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Old 02-11-2008, 02:58 PM    (permalink
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I still have dmn paper clippings of Roy signing with UT out of Odessa back in 01 I believe with BJ Johnson, and I loved the wr he turned into...Catches with his hands not with his body, and will punish a db after the catch...He loves running with the ball so he's a versatile guy, I can only imagine how creative Garrett could get with him and TO on opposite sides with Witten in the middle...So many options, and I have no doubt if Roy came here he would be a pro bowler, 1100 yds and 8 tds at the least...

Him and TO would present mis-matches with dbs and that leaves us with the endzone fade on both sides, or quick screens to let them run with the ball...We havent even seem him play his best ball yet, he was just starting to hit his stride last year before he hurt his knee.
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Old 02-11-2008, 05:46 PM    (permalink
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Todd Archer re: tagging Flozell. See what you think of it now

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How about naming Ken Hamlin the franchise player? It would cost the Cowboys half as much $4.396 million) to tag Hamlin than it would be to tag Adams ($9 million). And if they were to give Adams the franchise tag, then that would eat up just about all of their remaining cap room. Then the team would have to re-work a ton of contracts to come up with more room to sign free agents.
Yikes. Sounds to me like the best options are either to let Flo go, or to get him to sign some sort of longer term deal. Good luck signing that big corner you guys all want if you also franchise Flozell. Or trading for Williams or Rogers. Not a great situation, and it sounds like most of us on this board aren't really being cap conscious when we speak about free agency.
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Old 02-11-2008, 05:54 PM    (permalink
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Todd Archer re: tagging Flozell. See what you think of it now



Yikes. Sounds to me like the best options are either to let Flo go, or to get him to sign some sort of longer term deal. Good luck signing that big corner you guys all want if you also franchise Flozell. Or trading for Williams or Rogers. Not a great situation, and it sounds like most of us on this board aren't really being cap conscious when we speak about free agency.
I HATE the idea of franchising Flo. I don't want him signed for more than a 1 year contract. If we must, sign him to a longer contract, with the intention of cutting him after this next season. Back load the contract and pay him beans in his first year with a VERY minimal signing bonus.

We need to draft a LT on Day 1. It's critical.
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:06 PM    (permalink
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I HATE the idea of franchising Flo. I don't want him signed for more than a 1 year contract. If we must, sign him to a longer contract, with the intention of cutting him after this next season. Back load the contract and pay him beans in his first year with a VERY minimal signing bonus.

We need to draft a LT on Day 1. It's critical.
Of course if that's our intention, Flo and his agent would never sign that type of a deal.

I think we need to say goodbye to Flo. I hate it, but sometimes you have to follow the Pats model of making cold-hearted business decisions.

Now as for the player at LT, D-Unit and I disagree on who that should be. I personally don't think there will be anyone available when we pick that would better than Free or McQuistan on day one. I think, at some point, you have to trust your draft. Not to mention you have the highest paid OL coach in the league. He should be able to get either Free or McQuistan close to that level.
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:07 PM    (permalink
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I HATE the idea of franchising Flo. I don't want him signed for more than a 1 year contract. If we must, sign him to a longer contract, with the intention of cutting him after this next season. Back load the contract and pay him beans in his first year with a VERY minimal signing bonus.

We need to draft a LT on Day 1. It's critical.
did everyone forget we did that THIS year??
james marten and doug free anyone??
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:08 PM    (permalink
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Marten is not a LT, but I think Free has the athleticism to be a very good LT.
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:08 PM    (permalink
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I HATE the idea of franchising Flo. I don't want him signed for more than a 1 year contract. If we must, sign him to a longer contract, with the intention of cutting him after this next season. Back load the contract and pay him beans in his first year with a VERY minimal signing bonus.

We need to draft a LT on Day 1. It's critical.
I think that's pretty good reasoning. I'm not totally sure about it being critical that we draft a LT on Day 1, because I have some confidence in McQuistan and Free. I think that one should be able to do the job. I think that drafting a left tackle (Anthony Collins is my personal favorite right now) on Day 1 would be beneficial if we don't resign Flo, but in no way do I think it to be critical, especially if Adams is retained.
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:22 PM    (permalink
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Flo has NOT BEEN FRANCHISED YET..

