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Old 12-11-2006, 10:16 AM    (permalink
bearsfan_51
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Originally Posted by bigbluedefense
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Originally Posted by LSUALUM99
Ok, lets not overreact.

The bottom line is that NO is a better team than anyone was giving them credit for.

Their offense is sick. Their defense can't really stop the run but if you get up early you don't have to worry about that from a defense.

Romo has come back down to earth. That's not all bad. I'd rather he come back down to earth now than later. He does now need to play within the system more. He seems to be throwing off his back foot too much.

DWare played a very good game, but toward the end of the game he started to lose contain. It's official, DWare is good, Merriman is a better player. No more comments on this until proven otherwise, Merriman is the better player.

Terry Glenn is a stud still. Witten is starting to make me think he's overrated.

The penalty on Parcells was terrible. He should of just called a time out but the brain fart really sucked.

Overall, Roy Williams and Keith Davis played Terrible. KD needs to be benched, he's absolutely terrible.
Youre gonna anger alot of people with that statement my friend. I agree with you, but most on this board are gonna call for your head.

I wouldn't call Witten overrated. I actually like him alot. He thrives on a balanced attack. Witten is a great blocker and WR. He's at his best when you guys could do both, that allows him to catch LBs off guard and run out in patterns and catch balls.

When youre in must pass situations, his play decreases because he doesn't have elite speed to simply break an LB, but he's still damn good. Great hands, great route running, thick body I like Witten alot.
Sound like you like him a bit TOO much eh?
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Old 12-11-2006, 10:21 AM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by LSUALUM99
Ok, lets not overreact.

The bottom line is that NO is a better team than anyone was giving them credit for.

Their offense is sick. Their defense can't really stop the run but if you get up early you don't have to worry about that from a defense.

Romo has come back down to earth. That's not all bad. I'd rather he come back down to earth now than later. He does now need to play within the system more. He seems to be throwing off his back foot too much.

DWare played a very good game, but toward the end of the game he started to lose contain. It's official, DWare is good, Merriman is a better player. No more comments on this until proven otherwise, Merriman is the better player.

Terry Glenn is a stud still. Witten is starting to make me think he's overrated.

The penalty on Parcells was terrible. He should of just called a time out but the brain fart really sucked.

Overall, Roy Williams and Keith Davis played Terrible. KD needs to be benched, he's absolutely terrible.
Youre gonna anger alot of people with that statement my friend. I agree with you, but most on this board are gonna call for your head.

I wouldn't call Witten overrated. I actually like him alot. He thrives on a balanced attack. Witten is a great blocker and WR. He's at his best when you guys could do both, that allows him to catch LBs off guard and run out in patterns and catch balls.

When youre in must pass situations, his play decreases because he doesn't have elite speed to simply break an LB, but he's still damn good. Great hands, great route running, thick body I like Witten alot.
Sound like you like him a bit TOO much eh?
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Old 12-11-2006, 11:56 AM    (permalink
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Is that the subject of the conversation today? More Merriman vs. Ware debates??? We gonna make new judgements after every game? It's old.

First off, I'd rather have Ware... but even if Merriman was better, I'd still rather have Ware. Merriman may not be on roids now, but he definately used them to get where he is.

What the better debate is... is which front 7 is better? San Diego or Dallas?

I think it's San Diego hands down. I like our secondary much better... but talking about the front 7... San Diego is better... and the supporting cast is a big factor in comparing Merriman to Ware.
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:31 PM    (permalink
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No one wants to make this a Ware/Merriman debate, we all know what Ware needs to work on to become as good of a pass rusher as Merriman. Its up to Ware to take his game to that next level. Right now, he's not on the same level as Merriman, but with some offseason work, maybe he can be next year.

More importantly...the downlinemen. Should this now be an issue addressed in the draft?

I think the push youre getting from the 3 down linemen has been mediocre. Fergy is still great, but not dominant, but theres no solution here because theres no NTs in the draft.

