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Old 12-29-2008, 07:22 PM    (permalink
ShutDwn
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Missed the whole game, I was in NY with family, but saw the last kick. Watching the scores on the little scroll and seeing them give up a 13 point lead in like two minutes was terrible

I finally saw highlights just now, I noticed we brought more people on blitzes. I think those plays will work better with our DTs back, hopefully we aren't idiotic enough to believe that them being back bolsters our pass rush enough not to bring more guys.

I can't say much about the game, but I can say that we have two amazing players in DeAngelo and Smith. Deangelo has been so fantastic it is rediculous, and Smith is always there for the clutch play.

Once Stewart gets more comfortable, it will be so incredible, I don't even know how to phrase it.
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Old 12-29-2008, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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Are the problems in the secondary due to talent or the coaches? They've looked pitiful more times than not this season and their play was key to New Orleans' near comeback. They just seem so disorganized on every snap.
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Old 12-29-2008, 11:36 PM    (permalink
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I think Drew Brees was a big part of the problem for our secondary, but I still think there are problems within our secondary. If you look at some of the passes Brees completed you just have to give him credit because a lot of the time he put the ball in the precise location it needed to be in. But that was not the case on every throw. Our secondary plays so far back from the receivers that we give up relatively few big plays but a lot of shorter receptions. Brees almost got the record, but didn't even complete a pass longer than 26 yards. While I understand the bend-but-don't-break philosophy, I still think we need to get the corners and safeties a bit closer to the receivers. I didn't notice it as much against the Saints but a lot of the time when it's 3rd and short, the corners will still play way off the receivers and the receivers will run a short pattern and get the first down. In situations like that we need to realize that the receivers are most likely running short routes to get the first down. Then we need to play up on them. If we just play two or three yards closer to the receivers, we might give up one long pass but we will prevent a lot of the shorter passes that have been killing us all season and it will help our defense.
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Old 12-30-2008, 02:12 PM    (permalink
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congrats on a great regular season and with your first round bye, you lot deserved with playing the game right (now we just have to find a way to win close games)
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Old 12-31-2008, 09:13 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstAndGoal View Post
I think Drew Brees was a big part of the problem for our secondary, but I still think there are problems within our secondary. If you look at some of the passes Brees completed you just have to give him credit because a lot of the time he put the ball in the precise location it needed to be in. But that was not the case on every throw. Our secondary plays so far back from the receivers that we give up relatively few big plays but a lot of shorter receptions. Brees almost got the record, but didn't even complete a pass longer than 26 yards. While I understand the bend-but-don't-break philosophy, I still think we need to get the corners and safeties a bit closer to the receivers. I didn't notice it as much against the Saints but a lot of the time when it's 3rd and short, the corners will still play way off the receivers and the receivers will run a short pattern and get the first down. In situations like that we need to realize that the receivers are most likely running short routes to get the first down. Then we need to play up on them. If we just play two or three yards closer to the receivers, we might give up one long pass but we will prevent a lot of the shorter passes that have been killing us all season and it will help our defense.
If those blitzes start to work, I saw a lot on the highlights, Marshall was a lot, and some linebackers, we will see the corners get tighter.

The pressure was decent in the highlights, Brees just held it together very well.
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Old 12-31-2008, 12:34 PM    (permalink
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The whole smash and dash thing is over

http://www.nameswecanbelievein.com/

I think it is pretty sweet that they are good friends. They should still be judges as a duo, and a fantastic duo at that. I remember at the beginning of the year how when the top duos were discussed, they were never given much mention. I admit I didn't see it coming either though, DeAngelo exploded.

Jonathon Stewart is such a good thing for DeAngelo, not in threatening his job but they play for each other it seems. Always supporting each other.

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80dc0085

I like what Smith said. Good stuff.
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Old 01-03-2009, 09:58 AM    (permalink
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Hey guys, theres a forum mock thats being set up if anybody is interested. There are still something like 12 GM spots available if people are interested.

For people that haven't participated in a forum mock in the past they should check it out, they are tons of fun.

Sign-up deadline is tonight, so try to hurry.


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Old 01-03-2009, 02:54 PM    (permalink
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I wish I could but I am pretty busy nowadays, just enough time to post and watch games.

