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Old 01-17-2007, 06:02 AM    (permalink
thule
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I'm sure you all remember me ragging on JJ for being soft. How I wanted yac(yards after contact) information. Well I found a little bit of it...but YAC is hard to find for a rushing stat...so if anyone can find some more numbers let me know.
  • Team Name Att. Big Efforts Pct. +10-yard runs YAC Rec/TD
    DAL Jones 234 106 45.3 24 2.00 8/0
    DAL Barber 111 69 62.2 18 2.38 14/2

Quote:
How many yards can a running back pick up after contact? The top-five backs in average yards after contact are all significantly better than the 2-yard after-contact average in the NFL. The top-10 NFL backs with a minimum of 150 carries that make something happen after the first tackler strikes are Gore, Travis Henry, Laurence Maroney, Taylor, Cadillac Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Westbrook, Chester Taylor, Kevin Jones and Tiki Barber in that order.

I think its safe to say that if there was a guy who was good with YAC...its AD. I don't think we have a shot...but if for some reason he falls past Houston...who takes him?ATL?Buff?Pitt?GB is the next team that really needs a running back...if AD makes it past Cleveland...who could go a million directions...and get past Houston..who might not value RB in the first round. I mean maybe houston in interested in JJ...idk all i know is that if AD falls out of the top 10 I want him for w/e it takes I mean we could trade up infront of GB with a first and a third...throw in a player if we want I think we could get up to 10. I'm not gonna be as bold as to project a trade...but a team like houston could be interested in JJ...ATL could be interested in ellis...now we have the zimmer connection...maybe guys like Burnett or w/e have value. Buffalo needs help in their front 7...so we have ammo there. Not sure we have anything for pitt..but thats pick #15 and wouldn't take much. I know its a pipe dream...but if he falls past 3 and 8...RB really isn't a need position in this draft.
Quote:
Adrian Peterson was at number three nationally with 1,925 rushing yards. The yards after contact were 1,365, 71% of Adrian Peterson’s net.
I found a good site that really broke down running backs.
Running Back Stats
It uses some weird ways to break down running backs but I found one really interesting.
DVOA - DVOA breaks down every single play of the NFL season to see how much success offensive players achieved in each specific situation compared to the league average in that situation, adjusted for the strength of the opponent.

What does this mean?
On first down, a play is considered a success if it gains 45 percent of needed yards; on second down, a play needs to gain 60 percent of needed yards; on third or fourth down, only gaining a new first down is considered success.

There are other factors in this but you can read if you want all the info.

Using DVOA here is our backs.
M.Barber is #2 overall with a 31.7% DVOA
J. Jones is #28 overall with a -1.9% DVOA
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Old 01-17-2007, 09:13 AM    (permalink
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Q. Moses or Jarvis Moss?

Who would you pick up? And Why?
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Old 01-17-2007, 09:21 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetBLACK08
Q. Moses or Jarvis Moss?

Who would you pick up? And Why?
Neither it would hinder the development on Carpenter...not only that it would also put them on the bench behind Ellis for a year...and I can't see them starting over ellis or hatcher or ware in the nickle...would be a waste of talent at this point.
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Old 01-17-2007, 09:49 AM    (permalink
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You can never have too many LBers in a 3-4
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Old 01-17-2007, 10:16 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by jetBLACK08
You can never have too many LBers in a 3-4
When you have 4 first round picks in the LB corps plus a big time FA and a MLB who was just extended and a second rounder...I think its safe to say thats overdueing it.
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Old 01-17-2007, 10:49 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by thule
I'm sure you all remember me ragging on JJ for being soft. How I wanted yac(yards after contact) information. Well I found a little bit of it...but YAC is hard to find for a rushing stat...so if anyone can find some more numbers let me know.
  • Team Name Att. Big Efforts Pct. +10-yard runs YAC Rec/TD
    DAL Jones 234 106 45.3 24 2.00 8/0
    DAL Barber 111 69 62.2 18 2.38 14/2

Quote:
How many yards can a running back pick up after contact? The top-five backs in average yards after contact are all significantly better than the 2-yard after-contact average in the NFL. The top-10 NFL backs with a minimum of 150 carries that make something happen after the first tackler strikes are Gore, Travis Henry, Laurence Maroney, Taylor, Cadillac Williams, LaDainian Tomlinson, Westbrook, Chester Taylor, Kevin Jones and Tiki Barber in that order.