That article, which I was about to post, does make and interesting point. Also, it states that Franchising Flo would take away pretty much all of our cap room....
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:24 PM    (permalink
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Heard that Capers wont be on our staff this year as a consultant, hopefully he doesnt get any other job offers this season, we will surely find room for him next year...If/When Garrett gets promoted I really want him to bring Capers along with him.
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Old 02-11-2008, 06:54 PM    (permalink
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Marten is not a LT, but I think Free has the athleticism to be a very good LT.
I've seen some sites that I respect a lot that gave Free a late 2nd-early 3rd round grade last season. One even had him as the #5 tackle prospect in the draft. I think he's got pretty substantial upside, as does McQuistan (although his twin brother, Paul, hasn't lived up to that upside with more chances than Pat's been given). Free may have gone higher in the draft if there hadn't been concerns about his competition. In any case, I certainly think he has the potential to be a starting LT in this league, and a fairly good one. Nevertheless, I wouldn't be opposed to selecting another guy who could compete for the job.
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Old 02-11-2008, 11:59 PM    (permalink
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did everyone forget we did that THIS year??
james marten and doug free anyone??
Day 1 this year means Rounds 1 and 2. I think you're on an island of your own if you think we spent a 1st or 2nd rounder on Marten and Free.

Marten is our RT. Free as our starting LT means, no superbowl.
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Old 02-12-2008, 12:01 AM    (permalink
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I think that's pretty good reasoning. I'm not totally sure about it being critical that we draft a LT on Day 1, because I have some confidence in McQuistan and Free. I think that one should be able to do the job. I think that drafting a left tackle (Anthony Collins is my personal favorite right now) on Day 1 would be beneficial if we don't resign Flo, but in no way do I think it to be critical, especially if Adams is retained.
That's interesting because I just so happened to select Anthony Collins in the forum mock! :D
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Old 02-12-2008, 12:10 AM    (permalink
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So fanchising Hamlin is the new hype, huh?

Well thats nice... Jerry tells him if he plays well he will get paid well. He goes out and plays better than any safety in the NFC and then Jerry slaps him with the franchise tag instead of giving him the long term contract he was promised.

I'm sure Hamlin would be jumping for joy over that one. Then next year we could look forward to trying to figure out how to sign Hamlin, Newman, and T.O. -- Nice...
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Old 02-12-2008, 12:20 AM    (permalink
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So fanchising Hamlin is the new hype, huh?

Well thats nice... Jerry tells him if he plays well he will get paid well. He goes out and plays better than any safety in the NFC and then Jerry slaps him with the franchise tag instead of giving him the long term contract he was promised.

I'm sure Hamlin would be jumping for joy over that one. Then next year we could look forward to trying to figure out how to sign Hamlin, Newman, and T.O. -- Nice...
I don't get it. Hamlin deserves a long term contract.
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Old 02-12-2008, 12:29 AM    (permalink
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I don't get it. Hamlin deserves a long term contract.
I know, that's what I would hope.

But a lot of people are jumping onto the idea that we should franchise Hamlin.

To me, this is a slap in his face. I want him locked up long term, but I am also skeptical about Jerry getting it done-- as Im sure you already know.
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Old 02-12-2008, 01:03 AM    (permalink
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I know, that's what I would hope.

But a lot of people are jumping onto the idea that we should franchise Hamlin.

To me, this is a slap in his face. I want him locked up long term, but I am also skeptical about Jerry getting it done-- as Im sure you already know.
Franchising Hamlin would be pointless, Roy is almost on his way out as well, so basically we would be stuck without a safety at either spot...We need Hamlin for at least 3 more years, in that time find roy's replacement, and when he learns under Hamlin we can find a guy to replace Hamlin...Ill be very upset if we dont get a deal done for Hamlin this offseason, I think it would be a bad move.


