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Old 11-02-2013, 04:59 PM    (permalink
pocketaces
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You're great at using history when it suits your argument. Too bad you come away flawed most of the time. You're blaming him for not drafting 1st round OL in the 90s while we had the greatest OL of all time. You're suggesting that he didn't value OL just because he didn't use a 1st rounder on OL them...while he dished out huge contract after huge contract on OL.

Then when we do draft OL in the 1st, it's either swept under the rug (Smith) or heavily bashed on (Frederick).

Raise ya game Pocket.
LOL I do? What about you? Jerry is a great GM, he has 3 rings!!!!!! What about all those TERRIBLE drafts, ala 2009? Those were Wades drafts, JJ listens to his coaches. What about Dez and Ware? JJ did a great job!! What about Livings and MB? Those were Callahan signings, he must have seen something he liked... FLIP. FLOP. FLIP. FLOP.

Make NO mistake, JJ had NOTHING to do with the drafts from 89-93. Jimmy was getting ALL the credit and JJ HATED it and fired him because of it. Jimmy never believed in using a 1st round pick on an O-linemen cuz he said you could get similar talent later on.
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:03 PM    (permalink
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Ratliff to the Bears.
What a lying D*ck. Hope he loses all his signing bonus we gave him.
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Old 11-02-2013, 05:36 PM    (permalink
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**** Ratliff. Can't believe he did what he did.
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Old 11-02-2013, 07:06 PM    (permalink
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What a lying D*ck. Hope he loses all his signing bonus we gave him.
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**** Ratliff. Can't believe he did what he did.
No worries. It is a legal matter. Douchebag will get what's coming to him.

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Brandon George @DMN_George
Jerry Jones said he can't get into DT Jay Ratliff injury specifics because "this has now become a legal" matter.
12:17 PM - 17 Oct 2013
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Old 11-03-2013, 01:21 AM    (permalink
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LOL I do? What about you? Jerry is a great GM, he has 3 rings!!!!!! What about all those TERRIBLE drafts, ala 2009? Those were Wades drafts, JJ listens to his coaches. What about Dez and Ware? JJ did a great job!! What about Livings and MB? Those were Callahan signings, he must have seen something he liked... FLIP. FLOP. FLIP. FLOP.

Make NO mistake, JJ had NOTHING to do with the drafts from 89-93. Jimmy was getting ALL the credit and JJ HATED it and fired him because of it. Jimmy never believed in using a 1st round pick on an O-linemen cuz he said you could get similar talent later on.
If Jerry were left alone, I think he would be a terrible drafter. I don't think he has a good idea of grading college prospects.

But he doesn't make those decisions alone. Do people really think that happens every year? Wake up if you do. You won't find me bashing Jerry for the draft because I don't think those decisions belong to him. Draft trades? Sure, I'll grade him on that. He's a business man and he will play the asset management game. But on the players drafted, sorry I won't really go there. Not to credit him or bash him.

If you tell me he wanted Ware, I'll say it was Ireland that wanted Ware. Almost every other day we talk about liking Garrett because of his drafts. Not Jerry's drafts. Garrett's drafts! We talk about the DL moves and we credit Marinelli, not Jerry! OL pick ups like Livings/Mack... it's on Callahan... a fool would look at them and pin it on Jerry. We don't talk about the Parcells era being Jerry's drafts. Those were Parcells/Ireland drafts. During Wade's era, I call those the Wade/Ciskowski's drafts. Larry Lacewell has been a bad voice around here for years. Won't see me flip flopping on Jimmy's era either. Fully credit Jimmy for those drafts. ...and yeah, I believe Jerry fired him for taking the credit because I do believe Jerry was behind the Hershel Walker trade. Jimmy might've done the heavy lifting, but Jerry wasn't without credit either. Their success was a joint venture. That said, I'm way over that situation. The bottom line is that Jerry listens to what his staff tells him in regards to players drafted and signed. ...and if they get him hyped up enough and he can get his hands on a stud, he won't pinch pennies to get them here.

If you want to blame him for the coaches, I'm all in there. If you want to blame him for all the years of failure, then yeah, he deserves it because he hasn't made the right moves at head coach, made some bad trades and gave out contracts that didn't work. But once you start getting into blaming him for players drafted aka "Jerry doesn't draft OL in Round 1", then you lose me.

