Philadelphia Eagles Discussion - Page 191

Thumper · 02-10-2010, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniper

Yes please to Kolb for Rogers.

I'd much prefer to ship McNabb away for Shaun Rogers than Kevin Kolb.

The move would be incredibly stupid, getting rid of the future QB for a player the team doesn't even need. Is Shaun Rogers better than what the Eagles have yes, but he is old, lazy and injury prone and Bunkley, Patterson and Dixon are one of the best defensive tackle rotations in the NFL. Pass! The only player I'd consider trading Kolb for would be Jared Allen, you don't just throw away future franchise QBs.

Sniper · 02-10-2010, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thumper

The only player I'd consider trading Kolb for would be Jared Allen, you don't just throw away future franchise QBs.

Except Kolb's not a future franchise QB, and you'd be moronic to only trade him for Jared Allen. Your man-crush on Kolb is beyond ridiculous.

Thumper · 02-10-2010, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniper

Except Kolb's not a future franchise QB, and you'd be moronic to only trade him for Jared Allen. Your man-crush on Kolb is beyond ridiculous.

Yes, he is and I was saying that for dramatic effect really, although I would be really hesitant to throw away a future franchise QB (which is exactly what he is) for another player especially considering how McNabb's age and injury history.

Todd Bertuzzi · 02-10-2010, 09:21 PM

Can we start an Eagles discussion thread for those of us who are pro McNabb so we don't have to listen to this?

Brothgar · 02-10-2010, 10:02 PM

Hey guys I got the Eagles in RC's forum mock.

This is what I did thus far.

24. Philadelphia Eagles - Sean Weatherspoon, OLB, Missouri
56. Philadelphia Eagles - Larry Asante, S, Nebraska
69. Philadelphia Eagles (f/SEA) - Kareem Jackson, CB, Alabama
87. Philadelphia Eagles - D’Anthony Smith

*PHI/BUF - Buffalo trades its fifth (136th overall) and sixth (168th overall) round picks to Philadelphia for Michael Vick.

Tried to shop Mc5 but no takers.

superman8456 · 02-10-2010, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by broth223

Hey guys I got the Eagles in RC's forum mock.

This is what I did thus far.

24. Philadelphia Eagles - Sean Weatherspoon, OLB, Missouri
56. Philadelphia Eagles - Larry Asante, S, Nebraska
69. Philadelphia Eagles (f/SEA) - Kareem Jackson, CB, Alabama
87. Philadelphia Eagles - D’Anthony Smith

*PHI/BUF - Buffalo trades its fifth (136th overall) and sixth (168th overall) round picks to Philadelphia for Michael Vick.

Tried to shop Mc5 but no takers.

Don't know what safeties were available in the 2nd, so I wont complain. The draft looks pretty good thus far. Keep up the good work!

Next you should try and get LeGarrette Blount, or any bigger back really, along with a redzone target, tall, big WR.

If you get to the 5th and 6th and there is still a player like Mike Neal still on the board, take him. OG is a viable option as well.

superman8456 · 02-10-2010, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Todd Bertuzzi

Can we start an Eagles discussion thread for those of us who are pro McNabb so we don't have to listen to this?

I'm pro McNabb, but I could understand why the franchise would trade him/shop him around.

I also believe that Kolb is a very talented player.

brat316 · 02-10-2010, 10:31 PM

I believe Kolb is a very talented back up. I don't seem him as a starter, just a really good back up. Like a charlie batch.

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 04:04 PM

Okay two things, most of you think you have to hate Kolb if you support McNabb or you hate McNabb if you support Kolb. Is it that bad to think the Eagles might have a good starter and another good starter waiting in the wings?

Also you all bash Kolb, calling him similar to Charlie Batch and basically ensuating he is a bad player, give me reasons, you all keep saying "NO! We love McNabb and Kolb sucks!" (paraphrasing of course) but please, tell me why you think Kolb is a bad player, why do you think he is the next Charlie Batch, if you are going to say something stupid like that at least have a reason to back it up, based on his first two starts what makes you guys think that he cannot be a franchise QB?

cunningham06 · 02-11-2010, 04:21 PM

I don't think we have enough to evaluate Kolb either way. I remember watching him in the Saints game and he had some truly horrible plays where I was screaming at the tv. We ended up just running gadget and wild cat plays at the end of the half because he wasn't doing much of anything throwing the ball. He did play better in the second half, but I was a bit disappointed in him after that game.

Then the next week he did really well against the Chiefs, but well... it's the Chiefs.

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cunningham06

I don't think we have enough to evaluate Kolb either way. I remember watching him in the Saints game and he had some truly horrible plays where I was screaming at the tv. We ended up just running gadget and wild cat plays at the end of the half because he wasn't doing much of anything throwing the ball. He did play better in the second half, but I was a bit disappointed in him after that game.

Then the next week he did really well against the Chiefs, but well... it's the Chiefs.

Really? I thought just the opposite, I thought he was doing great in the first half, he finished the first half 14/22 with 196 yards and a TD pass. And then when momentum shifted to the Saints and they put up back to back scoring drives, Kevin Kolb then started forcing stuff.

Then against the Chiefs he did great, but like you said, they're the chiefs.