I think its safe to say that if there was a guy who was good with YAC...its AD. I don't think we have a shot...but if for some reason he falls past Houston...who takes him?ATL?Buff?Pitt?GB is the next team that really needs a running back...if AD makes it past Cleveland...who could go a million directions...and get past Houston..who might not value RB in the first round. I mean maybe houston in interested in JJ...idk all i know is that if AD falls out of the top 10 I want him for w/e it takes I mean we could trade up infront of GB with a first and a third...throw in a player if we want I think we could get up to 10. I'm not gonna be as bold as to project a trade...but a team like houston could be interested in JJ...ATL could be interested in ellis...now we have the zimmer connection...maybe guys like Burnett or w/e have value. Buffalo needs help in their front 7...so we have ammo there. Not sure we have anything for pitt..but thats pick #15 and wouldn't take much. I know its a pipe dream...but if he falls past 3 and 8...RB really isn't a need position in this draft.
Quote:
Adrian Peterson was at number three nationally with 1,925 rushing yards. The yards after contact were 1,365, 71% of Adrian Peterson’s net.
I found a good site that really broke down running backs.
Running Back Stats
It uses some weird ways to break down running backs but I found one really interesting.
DVOA - DVOA breaks down every single play of the NFL season to see how much success offensive players achieved in each specific situation compared to the league average in that situation, adjusted for the strength of the opponent.

What does this mean?
On first down, a play is considered a success if it gains 45 percent of needed yards; on second down, a play needs to gain 60 percent of needed yards; on third or fourth down, only gaining a new first down is considered success.

There are other factors in this but you can read if you want all the info.

Using DVOA here is our backs.
M.Barber is #2 overall with a 31.7% DVOA
J. Jones is #28 overall with a -1.9% DVOA
thule your reading my mind on a.d. i posted a few pages back that if he falls past 3 we call houston and offer our 1st ,3rd and j.j. for their 8th. idk if that would be enough but adding a.d to our team would be amazing. it would make our o-line better because he has great vision and speed and as you mentioned he gets yards when none are there. it makes our defense better because we are controlling the clock. i think this would be a great move.
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Old 01-17-2007, 11:17 AM    (permalink
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heres another article, this one by jean-jacques taylor on parcells.

No doubt exists in my mind that Bill Parcells will return to the Cowboys for a fifth season.

But for him to maximize the talent on this roster, he must change his approach. That won't be easy for a 65-year-old coach, but it's a necessity for Dallas to end its 10-year streak without a playoff victory.

Parcells believes that scheme, not players, wins games. That's why the Cowboys don't always seem to attack defensive weaknesses.

Look at the Seattle game. The Cowboys didn't attack their weak set of cornerbacks because Parcells wasn't sure Dallas could protect Romo, and he didn't want the game in Romo's hands.

That was a mistake.

The Bears couldn't possibly have a ton of confidence in inconsistent quarterback Rex Grossman, but they knew the best way to beat Seattle was to attack their secondary. Grossman threw for nearly 300 yards and the Bears won.

You can easily argue Dallas lost on a fluky play, but maybe they wouldn't have been in that position if they had attacked Seattle's secondary. Especially considering the passing game was the Cowboys' strength all season.

The Cowboys played the most simplistic, unimaginative 3-4 defense in the league. Parcells allowed that to happen because he thinks the scheme is good enough to win. The Cowboys, though, have players that are at their best when using speed and quickness. They need to be placed in position to succeed. Too many times, Parcells didn't allow that to happen.

what do you guys think? will parcells change or do we need a change?
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Old 01-17-2007, 11:20 AM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pocketaces
heres another article, this one by jean-jacques taylor on parcells.

No doubt exists in my mind that Bill Parcells will return to the Cowboys for a fifth season.

But for him to maximize the talent on this roster, he must change his approach. That won't be easy for a 65-year-old coach, but it's a necessity for Dallas to end its 10-year streak without a playoff victory.

Parcells believes that scheme, not players, wins games. That's why the Cowboys don't always seem to attack defensive weaknesses.

Look at the Seattle game. The Cowboys didn't attack their weak set of cornerbacks because Parcells wasn't sure Dallas could protect Romo, and he didn't want the game in Romo's hands.

That was a mistake.

The Bears couldn't possibly have a ton of confidence in inconsistent quarterback Rex Grossman, but they knew the best way to beat Seattle was to attack their secondary. Grossman threw for nearly 300 yards and the Bears won.

You can easily argue Dallas lost on a fluky play, but maybe they wouldn't have been in that position if they had attacked Seattle's secondary. Especially considering the passing game was the Cowboys' strength all season.

