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Old 10-30-2009, 11:06 PM    (permalink
EvilNixon
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I'd do everything to upgrade,because Orton just doesn't have the physical tools to be a franchise QB,IMO
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Old 10-31-2009, 02:06 AM    (permalink
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So question who is a bigger waste of pick so far? Ayers or Smith
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Old 10-31-2009, 02:14 AM    (permalink
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So question who is a bigger waste of pick so far? Ayers or Smith
Since Ayers has been improving every game and looked really good in the second half against SD, giving us that companion outside pass rusher to go with Doom, I'd question why he'd even be up for consideration as a "waste"...

Smith is the other way around - played well at the start, then got hurt and hasn't shown much since.
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Old 11-05-2009, 01:33 AM    (permalink
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Forum Mock update. Denver didn't have a representative so I filled in for the untaken team.


Move 1: Traded 2nd Round pick for RB Tashard Choice and ILB Bradie James.
Reasoning: I felt like this move gave me 2 sure things compared to a 2nd round gamble. Solidifying RB and adding another 3-4 vet for depth/leadership.

Move 2: First Round (15 pick) - QB Sam Bradford, Oklahoma.
Reasoning: I think Josh McDaniels' system is one of the few in the NFL that would be a good fit for Bradford. Orton will still lead the way until he flames out and Bradford is ready.

Move 3: Traded S Renaldo Hill and Third Round pick (94) to Minnesota for OG Anthony Herrera and Third Round pick (71).
Reasoning: Wanted to move up in Round 3 and felt like this was a big jump. Herrera has been a solid road grader for Adrian Peterson and I felt like he would at least improve the current situation at RG. I sacrificed Hill to get it done, but felt like between McBath and Bruton, one of the two could emerge.

Move 4: Traded CB Champ Bailey, TE Daniel Graham, 7th Round Pick to Baltimore for OG Chris Chester, DE Trevor Pryce and a 4th Rounder.
Reasoning: Kind of felt from the comments by njx that Bailey's days as a corner are numbered. Felt like trading him now was the best chance to get whatever remaining value he had left. I really like Chris Chester's versatility at OG and C and think he's been developed very well in Baltimore. With the emphasis that OG was a need, I felt like Chester could be a long term, key cog at LG as he's still young and has prime years left. Pryce returns to Denver with 3-4 experience in Mike Nolan's scheme. He's continued to produce at a high level in Baltimore and he'll finish his career out here while being a leader and teacher for the younger guys. The 4th rounder sweetened the pot and made it easier to pull the trigger.

Move 5: Third Round (pick 71) - CB Syd'Quan Thompson, Cal.
Reasoning: With trading Champ Bailey, I wanted to address the CB spot. Thompson has the track record and consistency that proved to me that he can be a big time playmaker in the mold of Asante Samuel.



This was just a 3 round draft. Must say, I had fun managing your team. Hopefully, you don't chop my head off.

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Old 11-05-2009, 10:31 AM    (permalink
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but you almost had to know that i'd disagree with nearly everything anyways =P

listed in the same order you used:

1 - i don't get the Choice trade. i mean, he's pretty good. but he'd be buried at #2 on the depth chart here, and that's assuming that he wasn't also behind buckhalter (i think choice is a better runner, but i know nothing about him as a receiver). bradie james is a meh. from the limited amount i've seen, i'd rather have a second and andra davis.

2 - i like bradford, and i think (though it hasn't been heavily discussed) i'm one of the few. i think he'd be perfect in this offense, and i think it's clear that orton can be a great guy to have for a couple of years, but a guy who can't throw 20 yards downfield is simply not the answer. i don't think bradford has a huge arm, but i think his arm is certainly better than orton's (i'm sort of assuming that all of this checks out pre-draft, and that he hasn't been turned into pennington by the injury).

3 - *shrug* i could live with it. anything would upgrade hamilton right now, and it makes a big difference on the offense to not be able to run between the tackles ever. assuming mcbath or bruton shows something the rest of this season, i wouldn't hate this.

4 - i think bailey's value may be limited, but i don't think this is a good trade for us (as much as that seems close to bailey's true value, sadly). giving up bailey and graham is a high price for a G and 78 year old DE and fully depletes our talent at CB (which we'll get to in 5). we do NEED a g. but i don't think there's a lot of value in pryce here, and unless richard-stupid-draft-pick-quinn figures out how to play nfl football, this would leave us without any capable blocking tes.