Also, good fact here, DeAngelo has lost one fumble his entire career, and has a total of two.
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Old 01-03-2009, 06:14 PM    (permalink
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I'm excited about this team's playoff prospects with a roster that is, in my opinion, vastly more talented than the last two playoff teams the Panthers have fielded. With a steady dose of Stewart and Williams, commitment by the coaches to the running game, and solid game management by Delhomme; I think the sky really is the limit for what this team is able to do in the next few weeks.
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Old 01-05-2009, 03:28 PM    (permalink
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I'm feeling good about this week. People are saying that this game might be a really close game and are using the Cardinals win this weekend and the earlier matchup as evidence. Well I don't think either are good forecasts for this week's game. As for the Cardinals' win on Saturday, the reason they won is because they played at home. There is a huge difference between the home Cardinals and the road Cardinals. They went 6-2 at home in the regular season and 3-5 on the road, beating only the other lousy members of their own division. And the same can be said about the Falcons. A lot has been made about the Cardinals' ability to stop the run against the Falcons, but Turner only averaged 3.9 per carry on the road this year. Now they have to face DeAngelo Williams, who averaged 6.2 per carry at home. They won't be able to bottle him up like they did to Turner. The Cardinals are 0-4 on the East Coast, another stat that helps us. Also, it is supposed to be pretty cold on Saturday, which could be trouble for the team from Arizona. As for the game earlier in the season between these teams, you can't really count that either. The Panthers are a much better offensive team now than they were in the beginning of the season. The Panthers' D had some trouble against those 5 WR sets the Cards ran, but if I remember correctly, the Cards were missing multiple TEs so they used more WRs than they had all season. Chris Harris said the Panthers had not practiced against or scouted their 5 WR sets because the Cardinals had not used them at all before that game. We will be prepared for them this time. And the Panthers even won that game. I predict this one will not be that close.
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Old 01-06-2009, 04:29 PM    (permalink
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Right, we have every inclination to believe that they haven't changed their inconsistencies on the road. They have generally looked pretty good at home other than the Vikings, but on the road is another story.

I don't think we take them lightly, but they haven't proven that they can go on the road.
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Old 01-10-2009, 10:45 PM    (permalink
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I know a lot of people are to blame, but no one can possibly trump Jake Delhomme. He effected the game in so many negative ways. Turning the ball over is always bad, then you add that the defense had no time to even get their helmets off, see what the hell was happening and just got destroyed because of it.

Not getting the ball to Smith is inexcusable. He is one of the most effective receivers anywhere on the field, yet we never once tried to get him the ball in an unconventional way.

Going to a hurry up offense before being down 20 would have at least shown me that they were trying to get a rhythm.

Things I'd like to see next season:
1. Open try outs at QB
Jake was not even solid this year, 15 TDs, 12 INTS, 3 lost fumbles. to expect him to get better would imply that he would (a) learn from a mistake, which he doesn't do and (b) not already be on the back end of his career.

2. Get rid of Trgo
things need to be shaken up, bring in someone with some damn enthusiasm, we need Jack Del Rio again haha. Anyone who can call a blitz that isn't obvious would work.


I don't know what will happen with Peppers and Gross, neither were impressive tonight at all.

Next season is going to be brutal.
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:23 PM    (permalink
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Briging Peppers back would be a good idea considering he had a career high for sacks this season, Gross might not be as needed as once thought though and with him gone it would free up some cap room for big playmaking DT like Albert Haynseworth or Tommie Harris if they dont get resigned by their respective teams...Open tryouts at QB or drafting a QB like Rhett Bomar or Chase Daniel with their first pick(second round) seems to be the best solution atm because we need someone who will get Smith the ball and not throw 5 INTs in one game against Arizonas secondary and their isnt really anyone to get excited about in free agency this year at QB except maybe Kyle Orton who wil most assuredly be back in Chicago...i also agree with getting rid of Trgovac, hes seemingly made Carolina's defense worse since hes been here even though the talent level has raised...sadly enough it feels almost like Carolina is in a rebuilding period despite having so much talent due to the situation at QB that has festered for years and has now gotten completely out of hand
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Old 01-11-2009, 10:13 PM    (permalink
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http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_yl...yhoo&type=lgns


“They don’t really change their schemes. … That’s John Fox’s motto,” Fitzgerald said.

How does that make you guys feel? Makes me feel like he just wants to keep his job. Not adapting is wrong on so many levels.

It doesn't work in the playoffs, it doesn't work against teams you play twice, it doesn't keep players excited, it doesn't win championships.

Shottenheimer was fired after a 14-2 season wasn't it? I wouldn't be against it, but it won't happen.
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Old 01-11-2009, 11:39 PM    (permalink
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be nice to hire Schottenheimer or even Brian Billick but yeah wont happen chances are Fox will be staying till Delhomme throws the season away next year then theyll finally get wise and get rid of them both
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Old 01-12-2009, 07:24 AM    (permalink
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No, I definitely do not want either of those, I was just saying that Schottenheimer was fired after a great season but disappointing playoff.