The Cowboys played the most simplistic, unimaginative 3-4 defense in the league. Parcells allowed that to happen because he thinks the scheme is good enough to win. The Cowboys, though, have players that are at their best when using speed and quickness. They need to be placed in position to succeed. Too many times, Parcells didn't allow that to happen.

what do you guys think? will parcells change or do we need a change?
Parcells doesn't need to change his ways...we just need to execute.
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Old 01-17-2007, 11:24 AM    (permalink
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according to the article parcells isnt allowing his players to make plays. almost as if hes playing not to lose and not to win. we all know what that gets you- beat.
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Old 01-17-2007, 11:41 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by pocketaces
heres another article, this one by jean-jacques taylor on parcells.

No doubt exists in my mind that Bill Parcells will return to the Cowboys for a fifth season.

But for him to maximize the talent on this roster, he must change his approach. That won't be easy for a 65-year-old coach, but it's a necessity for Dallas to end its 10-year streak without a playoff victory.

Parcells believes that scheme, not players, wins games. That's why the Cowboys don't always seem to attack defensive weaknesses.

Look at the Seattle game. The Cowboys didn't attack their weak set of cornerbacks because Parcells wasn't sure Dallas could protect Romo, and he didn't want the game in Romo's hands.

That was a mistake.

The Bears couldn't possibly have a ton of confidence in inconsistent quarterback Rex Grossman, but they knew the best way to beat Seattle was to attack their secondary. Grossman threw for nearly 300 yards and the Bears won.

You can easily argue Dallas lost on a fluky play, but maybe they wouldn't have been in that position if they had attacked Seattle's secondary. Especially considering the passing game was the Cowboys' strength all season.

The Cowboys played the most simplistic, unimaginative 3-4 defense in the league. Parcells allowed that to happen because he thinks the scheme is good enough to win. The Cowboys, though, have players that are at their best when using speed and quickness. They need to be placed in position to succeed. Too many times, Parcells didn't allow that to happen.

what do you guys think? will parcells change or do we need a change?
I said this long time ago.
Glad someone agrees.
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:16 PM    (permalink
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You posted snips from that article and you missed the best one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JJT
there have been some rumors that Patriots' linebackers coach Pepper Johnson could get an interview as the Cowboys' defensive coordinator. But we should assume next season will be Parcells' last. If that's the case, no assistant really wants to join a staff, when there's a firm belief the head coach is going to leave after one season. Jerry has also let it be known that he isn't interested in giving multi-year deals to assistant coaches this year, because if he has to hire a new coach next year, he wants that coach to have full flexibility to hire a staff.
This ones for you cowboysforever

Quote:
Q: I keep hearing that it will be hard to unload Roy Williams' contract, but I find that hard to believe. Isn't there any team out there with a contract they want to unload?

Jason R. Stubbs, Richmond, Calif.

TAYLOR: It sounds like you're talking about a baseball or basketball trade. Football trades work a lot differently. If the Cowboys were to trade Williams, he would still count nearly $10 million against the Cowboys' salary cap because of the contract extension he signed this summer. No team can really afford to have a hit like that against the cap and still do all of the other things they want to do in the off-season. You're going to have to get used to Williams because he isn't going anywhere.
12 hours later...JJT says this after me.
Quote:
TAYLOR: There have been no talks about moving Bradie to outside linebacker because I don't think he has the speed or explosion to be a dynamic pass rusher. I think Dallas would be more inclined to use Bobby Carpenter as an inside linebacker in nickel situations next season instead of Bradie because Carpenter has more speed and might be able to defend the deep ball down the middle better than Bradie.
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:19 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Rod
ha! i've enjoyed reading the past couple of pages of this thread...

I guess you guys now know what it's like for us Falcons fans to try to explain to idiots why we are not going to cut or trade Mike Vick... :roll:
We definitely feel your pain now! :D
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:19 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thule
You posted snips from that article and you missed the best one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JJT
there have been some rumors that Patriots' linebackers coach Pepper Johnson could get an interview as the Cowboys' defensive coordinator. But we should assume next season will be Parcells' last. If that's the case, no assistant really wants to join a staff, when there's a firm belief the head coach is going to leave after one season. Jerry has also let it be known that he isn't interested in giving multi-year deals to assistant coaches this year, because if he has to hire a new coach next year, he wants that coach to have full flexibility to hire a staff.
This ones for you cowboysforever

Quote:
Q: I keep hearing that it will be hard to unload Roy Williams' contract, but I find that hard to believe. Isn't there any team out there with a contract they want to unload?