5 - unfortunately, this combination means that teams would be putting up 400 yards per game on us in the air. as much as champ has lost a step, teams still seem to, if not fear him, at least take into account where he is. further, and the reason i'd like him at S, his tackling ability and ability to read plays is still top notch. it would.... hurt to lose that sure tackle on the outside when we happen to blitz heavily.

*shrug*

based on what we told you, not bad.
Thanks. I have no problems with the critique and appreciate the thoughtful response. The intention for Choice is not to be buried as the #2. I think in a committee approach, which he is fully accustomed to, he would have a bigger impact than "being buried on the bench". I chose him because he's a good inside runner, something I'm not fully convinced that Moreno is. He also has soft hands receiving the ball and has improved his blitz pick up, though he's not on the level of Barber. As for Buckhalter, this has probably been a career year for him, but I don't see it lasting long. James is a little more than "meh", as he's coming off a 117 tackle, 8 sack, 3 FF, 4 PD season last year. This is his 7th year in the league and he has good experience for a team in transition to the 3-4. While not a young stud, the ILB draft class is weak if you don't grab one in Round 1.

I know Pryce is old, but he does understand the nuances of Nolan's system. He's still putting up better numbers and is a key member of a good Baltimore defense. I don't expect to get more than a couple years out of him... probably the same that Bailey would give. I wanted to draft a young DE, but the opportunity in the draft just didn't fit the value. I probably would've addressed this if I didn't make the trade for Choice/James. But again, I tried to avoid any bust factors.

As for Thompson, I think he'll be a stud in the NFL one day. If there was a FA period, I would've made CB a top priority. I knew the thought of Smith and Thompson starting is a pretty scary idea and wouldn't be well received.
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Old 11-05-2009, 11:20 AM    (permalink
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Here's how the draft went.

1. St. Louis Rams - Ndamukong Suh, DT, Nebraska
2. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Eric Berry, DB, Tennessee
3. Tennessee Titans - Gerald McCoy, DT, Oklahoma
4. Cleveland Browns - Jake Locker, QB, Washington
5. Oakland Raiders - (f/ Kansas City) - Jimmy Clausen, QB, Notre Dame
6. San Diego Chargers (f/ Detroit) - Taylor Mays, DB, USC
7. Kansas City (f/ Oakland) - Russell Okung, OT, Oklahoma State
8. Houston Texans (f/ Washington) - Dez Bryant, WR, Oklahoma State
9. San Francisco 49ers (f/ Carolina) - Joe Haden, CB, Florida
10. Seattle Seahawks - CJ Spiller, RB, Clemson
11. Miami Dolphins - Rolando McClain, LB, Alabama
12. Buffalo Bills - Anthony Davis, OT, Rutgers
13. Jacksonville Jaguars - Greg Hardy, DE/OLB, Ole Miss
14. Baltimore Ravens (f/ San Francisco) - Sergio Kindle, DE/OLB, Texas
15. Denver Broncos (f/ Chicago) - Sam Bradford, QB, Oklahoma
16. San Francisco 49ers (f/ Baltimore) - Trent Williams, OT, Oklahoma
17. New England (f/Baltimore) - Brandon Spikes, ILB, Florida
18. Washington Redskins (f/ Houston) - Bryan Bulaga, OT, Iowa
19. New York Jets - Arthur Jones, DT, Syacuse
20. Green Bay Packers - Bruce Campbell, OT, Maryland
21. Philadelphia Eagles - Sean Weatherspoon, LB, Missouri
22. Atlanta Falcons - Patrick Robinson, CB, Florida State
23. Dallas Cowboys - Allen Bailey, DL, Miami
24. New York Jets (f/ Arizona) - Brandon Graham, DE/OLB, Michigan
25. New York Giants - Reshad Jones, S, Georgia
26. Pittsburgh Steelers - Jerry Hughes, DE/OLB, TCU
27. Cincinnati Bengals - Jermaine Gresham, TE, Oklahoma
28. New England Patriots - Corey Wootton, DE, Northwestern
29. Minnesota Vikings - Travis Lewis, OLB, Oklahoma
30. Seattle Seahawks (f/ Denver) - Charles Brown, OT, USC
31. Green Bay Packers (f/ New Orleans) - Jahvid Best, RB, California
32. Indianapolis Colts - Everson Griffen, DE, USC

