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Old 10-13-2009, 01:31 PM    (permalink
D-Unit
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I loved Bill Parcells and what he did for us. I defended Parcells like no other in my debates with kwhy. I will respect him forever for what he did here.

However, I'm ok with his departure. Why? Because he did here all that he could. We were at the point that we hit the plateau. Had we had won a playoff game, perhaps you could say that we were still on the incline under his reign. But we didn't. He's a fixer upper, but he's not a finisher. Him leaving on his own despite Jerry wanting him back was just the way Parcells wanted it. Plus, he was too tired of coaching. It had become a task beneath him. He wasn't motivated to do it like he was when he was younger. He was more interested in managing player personnel. He wanted GM responsibilities.

Sparano was a great OL coach, and he looks like a good HC too. But we needed someone who could continue to develop our 3-4 defense and Sparano didn't fit that bill. Secondly, I'm not a fan of the wildcat offense and would be pretty pissed today if that's would our offense looked like. So I'm not missing him at all.
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Old 10-13-2009, 01:36 PM    (permalink
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Parcells wouldve finished what he started if age wasn't a factor. He was just too old to coach anymore. His track record speaks for itself. I think the 3 things that held him back were age, not finding his qb until it was too late, and being forced to make Roy Williams work.

I fell in love with the wild cat yesterday. Its not just a gimic, it works. I'll probably make a thread on it tomorrow if i have some free time. Yesterday's game opened my eyes on how innovative and exciting that offense is.

You gotta love Parcells. Everyone is trying to put more and more owness on the passing game and the qb, and BP, Sparano and Henning found an innovative way to make the qb an afterthought.

Just wait until they get Pat White up to speed. With all the formations of the wildcat, plus a qb who can throw out of it, with the speed of Ginn plus the screen play ability of the TEs and WRs out of the formation, this is a very exciting offense.

I love what he did with Miami. First he innovated the 3-4, now he's innovating the run game. Gotta love BP.
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Old 10-13-2009, 02:01 PM    (permalink
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PS. Sadly you believe Jerrah + Wade >>>>>>> Parcells + Sparano.

Enjoy the sun in Sardinia. Ever been to Napolean's castle-in-exile?
And can you tell me when I said, exaclty, that? I said that Parcells days in Dallas were over and we needed a change.

P.S.: Napoleon was exiled to Elba which has nothing to do with Sardinia.
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Old 10-13-2009, 02:02 PM    (permalink
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Yes, Al Davis is lots more accomplished as a GM (Football Man) than Jones.

Al, today, is nuts but folks forget he was not always the case.

Memories are short but history was not invented yesterday.

And yes, Al has gone less time than Jerrah in winning a playoff game and going to the SB.
How has Al done more than Jerry? Both have 3 Super Bowls, and Jerry has been owner of the Cowboys for a much shorter time. You can say that he's gone shorter than winning a playoff game, but how good has the Raiders been since that time period? At least Jerry has put together a competitive enough team to make the playoffs 5 times since then while the Raiders are consistently picking in the top 10 of the draft.
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Old 10-13-2009, 04:18 PM    (permalink
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Okay Rob-I have defended you in the past. But saying Al Davis is a better football guy than Jerry? You are just being a shock jock now. I wont defend Jerry, but Al is the worst in the league! Only Matt Millen (WHo is not in football anymore) has been worse in the last few years, off the top of my head. Prove my point? I don't have to prove anything. I will just say this... Darius Heyward Bey JaMarcus Russell Whoever the heck it was they drafted in the second round this year The guy has gone completely nuts.
Anyone who thinks Jerry Jones has the history or track record of AL Davis in the football world as a FOOTBALL MAN are simply ignorant. You have no idea what you are talking about. You act as if history was invented yesterday.

Like telling me Riddick Boew is a better boxer than Ali -- yeah maybe right now -- but please do not compare historical importance or accomplishments.

This is an asinine conversation only a Cowboys fan would engage in all in a sily effort to defend their Team.

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Old 10-13-2009, 04:26 PM    (permalink
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I loved Bill Parcells and what he did for us. I defended Parcells like no other in my debates with kwhy. I will respect him forever for what he did here.

However, I'm ok with his departure. Why? Because he did here all that he could. We were at the point that we hit the plateau. Had we had won a playoff game, perhaps you could say that we were still on the incline under his reign. But we didn't. He's a fixer upper, but he's not a finisher. Him leaving on his own despite Jerry wanting him back was just the way Parcells wanted it. Plus, he was too tired of coaching. It had become a task beneath him. He wasn't motivated to do it like he was when he was younger. He was more interested in managing player personnel. He wanted GM responsibilities.

