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Old 12-03-2007, 09:57 PM    (permalink
BroadwayJoe10
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Don't forget Revis' 14 passes defensed, which ties him for the rookie lead with Leon Hall and Tanard Jackson. You guys got two stars in the making in Harris and Revis.
ahh yes i shouldnt have missed that.

As much as I love Mangold, how good would it be to have Haloti Ngata as our NT? He is an absolute presence out there.

Also, it is nice seeing mcgahee torch a team besides us for once. He is running like an absolute animal right now. And does anyone notice when brady gets a little dirt on his uniform he starts to have a hissy fit.
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Old 12-03-2007, 10:03 PM    (permalink
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ahh yes i shouldnt have missed that.

As much as I love Mangold, how good would it be to have Haloti Ngata as our NT? He is an absolute presence out there.

Also, it is nice seeing mcgahee torch a team besides us for once. He is running like an absolute animal right now. And does anyone notice when brady gets a little dirt on his uniform he starts to have a hissy fit.
I dunno how we would've gotten Ngata as opposed to Mangold? If I'm correct Ngata was either just after the top 10 (11?) or barely in the top 10, Mangold was a very late first rounder, 29 maybe?

And Brady's just a little girl and a cocky...insert whatever you want there I'm not gonna avoid the censors but there were about 5 things that went through my head in the first couple seconds I was trying to decide what to write.
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Old 12-04-2007, 12:09 AM    (permalink
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I dunno how we would've gotten Ngata as opposed to Mangold? If I'm correct Ngata was either just after the top 10 (11?) or barely in the top 10, Mangold was a very late first rounder, 29 maybe?

And Brady's just a little girl and a cocky...insert whatever you want there I'm not gonna avoid the censors but there were about 5 things that went through my head in the first couple seconds I was trying to decide what to write.
I wasn't really thinking I guess; i'm assuming i was thinking trading up for ngata like we were talking about doing for either cutler or leinhart? i forget which one..anyways, I was more speculating at how amaizing it would be to have him. And I know the feeling about brady; I know I am gonna have to wake up tommorrow morning and deal with this GD city.


Edit; I am official depressed. I'm gonna hope that big ben and the steelers can power run the ball and run those crossing routes (i pray santonio holmes will be playing) and their defense smashes them in the mouth. Because i don't trust the jets and certainly dont trust the dolphins to beat them. And i've refused to trust the giants ever again, no matter how well they are or arne't playing.
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Old 12-04-2007, 08:18 PM    (permalink
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Pats game was unbelievably depressing last night.

On an interesting side note, toonster (who I have a tremendous respect for) has us taking Kentwan Balmer at #4 in his most recent mock. He'd play DE in our scheme at around 6'5 (possibly 6'4) and 295ish. Supposedly he's been a monster this season at times, coming out of UNC. Intriguing pick although he'd have to be the kind of guy that would fly up in pre-draft workouts. Not sure if it happens and I don't really like the pick that high, but it brings him to attention and he's certainly a guy to follow thorugh postseason workouts and All-Star games.
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Old 12-04-2007, 08:25 PM    (permalink
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Anyone see CLE lose this week because a force out wasn't (according to many) called? I was hoping we could repay them in that way after what happened last year.

Jets can win this game. I think they can also beat TEN and KC....

Ok I am being EXTREMELY optimistic but I still think its possible! 6 wins is not out of the question! Would love to end this season on a good note.
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Old 12-04-2007, 08:58 PM    (permalink
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Anyone see CLE lose this week because a force out wasn't (according to many) called? I was hoping we could repay them in that way after what happened last year.

Jets can win this game. I think they can also beat TEN and KC....

Ok I am being EXTREMELY optimistic but I still think its possible! 6 wins is not out of the question! Would love to end this season on a good note.
Honestly, I want them to win, but I'm going to cry if I have to go through this pathetic of a season and not at least get a top 5 pick to go with it.
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:05 PM    (permalink
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Honestly, I want them to win, but I'm going to cry if I have to go through this pathetic of a season and not at least get a top 5 pick to go with it.
That is a pretty hypocritical statement right there. These players are prospects, nothing more.