If you want to hope for a solution to the problem, hope he makes the right moves at HC and Scouting Director first off. We can blame Jerry for old contracts, but Stephen has now taken over so the finger goes that way now. Don't like our draft board, blame the Scouts. Don't like trades... well, yeah.. I think that's Jerry's domain, so go for it. But it would be fruitless to hope for a change at the top. That's never gonna happen. ...and ultimately to blame Jerry about our players is such a shallow and lazy argument.
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Old 11-03-2013, 09:27 AM    (permalink
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So when it comes to the most important time of the year, we have NO GM is what your telling me huh? Jerrah doesent even need to be in the war room then, right? After all if there is a player a coach wants he would be able to make a trade up or down. As a matter of fact SJ not JJ made the trade in this years draft, no? So to recap. JJ sucks at hiring coaches (except his 1st one) and then lets said coaches run the team? Parcells wanted Spears, now your saying JJ ignored him and went with Ware because of Ireland. Now the HC is pissed because his voice was passed over. I wonder whos idea it was to not listen to his HC and pick up T.O.? I wonder who wanted Quincy in the 2nd round against the scouts advice? I wonder if the HC or scouts were begging JJ to give up two first round picks for Galloway? I wonder if the HC or scouts were telling JJ to give up all those picks for Roy Williams?

I guess when you have a puppet at GM we all have ideas of who to blame and the reasons for long time failures because we are all really just guessing on how things are run. Most NFL teams have a power structure and a defined way of doing things and knowing what their jobs are. Here, we just guess and wonder, which is dysfunction at its worst. No wonder we are stuck in a .500 rut....
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Old 11-03-2013, 09:31 AM    (permalink
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If you want to hope for a solution to the problem, hope he makes the right moves at HC and Scouting Director first off. We can blame Jerry for old contracts, but Stephen has now taken over so the finger goes that way now.

Don't like our draft board, blame the Scouts. Don't like trades... well, yeah.. I think that's Jerry's domain, so go for it. But it would be fruitless to hope for a change at the top. That's never gonna happen. ...and ultimately to blame Jerry about our players is such a shallow and lazy argument.
I think one of Jerry's weaknesses is that he wants to make the big splash or be annointed for finding the next great things. It is the entrepreneur mentality that you have to take big risk and fish unchartered waters to get break ground on something the competition doesn't have yet. If you look at the HC Jerry has hired since firing Landry you have Jimmy Johnson, a hot commodity in the college ranks but ZERO experience in the NFL prior. You can put Barry Switzer in with Jimmy with zero NFL coaching experience. You have Chan Gailey/Jason Garrett who were lifetime offensive assistant guru's on the rise and Dave Campo who had a ton of success coaching under Jimmy Johnson. Wade Phillips had great NFL bloodlines, coaching experience for decades and even some short term HC gigs but was hired mostly because the decision whether the Tuna would be back took so long. Parcells is the only "experienced and successful" NFL head coach that Jerry has installed to take over the team and the power struggle between the two made it a very short marriage.

That mentality also plays a roll in how we draft. Jerry has "overrulled" our scouting dept on several occasions to swing for the potential star or trade out of a spot in an attempt to make a blockbuster deal. It works both ways, it helped us to get Dez and Ware but it also leads to decisions like Jason Williams and Robert Brewster. We trade down with a huge hole at RB with Steven Jackson on the board to get Julius Jones or we trade down with Floyd on the board and get Frederick and T-Will.

Even though he has let some control go down to Stephen and the personel dept he still will drop the hammer when and where he wants. That being said we should expect that by now since he has been this way for the last 25 years.

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Old 11-03-2013, 10:13 AM    (permalink
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I never fully understood why Jimmy Johnson departed the Cowboys because I was a kiddo then. I've been reading about it over the last week and came across this great article. http://si.com/vault/article/magazine...5069/index.htm

I imagine most already knew about this or maybe have already read the article, but I found it to be really interesting!
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Old 11-03-2013, 10:24 AM    (permalink
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Read boys will be boys....great insight to how Jerry came to own and assemble the 90s cowboys.
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Old 11-03-2013, 10:43 AM    (permalink
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Headed to church now, dvr ' the ggme. Hope we are ready to bounce back. Still gotta bad taste in my mouth.
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Old 11-03-2013, 10:44 AM    (permalink
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I never fully understood why Jimmy Johnson departed the Cowboys because I was a kiddo then. I've been reading about it over the last week and came across this great article. http://si.com/vault/article/magazine...5069/index.htm

I imagine most already knew about this or maybe have already read the article, but I found it to be really interesting!
Fun read. I was young and dumb back then too. Thanks for sharing.

