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Old 12-16-2007, 09:38 PM    (permalink
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We have a first round bye clinched D...
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Old 12-16-2007, 09:43 PM    (permalink
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You guys should take easy these next two weeks and rest your players. :)
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Old 12-16-2007, 10:52 PM    (permalink
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Yeah the bye is clinched, home field is not.
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Old 12-17-2007, 12:54 AM    (permalink
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Well here it is...three years down the road.

It's time to go back and take a look at the trade we made with the Bills to see who won.

We traded back and landed Julius Jones.

The following year with the Bills pick we selected Marcus Spears.

The question becomes would you rather have Spears and Jones or Steven Jackson....easy decision for me...we made the wrong move.
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:24 AM    (permalink
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Well here it is...three years down the road.

It's time to go back and take a look at the trade we made with the Bills to see who won.

We traded back and landed Julius Jones.

The following year with the Bills pick we selected Marcus Spears.

The question becomes would you rather have Spears and Jones or Steven Jackson....easy decision for me...we made the wrong move.
Def. the wrong move.

Parcells was still living in the past with his evaluation of players from Notre Dame. He thought he was getting some well disciplined, good character guy in Julius Jones and he really got a whiny baby who blames others for his shortcomings. Same as Spears as far as his attitude goes.

Thank God Jerry pushed for demarcus at 11 and spears at 20... If we were sitting here now looking back and saying "we could have have Jackson and Ware" it would be 10X worse
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:27 AM    (permalink
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Def. the wrong move.

Parcells was still living in the past with his evaluation of players from Notre Dame. He thought he was getting some well disciplined, good character guy in Julius Jones and he really got a whiny baby who blames others for his shortcomings. Same as Spears as far as his attitude goes.

Thank God Jerry pushed for demarcus at 11 and spears at 20... If we were sitting here now looking back and saying "we could have have Jackson and Ware" it would be 10X worse
If I look at it like that wow...that makes it sound better...yet another great jerry move. I just hopes he gets us McFadden...I don't care if it costs 3 firsts and a player...It needs to happen.
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:34 AM    (permalink
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If I look at it like that wow...that makes it sound better...yet another great jerry move. I just hopes he gets us McFadden...I don't care if it costs 3 firsts and a player...It needs to happen.
I would like to have him on the team, that is for sure.

I wish we would cut this JJ crap out and start using Marion full time though. We really only gave him 1 game to show that he could be a "close to full time" back and the o-line didn't give him much help. I want to know what he really is.

The only reason I say this is because I complain about not having a new CB every year and I finally thought this year CB would be automatic in the first.

McFadden will probably do things Barber never will do, but if Barber can be a pro-bowl caliber RB in the NFC Im not sure that I would rather have McFadden over Barber + 3 draft picks including a CB.

Its a tough call. McFadden has the potential to be a superstar and could make this offense more potent than the pats, but at what cost to our defense?

EDIT: for all the crap jerry gets, he is the reason T-new is here and he is the reason Ware is here. I know he has done some stupid stuff (overpaying FA, Joey Galloway trade) but we would be hating Bill Parcells right now had we gone with what he wanted in a few of the draft picks.
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:53 AM    (permalink
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I would like to have him on the team, that is for sure.

I wish we would cut this JJ crap out and start using Marion full time though. We really only gave him 1 game to show that he could be a "close to full time" back and the o-line didn't give him much help. I want to know what he really is.

The only reason I say this is because I complain about not having a new CB every year and I finally thought this year CB would be automatic in the first.

McFadden will probably do things Barber never will do, but if Barber can be a pro-bowl caliber RB in the NFC Im not sure that I would rather have McFadden over Barber + 3 draft picks including a CB.

Its a tough call. McFadden has the potential to be a superstar and could make this offense more potent than the pats, but at what cost to our defense?

EDIT: for all the crap jerry gets, he is the reason T-new is here and he is the reason Ware is here. I know he has done some stupid stuff (overpaying FA, Joey Galloway trade) but we would be hating Bill Parcells right now had we gone with what he wanted in a few of the draft picks.
Ya, while I think that McFadden is going to cost us ALOT. I really can't say it would be too much. Unless a back really impresses me up before the draft...I don't see an upgrade over a back like JJ. Sure Stewart might be an upgrade...but we don't know forsure...we would be taking a gamble. So while I would love to just draft a guy like Jones...I really can't say that it would be an upgrade...and we'd be able to run the ball more than pass and win. Right now our coaching staff doesn't believe we can do that. We don't run against 8 man fronts...and when we do it's unsuccessful.

