can certainly win without a top LT but it is much harder to do without a good QB.
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Old 01-09-2014, 12:39 PM    (permalink
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Also, it means that we gotta look at a slot-WR. I like High-Top, but he ain't cutting it. Jackson, and a healthy Williams are an ok tandem, but we need a TE and a third WR.



As far as pre-March moves, cutting Da'Quan Bowers, Derek Landri and Gabe Carimi brings an instant $4.1mil in cap savings, putting us roughly $17mil under the projected cap. Enough money to really get started in free agency.

Our biggest needs are on the OL (T, LG & RG), a pass rushing DE, WR (that can move Williams to #3, or a slot WR), DT (1tech) and a SLB.


Free Agency

Jared Allen, 32, DE, Vikings - He is on the downside of his career, but I believe he still has good football left in him. With Leslie Frazier here, the familiarity could be a good lure. Part of his decline, has been Kevin Williams' play falling apart next to him, but here he'd have an ascending Gerald McCoy to play next to. With that, I think he can still be a 12-15 sack/yr player for a couple years. His contract demands are likely in the $10-12mil/yr range, but might be had a little less than that. If his production is back to his average for 2-3 years, it buys us that time to keep looking for a pass rusher at DE to take that spot down the road.

Michael Oher, 28, OT, Ravens - Career at a crossroads? Maybe. But I like what he brings to the table, and the flexibility he provides at OT for us. What I mean by that is, that he could step in at RT and do a solid job running and passing. That frees up Demar Dotson to slide over to LT and compete with a draft pick there. One signing, two position potentially solved. His contract demands are likely in the $6-7mil/yr area, and will probably sign for such.

Linval Joseph, 26, DT, NY Giants - He is a big body at 320+lbs that can stop the run well and collapse the pocket on occasion. To play between McCoy and Clayborn, he'd be a natural fit and in a great situation. His contract demands are likely in the $1.5-2mil/yr area, and that's a great bargain.


To make room for Oher and Joseph, Donald Penn could be cut with a cap savings of $4mil right away. Cut Carl Nicks after June 1, and we save about $3.5mil. That would create some dead money on the 2015 season cap, but it's best. Cutting him right away, and it costs us money up front, to the tune of $3mil. He's just got too much of that signing bonus left, and we have to defer it a little.

If we're creative enough, like say, using a signing bonus up front for Allen with a low base salary this year, with a higher base later (Penn alone creates about an $8mil/yr gap over the next 2 seasons)... it could work out quite easily.


Draft

R1 - Sammy Watkins, WR, Clemson
R2 - Austin Seferian-Jenkins, TE, Wash
R4 - James Hurst, OT, UNC
R5 - Spencer Long, LG, Nebraska
R7 - Tevin Reese, WR, Baylor


So, with needs filled in free agency, the draft could simply come right to us. There's a couple ways we could go, but I think this is best..... overall. Watkins and Reese give us instant explosion to go with Williams' and Jacksons' possession ability. Watkins would slide outside, moving Williams to slot, with Reese becoming a #4. At 6'6", Seferian-Jenkins provides a huge endzone threat and a complement to Tim Wright. Hurst and Long both had injuries late in their seasons', but they are both NFL players. Hurst has LT ability, especially in the pass game. His feet are nimble and he can lock on well. Not a punishing run blocker, just adequate. Long, he's a bull. A run technician who uses positioning very well. Good size, and he can block on the run pulling. Hurst and Long could then be in an open competition on the left side with Demar Dotson and Jamon Meredith. And I'd be fine with whichever combination wins that.



The good news is, all these moves still leaves us in good shape for 2015, 2016 and 2017. If we have to re-sigh McCoy, Clayborn, David, Foster, Barron or any other player that pops up, we can.
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Old 01-09-2014, 01:14 PM    (permalink
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Cocky attitude? Just described yourself, buddy. You are so full of yourself it is ridiculous... so full of yourself that you intentionally atrributed a completely incorrect quote to me:

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Well, we could trade, then we could shine up real nice, Madden says 98 rating, then Super Bowl.
You have ZERO integrity.
Can't put anything past you, eh Sherlock.

