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Old 09-23-2009, 04:14 PM    (permalink
scottyboy
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as GF1080 said, he got tripped and fell on his shoulder. He didn't have a "bum shoulder". It was obvious, the way he fell and landed on it. That's a lotta man to fall on that shoulder. I understand protecting your QB, but jesus flozell that was dirty as hell. Hold him or push him, but come on
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BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
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Old 09-23-2009, 04:16 PM    (permalink
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Justin Tuck talks a lot of smack so excuse me if I don't shed a tear for his injury. I'm sure if the roles were reversed Tuck would love to injure one of our most important players. Every good offensive line is at least a little dirty but are smart enough to do it discreetly so as not to get penalized and fined. It was stupid of Flo to do it as we were pretty much dominating them up front.
i must say, I kinda agree with you, but that was dirty as hell. come on, i know dirty plays happen all the time, but something like that? that instantly reminded me of what samuels did to kiwi last year. just blatently dirty and un-necessary
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Old 09-23-2009, 04:50 PM    (permalink
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i must say, I kinda agree with you, but that was dirty as hell. come on, i know dirty plays happen all the time, but something like that? that instantly reminded me of what samuels did to kiwi last year. just blatently dirty and un-necessary
We obviously don't care that it was a dirty play that hurt Tuck. We care about the dirty play that got called. If it didn't get called, we wouldn't care. If the tables were turned, and it happened to Ware, you wouldn't be pissed and we would be. That's football... and that's how fans react to football.
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Old 09-23-2009, 04:58 PM    (permalink
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We obviously don't care that it was a dirty play that hurt Tuck. We care about the dirty play that got called. If it didn't get called, we wouldn't care. If the tables were turned, and it happened to Ware, you wouldn't be pissed and we would be. That's football... and that's how fans react to football.
oh i know, but the most obvious ones are the worst. if you're discreetly dirty, that's fine, that's football, that's playing the trenches. but doing that, that obvious and dirty is stupid and a pretty dick move. geez flozell, injure him in a pile up or some crap, but not that.

and I would believe it or not, for a few reasons:

1. I actually really like D-Ware. Him and Marty-B are my favorite cowboys.

2. Osi and D-Ware are like best friends.

3. It would mean we had a dirty player and I'd lose a ton of respect for him and wouldn't want a guy with that image on our team. I probably wouldn't be as pissed, but I'd be pretty damn pissed if we hurt Ware with a dirty ass play like that.
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BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.
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Old 09-23-2009, 04:59 PM    (permalink
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Eh, i distinctly remember Tuck smashing Bollinger on his head last year, so put me on the list of people that don't give a **** about Tuck being injured. I'd even go so far as to say that it was a good exchange. We gave up a 30ish yard pass and got their best DL off the field for the rest of the game. I'd call that a win.
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Old 09-23-2009, 06:10 PM    (permalink
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I guess I'm in the minority here, but I don't think it's a dirty play. Illegal, yes. Penalty, yes. But I don't think it's anywhere in the neighborhood of chop blocks and illegal crack backs and things like that. I would have a hard time thinking he would get a fine had Tuck not been injured.

Also, if forgetting the fact that the Giants were actually called for a leg whip which is much more dangerous than that trip from Flozell.
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Old 09-23-2009, 07:05 PM    (permalink
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I guess I'm in the minority here, but I don't think it's a dirty play. Illegal, yes. Penalty, yes. But I don't think it's anywhere in the neighborhood of chop blocks and illegal crack backs and things like that. I would have a hard time thinking he would get a fine had Tuck not been injured.

Also, if forgetting the fact that the Giants were actually called for a leg whip which is much more dangerous than that trip from Flozell.
Yup yup. I agree. Flo didn't even really kick him as much as he just lifted his leg up. Not like he pulled back his leg first and actually karate kicked him.
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Old 09-23-2009, 08:29 PM    (permalink
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Isnt it funny that.....

Tony Romo has a terible game and people are ready to bench him or worse.
Peyton Manning in 2002 playoff game goes 14-31 137yrds 2int's QB rat 32.1
very next year 2003 playoff game he goes 23-47 1td 4int's QB rating 35.5
2006 he goes 15-30 170yrds 2int's QB rating 39.6. Granted it was the playoffs against good teams but I wonder if they were ready to get rid of him?