33. Cleveland Browns (f/ St Louis) - Jonathan Dwyer, RB, Georgia Tech
34. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Derrick Morgan, DE, Georgia Tech
35. Baltimore Ravens (f/ New England) - Terrence Cody, DT, Alabama
36. Cleveland Browns - Eric Norwood, DE/OLB, South Carolina
37. Kansas City Chiefs - Arrelious Benn, WR, Illinois
38. Washington Redskins (f/ Detroit) - Deymarius Thomas, WR, Georgia Tech
39. Oakland Raiders - Marvin Austin, DT, North Carolina
40. Washington Redskins - Ciron Black, OT, LSU
41. Carolina Panthers - Brandon Lafell, WR, LSU
42. Seattle Seahawks - Perrish Cox, CB, Oklahoma St.
43. Miami Dolphins - Damian Williams, WR, USC
44. Buffalo Bills - Brian Price, DT, UCLA
45. Baltimore Ravens (f/ New England) - Golden Tate, WR, Notre Dame
46. San Francisco 49ers - Ricky Sapp, DE/OLB, Clemson
47. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Vince Oghobaase, DT, Duke
48. San Diego Chargers - Tyson Alualu, DE, California
49. Detroit Lions (f/ Baltimore) - Selvish Capers, OT, West Virginia
50. Cleveland Browns (f/ Chicago) - Mike Iupati, OG, Idaho
51. Arizona Cardinals (f/ New York Jets) - Carlos Dunlap, DE, Florida
52. Green Bay Packers - Morgan Burnett, S, Georgia Tech
53. Philadelphia Eagles - Jason Fox, OT, Miami
54. Kansas City Chiefs (f/ Atlanta) - Kristopher O'Dowd, OC, USC
55. Dallas Cowboys - Nate Allen, S, South Florida
56. Arizona Cardinals - Rodney Hudson, OG, Florida State
57. New York Giants - Matt Tennant, OC, Boston College
58. Oakland Raiders (f/ Pittsburgh) - Jason Pierre-Paul, DE, USF
59. Cincinnati Bengals - Darrell Stuckey, S, Kansas
60. Detroit Lions (f/ New England Patriots) - Mardy Gilyard, WR, Cincinnati
61. Minnesota Vikings - Colt McCoy, QB, Texas
62. Dallas Cowboys (f/ Denver) - Dan Williams, DT, Tennessee
63. Green Bay Packers (f/ New Orleans) - Jared Odrick, DL, Penn State
64. Indianapolis Colts - Donovan Warren, CB, Michigan

65. St. Louis Rams - Tony Washington, OT, Abilene Christian
66. Tampa Bay Buccaneers - Eric Decker, WR, Minnesota
67. Tennessee Titans - Quan Sturdivant, ILB, North Carolina
68. Cleveland Browns - Anthony McCoy, TE, USC
69. Kansas City Chiefs - Brandon Lang, DE/OLB, Troy
70. New England Patriots (f/Detroit) - Ryan Mathews, RB, Fresno State
71. Denver Broncos (f/ Oakland via Minnesota) - Syd'Quan Thompson, CB, California
72. Washington Redskins (Pick forfeited due to Jeremy Jarmon selection)
73. Carolina Panthers - Tim Tebow, QB, Florida
74. Philadelphia Eagles (f/ Seattle) - Noel Devine, RB, West Virginia
75. Miami Dolphins - George Selvie, DE/OLB, USF
76. Buffalo Bills - QB Tony Pike, Cincinnati
77. Jacksonville Jaguars - Mike Neal, DT, Purdue
78. Indianapolis Colts (f/ San Francisco) - Daryl Washington, ILB, Texas Christian
79. Washington Redskins (f/ Chicago) - Joe McKnight, RB, USC
80. Cincinnati Bengals (f/ San Diego) - Brandon Ghee, CB, Wake Forest
81. Detroit Lions (f/ Baltimore) - Mike Johnson, OG, Alabama
82. Houston Texans - Myron Lewis, CB, Vanderbilt
83. Cleveland Browns (f/ New York Jets) - Kyle Calloway, OT, Iowa
84. Green Bay Packers
85. Philadelphia Eagles
86. Atlanta Falcons
87. Dallas Cowboys
88. Arizona Cardinals
89. New York Giants
90. Pittsburgh Steelers
91. San Diego (f/ Cincinnati)
92. Pittsburgh Steelers (f/ Oakland)
93. Pittsburgh Steelers (f/ Oakland)
94. Minnesota Vikings (f/ Denver)
95. Miami Dolphins (f/ New Orleans)
96. Indianapolis Colts