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Maybe so, in your not at all humble opinion. I feel Bridgewater is a definite franchise QB in the future. I like his ceiling. I think he's going to be excellent. I think Bortles has a ton of potential and could certainly be very good. Manziel and Carr I'm not so sure about, but they both have talent and could be excellent down the road. For you to attempt say anything definitely about the QBs in this draft just further illustrates how truly pompous and arrogant you are.... it is, simply because you say so... whatever.

I didn't say Matthews isn't a great prospect, only that you can certainly win without a top LT but it is much harder to do without a good QB.

You are terrible at evaluating QB's. Your record on the topic is noted. I can footnote more, if you'd like to continue. Mere months after declaring and arguing vigorously that Freeman is a Top 7 or 10 QB in the NFL, he is on the precipice of not even being in the league. Nicely done. Then you have the balls to walk around here like you are some sort of savant. Pipe down, Rainman.


Bortles is a combination of Tim Tebow and Josh Freeman. I don't care how hot his girlfriend is, that isn't going to help him read defenses. In fact, she'll probably take up his time when he should be studying film on how to read defenses and shorten up that motion of his. Upside.... pfffft! He is a red flag. Carr... well... I'll side with the bloodlines. And they're on my side. Manziel, that guy is going to sell seats for awhile and be an attention magnet. He may succeed somewhere..... but in Tampa.... there's too much to get distracted with, especially with dozens of stripclubs and bars mere seconds drive from One Buc. Ask Raheem how easy those are to ignore. Johnny Football would be primed to turn into Johnny Redner if he comes here. No thanks. The others are footnotes.

And as far as Bridgewater, he has the best shot at NFL success. But even at best, he won't be among the top 15 QB's in the league 3 years from now. He's gonna be no better than Brady, Brees, Eli, Roethlisberger, Rodgers, Ryan, Kaepernick, Griffin, Rivers, Newton, Cutler, Flacco, Stafford, Foles, Wilson or Luck. That's 16 starting NFL QB's 3 years from now. All I would take before I took Bridgewater..... even at his ceiling. It doesn't include Romo, Geno Smith, Dalton, Bradford and Alex Smith... about what his ceiling is. So franchise guy? Nope.
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Old 01-09-2014, 11:32 PM    (permalink
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Deadeagle,

Wow. You really stunned me. Educated me. You're are the best talent evaluator I've seen since Newsome. We should hire you as our gm. Why haven't lovie and the glazers called?

Asshole.
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Old 01-10-2014, 10:09 AM    (permalink
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Can't put anything past you, eh Sherlock.




You are terrible at evaluating QB's. Your record on the topic is noted. I can footnote more, if you'd like to continue. Mere months after declaring and arguing vigorously that Freeman is a Top 7 or 10 QB in the NFL, he is on the precipice of not even being in the league. Nicely done. Then you have the balls to walk around here like you are some sort of savant. Pipe down, Rainman.


Bortles is a combination of Tim Tebow and Josh Freeman. I don't care how hot his girlfriend is, that isn't going to help him read defenses. In fact, she'll probably take up his time when he should be studying film on how to read defenses and shorten up that motion of his. Upside.... pfffft! He is a red flag. Carr... well... I'll side with the bloodlines. And they're on my side. Manziel, that guy is going to sell seats for awhile and be an attention magnet. He may succeed somewhere..... but in Tampa.... there's too much to get distracted with, especially with dozens of stripclubs and bars mere seconds drive from One Buc. Ask Raheem how easy those are to ignore. Johnny Football would be primed to turn into Johnny Redner if he comes here. No thanks. The others are footnotes.