Isnt it funny that....

The "best organization in the NFL" just got dominated by the Jets and should be 0-2 if not for a fluke fumble. Most people talk about them "getting it" and what great drafters they are, but to me they look average at best.

Isnt it funny that...

We passed on a "franchise" RB in the first round to take a backup, and yet the "franchise" hardly see's the field. Wonder if maybe he's not as good as people thought or Pittsburgh might be too stupid in the way they use him. OR MAYBE just MAYBE we took the better back?

Isnt it funny that....

The great and all knowing Bill Parcell's led Dolphins are 0-2 ? They hold the ball for 45 min. at home and still lose. The offensive guru's of David Lee and Tony Sporano own the 29th ranked offense and 31st passing attack in the NFL. Anybody like Red a little more?

Isnt it funny that....

Jay Cutler and Matt Forte have more tackles than the guy everybody wanted us to draft? Jarron Gilbert, who many thought might start for us, has had zero impact for the Bears.

Just my version of "scattershooting" on a wed. afternoon.:D
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Old 09-23-2009, 09:40 PM    (permalink
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Originally Posted by pocketaces View Post
Isnt it funny that.....

Tony Romo has a terible game and people are ready to bench him or worse.
Peyton Manning in 2002 playoff game goes 14-31 137yrds 2int's QB rat 32.1
very next year 2003 playoff game he goes 23-47 1td 4int's QB rating 35.5
2006 he goes 15-30 170yrds 2int's QB rating 39.6. Granted it was the playoffs against good teams but I wonder if they were ready to get rid of him?

Isnt it funny that....

The "best organization in the NFL" just got dominated by the Jets and should be 0-2 if not for a fluke fumble. Most people talk about them "getting it" and what great drafters they are, but to me they look average at best.

Isnt it funny that...

We passed on a "franchise" RB in the first round to take a backup, and yet the "franchise" hardly see's the field. Wonder if maybe he's not as good as people thought or Pittsburgh might be too stupid in the way they use him. OR MAYBE just MAYBE we took the better back?

Isnt it funny that....

The great and all knowing Bill Parcell's led Dolphins are 0-2 ? They hold the ball for 45 min. at home and still lose. The offensive guru's of David Lee and Tony Sporano own the 29th ranked offense and 31st passing attack in the NFL. Anybody like Red a little more?

Isnt it funny that....

Jay Cutler and Matt Forte have more tackles than the guy everybody wanted us to draft? Jarron Gilbert, who many thought might start for us, has had zero impact for the Bears.

Just my version of "scattershooting" on a wed. afternoon.:D
If this makes you feel better than go ahead.

But a team who for three years continues to make the same mistakes over and over and over again -- it kind of bothers most reasoned folks.
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Old 09-23-2009, 09:42 PM    (permalink
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And please on Tuck, Mike Boley was make tackles out-of-bounds all day and on TWO ocassions the announcers said "kind fo close."

So Tuck got hurt, Flo got a penalty. So what. It was not a dirty play or intended to hurt him at all.
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Old 09-23-2009, 09:54 PM    (permalink
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pocketaces View Post
Isnt it funny that.....

Tony Romo has a terible game and people are ready to bench him or worse.
Peyton Manning in 2002 playoff game goes 14-31 137yrds 2int's QB rat 32.1
very next year 2003 playoff game he goes 23-47 1td 4int's QB rating 35.5
2006 he goes 15-30 170yrds 2int's QB rating 39.6. Granted it was the playoffs against good teams but I wonder if they were ready to get rid of him?

Isnt it funny that....

The "best organization in the NFL" just got dominated by the Jets and should be 0-2 if not for a fluke fumble. Most people talk about them "getting it" and what great drafters they are, but to me they look average at best.

Isnt it funny that...

We passed on a "franchise" RB in the first round to take a backup, and yet the "franchise" hardly see's the field. Wonder if maybe he's not as good as people thought or Pittsburgh might be too stupid in the way they use him. OR MAYBE just MAYBE we took the better back?

Isnt it funny that....

The great and all knowing Bill Parcell's led Dolphins are 0-2 ? They hold the ball for 45 min. at home and still lose. The offensive guru's of David Lee and Tony Sporano own the 29th ranked offense and 31st passing attack in the NFL. Anybody like Red a little more?