But what about 3-4 DEs? Should this be addressed now? Do you hold out hope that Spears can get it together, or give up on him? What about Canty, he started out hot, but has now gotten cold. What to do with him?

Im really starting to think that Marcus Spears is your William Joseph. Ive said it before, and the more I watch him the more I believe it. He has all the physical ability in the world, but for whatever reason, cannot and will not put it together.

Now DE might be an area of concern to put on the big board.
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Old 12-11-2006, 12:47 PM    (permalink
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No one wants to make this a Ware/Merriman debate, we all know what Ware needs to work on to become as good of a pass rusher as Merriman. Its up to Ware to take his game to that next level. Right now, he's not on the same level as Merriman, but with some offseason work, maybe he can be next year.

More importantly...the downlinemen. Should this now be an issue addressed in the draft?

I think the push youre getting from the 3 down linemen has been mediocre. Fergy is still great, but not dominant, but theres no solution here because theres no NTs in the draft.

But what about 3-4 DEs? Should this be addressed now? Do you hold out hope that Spears can get it together, or give up on him? What about Canty, he started out hot, but has now gotten cold. What to do with him?

Im really starting to think that Marcus Spears is your William Joseph. Ive said it before, and the more I watch him the more I believe it. He has all the physical ability in the world, but for whatever reason, cannot and will not put it together.

Now DE might be an area of concern to put on the big board.
I think Ratliff would get a shot at a starting position before we bring somebody in. Also we have Hatcher who has looked good, even though he seemed to be more of a project.


Also I don't think the problem in the game was execution, at least not on defense. I just think Dallas came into the game unprepared. It seemed like the Saints came into the game with a different gameplan, and Dallas was taken by surprise. They were able to keep Dallas on edge all game.
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Old 12-11-2006, 01:08 PM    (permalink
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No one wants to make this a Ware/Merriman debate, we all know what Ware needs to work on to become as good of a pass rusher as Merriman. Its up to Ware to take his game to that next level. Right now, he's not on the same level as Merriman, but with some offseason work, maybe he can be next year.

More importantly...the downlinemen. Should this now be an issue addressed in the draft?

I think the push youre getting from the 3 down linemen has been mediocre. Fergy is still great, but not dominant, but theres no solution here because theres no NTs in the draft.

But what about 3-4 DEs? Should this be addressed now? Do you hold out hope that Spears can get it together, or give up on him? What about Canty, he started out hot, but has now gotten cold. What to do with him?

Im really starting to think that Marcus Spears is your William Joseph. Ive said it before, and the more I watch him the more I believe it. He has all the physical ability in the world, but for whatever reason, cannot and will not put it together.

Now DE might be an area of concern to put on the big board.
I think Ratliff would get a shot at a starting position before we bring somebody in. Also we have Hatcher who has looked good, even though he seemed to be more of a project.


Also I don't think the problem in the game was execution, at least not on defense. I just think Dallas came into the game unprepared. It seemed like the Saints came into the game with a different gameplan, and Dallas was taken by surprise. They were able to keep Dallas on edge all game.
I don't think it was entirely coaching. Yes, the staff couldve done a better job, but most of the time it was just poor execution. Let me break it down.

-The bomb pass TD to Henderson. They came out in Iform. Dallas calls Cover 2. NO runs a PA fake end around bomb pass to Henderson for a TD. This was actually the perfect playcall by the defense, it just was a horrible play by Davis, the FS. The Cover 2 had the Corners stay home so if it was an end around, you had it covered, if it was a run up the gut, the LBs should fire the gaps, and if its a deep ball, the safety in the Cover 2 picks it up. Perfect playcall. But, Davis just did a horrible job closing in, and Henderson made the play for a TD. It wasn't like Brees hit him in the soft spot of the Cover 2, Brees hit him right in front of Davis. Davis is supposed to break that ball up, instead TD.