And as far as Bridgewater, he has the best shot at NFL success. But even at best, he won't be among the top 15 QB's in the league 3 years from now. He's gonna be no better than Brady, Brees, Eli, Roethlisberger, Rodgers, Ryan, Kaepernick, Griffin, Rivers, Newton, Cutler, Flacco, Stafford, Foles, Wilson or Luck. That's 16 starting NFL QB's 3 years from now. All I would take before I took Bridgewater..... even at his ceiling. It doesn't include Romo, Geno Smith, Dalton, Bradford and Alex Smith... about what his ceiling is. So franchise guy? Nope.
Never ever claimed he was top 7 according to your link, liar. You have ZERO accountability and believability at this point.

And to think I actually once valued your opinions. Not that you don't have valid arguments regarding your scouting stances, but you are such an unbelievable prick and pompous ass that even if you were right (I was wrong about Freeman, sue me for wanting to believe in my QB who was in the middle of a hot streak) about your opinion, it wouldn't matter.

Say whatever you want. Have you not been wrong before? Also recently, I was right about Kaepernick even though 90% of the posters thought I was stupid for saying he would be a successful QB, I was right about Richardson definitely not being worth a top 10 pick and not being any more special than Doug Martin (whom I compared to Richardson BEFORE the draft). I was also dead wrong about Gerald McCoy and I'll happily admit that. It may have taken him four years to become an elite player, but he did it, and I'm happy as hell to be wrong about him. I was right about Chris Long being a far better prospect than Glenn Dorsey, Tyson Jackson, etc. Are we keeping score? I'm sure you've flopped on your face more times than you care to remember.

It's great that you can throw names around and tell people that they're stupid behind the safety of their keyboard. You've got a strong dose of internet courage to go with your holier-than-thou belief in yourself.
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Old 01-10-2014, 10:27 AM    (permalink
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Bortles is a combination of Tim Tebow and Josh Freeman. I don't care how hot his girlfriend is, that isn't going to help him read defenses. In fact, she'll probably take up his time when he should be studying film on how to read defenses and shorten up that motion of his. Upside.... pfffft! He is a red flag. Carr... well... I'll side with the bloodlines. And they're on my side. Manziel, that guy is going to sell seats for awhile and be an attention magnet. He may succeed somewhere..... but in Tampa.... there's too much to get distracted with, especially with dozens of stripclubs and bars mere seconds drive from One Buc. Ask Raheem how easy those are to ignore. Johnny Football would be primed to turn into Johnny Redner if he comes here. No thanks. The others are footnotes.

And as far as Bridgewater, he has the best shot at NFL success. But even at best, he won't be among the top 15 QB's in the league 3 years from now. He's gonna be no better than Brady, Brees, Eli, Roethlisberger, Rodgers, Ryan, Kaepernick, Griffin, Rivers, Newton, Cutler, Flacco, Stafford, Foles, Wilson or Luck. That's 16 starting NFL QB's 3 years from now. All I would take before I took Bridgewater..... even at his ceiling. It doesn't include Romo, Geno Smith, Dalton, Bradford and Alex Smith... about what his ceiling is. So franchise guy? Nope.
So Bortles is bad because you know he can't read defenses? Because all spread QBs can't read defenses? What proof do you have. His throwing motion, not the greatest, he drops down to the bottom of his rib cage at times, it's far shorter than Tebow's and Leftwich's.

You crossed Carr off because of his bloodlines. Brilliant move. If that were the case, Peyton and Eli never should have been drafted due to the Cooper's failure to ever become an elite QB. There have been tons of little brothers that were far better than their big brothers. That argument has ZERO merit.

No argument with Manziel, the kid's a player but he would scare me for the reasons mentioned.

So you wouldn't take Bridgewater in three years over Brady, Brees, Roethlisberger, Eli, Cutler, Rodgers... you realize three years is a long, long time. Brady, Brees, and Roethlisberger may very well be out of the league by then. Eli, Stafford, and Ryan are coming off their worst ever seasons and who knows what the future holds. Cutler and Rodgers aren't spring chickens either, and Cutler doesn't belong in ANY conversation about better QBs. Griffin had one excellent season....ONE... and there's no way of telling if he'll ever regain his magic or if it was a fluke.

Your assessments offer very little in terms of actual thought and knowledge of the players or positions.