I think at one point, hate to admit it, I actually got upset when the Jets won their last game in 06. I never felt worse as a fan when I realized that I would rather want them to lose then win.

I'll take 6 wins over 3 wins any day year.
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Old 12-04-2007, 10:24 PM    (permalink
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That is a pretty hypocritical statement right there. These players are prospects, nothing more.

I think at one point, hate to admit it, I actually got upset when the Jets won their last game in 06. I never felt worse as a fan when I realized that I would rather want them to lose then win.

I'll take 6 wins over 3 wins any day year.
I'm with you here. The big thing here is that ending the season winning 5 of 7 bodes really well for going into next season. Obviously it's not a guarantee that we would win those games, but I would easily take take 3 wins out of our next 4 over a top 5 pick any day of the week. Helps build a winning attitude here, gives Clemens and the rest of our young guys some confidence going into next season...If it's starting the season 6-2 and losing out that's one thing, but winning towards the end of the season is very good. And beyond that, outside of Chris Long (who could very well be gone by our pick anyways) there aren't a ton of guys that are great fits for us top 5 anyways. Less important than the fact that it builds momentum heading into next year, but I would definitely take wins in any of our games the rest of this year.
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Old 12-04-2007, 11:49 PM    (permalink
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I too saw the pick of Kentwan Balmer and as I havn't seen or heard anything about him besides on draft websites (and my buddy at UNC who runs XC there says hes enormous and has a really long neck) but he seems like a pick a 3-4 team could reach for as a DE due to his supposed speed, but I don't see a 4-3 team reaching for him as a DT just yet, but that is all just speculation as I have never seen him. I just mention that, becuase atleast carricker was getting talked about a lot on espn and by sports pundits, but really i have no opinion haha..One good thing that can come from the rising of players such as Balmer and Langford, it gives us a better chance of getting one of them or possibly Dre Moore if he seems a better fit for our team. Basically, the talent depth of our positions of need are great. I still hope we will acquire a few more first day picks some how.


Anyways, regarding our last 4 games; I too admit there was a time in 06 where I was absolutely in love with Mario Williams and was upset when we won, but then I too realized i felt dirty for it. Nothing bad ever comes from winning (i think i made this one post about saying the only time i would ever be upset about losing a game was if it was the difference in the #1 pick and there was a 6'7 240 reciever who runs a legit sub 4.3 forty, has hands of glue and runs perfect routes with 0 injury history was draftable)...ok thats a drastic hyperbole, but i just wanted to make the point that nothing bad comes from winning. Besides possibly long, i dont think theres a dropoff in talent from the 3rdish pick to say the 8th pick.

Anyways, I expect cleveland to come out focused and ready to play considering they just lost, are well coached and can make the playoffs. It should be a good game and will be a matter of whether our offense can keep up with their scoring.

Ad for the pats, I just want to play them closely, however it would make my year to beat them, but i really just want to play them competitively. We can compete with the titans and beat the chiefs. I feel if we end the season on a win, while playing the last 4 games competitively, we will have some momentum.
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Old 12-05-2007, 10:18 AM    (permalink
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http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/fo..._footwork.html

good article on what clemens needs to work on (talks about his drops and how he needs to be more precise for the blocking scheme to be effective something Pennington was always good at so maybe he can learn from him)...also rumors that we may have a new D coordinator next season Rob Ryan anyone?
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Old 12-05-2007, 10:57 PM    (permalink
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I for one would love Rob Ryan, the raiders' defense is a little dissapointing this year after having been a top 5ish defense last year, but i feel that is more player related than coaching related.