And as far as the draft, if Jeff Otah falls to 22 I think we should take a long ahrd look, there isnt a backup lineman on the roster we have with more potential then him...Its very possible he's there at 22, and he's a step above the rest of the tackles left I think...I want to see what our youth can do, and I havent so I cant comment too much on them, but I think it would be nice to take a future LT early, let him sit and learn behind Adams for a year then be developed enough to start.
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Old 02-12-2008, 02:45 AM    (permalink
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Day 1 this year means Rounds 1 and 2. I think you're on an island of your own if you think we spent a 1st or 2nd rounder on Marten and Free.

Marten is our RT. Free as our starting LT means, no superbowl.
Well look back at my post and see that never in there did i say that Marten and Free were 1sts or 2nds. Did we spend first day picks on them this past draft? Yes. Glad we got that cleared up..

So now, if you re-sign Flo to a two or three year deal, THEN go out and draft another OT with a 2nd or 3rd, what the heck do we do with Free and Marten? I dont see colombo going anywhere seeing as he's playing just about as good as anyone at RT right now. If you spend more early picks on Linemen again, they're gonna have the same problem they have at LB now. You cant have 2nd and 3rd rounders backing everyone up. That's just a waste of money and draft picks, which could be used to shore up other, needier areas.

Now, im seeing that a lot of people think that the cowboys should sign Flo to a two or three year deal, backloaded with money that in essence he'll never recieve. Good, that would make sense on the cowboys side, but what incentive in the world would flozell's agent have of agreeing to that contract, KNOWING that the money is backloaded for a reason? to CUT him before they have to pay it. Now who in the world would agree to that? as much as Flo would like to stay, the man is no idiot either. Look at Larry Allen. He sure didnt mind going to cash in in San Fran.
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Old 02-12-2008, 03:14 AM    (permalink
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Well look back at my post and see that never in there did i say that Marten and Free were 1sts or 2nds. Did we spend first day picks on them this past draft? Yes. Glad we got that cleared up..

So now, if you re-sign Flo to a two or three year deal, THEN go out and draft another OT with a 2nd or 3rd, what the heck do we do with Free and Marten? I dont see colombo going anywhere seeing as he's playing just about as good as anyone at RT right now. If you spend more early picks on Linemen again, they're gonna have the same problem they have at LB now. You cant have 2nd and 3rd rounders backing everyone up. That's just a waste of money and draft picks, which could be used to shore up other, needier areas.

Now, im seeing that a lot of people think that the cowboys should sign Flo to a two or three year deal, backloaded with money that in essence he'll never recieve. Good, that would make sense on the cowboys side, but what incentive in the world would flozell's agent have of agreeing to that contract, KNOWING that the money is backloaded for a reason? to CUT him before they have to pay it. Now who in the world would agree to that? as much as Flo would like to stay, the man is no idiot either. Look at Larry Allen. He sure didnt mind going to cash in in San Fran.
LOL. Look at you try to cover your dirty tracks. AND you're STILL WRONG! Free was drafted in the 4th round! That is a DAY 2 pick! AND we didn't do that THIS year. This year is 2008! I wasn't aware there was another draft in 2008.

I said we needed to address LT in the first day in the upcoming draft. If you disagree, you disagree, but don't act like we did that in last year's draft, because we didn't draft a LT in the first 2 rounds last year.

Secondly, your logic makes no sense. What do you mean what happens with Marten and Free? Marten was a draft prospect projected to play RT in the NFL and we took him to inherit our RT position. He lacks the athleticism and footwork to be an NFL LT. Columbo was one of our last FA signings because of the difficulties we had trying to resign him. He nearly signed with another team while trying to play hardball with us. Reports indicated that he was all but gone all the way up to the 12th hour when he ended up signing a short 2 year deal (that is over after next season). You're right about him playing well, and you know what... the rest of the league has taken notice. Columbo will be looking to cash in when he becomes a FA and it's doubtful he returns if he gets a good deal. The selection of Marten was a brilliant move as it allows us to groom Marten until Columbo's contract is up. If Columbo resigns for cheap (unlikey), Marten still provides good depth and a third rounder providing good depth is not a waste. It's not the end of the world as you suggest.

