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Old 11-29-2006, 12:07 PM    (permalink
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DMW I agree that we have a good young core at WR. But my question to you is what happens if Glenn goes down. He has been injured alot in his career...and this other problem that just popped up could take him out for his career...depending on how long. We have to look at it. Who in the hell is our speed guy. Our ability to stretch the defense deep would go down alot. I mean Crayton at the 2 spot with TO in the slot with Hurd as the number 1 on three wr sets probabally wouldn't scare anyone. Sure we have a great chance at making the catch...but the would likely bring the safety's up and now not only is there more people in the 10 yard span...it also becomes harder to run. We need a speed guy who can contribute on special teams right away...and be our insurance plan behiind glenn. If we land a guy like lee higgins in the second so be it. But Ginn's potential is about as high as you can get in this draft...to have him in our future would be very nice. It also wouldn't hurt ot have a guy like Glenn/TO tutoring him. Glenn came from osu..so there are some ties there beside the way they play.

You have watched every game. Well then I'm sure you would agree if there was one OLman that got pushed into the backfield 5-10 times it would be rivera. He is still ok when pulling although he whiffs from time to time...but when asked to attack one on one he is not as powerful as he once was. He is our biggest liability on the OL. I'm not saying he is the worst RG in the league...but if there was one positon to upgrade it would be RG. Not only that he is up there in years...do you really see proctor as his replacement?

I meantion GB...not sure what we would have to give up to move up that far...but I was actually talking about picking up a 2nd rounder for JJ...but I suppose he could be good bait for moving up.

My ideal trade would be JJ a 2nd and one of our young WR...a hurd/crayton/austin for there top 10 pick. I think everyone here knows who I would select. But I think if there is one guy in this draft that we love....we have to trade up....we have above average depth at many spots. Pick out a late round gem and we're set.

Only thing that would worry me is give up a 2nd and then already having spent our 3rd on Brown
Trade talk is borderline insanity. If we start drawing up trades in our imaginations then we'll all go crazy by draft day.

Unlike Blalock, Ginn is someone worth giving up picks to get. The FA crop is crap... and there really isn't anyone else like him out there. He also can fill the role of kick/punt returner. ...and maybe even backup at corner! BP's gotta love that factor.

That said, I do think you are overreacting a little bit thule about filling Glenn's shoes. If you remember at the time Glenn was down, Crayton was also down. So our weakness was even more exploited. Crayton has shown the speed to get deep and there were even times last year when we were like "We found our future #2 receiver! YAY!" Remember that? :D
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:10 PM    (permalink
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Why do we need this "pure cover" guy at FS? Certainly you guys remember Darren Woodson, the converted linebacker? You don't need to be a converted corner to play free safety in the league, you need to be smart and make good decisions which is how Woodson made it work for himself. Landry is the better prospect in every way over Nelson, but maybe he'll run a slower 40. Don't be fooled. Landry has a body of work, whereas I've only heard of Nelson starting in the 2nd half of THIS SEASON. Buyer beware.
but i dont think Landry will not be there for you guys and dont for get Michael Griffin is a very good solid tackler like roy ... how many safetys do you know that in collage can rack up 2 years in a row with 100+ tackles
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:15 PM    (permalink
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I agree with thule, we need a WR, but I'd like Blalock in the 1st, and get a WR somewhere later. I like Paul Williams or Chansi Stuckey in the 2nd. Another two guys I like that aren't as fast are Bowe and Steve Smith. Some guys in later rounds that are kind of in the middle as far as speed goes that I like are Craig Davis and Chris Davis. In late rounds, I like Ryan Moore.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:16 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by Ward
Why do we need this "pure cover" guy at FS? Certainly you guys remember Darren Woodson, the converted linebacker? You don't need to be a converted corner to play free safety in the league, you need to be smart and make good decisions which is how Woodson made it work for himself. Landry is the better prospect in every way over Nelson, but maybe he'll run a slower 40. Don't be fooled. Landry has a body of work, whereas I've only heard of Nelson starting in the 2nd half of THIS SEASON. Buyer beware.
but i dont think Landry will not be there for you guys and dont for get Michael Griffin is a very good solid tackler like roy ... how many safetys do you know that in collage can rack up 2 years in a row with 100+ tackles
But we don't need a guy like Roy! We need a guy to compliment Roy.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:17 PM    (permalink
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I agree with thule, we need a WR, but I'd like Blalock in the 1st, and get a WR somewhere later. I like Paul Williams or Chansi Stuckey in the 2nd. Another two guys I like that aren't as fast are Bowe and Steve Smith. Some guys in later rounds that are kind of in the middle as far as speed goes that I like are Craig Davis and Chris Davis. In late rounds, I like Ryan Moore.
The only problem with that is do you see Williams or Stuckey as #1 guys in the future. We have alot of depth at the #2 and slot position. Unless you think Hurd will be a number 1 someday...we have to worry about filling that void. If you do agree we need a number one...then we might as well wait till next year because picking up a speed guy who will never be anything more then a slot guy would just add to the logjam at WR.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:18 PM    (permalink
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Why do we need this "pure cover" guy at FS? Certainly you guys remember Darren Woodson, the converted linebacker? You don't need to be a converted corner to play free safety in the league, you need to be smart and make good decisions which is how Woodson made it work for himself. Landry is the better prospect in every way over Nelson, but maybe he'll run a slower 40. Don't be fooled. Landry has a body of work, whereas I've only heard of Nelson starting in the 2nd half of THIS SEASON. Buyer beware.
but i dont think Landry will not be there for you guys and dont for get Michael Griffin is a very good solid tackler like roy ... how many safetys do you know that in collage can rack up 2 years in a row with 100+ tackles
But we don't need a guy like Roy! We need a guy to compliment Roy.
He's not like Roy, look beyond the physical stats and actually watch Landry play. He can cover better than just about anyone in the college game currently. He's bigger than Nelson, so? Landry is a ballhawk wether you guys want to admit it or not.