I beleive he was the linebackers coach for NE for 4 years?? so he obviously knows about the 3-4, but is that his forte? Other than that he seems like he's a good motivator, hes got a great pedigree and he has amazing hair.

Oh ya, and just replacing Sutton would be a place.
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Old 12-06-2007, 12:45 PM    (permalink
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That is a pretty hypocritical statement right there. These players are prospects, nothing more.

I think at one point, hate to admit it, I actually got upset when the Jets won their last game in 06. I never felt worse as a fan when I realized that I would rather want them to lose then win.

I'll take 6 wins over 3 wins any day year.
It's not hypocritical at all. As a fan, I want what is best for my team. Since we can no longer make the playoffs, I want them to have the highest pick possible. Honestly, right now we're tied with three other teams for third. If we were playing against one of them, I can't say I wouldn't hope that we would lose the game.

Yes, they're all prospects, but hell, we could even trade down, and when you're in the top 5, you can get a hell of a lot for a trade down.

Everyone always says "you hope for your team to win every week or you're not a fan", but that's BS. I hope for the best possible future for my team. If their future would be better if they lose a game, I want them to lose the game.

edit*

Well, aside from going winless. If I had a choice between going winless and having the first pick, or 1-15 and having second, I'd go 1-15.
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Old 12-06-2007, 01:29 PM    (permalink
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Just as a point, a trade down from the top 5 isn't likely because top 5 trades rarely happen. Also, it's different at this point with Clemens starting because getting our QB of the future at this point some confidence so he (and the rest of the team) can have some momentum heading into next season would be huge. So as much as having some nice picks are good for the future, not damaging the psyche of Clemens is important for the future as well.
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Old 12-06-2007, 02:06 PM    (permalink
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It's not hypocritical at all. As a fan, I want what is best for my team. Since we can no longer make the playoffs, I want them to have the highest pick possible. Honestly, right now we're tied with three other teams for third. If we were playing against one of them, I can't say I wouldn't hope that we would lose the game.

Yes, they're all prospects, but hell, we could even trade down, and when you're in the top 5, you can get a hell of a lot for a trade down.

Everyone always says "you hope for your team to win every week or you're not a fan", but that's BS. I hope for the best possible future for my team. If their future would be better if they lose a game, I want them to lose the game.

Building a good team through the draft has nothing to do with where you draft but drafting smart.

edit*

Well, aside from going winless. If I had a choice between going winless and having the first pick, or 1-15 and having second, I'd go 1-15.
Contrary to what you believe, losing doesn't help the team in anyway that would be better then winning. Saying you woulden't want the to go down in history as the team who went 0-16 while having the the first over being 1-15 and getting the second isn't saying much either.

Also, draft position really has nothing to do with building a good team. I mean this is obvious when you look back on drafts and see players who were drafted much later and turned out to be better.
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Old 12-06-2007, 04:40 PM    (permalink
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Anyone else see how Leon is only 6th in fan voting right now in the AFC and wes welker is #1 lol. I know fan voting only counts for a third of the pro bowl vote, but how can people be that ignorant. I mean if not leon than cribbs.
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Old 12-06-2007, 05:45 PM    (permalink
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Wes Welker clearly deserves it over Leon Washington, were you being serious or are you just a Leon flaming homer?
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Old 12-06-2007, 07:30 PM    (permalink
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Wes Welker clearly deserves it over Leon Washington, were you being serious or are you just a Leon flaming homer?
First off I was being serious. Secondly, what is the reason for being so condescending, we are all jets fans here and it's much easier to point out actual stats to me and justifying your reasoning than just saying im wrong and an insult.

So for kicks, lets just throw out the stats here. Leon is much more of a kick returner than punt returner and welker vice versa.