Now I think it's become pretty obvious that we use the pass to set up the run...but if we are down by 4 points...and our defense is playing top notch ball....and our QB and Center are injured...we better have the confidence in our runningbacks to get first downs. Now you have to run the ball more than once in the 4th quarter...I mean we were down by a measily 4 pts...that was nothing..and romo was off all night.

Give me McFadden. I would trade both of our firsts and a future first plus carp for him. Basically 4 first round picks. What's it really cost us....well we lose a special teamer in Carp...which I think he plays a big part in. We lose 2 picks this year....but I think a CB is a lock...so lets say a guy like Mike Jenkins. Our 2nd pick in the first could go anywhere....Jerry says he wants offensive playmakers...so I would guess a WR...but we could go OT like D wants. We could even take a DL...but we have invested there quite a bit.

Do you see my point...our 2nd pick is almost like a luxary anyways...a WR that might not even break the top 3.....a CB that would be a nickel back...a OT to groom for the future...although we went there twice last year...and look to resign out LT for a couple more years.

I just don't think we give up all that much. If anything it might hurt us next year not having that first round pick....but it's almost a lock that we'll have a pick in the 25-32 range next year(barring huge injury only Romo takes us out of this range I think). We lose a backup player who hasn't really seen a snap all year. And we miss out on a nickel corner.

So when it comes down to it....you really have to ask yourself. Would you give up Carp....

What is your CB board like....is there really a big difference between a guy like Jenkins and a guy like Flowers.

Are you going to give up a pick in the top half of the draft next year?

I can honestly give positive answers to all of those questions. Only 2 CB's really are above the rest....and I'm less and less sold on that every day. We will have a late pick in 09...and Carp isn't anything but a special teamer.

So when it comes down to business....you resign your guys before FA...maybe make a splash for one guy....thinking maybe a WR to stretch the field...but we really don't even need to dip into FA this year.

With the reports coming out that we are looking to resign 3 or 4 more of our teams FA's...I think this draft is really becoming more clear. If guys like Reeves and Crayton and Flozell are being brought back...then I think it is about a 50% chance we are going to make a strong push for McFadden.
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:59 AM    (permalink
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Keep the starters in until the games are put away. You never want to go into the playoffs on a losing streak or questionable end to the season. We did that last year and everyone was on Tony's case for crumbling at the end of the season. We need to finish out STRONG.
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Old 12-17-2007, 04:54 AM    (permalink
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If Tony continues to play like this...Jessica has gotta go.

In all seriousness though, you could kind of tell where this game was going from the beginning. Reminded me a lot of the Bills game, Tony missed a sure TD pass early and Sammy dropped a ball that he def. should have caught, he needs to learn to bring that ball into his body. When Tony misses those early opportunities or throws early costly picks (redzone INT), it does take him a while to get his groove back...and the thumb injury didnt help at all either. This was a real rough one...but, i wouldnt be worried just yet. I really think this team needed another loss to be honest...it will only help these guys....and Terry will be back soon so, it's all good...we're going to be fine.

Just wanted to add...Julius had no where to run today...be it a simple dive or pitch, our line gave him nothing...again.
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Old 12-17-2007, 04:57 AM    (permalink
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One last thing...people talk about how penalty prone Adams is, how about Colombo? The dude is a false start machine, this is becoming a theme with him.
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Old 12-17-2007, 09:16 AM    (permalink
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Thats two weeks of not much to NO involvement from Terrell Owens. I realise that Witten is catching everything thrown in his direction. But we just arent using our best and most talented reciever enough. Even with double coverage you still have to give T.O the opportunity to do something with the ball...
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Old 12-17-2007, 09:21 AM    (permalink
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Thats two weeks of not much to NO involvement from Terrell Owens. I realise that Witten is catching everything thrown in his direction. But we just arent using our best and most talented reciever enough. Even with double coverage you still have to give T.O the opportunity to do something with the ball...
Well he was thrown to 9-10 times yesterday, and either it be due to drops or Romo being way off on his throw, we couldn't capitalize on it.
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Old 12-17-2007, 09:24 AM    (permalink
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One last thing...people talk about how penalty prone Adams is, how about Colombo? The dude is a false start machine, this is becoming a theme with him.
2 on Colombo and 1 on Flozell yesterday I believe. Extremely stupid problem to have, especially at home.
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Old 12-17-2007, 12:16 PM    (permalink
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Well he was thrown to 9-10 times yesterday, and either it be due to drops or Romo being way off on his throw, we couldn't capitalize on it.
Admittedly I lost my connection for the second half of the game. But it seemed like Sam Hurd was targeted far more early on...
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Old 12-17-2007, 12:20 PM    (permalink
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Thats two weeks of not much to NO involvement from Terrell Owens. I realise that Witten is catching everything thrown in his direction. But we just arent using our best and most talented reciever enough. Even with double coverage you still have to give T.O the opportunity to do something with the ball...