Sparano was a great OL coach, and he looks like a good HC too. But we needed someone who could continue to develop our 3-4 defense and Sparano didn't fit that bill. Secondly, I'm not a fan of the wildcat offense and would be pretty pissed today if that's would our offense looked like. So I'm not missing him at all.
So you are telling me Sparano as a Head Coach could not contintue developing the Dallas 3-4?

That makes no sense.

What about having kept Sparano to continue the development of the Offense which regressed? Keeping him as the OC when Parcells left??

What about having hired or promoted a young guy to be 3-4 DC instead of hiring meatball and Stewart?

Again, this line of reasoning makes no sense. As if Meatball and Turner were the only options???? Maybe in Jerrah's limited brain.

Let us be REAL, Sparano was treated like a Piece of Crap b/c Parcells found him and groomed him and Jerrah the Moron did not.

Jerrah could, however, claim Garrett was his creation by picking an unaccomplished coach from obscurity. Garrett did not even coach a decent QB or develop one. He was a great clip board carrier for Aikman though!!!!!!

The fact Jerrah picked Garrett over Sparano and the results speak for themselves about Jerrah Botox Idiot Jones.

Jerrah knows NOTHING ABOUT FOOTBALL. He is an ignorant GM who would have lost his job 15 years ago for the mess he created.

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Old 10-13-2009, 04:28 PM    (permalink
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Well, I think we've seen enough from this version of the Dallas Cowboys to safely say that they are not a good team. Its pretty amazing to look back and see that the obvious move after the 44-6 Philly debalce--FIRE WADE PHILLIPS--was completely and abjectly ignored and glossed over, all because business man Jerry wanted to be able to sell a stable product instead of make his team the best it could be.

This team is in desperate need of passion, fire and discipline. Its a perfect situation for a Bill Cowher or John Gruden type to come in and go gangbusters with. Wade was a bad hire, the fly in the ointment during a magical 2007 season that ultimately was derailed by a few bonehead plays, was a bad decision to bring back after a horrid 2008 season, and is currently a bad head coach. At no point in time have I been happy to have had him here. Aside from the Campo years and possibly the Chan Gailey hire, Wade Phillips has to go down and Jerry's worst mistake as GM of the Dallas Cowboys.
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Old 10-13-2009, 04:30 PM    (permalink
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I'm not an NFL historian, but what exactly has Al done? I'm sure he's done stuff. He's been in this business a long time. But that's as much as I know. I'm curious to know what kind of football genius he used to be. Can someone educate me?
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Old 10-13-2009, 04:41 PM    (permalink
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I'm not an NFL historian, but what exactly has Al done? I'm sure he's done stuff. He's been in this business a long time. But that's as much as I know. I'm curious to know what kind of football genius he used to be. Can someone educate me?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Davis
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Old 10-13-2009, 06:06 PM    (permalink
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What personally gives you positive memories of him and what he did for the league?
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Old 10-13-2009, 06:14 PM    (permalink
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So you are telling me Sparano as a Head Coach could not contintue developing the Dallas 3-4?

That makes no sense.

What about having kept Sparano to continue the development of the Offense which regressed? Keeping him as the OC when Parcells left??

What about having hired or promoted a young guy to be 3-4 DC instead of hiring meatball and Stewart?

Again, this line of reasoning makes no sense. As if Meatball and Turner were the only options???? Maybe in Jerrah's limited brain.

Let us be REAL, Sparano was treated like a Piece of Crap b/c Parcells found him and groomed him and Jerrah the Moron did not.

Jerrah could, however, claim Garrett was his creation by picking an unaccomplished coach from obscurity. Garrett did not even coach a decent QB or develop one. He was a great clip board carrier for Aikman though!!!!!!

The fact Jerrah picked Garrett over Sparano and the results speak for themselves about Jerrah Botox Idiot Jones.

Jerrah knows NOTHING ABOUT FOOTBALL. He is an ignorant GM who would have lost his job 15 years ago for the mess he created.
Actually, yeah... I don't think Sparano could've run the 3-4 on his own. He would've had to find someone with 3-4 experience as his DC. I dunno who out there at the time would've been his DC for him. Do you?

I would've been fine with keeping him as OC. Let's not have selective memory here. Jerry did not treat Sparano as crap. He allowed all of Parcells' other coaches to leave, but NOT Sparano. He coveted Sparano. He just didn't want an inexperienced HC. Same reason was given as to why he didn't take Singletary and Garrett as HCs. Singletary, Garrett and Sparano were all interviewed.

You seem to think Sparano was willing to take on the job as OC. Sparano was looking for a HC gig. Let's be honest.

And let's be reeeal honest. Wade's defense in San Diego was sick. One of the sickest Ds in the league. Jerry saw that and wanted it. I don't blame him for that.