Stats -------------Leon-----------Welker
Kick returns-------33 (11th)--------6
KR Yards---------1011 (6th)-------157
KR Avg------------30.6 (2nd)------26.2
KR tds--------------3 (1st)--------0


Punt Returns-------3--------------22 (14th)
PR Yards----------13-------------237 (8th)
PR Avg------------8.1------------10.8 (7th)
PR tds-------------0---------------0




Ok, so leon absolutely destroys him in kick returns and welker beats him in punt returns, so i guess thats a wash. So what you'll have to do is look at how much better they are against their opponents in their respective forte. Leon is clearly more dominant against the other kick off returners, which includes Joshua cribbs who is probably the best, wheres welker, who is good, isn't nearly as dominant. But seriously, just take some time to look up the actual stats before insulting me. We both like the jets, and are passionate about our guys, no reason to go burnin bridges.
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Old 12-06-2007, 08:12 PM    (permalink
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First off I was being serious. Secondly, what is the reason for being so condescending, we are all jets fans here and it's much easier to point out actual stats to me and justifying your reasoning than just saying im wrong and an insult.

So for kicks, lets just throw out the stats here. Leon is much more of a kick returner than punt returner and welker vice versa.

Stats -------------Leon-----------Welker
Kick returns-------33 (11th)--------6
KR Yards---------1011 (6th)-------157
KR Avg------------30.6 (2nd)------26.2
KR tds--------------3 (1st)--------0


Punt Returns-------3--------------22 (14th)
PR Yards----------13-------------237 (8th)
PR Avg------------8.1------------10.8 (7th)
PR tds-------------0---------------0




Ok, so leon absolutely destroys him in kick returns and welker beats him in punt returns, so i guess thats a wash. So what you'll have to do is look at how much better they are against their opponents in their respective forte. Leon is clearly more dominant against the other kick off returners, which includes Joshua cribbs who is probably the best, wheres welker, who is good, isn't nearly as dominant. But seriously, just take some time to look up the actual stats before insulting me. We both like the jets, and are passionate about our guys, no reason to go burnin bridges.

One thing I can think of there is that he thought you meant at a position other than KR, since you really didn't specify a position. I think Leon obviously deserves it over Welker as a return man, not sure if he does over Cribbs but it should be one or the other in the Pro Bowl.
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Old 12-06-2007, 08:28 PM    (permalink
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One thing I can think of there is that he thought you meant at a position other than KR, since you really didn't specify a position. I think Leon obviously deserves it over Welker as a return man, not sure if he does over Cribbs but it should be one or the other in the Pro Bowl.
It's a possibility, although i'm not sure how, when welker is on the ballot for WR & KRwhereas Leon is on for RB & KR. I think Cribbs deserves it, but i was just making a point at how welker is #1 and leon was only #6. I don't understand how welker could be considered the best returner; i would really like to hear the argument.
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Old 12-06-2007, 09:43 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by CannedToast View Post
Honestly, I want them to win, but I'm going to cry if I have to go through this pathetic of a season and not at least get a top 5 pick to go with it.
give me the wins anyday. You can get great players at the 10th pick, and nothing is a gaurentee in the top 5. I'd much rather have the wins so that i can walk with pride with my Jets gear. The Jets front office has done a real good job the last few years, so i trust them to make the right choices regardless of where we're picking
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Old 12-06-2007, 09:50 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by The Great Jonathan Vilma View Post
give me the wins anyday. You can get great players at the 10th pick, and nothing is a gaurentee in the top 5. I'd much rather have the wins so that i can walk with pride with my Jets gear. The Jets front office has done a real good job the last few years, so i trust them to make the right choices regardless of where we're picking
Exactly! Now, I'm not sayin i lose pride in being a jets fan, but there's times when i've walked outta the bar here in boston after some pretty tough losses this year where i've zipped up my sweatshirt a little more than the weather called for hah.
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Old 12-06-2007, 10:26 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by BroadwayJoe10 View Post
First off I was being serious. Secondly, what is the reason for being so condescending, we are all jets fans here and it's much easier to point out actual stats to me and justifying your reasoning than just saying im wrong and an insult.