Pocket, was that you sending Jerry the death threats? Or was it Bob? haha jk.
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Old 11-03-2013, 10:48 AM    (permalink
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I think one of Jerry's weaknesses is that he wants to make the big splash or be annointed for finding the next great things. It is the entrepreneur mentality that you have to take big risk and fish unchartered waters to get break ground on something the competition doesn't have yet. If you look at the HC Jerry has hired since firing Landry you have Jimmy Johnson, a hot commodity in the college ranks but ZERO experience in the NFL prior. You can put Barry Switzer in with Jimmy with zero NFL coaching experience. You have Chan Gailey/Jason Garrett who were lifetime offensive assistant guru's on the rise and Dave Campo who had a ton of success coaching under Jimmy Johnson. Wade Phillips had great NFL bloodlines, coaching experience for decades and even some short term HC gigs but was hired mostly because the decision whether the Tuna would be back took so long. Parcells is the only "experienced and successful" NFL head coach that Jerry has installed to take over the team and the power struggle between the two made it a very short marriage.

That mentality also plays a roll in how we draft. Jerry has "overrulled" our scouting dept on several occasions to swing for the potential star or trade out of a spot in an attempt to make a blockbuster deal. It works both ways, it helped us to get Dez and Ware but it also leads to decisions like Jason Williams and Robert Brewster. We trade down with a huge hole at RB with Steven Jackson on the board to get Julius Jones or we trade down with Floyd on the board and get Frederick and T-Will.

Even though he has let some control go down to Stephen and the personel dept he still will drop the hammer when and where he wants. That being said we should expect that by now since he has been this way for the last 25 years.
Yeah, I agree. Jerry "Big Splash" Jones should be put on his tombstone.

When Jerry fired Landry and hired Jimmy, I bet he said.... "CANNONBALL!!!!"
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Old 11-03-2013, 11:08 AM    (permalink
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Apparently, Jerry Jones was close to owning the Chargers fresh out of college with zero cash but his dad found out and talked him out of it.

“The thing I could do better than anything back then was borrow money,” Jerry Jones said, recalling the moment more than 47 years later.

Lol

Thanks freshboy, I'll get boys will be boys off of amazon.
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Old 11-03-2013, 11:32 AM    (permalink
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Fun read. I was young and dumb back then too. Thanks for sharing.

Pocket, was that you sending Jerry the death threats? Or was it Bob? haha jk.
I was actually a JJ suporter for years. Even had arguments with Bob about him. But there comes a point (18 years?) where you just have to admit its not working (132-132) There is no swagger, there is no fear of losing, there is no accountability. Something needs to change.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:04 PM    (permalink
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So when it comes to the most important time of the year, we have NO GM is what your telling me huh? Jerrah doesent even need to be in the war room then, right? After all if there is a player a coach wants he would be able to make a trade up or down. As a matter of fact SJ not JJ made the trade in this years draft, no? So to recap. JJ sucks at hiring coaches (except his 1st one) and then lets said coaches run the team? Parcells wanted Spears, now your saying JJ ignored him and went with Ware because of Ireland. Now the HC is pissed because his voice was passed over. I wonder whos idea it was to not listen to his HC and pick up T.O.? I wonder who wanted Quincy in the 2nd round against the scouts advice? I wonder if the HC or scouts were begging JJ to give up two first round picks for Galloway? I wonder if the HC or scouts were telling JJ to give up all those picks for Roy Williams?

I guess when you have a puppet at GM we all have ideas of who to blame and the reasons for long time failures because we are all really just guessing on how things are run. Most NFL teams have a power structure and a defined way of doing things and knowing what their jobs are. Here, we just guess and wonder, which is dysfunction at its worst. No wonder we are stuck in a .500 rut....
I know you're being sarcastic, but you're kind of right. lol. In the traditional sense of having a GM in the room, no, we don't have that. There is not a single voice of opinion making all the picks or doing all the trades. Some coaches around the league have no voice at all when it comes to making the picks.