Here's an example of Landry's speed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R211e6JdVew
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:20 PM    (permalink
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Why do we need this "pure cover" guy at FS? Certainly you guys remember Darren Woodson, the converted linebacker? You don't need to be a converted corner to play free safety in the league, you need to be smart and make good decisions which is how Woodson made it work for himself. Landry is the better prospect in every way over Nelson, but maybe he'll run a slower 40. Don't be fooled. Landry has a body of work, whereas I've only heard of Nelson starting in the 2nd half of THIS SEASON. Buyer beware.
Don't be mislead only because you've only heard about him this year. He's a JC transfer and he has another year of eligibilty. He's faced top notch competition and has excelled this year. You can't deny the fact that he's a gamebreaker.

Why do we need a "pure cover" guy at FS? I can't believe I'm hearing these words. haha. How many times have we gotten beat deep this year and last year and the year before that??? Let's not get confused here. Nelson is not only a pure cover safety. He's simply the best one, imo.

Sounds like his name is picking up speed and may not be there late in the first anymore... but Landry for sure will not be there. ...and Landry is not worth trading up for.

...and Woodson could play FS because like you said... he had the smarts to play it. Those smarts came after years and years of veteran experience. He was a SS before we got Roy. You don't just draft a guy and expect him to have the smarts of a Darren Woodson to help subsidize his physically inept coverage skills.

That said, hell I'd be stoked if we got Landry. I just don't see the possibility of grabbing him without trading up. ...and he's not worth trading up for.

If we talk about hoping to get Landry, we might as well begin hopes of drafting Calvin Johnson too.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:23 PM    (permalink
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I agree with thule, we need a WR, but I'd like Blalock in the 1st, and get a WR somewhere later. I like Paul Williams or Chansi Stuckey in the 2nd. Another two guys I like that aren't as fast are Bowe and Steve Smith. Some guys in later rounds that are kind of in the middle as far as speed goes that I like are Craig Davis and Chris Davis. In late rounds, I like Ryan Moore.
Those guys are .... blah. Serviceable at the most. I am a fan of Steve Smith though. Smart player with great hands. Always seems to find the soft zone coverage holes. Not an NFL #1 though.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:26 PM    (permalink
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I agree with thule, we need a WR, but I'd like Blalock in the 1st, and get a WR somewhere later. I like Paul Williams or Chansi Stuckey in the 2nd. Another two guys I like that aren't as fast are Bowe and Steve Smith. Some guys in later rounds that are kind of in the middle as far as speed goes that I like are Craig Davis and Chris Davis. In late rounds, I like Ryan Moore.
Those guys are .... blah. Serviceable at the most. I am a fan of Steve Smith though. Smart player with great hands. Always seems to find the soft zone coverage holes. Not an NFL #1 though.
Pretty much what I said. If we don't land Ginn...this is where the CB who can impact the special teams game will come into play. Like I said...it basically comes down to who is available when we pick...and if a team is looking to move down.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:26 PM    (permalink
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Why do we need this "pure cover" guy at FS? Certainly you guys remember Darren Woodson, the converted linebacker? You don't need to be a converted corner to play free safety in the league, you need to be smart and make good decisions which is how Woodson made it work for himself. Landry is the better prospect in every way over Nelson, but maybe he'll run a slower 40. Don't be fooled. Landry has a body of work, whereas I've only heard of Nelson starting in the 2nd half of THIS SEASON. Buyer beware.
but i dont think Landry will not be there for you guys and dont for get Michael Griffin is a very good solid tackler like roy ... how many safetys do you know that in collage can rack up 2 years in a row with 100+ tackles
But we don't need a guy like Roy! We need a guy to compliment Roy.
He's not like Roy, look beyond the physical stats and actually watch Landry play. He can cover better than just about anyone in the college game currently. He's bigger than Nelson, so? Landry is a ballhawk wether you guys want to admit it or not.