I think you have to give Philly some credit. They have two very good CBs and Crayton just doesn't give a good CB much of a threat. I think a game like yesterday makes you see why we need Glenn back.
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:19 PM    (permalink
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The reason why we lost was because Jason Garrett COMPLETELY abandoned the running game with Marion Barber and Julia Jones got too many touches.

When your QB is having a bad day, you RUN the ball. Especially in a tight game. Geez.
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:24 PM    (permalink
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I agree D-unit. I kept thinking one of two things. Either go no huddle and try to get Tony into some rhythum or just try to grind it out some with Barber.
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Old 12-17-2007, 01:41 PM    (permalink
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Ya, while I think that McFadden is going to cost us ALOT. I really can't say it would be too much. Unless a back really impresses me up before the draft...I don't see an upgrade over a back like JJ. Sure Stewart might be an upgrade...but we don't know forsure...we would be taking a gamble. So while I would love to just draft a guy like Jones...I really can't say that it would be an upgrade...and we'd be able to run the ball more than pass and win. Right now our coaching staff doesn't believe we can do that. We don't run against 8 man fronts...and when we do it's unsuccessful.

Now I think it's become pretty obvious that we use the pass to set up the run...but if we are down by 4 points...and our defense is playing top notch ball....and our QB and Center are injured...we better have the confidence in our runningbacks to get first downs. Now you have to run the ball more than once in the 4th quarter...I mean we were down by a measily 4 pts...that was nothing..and romo was off all night.

Give me McFadden. I would trade both of our firsts and a future first plus carp for him. Basically 4 first round picks. What's it really cost us....well we lose a special teamer in Carp...which I think he plays a big part in. We lose 2 picks this year....but I think a CB is a lock...so lets say a guy like Mike Jenkins. Our 2nd pick in the first could go anywhere....Jerry says he wants offensive playmakers...so I would guess a WR...but we could go OT like D wants. We could even take a DL...but we have invested there quite a bit.

Do you see my point...our 2nd pick is almost like a luxary anyways...a WR that might not even break the top 3.....a CB that would be a nickel back...a OT to groom for the future...although we went there twice last year...and look to resign out LT for a couple more years.

I just don't think we give up all that much. If anything it might hurt us next year not having that first round pick....but it's almost a lock that we'll have a pick in the 25-32 range next year(barring huge injury only Romo takes us out of this range I think). We lose a backup player who hasn't really seen a snap all year. And we miss out on a nickel corner.

So when it comes down to it....you really have to ask yourself. Would you give up Carp....

What is your CB board like....is there really a big difference between a guy like Jenkins and a guy like Flowers.

Are you going to give up a pick in the top half of the draft next year?

I can honestly give positive answers to all of those questions. Only 2 CB's really are above the rest....and I'm less and less sold on that every day. We will have a late pick in 09...and Carp isn't anything but a special teamer.

So when it comes down to business....you resign your guys before FA...maybe make a splash for one guy....thinking maybe a WR to stretch the field...but we really don't even need to dip into FA this year.

With the reports coming out that we are looking to resign 3 or 4 more of our teams FA's...I think this draft is really becoming more clear. If guys like Reeves and Crayton and Flozell are being brought back...then I think it is about a 50% chance we are going to make a strong push for McFadden.
The only thing holding me back from being 100% on board with this is that we dont know who marion barber is.

If he is just a "half of the load" complimentary back, than yes McFadden is worth whatever we have to pay. But if he is pro bowl caliber as I said before then Im not sure than I want him.

I look at it like this -- We get Mcfadden and that is pretty much the extent of our draft

OR

we find out what barber is, and if he pans out we keep him, get a CB plus some luxury picks, possibly a replacement for Julius Jones to take 5-7 carries a game.

McFadden Vs. Barber+CB+another first is what we are looking at.

Barber really is the make or break guy for everything. If I knew what Barber was it would be a no brainer, but I dont.

EDIT: How nice would it be if Barber turned out to be capable of shouldering the load and we Somehow got Kenny Phillips with our first pick, CB BPA with our second first, and a complimentary RB in the 2nd.... Of course this means we found something to do with roy williams, which isnt happening but it would be sick to see Hamlin at SS and Phillips at FS

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Old 12-17-2007, 04:51 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Burns336 View Post
The only thing holding me back from being 100% on board with this is that we dont know who marion barber is.