Sniper · 02-11-2010, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cunningham06

I don't think we have enough to evaluate Kolb either way. I remember watching him in the Saints game and he had some truly horrible plays where I was screaming at the tv. We ended up just running gadget and wild cat plays at the end of the half because he wasn't doing much of anything throwing the ball. He did play better in the second half, but I was a bit disappointed in him after that game.

Then the next week he did really well against the Chiefs, but well... it's the Chiefs.

Plus, despite the fact that the Saints won the Super Bowl, their pass defense still ranked in the lower third of the league.

Todd Bertuzzi · 02-11-2010, 04:30 PM

Coming in to last season I was ready to give up on Kolb, but he showed signs with the playing time he got and it gave me hope. That being said, two starts is not enough to give him the label of franchise quarterback. Both starts he made some good decisions/throws and he made some bad ones. Take in to account that we passed the ball 40+ times each game and that he put up the numbers he did against mediocre to bad defenses. Still not enough to hand over the reigns to him, especially when McNabb has done nothing imo to be traded or benched. If the only argument you can give me for going with Kolb over McNabb is simply change than that's bs. McNabb's been here so long that we take for granted what it's like having an elite qb.

Sniper · 02-11-2010, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thumper

Really? I thought just the opposite, I thought he was doing great in the first half, he finished the first half 14/22 with 196 yards and a TD pass. And then when momentum shifted to the Saints and they put up back to back scoring drives, Kevin Kolb then started forcing stuff.

Then against the Chiefs he did great, but like you said, they're the chiefs.

So that's 13/21 for 125 yards (5.95 ypa) without the big play to Jackson. Captain Checkdown, anyone?

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sniper

So that's 13/21 for 125 yards (5.95 ypa) without the big play to Jackson. Captain Checkdown, anyone?

or 9.6 yards per completion, so no he isn't captain check down.

brat316 · 02-11-2010, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thumper

or 9.6 yards per completion, so no he isn't captain check down.

that doesn't really count, since its really just hopping on the back of the WR or ball carriers work.

brat316 · 02-11-2010, 04:46 PM

Also I don't hate either one, both are good qbs. McNabb is the franchise qb, I don't know how you can say Kolb is. Maybe i'm wrong and Kolb can be a starting qb, but I just don't think he has "it" to be a franchise qb.

How is everyone insulating him by comparing him to charlie batch? I'm the only one that said it. And that is a pretty good thing, Charlie Batch is a very good back up, and can start for you in a pinch, recently his injuries have led to him being not as good.

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhaarat316

that doesn't really count, since its really just hopping on the back of the WR or ball carriers work.

and YPA does count? This is just an example, but lets say a QB throws a long pass and it doesn't connect and then they connect for a 10 yard pass, do you know what their average is? 5 yards per throw, does that make them captain checkdown? According to Sniper they would be.

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhaarat316

Also I don't hate either one, both are good qbs. McNabb is the franchise qb, I don't know how you can say Kolb is. Maybe i'm wrong and Kolb can be a starting qb, but I just don't think he has "it" to be a franchise qb.

How is everyone insulating him by comparing him to charlie batch? I'm the only one that said it. And that is a pretty good thing, Charlie Batch is a very good back up, and can start for you in a pinch, recently his injuries have led to him being not as good.

I was referring to you in that post for the most part, you keep saying that and yet Kolb and Batch have only one thing in common and that is that they are #2 QBs other than that they aren't very similar. Also give me reasons why you think Kolb is a career back-up, you keep saying that but WHY do you think that, what has Kolb shown you that makes you think he will never be a permanent starter in the NFL?

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 05:13 PM

Also should we subtract all the big plays the receivers made for Donovan McNabb as well like Sniper did with Kolb?

Todd Bertuzzi · 02-11-2010, 05:14 PM

He's done it without them before.

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Todd Bertuzzi

He's done it without them before.

Yeah, counting 2004 and 2009 McNabb has a career average of 6.9 yards per attempt, so is McNabb captain checkdown? And he has only averaged over 7 yards an attempt 3 times, 2004, 2006, 2009. McNabb = captain checkdown?

And his average would go down significantly if you took out all the big plays that DeSean, Jeremy and Brent made for him, so are we going to leave McNabb's alone and praise him for averaging 8.0 yards per throw while leaving all the big plays while we take away all the big plays DeSean and Brent Celek made for Kolb and knock him because of it.

brat316 · 02-11-2010, 05:29 PM

I don't really like either one. I like the one that shows yards per completion, but before YAC. So throw at 17 yards pass, but it goes for 30. Only count the 17 yards.

Also every qb has one or 2 big plays. But sometimes you take that away and see what else he has done. Its good to see what else they can do other than bomb it deep...since they can't do that every play.

Thumper · 02-11-2010, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhaarat316

I don't really like either one. I like the one that shows yards per completion, but before YAC. So throw at 17 yards pass, but it goes for 30. Only count the 17 yards.

Also every qb has one or 2 big plays. But sometimes you take that away and see what else he has done. Its good to see what else they can do other than bomb it deep...since they can't do that every play.

Exactly so is it fair to tear Kolb down while propping up McNabb for making big plays? No. (this is mostly directed at Sniper)

Sniper · 02-12-2010, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thumper

Exactly so is it fair to tear Kolb down while propping up McNabb for making big plays? No. (this is mostly directed at Sniper)

About as fair as it is to crown Kolb for padding his stats against bottom-10 secondaries.