Free has a chance to be a good OT in the NFL. We don't know. We do know he has a history of injuries. I'm of the opinion that we let Flo go altogether. I don't want him resigned. If he is resigned, then it better not be for a long ridiculous contract. I don't want to go into next season with Free as the outright starter. If he's the starter, I want him to fight for the spot and challenge an elite talent for the job. McQuistan is NOT the kind of elite talent that I'm talking about. We've seen rookie tackles succeed recently in the NFL, so it's not absurd to think it wouldn't work. Joe Thomas, Tony Ugoh, Marcus McNeill, Jammal Brown, Levi Brown, etc have stepped right in and teams have benefited right from the start. If Free doesn't work out at OT, he can be tried at OG. Kosier ain't irreplaceable.
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Old 02-12-2008, 07:12 AM    (permalink
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Well here it is late at night or early in the morning however you wanna look at it...for some reason I felt like having a productive night.

Going back to the game against the Giants....I have one feeling...total disappointment.

Start the game off....stop them on 3rd down...but a bad call on Ware jumping offsides...

Next play Henry gives underneath release to early...and Ellis comes from behind..they both miss the tackle...TD...7 free points.

We get the ball and do nothing...TO drops a pass the could have started the drive.

Next time around we have them stopped deep but once again...refs blow a offsides call by Ellis...and they get a 1st down and we stop them the next series..

So at this piont you have to be feeling well it can't get any worse...

Then we march down the field easily...MB3 has a huge run...and we end with a easy TO TD.

They get the ball back and do nothing.

We get the ball back and have a 20 play drive taking the clock down near 1min...and punch it in...MB3 earned his spot on the team this drive alone.

Well here is my question...a min left...Roy Williams and Reeves are on the field....why in the world would you have them playing near each other....scheme wise this is terrible...they both were close on all the passes...just a half step short...but this had happened all year....Reeves gets a stupid penalty....and instead of stopping them....**** instead of only giving up 3...we let them get inside our 5 and give up a TD.

I'd love to talk about this game with someone else who has it fresh in their mind...but I just wanted to point out some things....

This game you could really see the heart.

Chris Canty was once again a man amongst boys.
Ware showed why he is our best player period.
Spencer really impressed me when he was in.
Hamlin was a spark plug...and everywhere on the field.
Offense...
TO has heart...you can tell he is hurt...still was a beast 1st half
MB3 not a full time back...but you wouldn't want to play against him...no way you let him get away.
Witten...our unsong hero...he is the reason we are so good in clutch situations...he just gets it.
Flozell Adams...I don't care what anyone else says....he was able to take on top DE's all year without much help at all and we didn't hardly ever have to worry about help on his side..really underestimated this year because of silly false start penalties he won't get the recognition he deserved.

Now for what costs us...
Crowd...how stupid is it when you jump offsides because of crowd noise at home!?
Anthony Fasano...2 years in and this guy still can't block wat a joke.
TG....you've been running in the stadium for how long..and still don't have the right size cleats...maybe if you weren't running bow-legged afraid to make cuts your old shoes would work...but terrible couple of plays cost us there.


Just looking at this one half toward offseason.
Canty/Hamlin/MB3 all deserve deals...they played with fire and heart...and were the biggest reason we dominated the half.

Who is calling defensive plays? Reeves and Roy on the field at the same time..split sides of the field or take one player off...terrible coaching. Roy can play man coverage if a team tries to isolate him....he just doesn't have that sideline to sideline range to play centerfield...something needs to be drawn up for him there....

Reeves has seen his last chance at a nickel back spot on the cowboys roster...he just doesn't have it.

Anthony Fasano...this guy made me sick all year long....for being a recieving TE he sure doesn't catch a lot of balls...and that sure isn't a good enough reason for him to be a terrible blocker....this is the one Parcells draft pick that deserves to get traded...Carp and Spears are role-players....but atleast they do their assignments...Carp is a great depth peice and special teamer...and Spears doesn't hurt you when he plays in the base defense. However Fasano is a weakness when he is on the field...constantly missing assignments...not engaging in blocks...explain to me this....you have a huge TE in Fasano matched up one on one with a small corner in Ross....how the hell does he not get a hand on him and allow Ross to blow up the WR screen 5 yards in the backfield...don't even get me started about him blocking out of the backfield..I only wish this guy wasn't a cowboys next year....Curtis truly outplayed him...and his increase in playing time started to show.
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Old 02-12-2008, 09:01 AM    (permalink
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Well here is my question...a min left...Roy Williams and Reeves are on the field....why in the world would you have them playing near each other....scheme wise this is terrible...they both were close on all the passes...just a half step short...but this had happened all year....Reeves gets a stupid penalty....and instead of stopping them....**** instead of only giving up 3...we let them get inside our 5 and give up a TD.