-The Reggie Bush screen pass for a TD. Dallas didn't blitz like hell on that play, everyone stayed home. The problem was, everyone got blocked, and people missed tackles. Thats not a coaching error, thats execution. Its a coaching error if you call an all out blitz on a screen, because you play right into their hands, but that was not the case.

-You can have the brightest X and O guy in the world. Theres not a scheme in the world that is built to stop the run. Stopping the run is strictly a personnell problem. Dallas is a very good run stuffing defense, but yesterday, they weren't. Those FB runs...the LBs are supposed to fire those gaps, theres no scheme you can draw up to stop that, thats pure execution.

-The bomb pass on Roy Williams, he simply got beat. That penny defense you guys got was built to stop it. The CB got beat, then Roy came by to help, he gets beat. There were 2 guys there that couldve held their assignment, but both got burned. They couldve used some pass rush out of the front 4, but again, thats execution. Ware and crew simply were not winning their individual matchups. The problem I can see with this defense is having Roy back there instead of a FS, but who do you trust more, Roy or Keith Davis? Still, I'll go 50/50 on this one. They shouldn't have came out with 1 safety, but at the same time, the guys just got beat.

-The FB flat routes...you gotta believe that your LBs are good enough to stop that. Come on, theyve stopped better guys out of the backfield, they could definately pick him up, but for whatever reason, didn't.

-The onside kick...come on, no one expects that. No coach can save you on that one, its up to the special teams to be more aware.

-Brees having all day to throw was due to a poor pass rush. Dallas blitzed plenty of times out of the nickel, it never got there. Whether you sent 7 or 4, no one got to Brees. Guys simply were not winning their individual assignments in the pass rush.

This NO offense really isn't anymore dynamic than the Colts offense. But the difference was you guys generated a rush on the Colts and didn't against NO. And you couldn't stop the run. I think thats the real issue, pass rush, and you couldn't stop the run. Thats why you lost.
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Old 12-11-2006, 02:37 PM    (permalink
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o.k. my take on this game is that we just came off a HUGE win in new york and we played the saints in the preseason and just abused them. imo dallas took them lightly and paid the price. this happens to young teams from time to time. we still have everything in front of us. we can win the division and make the playoffs and really theres nobody in the nfc that we cant beat. i think we still have a chance to go to the superbowl even though we have obvious flaws to our team. name one team in the nfc that doesnt have a weakness or a question mark somewhere. there isnt one. it was very dissapointing but it was just 1 loss. if we lose next week in atlanta then we will no longer be in 1st in our division and then it might be time to panic but i think its to early to jump off the bridge right now. one thing is for sure, we will see what were made of and how romo will respond to adversity in 6 short days.
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Old 12-11-2006, 02:44 PM    (permalink
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o.k. my take on this game is that we just came off a HUGE win in new york and we played the saints in the preseason and just abused them. imo dallas took them lightly and paid the price. this happens to young teams from time to time. we still have everything in front of us. we can win the division and make the playoffs and really theres nobody in the nfc that we cant beat. i think we still have a chance to go to the superbowl even though we have obvious flaws to our team. name one team in the nfc that doesnt have a weakness or a question mark somewhere. there isnt one. it was very dissapointing but it was just 1 loss. if we lose next week in atlanta then we will no longer be in 1st in our division and then it might be time to panic but i think its to early to jump off the bridge right now. one thing is for sure, we will see what were made of and how romo will respond to adversity in 6 short days.
If we lose, we're right with the Giants and Eagles. Things aren't so merry around here anymore. Once you lose a game the way we did, you get exposed and the rest of the NFL copies the blue print. The Colts are still reeling from that. It's up to our coaching staff to come up with adjustments.
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Old 12-11-2006, 02:51 PM    (permalink
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yeah if we lose were tied with the giants or eagles (they play each other this weekend) but they own the tie breakers. and as far as a blueprint, sean tottally out coached us but also their d.c. is very good ant he was also from our staff so we were very well scouted.
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Old 12-11-2006, 03:04 PM    (permalink
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I want to believe this was just an abberation and not indicative of how good or bad we really are. If we lose next week we don't deserve to make the playoffs anyway, it's a one game season right now. We have to run the ball a lot more to take the onus off Tony like Pitt did with Ben.
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Old 12-11-2006, 03:14 PM    (permalink
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I want to believe this was just an abberation and not indicative of how good or bad we really are. If we lose next week we don't deserve to make the playoffs anyway, it's a one game season right now. We have to run the ball a lot more to take the onus off Tony like Pitt did with Ben.
Yup, thats how you "fix" the offense if thats what you guys want to assume. I think it was just an off day, but there are some things that teams will use against Dallas to stop Romo, like play contain with their ends and blitz a DB or bring pressure up the middle with MIKE blitzes.