Isnt it funny that....

Jay Cutler and Matt Forte have more tackles than the guy everybody wanted us to draft? Jarron Gilbert, who many thought might start for us, has had zero impact for the Bears.

Just my version of "scattershooting" on a wed. afternoon.:D
It was funny until you got to the Jarron Gilbert part. lol. Rather have him than Robert Brewster and Brandon Williams. Marcus Spears sucks. Jason Hatcher sucks. Where's Stephen Bowen? I thought he was supposed to break out according to MOTH.

Fact that he doesn't do anything for the Bears is irrelevant at this point.
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Old 09-23-2009, 10:01 PM    (permalink
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Osi didn't do **** to Flo. Flo owned him sadly.
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Old 09-23-2009, 10:07 PM    (permalink
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Anyone else think Roy needed to be more involved? It's like Romo gave up to him after that bomb he didn't come up with. Garrett needs to recognize that. The 1 catch he did make, he made Corey Webster look like yesterday's trash.
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Old 09-23-2009, 10:30 PM    (permalink
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Anyone else think Roy needed to be more involved? It's like Romo gave up to him after that bomb he didn't come up with. Garrett needs to recognize that. The 1 catch he did make, he made Corey Webster look like yesterday's trash.
Who knows? The way Romo was throwing, half the time I thought he was throwing it to me.:p Everybody needs to be more involved. A 60% completion rate would be a good start.
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Old 09-24-2009, 12:47 AM    (permalink
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Yes, Roy needs to be more involved, but to be honest, Romo needs to step the **** up and play better. I'm not even that mad at his mis-reads, but many times he had amazing pass protection and he threw some horrible passes.

I agree though, that if we're gonna be dropping back that much, we should at least get Williams a little more involved. Gotta credit Corey Webster for doing a good job on him though, he even though he did pwn him in that one catch he had.
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Old 09-24-2009, 03:09 AM    (permalink
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We must use Roy the way we used TO... slant routes and let him run after the catch..
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Old 09-24-2009, 11:04 AM    (permalink
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It was funny until you got to the Jarron Gilbert part. lol. Rather have him than Robert Brewster and Brandon Williams. Marcus Spears sucks. Jason Hatcher sucks. Where's Stephen Bowen? I thought he was supposed to break out according to MOTH.

Fact that he doesn't do anything for the Bears is irrelevant at this point.
I'm not giving up on those guys. Certainly, we won't get anything out of Brewster this year, but we may still get something out of Williams.
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Old 09-24-2009, 11:26 AM    (permalink
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It was funny until you got to the Jarron Gilbert part. lol. Rather have him than Robert Brewster and Brandon Williams. Marcus Spears sucks. Jason Hatcher sucks.
I agree D, Gilbert would have been the best fit in Dallas, not Chicago. He can't crack the starting d-line there, while in Dallas he was filling a clear need with Canty gone to NY & the sucking from Spears & Hatcher.

Gilbert was the national leader in Div. 1 last season in TFLs, is a premier pass rusher, & is rotting on the vine on the Bears bench.
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Old 09-24-2009, 11:40 AM    (permalink
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I agree D, Gilbert would have been the best fit in Dallas, not Chicago. He can't crack the starting d-line there, while in Dallas he was filling a clear need with Canty gone to NY & the sucking from Spears & Hatcher.

Gilbert was the national leader in Div. 1 last season in TFLs, is a premier pass rusher, & is rotting on the vine on the Bears bench.
Guys, he may turn out to be a good player, but to say he's a "premiere pass rusher" is stretching it a bit.
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Old 09-24-2009, 01:11 PM    (permalink
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I agree D, Gilbert would have been the best fit in Dallas, not Chicago. He can't crack the starting d-line there, while in Dallas he was filling a clear need with Canty gone to NY & the sucking from Spears & Hatcher.

