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Old 04-22-2014, 05:45 PM    (permalink
BuckeyeDan17
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Originally Posted by Jas View Post
Evidently you were also under the baseless assumption that you're funny.
Well, I'm not a gif master like Alex so perhaps you can provide one which illustrates someone walking away with their head down. A dog walking with a tail between its legs is probably fitting as well.
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:47 PM    (permalink
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If I pay them, can I touch them?
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Old 04-22-2014, 06:05 PM    (permalink
Jas
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Originally Posted by BuckeyeDan17 View Post
Well, I'm not a gif master like Alex so perhaps you can provide one which illustrates someone walking away with their head down. A dog walking with a tail between its legs is probably fitting as well.
There ya go ;)
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Old 04-22-2014, 06:06 PM    (permalink
Jas
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If I pay them, can I touch them?
And here's one for you my friend.

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Old 04-22-2014, 10:55 PM    (permalink
WCH
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Don't they make money off of personal appearances and calendar sales?
That was always my assumption, and it's why I don't feel bad for them. I know that a lot of minor league mascots earn more from personal appearances than they do from showing up at games.

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Old 04-22-2014, 11:23 PM    (permalink
Iamcanadian
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There is a lot rotten in sports and leagues are now wheeling from lawsuits and beginning to loose some. This is just another case of pro teams exploiting people, they did it to the players for years, so I'm not surprised they do it to cheerleaders as well.

The real problem is still at the college level where players are terribly abused and sooner or later, the courts will put it to the colleges and they too, will have to grow up or pay the consequences.
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:18 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BuckeyeDan17 View Post
Well, I'm not a gif master like Alex so perhaps you can provide one which illustrates someone walking away with their head down. A dog walking with a tail between its legs is probably fitting as well.
GIFs don't have the Charlie Brown sad music.
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Old 04-23-2014, 04:22 AM    (permalink
Jas
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That was always my assumption, and it's why I don't feel bad for them. I know that a lot of minor league mascots earn more from personal appearances than they do from showing up at games.
Did anyone actually read the article..lol.
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Old 04-23-2014, 04:33 AM    (permalink
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There is a lot rotten in sports and leagues are now wheeling from lawsuits and beginning to loose some. This is just another case of pro teams exploiting people, they did it to the players for years, so I'm not surprised they do it to cheerleaders as well.

The real problem is still at the college level where players are terribly abused and sooner or later, the courts will put it to the colleges and they too, will have to grow up or pay the consequences.
Thank you, exactly, the league and team owners are exploiting these women.

And for those who would say they knew what they signed on for, I guess you've never taken a job but felt like you should've been making more money or that you were being exploited by an employer?

Open the flood gates.
http://news.msn.com/us/5-former-buff...sue-over-pay-1
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Old 04-23-2014, 06:11 AM    (permalink
Halsey
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The players shouldn't be paid well because they make good money off of endorsement deals!

"but, but cheerleaders aren't the same as players!"

Doesn't matter. If you employ someone, you can pay them a reasonable wage.

"but, but they should have asked for more money before signing up!"

They have the right to ask for more money anytime they want. The players did. The refs did. The NFL wants a new TV deal every other year.
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Old 04-23-2014, 06:35 AM    (permalink
Jas
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The players shouldn't be paid well because they make good money off of endorsement deals!

"but, but cheerleaders aren't the same as players!"

Doesn't matter. If you employ someone, you can pay them a reasonable wage.

"but, but they should have asked for more money before signing up!"

They have the right to ask for more money anytime they want. The players did. The refs did. The NFL wants a new TV deal every other year.
Excellent points. You see the subtle influence the media and our culture has created surrounding women in the comments. Somehow it doesn't matter as much.

The fact is they actually don't make money off the endorsement deals or appearances.
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Old 04-23-2014, 08:53 AM    (permalink
badgerbacker
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Excellent points. You see the subtle influence the media and our culture has created surrounding women in the comments. Somehow it doesn't matter as much.

The fact is they actually don't make money off the endorsement deals or appearances.
Men can be cheerleaders, too. Stop being sexist.

This has nothing to do with gender. It doesn't matter as much because the position of cheerleader is unimportant. They add basically nothing to the game other than something interesting to look at and what they do add can be replaced by dressing up a trained animal in team colors.

Why is there so much competition for these spots if they are being exploited?

Edit: To sum up my thoughts: being a cheerleader is a volunteer position. I don't care if some of them actually are paid a little bit to compensate for the travel, hair or outfits or whatever, I still consider it a volunteer position.
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:47 PM    (permalink
Jas
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Men can be cheerleaders, too. Stop being sexist.

This has nothing to do with gender. It doesn't matter as much because the position of cheerleader is unimportant. They add basically nothing to the game other than something interesting to look at and what they do add can be replaced by dressing up a trained animal in team colors.

Why is there so much competition for these spots if they are being exploited?

Edit: To sum up my thoughts: being a cheerleader is a volunteer position. I don't care if some of them actually are paid a little bit to compensate for the travel, hair or outfits or whatever, I still consider it a volunteer position.
You just equated them with trained animals and I'm being sexist!!??