I'd love to talk about this game with someone else who has it fresh in their mind...but I just wanted to point out some things....


Who is calling defensive plays? Reeves and Roy on the field at the same time..split sides of the field or take one player off...terrible coaching. Roy can play man coverage if a team tries to isolate him....he just doesn't have that sideline to sideline range to play centerfield...something needs to be drawn up for him there....

Reeves has seen his last chance at a nickel back spot on the cowboys roster...he just doesn't have it.



You know I questioned this as well, and the monday after the game they had this cowboys show and Darren Woodson was on there where he broke down the game tape...Teams were doing exactly what you said, they saw Roy and Reeves covering areas and he illustrated where they were supposed to be on each play for it to work, and they were both out of position every time the ball was thrown over there...Thats some personnel and coaching that nothing was done about it, we had a huge glaring hole in our defense and it was no secret to anyone we played, Roy for some reason when the ball is in the air gets confused and takes bad angles...

When you go back and watch it on broken down tape, you can see how everyone else had their assignments and the plays were drawn up to work, but clearly neither Reeves or Williams was going to make a play...Its a shame that no one picked that up and made an adjustment, those are a few things that Irk me about WP, he's a defensive guy he's got to know thats where their going and Roy shouldnt be over top Reeves.
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:43 AM    (permalink
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I agree on Fasano. With all the talk about the Rogers bust, Fasano may be an even bigger bust. It's only masked by the fact that we have such a stud in Witten. How big of a bust would Fasano be if we didn't have Witten?
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Old 02-12-2008, 11:48 AM    (permalink
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Well here it is late at night or early in the morning however you wanna look at it...for some reason I felt like having a productive night.

Going back to the game against the Giants....I have one feeling...total disappointment.

Start the game off....stop them on 3rd down...but a bad call on Ware jumping offsides...

Next play Henry gives underneath release to early...and Ellis comes from behind..they both miss the tackle...TD...7 free points.

We get the ball and do nothing...TO drops a pass the could have started the drive.

Next time around we have them stopped deep but once again...refs blow a offsides call by Ellis...and they get a 1st down and we stop them the next series..

So at this piont you have to be feeling well it can't get any worse...

Then we march down the field easily...MB3 has a huge run...and we end with a easy TO TD.

They get the ball back and do nothing.

We get the ball back and have a 20 play drive taking the clock down near 1min...and punch it in...MB3 earned his spot on the team this drive alone.

Well here is my question...a min left...Roy Williams and Reeves are on the field....why in the world would you have them playing near each other....scheme wise this is terrible...they both were close on all the passes...just a half step short...but this had happened all year....Reeves gets a stupid penalty....and instead of stopping them....**** instead of only giving up 3...we let them get inside our 5 and give up a TD.

I'd love to talk about this game with someone else who has it fresh in their mind...but I just wanted to point out some things....

This game you could really see the heart.

Chris Canty was once again a man amongst boys.
Ware showed why he is our best player period.
Spencer really impressed me when he was in.
Hamlin was a spark plug...and everywhere on the field.
Offense...
TO has heart...you can tell he is hurt...still was a beast 1st half
MB3 not a full time back...but you wouldn't want to play against him...no way you let him get away.
Witten...our unsong hero...he is the reason we are so good in clutch situations...he just gets it.
Flozell Adams...I don't care what anyone else says....he was able to take on top DE's all year without much help at all and we didn't hardly ever have to worry about help on his side..really underestimated this year because of silly false start penalties he won't get the recognition he deserved.

Now for what costs us...
Crowd...how stupid is it when you jump offsides because of crowd noise at home!?
Anthony Fasano...2 years in and this guy still can't block wat a joke.
TG....you've been running in the stadium for how long..and still don't have the right size cleats...maybe if you weren't running bow-legged afraid to make cuts your old shoes would work...but terrible couple of plays cost us there.