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Old 11-05-2009, 07:15 PM    (permalink
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Move 1: Traded 2nd Round pick for RB Tashard Choice and ILB Bradie James.
Both Andra Davis and Correll Buckhalter have played well for us. James may be an upgrade to Davis, and Choice more durable than Buckhalter... but is that enough to justify spending a second?

In some ways drafting an ILB makes more sense than trading for a veteran, as we could develop them to replace one of our starting guys in a few years.

Quote:
Move 2: First Round (15 pick) - QB Sam Bradford, Oklahoma.
I'd be very leery of this move. People gripe about Orton's arm, but Bradford isn't bringing a cannon to the table either. My main concern are the injuries, though. A QB has to be able to take a hit. Sure, he'd get to play out of the shotgun here, but let's not confuse "formation" with "system". McD's offense is a totally different animal than the easy reads & throws that OK's system emphasizes.

Quote:
Move 3: Traded S Renaldo Hill and Third Round pick (94) to Minnesota for OG Anthony Herrera and Third Round pick (71).
Dawkins may be our inspirational leader, but Hill is our field general. He's one of the key guys who works with the coaching staff on the halftime defensive adjustments. I'd hate to lose him.

That being said, we definitely need the help at OG.

Quote:
Move 4: Traded CB Champ Bailey, TE Daniel Graham, 7th Round Pick to Baltimore for OG Chris Chester, DE Trevor Pryce and a 4th Rounder.
I like Chris Chester, and glad he got his chance with Yanda out, but this would be a tough trade. Losing both Graham and Bailey hurts. Graham is a leader on the offense and a great blocker - unless our rookie TE really emerges I can't see us making this move.

Quote:
Move 5: Third Round (pick 71) - CB Syd'Quan Thompson, Cal.
We certainly need another CB to groom behind Champ and Goodman - obviously this becomes an even bigger need if you trade Champ away.
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Old 11-06-2009, 10:43 AM    (permalink
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Assuming no trades were done, what are your ideal scenarios for picks 15, 62, & 94...as this draft played out? Interested to know which players you would've taken.
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Old 11-10-2009, 05:55 PM    (permalink
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Yeah I think though after looking so bad the past 2 weeks, it's easy to get pessimistic. But if we lose next week to the ******* Redskins, I'm personally delivering that petition to your door.

Seriously though, at this point we SHOULD get 10 wins. As in, not getting 10 wins would be VERY dissapointing and should be the almost worst-case scenario. Redskins, Chiefs twice, Raiders. All 4 should be gimmes. And then San Diego still doesn't look like anything special and the game's in Denver so hopefully we beat them. Even though I had the "sky is falling" mentality last night, we should still make the playoffs.
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Old 11-10-2009, 09:04 PM    (permalink
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I am not sure why anyone is getting particularly upset with the last two weeks. This Broncos team is a good football team, nothing more and nothing less. They should beat the bottom half of the NFL almost every time, and they should be in the contest against the top half of the NFL every game. We will lose some games against other good football teams. Considering we have a new coach, new offensive scheme, new defensive scheme, and mostly new players, that is not a bad thing. Being a playoffs caliber team, if only just, is something everyone of us would have taken as the start of the season. I dont expect to be the best team in the NFL, or even top 5, this year, and wasnt thinking it even when we were 6-0. Winning some close games has seemingly unrealistically raised the expectations of a lot of fans to believing this team is better than a good football team. If we lose to the redskins, chiefs, etc. down the stretch, then I will start worrying.
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Old 11-11-2009, 09:27 PM    (permalink
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Hamilton gets benched in Denver

"Lindsay Jones of the Denver Post reports that Hamilton has been replaced in the starting lineup by former Patriots guard Ross Hochstein."
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Old 11-12-2009, 02:16 PM    (permalink
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can't hurt.
It was necessary. The problem goes beyond the scheme/blocking change issues... he's simply getting manhandled out there.