Sexist, lol. The fact is they don't have male cheerleaders in the NFL. If they did, I would hope they would be paid fairly as well.
Why is there so much competition for the spots, um Idk, why are there so many people willing to work in sweatshops?
My guess is they do what they do with the hopes of it leading to something else, in the entertainment field..modeling, acting, dancing.

But while they do it and while it exists, they should be compensated fairly, it's not a volunteer position, why would you consider it that, perhaps if you worked as hard as they do and got paid what they do, you'd understand.
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:52 PM    (permalink
badgerbacker
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You just equated them with trained animals and I'm being sexist!!??

Sexist, lol. The fact is they don't have male cheerleaders in the NFL. If they did, I would hope they would be paid fairly as well.
Why is there so much competition for the spots, um Idk, why are there so many people willing to work in sweatshops?
My guess is they do what they do with the hopes of it leading to something else, in the entertainment field..modeling, acting, dancing.

But while they do it and while it exists, they should be compensated fairly, it's not a volunteer position, why would you consider it that, perhaps if you worked as hard as they do and got paid what they do, you'd understand.
How much should Miss America contestants be paid?
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:54 PM    (permalink
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How much should Miss America contestants be paid?
Apples and oranges, thats a competition, this is a job.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:02 PM    (permalink
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Apples and oranges, thats a competition, this is a job.
The Miss America winner has job responsibilities. She has to go to charity events,parades, give speeches, and a lot of other stuff. They put in hours of practice, are judged by their physical appearance, and are not paid. It's very similar.

Don't insult volunteer work. A lot of volunteers work extremely hard.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:08 PM    (permalink
Jas
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Yes, the winner does have responsibilities but they technically don't get hired by an employer.
Your arguement has no logistical merit, you're just debating for the sake of debating.
And I never insulted volunteers, I've volunteered and unloaded trucks and filled bags with food for needy families, I know how much work it is, but I wasn't hired by anyone.
I went into it knowing it was volunteer work.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:10 PM    (permalink
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Yes, the winner does have responsibilities but they technically don't get hired by an employer.
Your arguement has no logistical merit, you're just debating for the sake of debating.
And I never insulted volunteers, I've volunteered and unloaded trucks and filled bags with food for needy families, I know how much work it is, but I wasn't hired by anyone.
I went into it knowing it was volunteer work.
And they go into it knowing EXACTLY what they will be compensated. If they were promised something different than they received, it'd be a different story.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:13 PM    (permalink
Jas
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So you go into a job getting paid a certain salary, and should never ever ask for a raise or to at least be paid minumum wage, meanwhile we have laws that state you have a right to that?

If it were up to you we'd still be in 1910 evidently..lol
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:21 PM    (permalink
badgerbacker
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So you go into a job getting paid a certain salary, and should never ever ask for a raise or to at least be paid minumum wage, meanwhile we have laws that state you have a right to that?

If it were up to you we'd still be in 1910 evidently..lol
If I'm hired as a seasonal employee for an agreed wage I have the right to ask for a raise, but that doesn't mean I can sue if the company doesn't want to give me one. If I think it's unfair, I'm free to pursue other opportunities.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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If I'm hired as a seasonal employee for an agreed wage I have the right to ask for a raise, but that doesn't mean I can sue if the company doesn't want to give me one. If I think it's unfair, I'm free to pursue other opportunities.
I think they absolutely have a right to sue for minumum wage and will more than likely get it or more. And yeah you can walk away and nothing gets done, and so much for progress, hows that gonna help?
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:33 PM    (permalink
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I think they absolutely have a right to sue for minumum wage and will more than likely get it or more. And yeah you can walk away and nothing gets done, and so much for progress, hows that gonna help?
I won't pretend to know the laws behind it, but in my opinion a person shouldn't be able to sue because they agreed to a deal they later thought was unfair.

Edit: Explain to me again, exactly, why it isn't a volunteer position? Because they work hard, was that it?
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:39 PM    (permalink
Jas
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I won't pretend to know the laws behind it, but in my opinion a person shouldn't be able to sue because they agreed to a deal they later thought was unfair.
Well there goes a century of labor laws we fought for out the window, we can all go back to working 7 days a week without weekends, and 12-18 hour days for almost no pay, and forget about workers comp and osha and medical leave and sick time and holidays..etc.
All of those things were originally not agreed upon but taken to courts and won by the people who found it unfair.

No not just because they work hard, because they were "hired" by an "employer" who is paying them below a legal standard.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:45 PM    (permalink
badgerbacker
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Well there goes a century of labor laws we fought for out the window, we can all go back to working 7 days a week without weekends, and 12-18 hour days for almost no pay, and forget about workers comp and osha and medical leave and sick time and holidays..etc.
All of those things were originally not agreed upon but taken to courts and won by the people who found it unfair.

No not just because they work hard, because they were "hired" by an "employer" who is paying them below a legal standard.
I've been "hired" as a volunteer to work for an "employer" in a hospital ER and wasn't paid anything.
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:49 PM    (permalink
Jas
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I've been "hired" as a volunteer to work for an "employer" in a hospital ER and wasn't paid anything.
You don't get hired, you volunteer and they don't give you a salary, so technically its not an employer.
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