But I think the answer to that is simply running the ball more. I was surprised that BP just thrusted Romo into the mix like he did, I honeslty expected him to have a Ben like role. I think now that Romo has had 1.5 bad games in a row (1st half against Giants), I think he'll bring in the reigns a little.

Defensively...I don't know if there is an adjustment that can be done. He moved Ware around that game, he blitzed, there really wasn't anything else to do, outside of DB blitzes.

I think teams will start to use NO's blueprint of picking on your safeties. If thats the case, youre gonna have to go with more man coverage schemes.

This puts a lot of pressure on Carp to defend the TE in man coverage, because the zone schemes are vulnerable deep because of your safeties. So now its time for Carp to earn his money. I thought he did a good job last night when on the field, but he needs field time to learn. Why isn't BP giving him more field time?
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Old 12-11-2006, 07:11 PM    (permalink
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1. Aaron Rouse
2. Dwayne Bowe
3. Manni Rameriez

??
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Old 12-11-2006, 07:13 PM    (permalink
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Question, is Fasano in the doghouse or injured? I hadn't heard anything but he's done nothing the past 2 games.
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Old 12-11-2006, 07:44 PM    (permalink
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Just wanted to make a couple of quick comments.

Some will say that Payton's idea of an onside kick when up by 18 was unnecessary and I agree but I bet Parcells couldn't give a rats you know what that Payton did that.

And yes Payton did outcoach Parcells, though I will say he certainly knew more about our team then we knew about his. He knew Tony Romo inside and out, and more importantly Gibbs knew this defense and how to exploit it.

We got killed nonetheless. It's embarassing, and I can't wait to move on.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I also wanted to vent something else...I am talking about Terrell Owens.

I hope he stays a Cowboy, oh yes I hope. I hope he's a Cowboy all the way until the end of the 2006 season. That's right, I want TO gone after this season....I want Bill back and Owens out. My reasoning is this. Terrell Owens has been productive, no doubt about it. 9 TD's, 971 yards so far this season. But I don't care. Any #1 receiver could have those stats. My problem is Owens drops all these passes and has an excuse for every single one. He can't just accept it and move on, he has to make a case for himself. He has to say he is unhappy. Well I don't want him to stick around another season, long enough to poison our team. Jerry sold his soul to the devil on this one, and hopefully we can rectify the situation before it's too late. Owens is nothing more than a 10 million dollar a year decoy. Get him out at the end of the year and don't let him back in Dallas.

All this being said I want to finish the season with him and whatever happens, happens. If he is on the team and we go deep in the playoffs fine. But either way he is out at seasons end.

Thoughts?
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:01 PM    (permalink
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i think he's been well behaved. he's always had a problem with drops. he always opens up the field for others.

the worst part is he doesn't seem to be able to get separation, the only time he's open is when he's on shallow crossing routes. i thought teams figured him out when they started press coverage on him, but lately they've been playing away.

for $10m a year they should be able to get more. imo, i think they'll keep him next year, then when BP leaves let him go. if they let TO go, i can't see this team being nearly as explosive offensively and unless he thinks the defense is going to turn bearish they won't have a chance at a super bowl.
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:07 PM    (permalink
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I don't want to give away right now my theory for the Cowboys draft, but if Owens does indeed leave this year is heavy at the WR position and would be a great opportunity to grab a stud. I mean of course the offense would lose some explosiveness but I think the offense could stay productive.
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:19 PM    (permalink
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I was going to post on TO, but decided not to. Since he has been brought up though-

I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.