Gilbert was the national leader in Div. 1 last season in TFLs, is a premier pass rusher, & is rotting on the vine on the Bears bench.
But didn't Gilbert play in a 4-3 during college? That would seem to be an easier transition than learning a 3-4. Not saying that he couldn't beast it up here, but he'd have to deal with learning the intricacies of playing outside in a different scheme in addition to learning the speed of the game.
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Old 09-24-2009, 01:44 PM    (permalink
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But didn't Gilbert play in a 4-3 during college? That would seem to be an easier transition than learning a 3-4. Not saying that he couldn't beast it up here, but he'd have to deal with learning the intricacies of playing outside in a different scheme in addition to learning the speed of the game.
They are moving him to the inside in Chicago. ...and in Phillips' 34, he would've been perfectly fine because it's still a 1 gap scheme. The Parcells and Lebeau schemes are 2 gap, so that's a bigger transition.
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Old 09-24-2009, 01:45 PM    (permalink
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Guys, he may turn out to be a good player, but to say he's a "premiere pass rusher" is stretching it a bit.
I think he was referring to Gilbert as an elite pass rusher "in college". ...which he was.
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Old 09-24-2009, 02:00 PM    (permalink
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I think he was referring to Gilbert as an elite pass rusher "in college". ...which he was.
Thanx, that's all I was reffing here, his college experience at SJSU, that's all anyone can measure a rookie with.

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They are moving him to the inside in Chicago. ...and in Phillips' 34, he would've been perfectly fine because it's still a 1 gap scheme. The Parcells and Lebeau schemes are 2 gap, so that's a bigger transition.
I interviewed Gilbert at the SJSU Pro Day. He played outside in college as a designated pass rusher on 3rd & long downs, then was moved inside as a 4-3 DT. The combo of the 2 led to his accumulated highest TFL total in Div. 1.

He has the size to be a 4-3 2-gapper DT, & the quick 1st step to be a 5 technique DE, which is where he thought he would be best in the NFL. I hope he gets his chance with the Chicago d-line where they're looking for Mark Anderson to return to his league-leading sack total form he posted as a rookie & for Tommie Harris to fully recover from his leg injury that kept him out of their SB. IDK his present status, Bears fans help us out, is he a situational DE now?

Dallas had an overt interest in him as an early Day 2 pick, then Chicago snatched him up 1 pick before the Cowboys selection. For this season, he's the DE who could've replaced Canty who got away.
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Old 09-24-2009, 02:17 PM    (permalink
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Thanx, that's all I was reffing here, his college experience at SJSU, that's all anyone can measure a rookie with.



I interviewed Gilbert at the SJSU Pro Day. He played outside in college as a designated pass rusher on 3rd & long downs, then was moved inside as a 4-3 DT. The combo of the 2 led to his accumulated highest TFL total in Div. 1.

He has the size to be a 4-3 2-gapper DT, & the quick 1st step to be a 5 technique DE, which is where he thought he would be best in the NFL. I hope he gets his chance with the Chicago d-line where they're looking for Mark Anderson to return to his league-leading sack total form he posted as a rookie & for Tommie Harris to fully recover from his leg injury that kept him out of their SB. IDK his present status, Bears fans help us out, is he a situational DE now?

Dallas had an overt interest in him as an early Day 2 pick, then Chicago snatched him up 1 pick before the Cowboys selection. For this season, he's the DE who could've replaced Canty who got away.
You interviewed him? Who ARE you? haha.

I really think he was going to be our pick even though Dallas would deny it after the fact that they wanted Williams.

Anyhow... We could've had Gilbert AND Williams if we didn't do that Buffalo trade. That would've made for a good draft. Too cute Jerry! Too cute!
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Old 09-24-2009, 04:31 PM    (permalink
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D-Unit is right about not freaking out just yet, the team is 1-1after 2 tough games.

But don't underestimate what a wakeup call Sunday night's game was for Dallas. They were at home & clearly had the advantage of comparative injuries. That loss emphasized a number of problem areas that need immediate attn. from the coaching staff, but ther were bright spots too, like the defensee holding NY to FGs vs TDs when they had them in the red zone & reinforced the Giants rep as a team with red zone scoring issues. And the o-line minimized the sacks allowed & opened huge holes you could drive a bus through for Barber & the RBs.

It's official -- the Giants just put Kenny Phillips on IR, done for the yr. Add the Tuck injury & the next NY opponents will have to tip their hats to Dallas for depleting their active roster. Just like the 9ers will issue a big old Thank You to Dallas if the Cowboys pummel Delhomme & the Panthers next Monday night since they own Carolina's #1 pick in 2010
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