Jason R. Stubbs, Richmond, Calif.

TAYLOR: It sounds like you're talking about a baseball or basketball trade. Football trades work a lot differently. If the Cowboys were to trade Williams, he would still count nearly $10 million against the Cowboys' salary cap because of the contract extension he signed this summer. No team can really afford to have a hit like that against the cap and still do all of the other things they want to do in the off-season. You're going to have to get used to Williams because he isn't going anywhere.
dont know why but not all of your article posted
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:24 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit
I agree. Age at corner does not concern me. The regression in Henry's play does, but I'm not willing to write him off. Cornerback isn't a first round need, but under the right circumstances and the willingness to try Henry at FS, I could see a possibility.
One thing that's not being talked about much in regards to Henry is that he was having a knee problem for pretty much all of December. Apparently it's not structural so it should be better next year. While it doesn't excuse every bad play he made, it does provide a context for some of the problems he had in December--sort of like Newman's problems in his second year.
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:29 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetBLACK08
Q. Moses or Jarvis Moss?

Who would you pick up? And Why?
Dear god not another OLB in the first round. We have other needs to address.
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FinChase
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit
I agree. Age at corner does not concern me. The regression in Henry's play does, but I'm not willing to write him off. Cornerback isn't a first round need, but under the right circumstances and the willingness to try Henry at FS, I could see a possibility.
One thing that's not being talked about much in regards to Henry is that he was having a knee problem for pretty much all of December. Apparently it's not structural so it should be better next year. While it doesn't excuse every bad play he made, it does provide a context for some of the problems he had in December--sort of like Newman's problems in his second year.
You have a source for these so-called knee problems...i never heard about this.
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:38 PM    (permalink
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Here is my pick:

1). Amobi Okoye, CB, or Nelson
2). Victor Abiamiri, Jarvis Moss, Anthony Spencer or any push rusher DEs.
3). Daymeion Hughes - Eric Weddle ,
4). Manuel Ramirez, Arron Sears
5). Marvin White, Paul Soliai
7). Aaron Fairooz
7). Jacob Ford
7). Kevin Boss

I know this is no a NBA and this is not going to happen either but I would trade Ellis for Sharpe (need a new captain in the backfield). I also believe that we will extend all three OL contracts.
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Old 01-17-2007, 12:42 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by nrcirc
Here is my pick:

1). Amobi Okoye, CB, or Nelson
2). Victor Abiamiri, Jarvis Moss, Anthony Spencer or any push rusher DEs.
3). Daymeion Hughes - Eric Weddle ,
4). Manuel Ramirez, Arron Sears
5). Marvin White, Paul Soliai
7). Aaron Fairooz
7). Jacob Ford
7). Kevin Boss

I know this is no a NBA and this is not going to happen either but I would trade Ellis for Sharpe (need a new captain in the backfield). I also believe that we will extend all three OL contracts.
Haha good ole nrcirc,
your way off base here.
Okoye will likely be gone...more of a 4-3 NT guy.
All you second rounders will likely be gone say 90% they are
Hughes and Weddle won't fall past 50
Ramirez looks like a solid 3rd right now with little OG depth inthis draft
Sears is a second rounder at this point.

No way a draft happens like this...do a little research man.
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Old 01-17-2007, 01:06 PM    (permalink
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I agree. Age at corner does not concern me. The regression in Henry's play does, but I'm not willing to write him off. Cornerback isn't a first round need, but under the right circumstances and the willingness to try Henry at FS, I could see a possibility.
One thing that's not being talked about much in regards to Henry is that he was having a knee problem for pretty much all of December. Apparently it's not structural so it should be better next year. While it doesn't excuse every bad play he made, it does provide a context for some of the problems he had in December--sort of like Newman's problems in his second year.
You have a source for these so-called knee problems...i never heard about this.
this is from a article by calvin watkins on 1/4/07

Henry says he's OK to play: Despite a right knee that's caused him discomfort for the last month, cornerback Anthony Henry said he's ready to play.

"I feel like I'm not where I want to be, but at the same time I'm all right to play and make plays," Henry said. "I came out of last week's game feeling the same as I do now, so I think I'll be fine."