Here's an example of Landry's speed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R211e6JdVew
I never said Landry wasn't a great FS. He is. He won't be there for us though. I like Michael Griffin just as much as Landry. ...and Griffin could fall to us. Coverage wise, speed wise, I'd have to say Nelson is on another level.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:29 PM    (permalink
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Why do we need this "pure cover" guy at FS? Certainly you guys remember Darren Woodson, the converted linebacker? You don't need to be a converted corner to play free safety in the league, you need to be smart and make good decisions which is how Woodson made it work for himself. Landry is the better prospect in every way over Nelson, but maybe he'll run a slower 40. Don't be fooled. Landry has a body of work, whereas I've only heard of Nelson starting in the 2nd half of THIS SEASON. Buyer beware.
but i dont think Landry will not be there for you guys and dont for get Michael Griffin is a very good solid tackler like roy ... how many safetys do you know that in collage can rack up 2 years in a row with 100+ tackles
But we don't need a guy like Roy! We need a guy to compliment Roy.
He's not like Roy, look beyond the physical stats and actually watch Landry play. He can cover better than just about anyone in the college game currently. He's bigger than Nelson, so? Landry is a ballhawk wether you guys want to admit it or not.

Here's an example of Landry's speed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R211e6JdVew
I was talking about Griffeth. Landry's my guy if we go FS in round 1.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:29 PM    (permalink
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Why do we need this "pure cover" guy at FS? Certainly you guys remember Darren Woodson, the converted linebacker? You don't need to be a converted corner to play free safety in the league, you need to be smart and make good decisions which is how Woodson made it work for himself. Landry is the better prospect in every way over Nelson, but maybe he'll run a slower 40. Don't be fooled. Landry has a body of work, whereas I've only heard of Nelson starting in the 2nd half of THIS SEASON. Buyer beware.
Don't be mislead only because you've only heard about him this year. He's a JC transfer and he has another year of eligibilty. He's faced top notch competition and has excelled this year. You can't deny the fact that he's a gamebreaker.

Why do we need a "pure cover" guy at FS? I can't believe I'm hearing these words. haha. How many times have we gotten beat deep this year and last year and the year before that??? Let's not get confused here. Nelson is not only a pure cover safety. He's simply the best one, imo.

Sounds like his name is picking up speed and may not be there late in the first anymore... but Landry for sure will not be there. ...and Landry is not worth trading up for.

...and Woodson could play FS because like you said... he had the smarts to play it. Those smarts came after years and years of veteran experience. He was a SS before we got Roy. You don't just draft a guy and expect him to have the smarts of a Darren Woodson to help subsidize his physically inept coverage skills.

That said, hell I'd be stoked if we got Landry. I just don't see the possibility of grabbing him without trading up. ...and he's not worth trading up for.

If we talk about hoping to get Landry, we might as well begin hopes of drafting Calvin Johnson too.
:roll: I've been a draft nerd at this site for a couple of years and Reggie Nelson has never been mentioned prior to this fall. I'm not the only one. He's faced the same level of competition as Landry, and has done well - this season.

We need someone who can cover well at this point to get a significant upgrade to our defense. We don't need Ed Reed. We need a young Brian Dawkins.

Personally I think Scott overrates safeties with the exception of Sean Taylor. Remember thinking Brodney Pool would be gone before we got to take him? Then he went in the 2nd to Cleveland because he wasn't really that hot of a prospect. Landry or Nelson, possible both will be there. The real question is: which one is a Parcells type player?
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:34 PM    (permalink
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He's not like Roy, look beyond the physical stats and actually watch Landry play. He can cover better than just about anyone in the college game currently. He's bigger than Nelson, so? Landry is a ballhawk wether you guys want to admit it or not.