I don't really think we should cut him though. I just think we need to spread the ball around more, like last year.
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:39 PM    (permalink
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I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.
Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:50 PM    (permalink
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If Owens leaves a rookie is not the answer to replacing him. I would not feel comfortable with Crayton as the #2. We may draft a WR, but if Owens leaves a FA WR will be brought in.

I still am not sure if Parcells will draft a WR though, with two young promising WRs.
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:58 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by fryman
I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.
Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.
TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.
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Old 12-11-2006, 09:17 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by CTCowboysFan
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Originally Posted by fryman
I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.
Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.


TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.
If the "suicide/overdose" didn't distract the team, then I don't know what will.
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Old 12-11-2006, 10:20 PM    (permalink
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I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.
Same...
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Old 12-11-2006, 10:29 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by CTCowboysFan
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Originally Posted by fryman
I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.
Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.
TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.
Oh I know he drops passes, and I know he did before he got here. Yes on the statsheet he will always be a top WR because of all the passes thrown his way. He's bound to catch some.... Also TO may have heart but he is too emotional and he lets every little thing bother him which overshadows his "heart" and I'll bet Tony Romo has more heart than TO. At least Romo plays for the love of the game. TO has to feed his family :roll:
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Old 12-11-2006, 10:35 PM    (permalink
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I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.
Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.
TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.
Oh no I know he drops passes. And I know he did before he got here. Yes on the statsheet he will always be a top WR because of all the passes thrown his way. Also TO may have heart but he is too emotional, he lets every little thing bother him which overshadows his "heart" and I'll bet Tony Romo has more heart than TO. At least Romo plays for the love of the game. TO has to feed his family :roll:
Just to add to my arguement. Look at Tory Holt. He has had quite a few drops today. He is a "me" player. He is emotional. Yet he is a top WR in this league. I bet you wouldn't be asking for his head if he played for us. I just don't get where your coming from. The best WR's in the league are emotional. Thats what makes them the best. TO is under a magnifined glass so his mistakes are played out by the media more then any other player. Don't read into the media...otherwise it'll be a rollercoaster ride.
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Old 12-11-2006, 10:44 PM    (permalink
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Just to add to my arguement. Look at Tory Holt. He has had quite a few drops today. He is a "me" player. He is emotional. Yet he is a top WR in this league. I bet you wouldn't be asking for his head if he played for us. I just don't get where your coming from. The best WR's in the league are emotional. Thats what makes them the best. TO is under a magnifined glass so his mistakes are played out by the media more then any other player. Don't read into the media...otherwise it'll be a rollercoaster ride.
Yes Torry Holt has dropped passes tonight which is why the announcers are saying it's uncharacteristic for him, that's the difference. You expect TO to drop passes, from Holt you don't expect it. And Holt is emotional mostly in his head and with his play on the field, he isn't crazy emotional like TO. There aren't headlines of Holt sleeping in meetings, talking like he doesn't listen to the coach, or having any accidental overdoses. Where I am coming from is that TO is a time bomb, I know that sounds typical of the media but he is a basket case the sooner we realize this the better; and yes I would rather have Holt and would not be calling for his head because he wouldn't have a Sunday conversation talking about all of the flaws in the organization. Heart and stupidity are two different things. TO is under the magified glass which is why he should make an even bigger effort not to give the media a story but he gets enjoyment out of it. To take a quote for Bill, he sucks the media right in. It seems like to me you believe every word TO says when he tells people that everything he does is magnified and how much heart he has. Its all BS. I just hope we can get out this relationship before it gets to much worse. If he's back next year I will be very upset and will expect a lot of controversy. Year 1 you can usually get by with TO, year 2 your pushing it. Let's not push it.
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