Henry said his knee could be drained but he would run the risk of an infection, so he will keep icing it down instead.
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Old 01-17-2007, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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Ikaika Alama-Francis in the 2nd or 3rd?
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Old 01-17-2007, 01:09 PM    (permalink
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this is from todd archer on 12/28/06

Then there's the secondary. Anthony Henry had his second pick of the season Monday. But he is playing on a bum knee, which became obvious when he was tracked down from behind on his interception against Philadelphia.
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Old 01-17-2007, 01:13 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thule
Quote:
Originally Posted by nrcirc
Here is my pick:

1). Amobi Okoye, CB, or Nelson
2). Victor Abiamiri, Jarvis Moss, Anthony Spencer or any push rusher DEs.
3). Daymeion Hughes - Eric Weddle ,
4). Manuel Ramirez, Arron Sears
5). Marvin White, Paul Soliai
7). Aaron Fairooz
7). Jacob Ford
7). Kevin Boss

I know this is no a NBA and this is not going to happen either but I would trade Ellis for Sharpe (need a new captain in the backfield). I also believe that we will extend all three OL contracts.
Haha good ole nrcirc,
your way off base here.
Okoye will likely be gone...more of a 4-3 NT guy.
All you second rounders will likely be gone say 90% they are
Hughes and Weddle won't fall past 50
Ramirez looks like a solid 3rd right now with little OG depth inthis draft
Sears is a second rounder at this point.

No way a draft happens like this...do a little research man.
This year drafts are pretty deep and DT always fall a little just like last year. Some people believe Gabe Watson is is a first rounder but ended up being a 4 and Rodright Wright a first day project was a 7. If I said Justin Blalock will be a 2nd, you would said I am crazy.
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Old 01-17-2007, 01:43 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by thule
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinChase
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Originally Posted by D-Unit
I agree. Age at corner does not concern me. The regression in Henry's play does, but I'm not willing to write him off. Cornerback isn't a first round need, but under the right circumstances and the willingness to try Henry at FS, I could see a possibility.
One thing that's not being talked about much in regards to Henry is that he was having a knee problem for pretty much all of December. Apparently it's not structural so it should be better next year. While it doesn't excuse every bad play he made, it does provide a context for some of the problems he had in December--sort of like Newman's problems in his second year.
You have a source for these so-called knee problems...i never heard about this.
Are you serious? It was a well known and well documented fact that he had a bursa sac problem. Don't you usually listen to Parcells' press conferences? He talked about it multiple times.

Not only that, but I don't know w t f people are talking about when they say Henry has been bad. He had a down December, true, but so did nearly every player on the defense, and he was exceptional all throughout the first 3 months. Hell, the guy tied a franchise record for pass deflections this year, and when KC Joyner did an article in mid-November about CBs, he listed Henry as his "Most Underrated" player, and showed that he actually had better metrics - at the time - then Newman did. Anyone who complains about him, imo, is up in the night.
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From what? His leg?
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Old 01-17-2007, 03:42 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by thule
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Originally Posted by FinChase
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit
I agree. Age at corner does not concern me. The regression in Henry's play does, but I'm not willing to write him off. Cornerback isn't a first round need, but under the right circumstances and the willingness to try Henry at FS, I could see a possibility.
One thing that's not being talked about much in regards to Henry is that he was having a knee problem for pretty much all of December. Apparently it's not structural so it should be better next year. While it doesn't excuse every bad play he made, it does provide a context for some of the problems he had in December--sort of like Newman's problems in his second year.
You have a source for these so-called knee problems...i never heard about this.
Are you serious? It was a well known and well documented fact that he had a bursa sac problem. Don't you usually listen to Parcells' press conferences? He talked about it multiple times.

Not only that, but I don't know w t f people are talking about when they say Henry has been bad. He had a down December, true, but so did nearly every player on the defense, and he was exceptional all throughout the first 3 months. Hell, the guy tied a franchise record for pass deflections this year, and when KC Joyner did an article in mid-November about CBs, he listed Henry as his "Most Underrated" player, and showed that he actually had better metrics - at the time - then Newman did. Anyone who complains about him, imo, is up in the night.
Yeah, I don't think CB is our most pressing need--unless we move Henry to FS, and then it moves right to the top of the list.
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Old 01-17-2007, 04:09 PM    (permalink
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so does anybody here care to look back at last years draft and reveiw what coulda been? some people were defending the fasano pick as well as the entire draft. in fact someone who shall remain nameless gave us an A++++++ i said at the time it was average at best and the eagles were killing us. the reason i bring this up is because i was screaming for o-line help and marcus mcneil was there for the taking in the 2nd round. the fact that he just got added to the pro bowl roster makes this even more painful. i was o.k. with the B.C. pick although i was hoping for manny lawson. after that its very open for debate.
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