If he is just a "half of the load" complimentary back, than yes McFadden is worth whatever we have to pay. But if he is pro bowl caliber as I said before then Im not sure than I want him.

I look at it like this -- We get Mcfadden and that is pretty much the extent of our draft

OR

we find out what barber is, and if he pans out we keep him, get a CB plus some luxury picks, possibly a replacement for Julius Jones to take 5-7 carries a game.

McFadden Vs. Barber+CB+another first is what we are looking at.

Barber really is the make or break guy for everything. If I knew what Barber was it would be a no brainer, but I dont.
I love barber as much as the rest...but he is a RFA after this year and will be due for FA in 09. So while I love him...I know if he turns out we are going ot have to pony up for him. Like you said if he is capable being the starter which I think he is it might be worth it. But I think the main reason barber hasn't been the feature back...is because he tends to move laterally too much. Now this isn't a huge problem with his because he is so hard to get to the ground...but if he is touching the ball 20+ times a game he could cost us a drive or two...which is points. Add that in to the fact...that he doesn't have game-breaking speed I think he is what he is. 50% of the running snaps is about right...put him with a guy like Maroney or McFadden...you have a serious tandem. But I just don't think you want him as a featured back...because of how lateral he tends to go.

You make it sound like with trading all those picks our draft is just McFadden. That isn't correct...because we have a 2nd round pick...and as I stated earlier...it's how you view this crop of CB's...if you don't see much seperation...then your not worried about waiting till the 2nd. That is really how it is set up right now.

So by trading your 1st round picks...you really put a lot of trust into your scouting department. Because lets face it if we landed a premier running back...and by premier I mean elite...LT good. And a 2nd tier CB...is it really that big of difference. Your more than likely going to be getting another player and a 2nd tier CB at our picks anyways. So basically you have to look a the other baggage...Carp and the 09 first...that is what it really comes down too imo.

You said it like this
McFadden Vs. Barber+CB+another first is what we are looking at.

I say it like this
McFadden and 2nd tier CB Vs. Barber+CB+another first+2nd day RB

The only thing that makes me weary of this trade is the #1 draft pick salary. That is going to be a ton of money....esspecially for a running back...you only pay that type of money for a QB/LT/CB so this is what worries me.
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Old 12-17-2007, 06:47 PM    (permalink
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If we get McFadden, I'll be happy, but disappointed at the same time. If we don't get him, I'll just be happy. lol.

My preference is to pass on DMAC.

Barber is the man. There's no other way to put it. He's terribly undervalued by the guys on this board who think he's expendable, not worth the big contract or think he's replaceable. Fact of the matter is that he will cost big money to resign and he deserves it. There's no other RB in the NFL like him. Period. My only concern is that Jerry might be a fool and offer him something outrageously low that offends him and makes him want to shop elsewhere, where someone will appreciate him more.

I dunno if people realize this, but Barber is being severely underused. He can be so much more than what we've seen. It's terribly obvious to me that the reigns are being held back on him too tight. In my opinion he should be getting 75% of the snaps. Getting DMAC only keeps Barber on the bench more and I'm not in favor of that one bit.

Grab a RB in Round 3-5 and let him be happy taking 25% of the snaps and be ready to be the starter in case of an injury to Barber. That's all a complimentary back needs to be. We say we like DMAC because he is explosive, but he's not the only back like that in the draft. IMO, Alridge is the best fit for us, because he offers more to the table than DMAC as far as being an excellent downfield receiver.

Barber's heart epitomizes the kind of passion I'd like to see in every Cowboys player. I hope he retires a Cowboy very very badly.
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Old 12-17-2007, 06:54 PM    (permalink
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I really am disgusted by this article:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3158901

"It's frustrating right now. This is the part of the season that is going to be an emotional letdown," Romo said after the Eagles game.

It's just that Dallas struggled late in that Nov. 29 showdown against the Packers, and in the two games since. (From the article)

BTW, Roy has been suspended for 1 game.
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Old 12-17-2007, 06:54 PM    (permalink
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Williams has been suspended for one game, according to Mort on ESPN.
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Old 12-17-2007, 06:56 PM    (permalink
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Keyshawn just said flatly that Roy should be suspended. What a traitor.
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Old 12-17-2007, 06:58 PM    (permalink
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Lets hypothetically say we move up for DMAC... do you guys think Cason will still be on the board with our second pick?

I know he isn't rated as high as some of the other guys but I look at him as a young anthony henry. Hes long, lanky, and has a similar body type to henry. He has great ball skills. His main knock is that he may not have elite speed, but in this pressure oriented defense a bigger, more physical corner with good ball skills may be just what the doctor ordered.
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