Here's an example of Landry's speed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R211e6JdVew
Just saw that vid. Impressive... but if you think Nelson isn't an intimidator in his own right and can't deliver hits, you'd be dead wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcMGyqZ-TBU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRW3JFaMN_A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3o2U...elated&search=
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:35 PM    (permalink
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I've been a draft nerd at this site for a couple of years and Reggie Nelson has never been mentioned prior to this fall.
People hit strides at different periods. Happens all the time. Not many people talked about players like Dunta Robinson prior to the season he went into the draft.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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He's not like Roy, look beyond the physical stats and actually watch Landry play. He can cover better than just about anyone in the college game currently. He's bigger than Nelson, so? Landry is a ballhawk wether you guys want to admit it or not.

Here's an example of Landry's speed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R211e6JdVew
Just saw that vid. Impressive... but if you think Nelson isn't an intimidator in his own right and can't deliver hits, you'd be dead wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcMGyqZ-TBU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRW3JFaMN_A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3o2U...elated&search=
I've never said an ill word about Nelson other than that he lacks the experience of Landry. Landry is a 4 year starter at free safety in the SEC.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:36 PM    (permalink
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I agree with thule, we need a WR, but I'd like Blalock in the 1st, and get a WR somewhere later. I like Paul Williams or Chansi Stuckey in the 2nd. Another two guys I like that aren't as fast are Bowe and Steve Smith. Some guys in later rounds that are kind of in the middle as far as speed goes that I like are Craig Davis and Chris Davis. In late rounds, I like Ryan Moore.
Those guys are .... blah. Serviceable at the most. I am a fan of Steve Smith though. Smart player with great hands. Always seems to find the soft zone coverage holes. Not an NFL #1 though.
I see Bowe as a guy who can be a #1 in time. And I think his speed is a bit underrated. We'll see come Combine time.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:39 PM    (permalink
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I've been a draft nerd at this site for a couple of years and Reggie Nelson has never been mentioned prior to this fall.
People hit strides at different periods. Happens all the time. Not many people talked about players like Dunta Robinson prior to the season he went into the draft.
A lot of it has to do with the fact that he was playing in Junior College. If he wasn't tearing it up there, he wouldn't be starting at Florida. Being in JC doesn't mean you aren't an NFL caliber prospect.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:40 PM    (permalink
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Actually, now that I think about it.

Reggie Nelson = Bob Sanders
Landry = Sean Taylor

Landry is the guy I want at SS, but not at FS. I think Nelson is just a better FS.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:42 PM    (permalink
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He's not like Roy, look beyond the physical stats and actually watch Landry play. He can cover better than just about anyone in the college game currently. He's bigger than Nelson, so? Landry is a ballhawk wether you guys want to admit it or not.

Here's an example of Landry's speed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R211e6JdVew
Just saw that vid. Impressive... but if you think Nelson isn't an intimidator in his own right and can't deliver hits, you'd be dead wrong.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcMGyqZ-TBU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aRW3JFaMN_A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3o2U...elated&search=
I've never said an ill word about Nelson other than that he lacks the experience of Landry. Landry is a 4 year starter at free safety in the SEC.
Yeah, but Landry won't last past 20. Do you think we should trade up for him?
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:43 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, but Landry won't last past 20. Do you think we should trade up for him?
I disagree that he won't last past 20, he will. But no, he wouldn't be worth trading up for.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:49 PM    (permalink
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Actually, now that I think about it.

Reggie Nelson = Bob Sanders
Landry = Sean Taylor

Landry is the guy I want at SS, but not at FS. I think Nelson is just a better FS.
Bob Sanders isn't comparison I'd make. Sanders is a lot shorter at 5'8". Nelson is listed at 6'1" which means he's probably 6'0".

Nelson to me plays more similarly to someone like Charles Tillman or Ken Hamlin.

Landry is like Darren Sharper.
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Old 11-29-2006, 12:50 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, but Landry won't last past 20. Do you think we should trade up for him?
I disagree that he won't last past 20, he will. But no, he wouldn't be worth trading up for.
You could be right in the end... and Nelson could be the one that doesn't make it past 20.
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Old 11-29-2006, 01:27 PM    (permalink
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Yeah, but Landry won't last past 20. Do you think we should trade up for him?
I disagree that he won't last past 20, he will. But no, he wouldn't be worth trading up for.
You could be right in the end... and Nelson could be the one that doesn't make it past 20.
This end of the year is key to how early we address FS...hopefully Watkins fills in and we can use our first somewhere else.
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Old 11-29-2006, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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It looks like going to be a good game. Giants have 3 (Umenyiora, Short, Madison back from injuries) or even Michael Strahan is a maybe for the Sunday game.
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Old 11-29-2006, 01:49 PM    (permalink
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Suisham is a traitor. I actually liked him...
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