Billick and Schottenheimer are not upgrades at all.
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Old 01-12-2009, 09:07 AM    (permalink
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fire fox, hire spags. he'd sort out our D.
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Old 01-12-2009, 09:20 AM    (permalink
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fire fox, hire spags. he'd sort out our D.
I wish.

When nothing changes in the gameplan, players get lazy, uninterested, unmotivated. If you excite them though, they will play harder, play FOR you, and you will win.

I think that is a fair assesment to say that one of the reasons our defense doesn't hit as hard as any of the others in the playoffs, doesn't have the enthusiasm (outside Harris, Beason and Godfrey and sometimes Davis) is because they play the same old game plan every week.

We did well the first half the schedule because we played teams that were mostly vanilla offenses, sure they had great backs, but our problem wasn't run stuffing. Once the Saints came in and we had to really play the pass, teams knew how we played. Then we started seeing the passing teams like GB, Denver, Arizona and usually they had good success.
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Old 01-13-2009, 02:57 PM    (permalink
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Firing Fox would be the wrong move. We played a bad game, he didn't prepare his team well for it, but he led the Panthers to a 12-4 record and a playoff bye. Getting rid of Jake also would only hurt the team. He killed our chances against Arizona, but he won a lot of games for us earlier in the year, and he also did so well the season we went to the Super Bowl. What I would like to see in the passing game is more usage of the TEs, running backs, and backup WRs. Our passing game is virtually limited to Smith and Moose, and Jake seems to pick one pre-snap and throw to him whether he is guarded or not. If we open up the passing game a bit more he will do better.
Defense is the problem for this team. Trgo needs to go. Our D hass not played up to its potential since del Rio left. This team has talent on D- Peppers, Beason, Gamble, etc. so there is no excuse for how terribly they played at the end of the season. The secondary just backs off into a loose zone and the opposing QB seemns to always be able to find an open receciver. That was our gameplan against Fitz in the first half and it obviously did not work. In the second half we put Gamble on him man-to-man and he was held to less than 15 yards receiving. What I'd like to see is a new D-Coordinator who can get the CBs to pressure the WRs and draft some D linemen who can pressure the QB. I'd also like to see Thomas Davis blitz more. The best defensive teams blitz their linebackers all the time, and Davis has some talent at blitzing, but the coaches do not let him use it often. Another corner would also be nice.
Overall, I think we should keep the core about the same. Try to resign Gross and Peppers and don't go after any big free agents. Get some quality young defensive players in the draft (Don't go QB early- thats saying that we are looking a couple years in the future and not at the coming year). If we can get a new Defensive scheme I think the team will not need a whole lot to be playing long into January next year.
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Old 01-13-2009, 03:57 PM    (permalink
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Firing Fox would be the wrong move. We played a bad game, he didn't prepare his team well for it, but he led the Panthers to a 12-4 record and a playoff bye. Getting rid of Jake also would only hurt the team. He killed our chances against Arizona, but he won a lot of games for us earlier in the year, and he also did so well the season we went to the Super Bowl.
He didn't prepare them at all. When the opposing player says that we didn't do anything differently, and that is John Fox's motto, something is wrong.

Leading us to 12-4? Last time I checked Fox was a defensive coach, and last time I checked, our defense got bent over the last half of the season. They were abysmal, nothing to be happy about. The defense held against crappy offenses the first half of the year, holding down the Saints and then falling apart.

We were 12-4 because of offense, because DeAngelo was amazing, and Smith made clutch catches to bail the defense out.

Cardinals- Smith's tight rope, DeAngelo turns it on, saves game. Defense didn't stop anyone other than a tipped pass

Saints- Saints came back, in like two minutes, who saves us? Steve Smith catches a prayer.

Green Bay- Green Bay moves the ball with ease, nothing stops them. Who saves the day? Steve Smith again.

We had to score at least 30 to win at the end of the season.

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Defense is the problem for this team. Trgo needs to go. Our D hass not played up to its potential since del Rio left. This team has talent on D- Peppers, Beason, Gamble, etc. so there is no excuse for how terribly they played at the end of the season. The secondary just backs off into a loose zone and the opposing QB seemns to always be able to find an open receciver. That was our gameplan against Fitz in the first half and it obviously did not work. In the second half we put Gamble on him man-to-man and he was held to less than 15 yards receiving. What I'd like to see is a new D-Coordinator who can get the CBs to pressure the WRs and draft some D linemen who can pressure the QB. I'd also like to see Thomas Davis blitz more. The best defensive teams blitz their linebackers all the time, and Davis has some talent at blitzing, but the coaches do not let him use it often. Another corner would also be nice.
Fox should stay, but Trgovac should leave? Fox is the one who chooses the way to go for a game plan. Nothing Trgo does is approved without Fox seeing it.