Just looking at this one half toward offseason.
Canty/Hamlin/MB3 all deserve deals...they played with fire and heart...and were the biggest reason we dominated the half.

Who is calling defensive plays? Reeves and Roy on the field at the same time..split sides of the field or take one player off...terrible coaching. Roy can play man coverage if a team tries to isolate him....he just doesn't have that sideline to sideline range to play centerfield...something needs to be drawn up for him there....

Reeves has seen his last chance at a nickel back spot on the cowboys roster...he just doesn't have it.

Anthony Fasano...this guy made me sick all year long....for being a recieving TE he sure doesn't catch a lot of balls...and that sure isn't a good enough reason for him to be a terrible blocker....this is the one Parcells draft pick that deserves to get traded...Carp and Spears are role-players....but atleast they do their assignments...Carp is a great depth peice and special teamer...and Spears doesn't hurt you when he plays in the base defense. However Fasano is a weakness when he is on the field...constantly missing assignments...not engaging in blocks...explain to me this....you have a huge TE in Fasano matched up one on one with a small corner in Ross....how the hell does he not get a hand on him and allow Ross to blow up the WR screen 5 yards in the backfield...don't even get me started about him blocking out of the backfield..I only wish this guy wasn't a cowboys next year....Curtis truly outplayed him...and his increase in playing time started to show.
I think you are being a little too harsh on Roy. Also, to use back-ups like Reeves and Fasano as the goats for a loss to the eventual Super Bowl winner is difficult for me to agree with.

You mainly lost because your offense played poorly, OL, QB and Receivers -- that is 80% of it. The other was 15% was Special Teams and 5% to the D for that 1 minute drive. Random numbers but order-of-magnitude correct IMHO.

You will be fine next year as long as you pick up 3-4 quality FA / Rookies. It is a mature team with most of the talent now in Year 3 of playing or beyond.

CHeers
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Old 02-12-2008, 01:45 PM    (permalink
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Our offense dominated the first half....they didn't do one thing wrong outside of a dropped pass on our first possession and a false start penalty by Columbo before we scored....we played a great half of football on offense....can you give examples of where our offense fluttered...a 20 play drive and another drive that went about as good as it could go really make me think your talking out of your ass.
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Old 02-12-2008, 02:25 PM    (permalink
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You mentioned something key that I brought up after the game that no one really picked up discussion on. That is... the crowd noise. I thought it was totally f'n dumb for our own fans to be extremely loud when WE are on OFFENSE!!!! It was like an away game for Romo trying to call the plays! I was yelling at my TV telling the fans to shut up! Ga! Still pisses me off!!!

Garrett's play calling in the second half was also terrible. He panics when the team is behind. He starts to think too much like a QB and will call pass play after pass play. They totally abandoned the run game on our final drives and when they did run, they were very predictable.

I also blame our overrated OL that receives showers of love from everyone. They totally broke down and could not handle the Giants pressure. It wasn't Barber... he was picking up his blocker fine. It was all the OL. Miscommunication, misreads, missed assignments, false starts... you name it... They were bad and simply got beat by the pressure. Props to the Giants for their play. They won the game with amazing pressure despite having a bad secondary.

Another reason why I think we need more pressure from our defensive front. Statistically, we did good overall on the season. However, we are not where we need to be. Not if we want to win the SB. I want a big NT. ...and I want one NOW! Between NT and LT, those are our #1 and #2 needs imo.
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Old 02-12-2008, 02:30 PM    (permalink
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I also blame our overrated OL that receives showers of love from everyone. They totally broke down and could not handle the Giants pressure. It wasn't Barber... he was picking up his blocker fine. It was all the OL. Miscommunication, misreads, missed assignments, false starts... you name it... They were bad and simply got beat by the pressure. Props to the Giants for their play. They won the game with amazing pressure despite having a bad secondary.
I'm not sure our line getting dominated in one half of a game by arguably the best defensive line in football means that they are overrated. I'd say once we get Gurode to figure out shotgun snaps, and someone with more talent than Kosier, we might have the best line in football.
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