Yeah, I thought Freeman was the 8th best QB in the NFL last season in November last year... at that time he was the 8th, he had just had 4 or 5 games with 100+ ratings in a row. The needle was pointing up. Nail me to a freaking cross for supporting the QB of my team. All you do is complain about everything, about what should've been done, but you never offer better solutions. Why isn't Pete Carmichael getting attention from teams looking for a head coach? Is it possible that the league knows something that you don't... NO WAY... you know everything, so sorry about that. Go back to telling everybody the way it is or should be.
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Old 01-10-2014, 10:55 AM    (permalink
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Funny that you hammer this out in one breath......

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Never ever claimed he was top 7 according to your link, liar. You have ZERO accountability and believability at this point.
... and then in the next, spit this nugget out.

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Yeah, I thought Freeman was the 8th best QB in the NFL last season.


...... accountability. Not what you think it means. Anyone who read the link, can see who's lying. But since you're taking both sides here, I guess that makes one of your posts right. Clever.



Listen pal, I get that you are butthurt that someone around here has the balls to call your hypocrisy to the floor, but take it like a man. And yeah... I've been wrong on prospects. But I will not ignore the reasons why I was wrong in the past and be so rigid in my logic to not apply it today. Think about that for a minute.
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:27 AM    (permalink
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Funny that you hammer this out in one breath......



... and then in the next, spit this nugget out.





...... accountability. Not what you think it means. Anyone who read the link, can see who's lying. But since you're taking both sides here, I guess that makes one of your posts right. Clever.



Listen pal, I get that you are butthurt that someone around here has the balls to call your hypocrisy to the floor, but take it like a man. And yeah... I've been wrong on prospects. But I will not ignore the reasons why I was wrong in the past and be so rigid in my logic to not apply it today. Think about that for a minute.
I actually busted my boy brasho bc we had our freeman debates. He took it like a man and admitted I was right.

You are a fool. Oher? Lol. Ravens don't want any part of him.

And please explain to me how 4.25 seconds is horrible reflection in penn? Merideth, Zuttah and Joseph have been terrible. TERRIBLE. We're keeping penn. we don't have a chance in hell of landing Matthews and sure as heck not trading up for anyone besides a qb.
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:28 AM    (permalink
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Lol bortles may not be a developed and refined qb but I see ZERO similarities to Tebow. Reminds me a lot of Roethlisbuerger but more accurate.
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Old 01-10-2014, 11:57 AM    (permalink
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Funny that you hammer this out in one breath......



... and then in the next, spit this nugget out.





...... accountability. Not what you think it means. Anyone who read the link, can see who's lying. But since you're taking both sides here, I guess that makes one of your posts right. Clever.



Listen pal, I get that you are butthurt that someone around here has the balls to call your hypocrisy to the floor, but take it like a man. And yeah... I've been wrong on prospects. But I will not ignore the reasons why I was wrong in the past and be so rigid in my logic to not apply it today. Think about that for a minute.
Yeah, you've got a ton of balls. It really takes balls to try to be an internet tough guy. Take it like a man? How many times do I need to say I was wrong about Freeman to prove I can take it like a man? You don't have balls, you're just a douchebag... do you want to own that truth like a man?

How am I taking both sides? I read the post... I ranked Freeman number 8 at that time... November 4, 2012... which at that point in the season it seemed fair.
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Old 01-10-2014, 01:55 PM    (permalink
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What I've learned from the Great and Almighty is that you absolutely CANNOT win with guys like Will Svitek, Chris Clark, Terron Armstead, or King Dunlap protecting your QB's blindside. The Buccaneers never won anything with Roman Oben or Derrick Deese (or even Pierson or whomever it was that was lining up in 1999 for them) as their LTs.

But if you have Matt Kalil, Jake Long, or Joe Thomas, you will be a big winner.
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Old 01-21-2014, 01:00 PM    (permalink
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Guys we as of right now have no clue where we are going in the draft. We need a GM, also cuts are coming. A lot to do before we know where we are looking. We do know somethings like, upgrading the pass rush, finding a QB and needing a 3rd ad 4th WR.
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