Do I think Hochstein is the solution? Hell no. He's a utility guy and therefore best suited for a backup role. However, we don't have a lot of options at this point.
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Old 11-12-2009, 04:13 PM    (permalink
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It was necessary. The problem goes beyond the scheme/blocking change issues... he's simply getting manhandled out there.

Do I think Hochstein is the solution? Hell no. He's a utility guy and therefore best suited for a backup role. However, we don't have a lot of options at this point.
I hate to see this happen to guys that have been so good for so long. It is always much better to retire while you still have game rather than get dumped because you are no longer up to it.

I really hope Harris gets healthy soon. Hochstein may be okay if he is the weak link in the o-line (we can scheme around that), but when Polumbus is letting guys through on the right all game, it becomes infinitely harder.
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Old 11-12-2009, 04:54 PM    (permalink
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I hate to see this happen to guys that have been so good for so long. It is always much better to retire while you still have game rather than get dumped because you are no longer up to it.
He's been on thin ice due to the concussion problems, but IIRC his present problem is his hamstring. Injuries aside, the weak push inside has been a issue for quite a while and contributed to the goal line problems we've had the last few years.
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Old 11-13-2009, 11:07 AM    (permalink
Diehard
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how do we upgrade the spot? i think dennison can still capably find guys that fit in the later rounds, but i don't see a rookie as the immediate answer.
D-Unit had some interesting ideas... but even more to the point, isn't Logan Mankins a FA at the end of the season? The Pats tend to be stingy and the connection to our HC certainly wouldn't hurt our chances.

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as a complete aside, has wiegmann ever played G? and not that danni boatwright doesn't have a weird face, but how the **** are they married? it's like jeff garcia and whatsername.
As far as I know, he's strictly played C... and yes, they are an odd couple.
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Old 11-13-2009, 12:48 PM    (permalink
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Maybe Weigmann is hung like a Bronco.

Sorry for putting that image in your head.
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Old 12-08-2009, 04:19 PM    (permalink
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Broncos lose tackle Ryan Harris for season
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Old 12-08-2009, 04:40 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, not fun but expected when he went off the field. That being said, Polumbus has done pretty well in the running game... his main problem is the pass protection against speed rushers.
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Old 12-08-2009, 05:11 PM    (permalink
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Damn annoying that a freakin toe injury can put a guy out for the season. Cut the bloody thing off - then he will be available for playoffs (an Australian rules footballer did that with his finger some years ago - cut it off as it wasnt going to heal in time for playoffs).
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Old 12-08-2009, 06:16 PM    (permalink
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I just hope Orton doesn't get hurt. I don't think this game is very winnable to be honest, but luckily the next three are.
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Old 12-08-2009, 11:45 PM    (permalink
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Hopefully Harris comes back healthy next year. He was fantastic last year and very good this year, he's a key member of the team for the future. Polumbus is ok I guess, he has looked a lot better than I expected so far this year.
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Old 12-10-2009, 10:01 AM    (permalink
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Polumbus is a piece of garbage. He has been owned in pass protection every game this year and is average in the running game. Losing Harris hurts tremendously.
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Old 01-04-2010, 01:23 PM    (permalink
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http://twitter.com/fs3142/status/7374458384
http://twitter.com/fs3142/status/7375172404

Marshall took everything out of his locker.

Even the nameplate.
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Old 01-12-2010, 10:22 PM    (permalink
DiG
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you guys thinks that mcdaniels will cut peyton hillis? hes a shanny guy that id love in DC and isnt an offense player that mcdaniels seems to really like or try to work into the offense. with all the backs on your roster i cant see all of them being kept around and id guess mcdaniels would keep guys he brought in before shanny guys. thoughts on both hillis and whether you think hed be available?
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Old 01-12-2010, 10:41 PM    (permalink
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I think Hillis is as good as gone, sadly.
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