But look, we hear it from the guys in the room every year, THEY MAKE DECISIONS AS A GROUP. That doesn't mean they all agree on every move made. That doesn't mean if the HC doesn't get his way that there is now consternation. There's no doubt that there is frequent disagreement on which pick to make, but that doesn't equate to all of a sudden the HC is mad at the Jerry. You're recap up top is terrible. Your thoughts are so misguided it's not even funny. You simply can't point out one move and define that as how things are done here. Yeah, Bill was overruled on Ware, but he wasn't overruled when he wanted to pass on Steven Jackson to get his boys Julius Jones and Jacob Rogers. Nor when he drafted Bobby Carpenter. Wade came in the following year and took his guy Spencer. Sure, Jerry wanted TO, Galloway, and Roy. He likes shiny things! That's how we got Dez too. Scouts get their say too. Jason Williams and every small school guy ever drafted can attest.

If you want to blame the guy up top, then fine. But don't say silly things like "Jerry doesn't draft 1st Round OL" or act like HC's don't have a huge say in the War Room.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:13 PM    (permalink
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I was actually a JJ suporter for years. Even had arguments with Bob about him. But there comes a point (18 years?) where you just have to admit its not working (132-132) There is no swagger, there is no fear of losing, there is no accountability. Something needs to change.
I'm pretty sure you are Bob. lol

Defense just did their job. Now let's see this offense do theirs.

Which Romo showed up today?
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:17 PM    (permalink
E-Man
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Randle just got jacked up. lol
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:19 PM    (permalink
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Helmet to helmet too.

Then Dez drops a catch-able ball in the red zone. Same ol Dallas. At least the Vikings suck. Ideally Romo puts that ahead of him but the weakside LB may have been in the way but Dez is a probowl WR there's no excuse for dropping that.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:24 PM    (permalink
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E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
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I wonder why they're starting Sims over Carter.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:26 PM    (permalink
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I'm going to be sick. Ponder is eating our secondary alive.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:27 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Unit View Post
I know you're being sarcastic, but you're kind of right. lol. In the traditional sense of having a GM in the room, no, we don't have that. There is not a single voice of opinion making all the picks or doing all the trades. Some coaches around the league have no voice at all when it comes to making the picks.

But look, we hear it from the guys in the room every year, THEY MAKE DECISIONS AS A GROUP. That doesn't mean they all agree on every move made. That doesn't mean if the HC doesn't get his way that there is now consternation. There's no doubt that there is frequent disagreement on which pick to make, but that doesn't equate to all of a sudden the HC is mad at the Jerry. You're recap up top is terrible. Your thoughts are so misguided it's not even funny. You simply can't point out one move and define that as how things are done here. Yeah, Bill was overruled on Ware, but he wasn't overruled when he wanted to pass on Steven Jackson to get his boys Julius Jones and Jacob Rogers. Nor when he drafted Bobby Carpenter. Wade came in the following year and took his guy Spencer. Sure, Jerry wanted TO, Galloway, and Roy. He likes shiny things! That's how we got Dez too. Scouts get their say too. Jason Williams and every small school guy ever drafted can attest.

If you want to blame the guy up top, then fine. But don't say silly things like "Jerry doesn't draft 1st Round OL" or act like HC's don't have a huge say in the War Room.
You can defend, deflect, ignore, all you want. The only question that really matters is, is it working? The last 18 years say NO. I blame JJ, you blame who you want or maybe your ok with medicroty. Im not sure.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:35 PM    (permalink
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*Sigh* These guys are terrible with momentum. Whenever the other team starts to look decent they don't answer like they should.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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This is a lovely start
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:37 PM    (permalink
E-Man
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E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
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These soft zones keep killing me! Why are they giving 5 yard cushions on 3rd and 3? They've been doing that for years. Geez.
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:43 PM    (permalink
E-Man
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E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.E-Man is kind of a big deal around here, people know him.
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Bruce Carter makes two nice plays, so naturally they'll sit him on the next drive.
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Da riddum is too much for you.
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