Corners playing off? That's Fox.
No blitzes? That's Fox.
Same gameplan? That's Fox.

Bringing in a new coordinator is pointless, when the Head coach has a specialty, they have the say in how the team plays.

If you want a new aggressive defense, a new HC will have to be hired.

I doubt anything happens.
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Old 01-13-2009, 05:04 PM    (permalink
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Bringing in a new coordinator is pointless, when the Head coach has a specialty, they have the say in how the team plays.

If you want a new aggressive defense, a new HC will have to be hired.

I doubt anything happens.
Thats what people said about the offense before we got rid of Henning. After we switched coordinators our offense went from being not very good to one of the best in the league. Also, theres a reason our D went from being 2nd in the league under Fox and del Rio to awful under Fox and Trgovac.

And there is no use in firing a coach who has proven he can win and hiring an unproven coordinator. Let the smoke clear and remember that that in all other playoff games under Fox (with maybe the exception of the Seahawks game) the team has come in extremely prepared. Fox is 5-3 in the playoffs, and in the Super Bowl loss he prepared the team as well as he could have. If we fire Fox, it would be based on one game. No one would have fired him before the Arizona game. This team has most of the pieces to do very well next year. We don't need a massive overhaul, and that includes head coach.
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Old 01-13-2009, 06:38 PM    (permalink
ShutDwn
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Thats what people said about the offense before we got rid of Henning. After we switched coordinators our offense went from being not very good to one of the best in the league. Also, theres a reason our D went from being 2nd in the league under Fox and del Rio to awful under Fox and Trgovac.

And there is no use in firing a coach who has proven he can win and hiring an unproven coordinator. Let the smoke clear and remember that that in all other playoff games under Fox (with maybe the exception of the Seahawks game) the team has come in extremely prepared. Fox is 5-3 in the playoffs, and in the Super Bowl loss he prepared the team as well as he could have. If we fire Fox, it would be based on one game. No one would have fired him before the Arizona game. This team has most of the pieces to do very well next year. We don't need a massive overhaul, and that includes head coach.
You are missing the point. Hiring a coordinator who matches the coaches specialty makes no sense.

If Mike Martz were head coach, would he hire someone who wanted to play conservative offense and just run the ball? No, of course not. He would have a type of defense he would want to run too, but because it isn't his specialty, the defensive coordinator would have more freedom than the offensive assistant.


The Henning argument doesn't work, because look at what Henning has done since in Miami. He has created a very diverse offense that has only one real star in Ronnie Brown and decent players at every skill position. Three receivers had 50 catches, another three had thirty. Henning's terrible offense in my opinion was because of Fox's desires.

The run game got better, and because of it the pass game got a little better, but it is still a long shot from how good it should be. We

Firing Fox would be based on inconsistency. He had a winning season this year, but I bet you that we don't make the playoffs next year. When has Fox ever made the playoffs when we were predicted to? The answer is never. We don't even do well in individual games when we are predicted to win.


If Fox is kept around, the pressure must still be on to produce, he should have no job security for the next few years. Pressure should be put on him to be more aggressive on defense like it was to be better on offense, find a QB because we didn't get where we were because of Delhomme, he was just along for the ride.

We still have guys like Rosario, Jarrett, and DeAngelo who can be used in the passing game significantly more. Adding more components only gives the defense more to worry about, which opens everything else up.
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:32 AM    (permalink
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You fire Fox, you lose a lot of the team. The fact is they played a good year, and picked the worst possible time to have a bad game. I think the team has shown they can make adjustments during games, but there hasn't been enough execution on the field early on.

Some tough choices in the line up have to be made so we can get the guys out there to execute the game plan properly. Lucas? Peppers? Someone to pressure from the DT position? If we could pick up some help in one of those areas, we're looking at a defensive team that can make the run like in 2003.

On offense, you can't just dump the best QB to play for your team, ever. He had a bad game, so did everyone else. Bring in some youth and competition for next year to push Jake to get back into the form he started the 2007 season.

Also, lets put this in perspective, at the end of the 2007 season, we didn't even know if we'd have a QB in August, muchless be in the playoffs. Weren't we all clamouring for Jake in december of 2007? So lets bring in some youth and open up the competition for starter just to get Jake's mojo running. I think he tends to play his best when he's got something to prove.