So for kicks, lets just throw out the stats here. Leon is much more of a kick returner than punt returner and welker vice versa.

Stats -------------Leon-----------Welker
Kick returns-------33 (11th)--------6
KR Yards---------1011 (6th)-------157
KR Avg------------30.6 (2nd)------26.2
KR tds--------------3 (1st)--------0


Punt Returns-------3--------------22 (14th)
PR Yards----------13-------------237 (8th)
PR Avg------------8.1------------10.8 (7th)
PR tds-------------0---------------0




Ok, so leon absolutely destroys him in kick returns and welker beats him in punt returns, so i guess thats a wash. So what you'll have to do is look at how much better they are against their opponents in their respective forte. Leon is clearly more dominant against the other kick off returners, which includes Joshua cribbs who is probably the best, wheres welker, who is good, isn't nearly as dominant. But seriously, just take some time to look up the actual stats before insulting me. We both like the jets, and are passionate about our guys, no reason to go burnin bridges.

Ok, you didn't mention that this was for the kick returner to represent the AFC. In that case, I agree with you 100% that Leon deserves it.
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Old 12-06-2007, 11:11 PM    (permalink
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Ok, you didn't mention that this was for the kick returner to represent the AFC. In that case, I agree with you 100% that Leon deserves it.
My bad, i shoulda specified. If they had just an offensive production category instead of WR and RB positions than welker definatley has the edge over leon. I think thats just shotty's fault for not giving leon the ball more, and welker just having a fantastic year. I personally feel welker should get a look at the probowl this year, but i don't think he'll get it. He has been just as valuable as moss in some of the games, granted without moss they could double welker, but i'm always more worried about welker than moss on 3rd down every time i watch them play.

I havn't really paid any attention to many of the AFC centers this year, but i was surprised to see mangold be only #6.
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Old 12-07-2007, 12:48 PM    (permalink
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David Harris jsut won defensive rookie of the month and IMO should win it for the year. One of the Jets said they should just remove the rookie and say def player of the month bc hes just been THAT good. Its a shame he started later in the season and hasnt had a chance to garner some pro bowl momentum but I am also surprised at Mangold's status bc Ive read some believe in a year he could easily be considered the best center in football. As of now I put him behind Matt Birk only as the best center in the league so I guess I think he's the best center in the AFC. Some might disagree and say Dan Koppen but I think with the LG situation of the Jets it could be a lot worse if Mangold wasn't the center.

Also this is just a thought and with Mangold's great play at C its VERY unlikely and probably shouldn't happen, but does anybody feel strongly enough about maybe drafting a C (bc of the weak senior class of OG) and moving Mangold to G bc of his physicality so we can actually have a good OL. (I just think of Mangold and Brick next to each other and get chills) Alex Mack came to mind as this type of guy he's a junior C from Cal 6'5'' 305 (im not sure if he can play guard though) I dunno he just seems to me to be the only candidate but let me know who comes to mind for you

I would prefer to draft a Duke Robinson and keep Mangold at C but I think if we could find a C who can't play guard whos grading MUCH better than the guards we think will be at our spots I think we should consider it.

Another option would be finding a C who could play G and switching him keeping Mangold at C a much more important piece of the line.

Basically, does anyone see any tweeners that might be able to brigthen our outlook on the LG position and addressing it via the draft bc the Gs in this draft w the exception of maybe 2 is depressing and having to COVET a G in the draft is dangerous. I also read somewhere that Faneca's play was fading and 2006 was his worst year at any level in protection, but one year may just have been a result of the sdtruggling steelers I dunno we'll see. Its just keeping up with the OL FA market is too tasking at this point in the season.LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU ALL THINK
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Old 12-07-2007, 01:06 PM    (permalink
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As you already stated, moving Mangold won't happen. I see your logic but I really wouldn't want to move him out of C. As you said also, in the short time he has been in the pros, he has done an amazing job.
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