Though I do agree lets open things up a little bit. I'd love to see some more 4 WR sets with Williams back there and run a little run and shoot on opposing defenses. I'd also like to see us run the 2 minute drill more often because that seems to be a time when we are very effective.
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Old 01-14-2009, 09:51 AM    (permalink
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You fire Fox, you lose a lot of the team. The fact is they played a good year, and picked the worst possible time to have a bad game. I think the team has shown they can make adjustments during games, but there hasn't been enough execution on the field early on.

Some tough choices in the line up have to be made so we can get the guys out there to execute the game plan properly. Lucas? Peppers? Someone to pressure from the DT position? If we could pick up some help in one of those areas, we're looking at a defensive team that can make the run like in 2003.

On offense, you can't just dump the best QB to play for your team, ever. He had a bad game, so did everyone else. Bring in some youth and competition for next year to push Jake to get back into the form he started the 2007 season.

Also, lets put this in perspective, at the end of the 2007 season, we didn't even know if we'd have a QB in August, muchless be in the playoffs. Weren't we all clamouring for Jake in december of 2007? So lets bring in some youth and open up the competition for starter just to get Jake's mojo running. I think he tends to play his best when he's got something to prove.

Though I do agree lets open things up a little bit. I'd love to see some more 4 WR sets with Williams back there and run a little run and shoot on opposing defenses. I'd also like to see us run the 2 minute drill more often because that seems to be a time when we are very effective.
We didn't know if we had a QB, and now for sure that it isn't Delhomme. Gunslingers fade the fastest. Jake has not looked good at all this year, the only game I can say he looked good in was the Chargers game. The Chiefs are terrible, don't bring them up.

Let's hear some of the examples of these adjustments that you have seen? Would it be the adjustment to being absolutely horrible after the Saints game?

Jake finished the year with more turnovers than touchdowns, no QB keeps his job with an offense around him like ours. He should be at least +10 in the TD to turnover ratio. Look at David Garrard last year, he has half the skill at receiver, and our running game was better, yet he was extremely efficient. He is an aging QB, the chances of him getting his mojo back are slim, he isn't like Kerry Collins who played within the offense, I don't know if Jake has the capability to throw to anyone else other than Smith and Muhammad.

Keeping Jake at QB just because he is the best QB we have had is stupid. We don't win games based on what happened 6 years ago, in other words, what has he done for us lately?

Mary Schottenheimer was just as much a player's coach as Fox is. The players would have to put their big boy pants on because this is a business.

If Fox isn't fired, pressure needs to be put on him to get more aggressive on defense. Fox's tactics for getting better has always been sign free agents to fix everything, that doesn't work. You can't cut corners like that to cover up bad drafting and lackluster gameplans. Talent is important, but putting the talent in the right position to make plays is more important.

The Baltimore Ravens are in the championship game with Samari Rolle, Fabian Washington, Corey Ivy, and Frank Walker. The Cardinals are nothing to brag about either. Our guys could be just as good as those guys, if not significantly better. The scheme is the problem, Marshall and Lucas are still good players but they are forced to be something they're not.

Tim Lewis also seems to be a problem, since coming here Lucas and Marshall have fallen off the face of the earth, one of Fox's decisions. Since Lewis left the Giants, Webster, who was looking like a bust, has since become their best corner and an anchor outside.

Maybe I'm wrong, I am just wondering why we payed Gamble all that money to shut down Steve Breaston.
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Old 01-14-2009, 06:32 PM    (permalink
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We have this argument every year. When Jake is healthy, no one likes him, but when he is injured, everyone realizes how much he means to the team. It gets old. To change starting QBs in one of the best offenses would only be a step back.
As for Fox, he inherited a one-win team and led them to an average of 9 wins in the next 7 years. Every year that he has not had a winning record there has been a huge injury to an important player. Last year we won 7 games with Michael Jackson and a half-corpse at QB. The year before we won 8 with Nick Goings as our leading rusher, thats how banged up our RB corps was. Two years before that we won 7 games without Smitty. The only year Fox has had that he didn't have an injured star and still did not win at least 11 games was his first year, when he took the one-win team to a 7 win team with Rodney Peete at QB. Every other year he has won 11 or 12 games. The point is, he wins. Even when his best players are injured, he still wins at least 7 games. His seven years of good coaching trump the one game he did not coach well.

The reason so many people want to see changes is because the loss was not even a week ago. But once the anger from the loss goes away, you'll see that the people we have right now can win and it would be stupid to change that.
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