Unfortunately we learned the hard way that Wade is nothing more than a good DC.
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Old 10-13-2009, 07:56 PM    (permalink
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Actually, yeah... I don't think Sparano could've run the 3-4 on his own. He would've had to find someone with 3-4 experience as his DC. I dunno who out there at the time would've been his DC for him. Do you?
Jerry got a woodie for Red and almost made him HC. It was like his first interview. But then Jerrah got cold feet and thought to himself .... I guess I need some grey hair and some DC experience and there was Meatball coming off a great year for him personally.

But to name two guys .... Manusky and Singletary could have been DC with Sparano as HC. How about T. Bowles.

But again, picking Sparano was Jerry admitting he wanted to continue with what Parcells built and Jerry wanted no part of that. Jerry wanted HIS GUYS that HE PICKED.

You have the results.

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I would've been fine with keeping him as OC. Let's not have selective memory here. Jerry did not treat Sparano as crap. He allowed all of Parcells' other coaches to leave, but NOT Sparano. He coveted Sparano.
If Jerry Jones coveted Sparano he would have made Sparano OC or HC and certainly NOT made Red OC / Coach in Waiting. That seems like sheer nonsense to say.

Sparano was kept by Jerry b/c a) he needed some continuity on the O and Garrett had yet to manage one soul his entire life -- Sparano became JG beeyotch and was the only reason JG's was "hot" after 2007 and b) I believe they were still under contract by Jerrah and he would have had to pay them.

But frankly, JG can't lick Sparano' nutz without saying thank you. Sparano can coach and can play call. JG is just a Princeton guy.

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He just didn't want an inexperienced HC.
So instead he picked a loser HC and two wet-behind-the-ear Coordinators. Great.

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Same reason was given as to why he didn't take Singletary and Garrett as HCs. Singletary, Garrett and Sparano were all interviewed.
And interestingly enough Sparano was the only one DEMOTED.

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You seem to think Sparano was willing to take on the job as OC.
Um yeah, he would have taken it in a heart beat with Meatball being the HC and DC.

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Sparano was looking for a HC gig. Let's be honest.
Not sure how that effects the discussion since ALL Coordinators want to be promoted. All Position coaches want to be Coordinators.

Sparano wanted to be HC sure. I want to be Bill Gates. What does that have to do with Jerry Jones muffing a critical search for management talent???

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And let's be reeeal honest. Wade's defense in San Diego was sick. One of the sickest Ds in the league. Jerry saw that and wanted it. I don't blame him for that.
Wade's D's also always collapsed in the playoffs and in big games.

Look at how 2007 ended. How 2008 ended. How we have lost games with poor D play in the final 2 minutes of Halves.

Wade is 100% responsible.

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Old 10-13-2009, 08:24 PM    (permalink
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Jerry got a woodie for Red and almost made him HC. It was like his first interview. But then Jerrah got cold feet and thought to himself .... I guess I need some grey hair and some DC experience and there was Meatball coming off a great year for him personally.

But to name two guys .... Manusky and Singletary could have been DC with Sparano as HC. How about T. Bowles.

But again, picking Sparano was Jerry admitting he wanted to continue with what Parcells built and Jerry wanted no part of that. Jerry wanted HIS GUYS that HE PICKED.

You have the results.



If Jerry Jones coveted Sparano he would have made Sparano OC or HC and certainly NOT made Red OC / Coach in Waiting. That seems like sheer nonsense to say.

Sparano was kept by Jerry b/c a) he needed some continuity on the O and Garrett had yet to manage one soul his entire life -- Sparano became JG beeyotch and was the only reason JG's was "hot" after 2007 and b) I believe they were still under contract by Jerrah and he would have had to pay them.

But frankly, JG can't lick Sparano' nutz without saying thank you. Sparano can coach and can play call. JG is just a Princeton guy.



So instead he picked a loser HC and two wet-behind-the-ear Coordinators. Great.



And interestingly enough Sparano was the only one DEMOTED.



Um yeah, he would have taken it in a heart beat with Meatball being the HC and DC.



Not sure how that effects the discussion since ALL Coordinators want to be promoted. All Position coaches want to be Coordinators.

Sparano wanted to be HC sure. I want to be Bill Gates. What does that have to do with Jerry Jones muffing a critical search for management talent???



Wade's D's also always collapsed in the playoffs and in big games.

Look at how 2007 ended. How 2008 ended. How we have lost games with poor D play in the final 2 minutes of Halves.

Wade is 100% responsible.
I'm not saying Wade isn't the problem. Because he is, as the HC. He is better suited for DC. As a HC, he just sucks. He doesn't have the character.

Singletary wouldn't be DC with Sparano as HC. That's just out of the blue. Another one of your crazy make believe assumptions. What makes you say Manusky would've followed Sparano too? Weird. There's a reason why Manusky is DC for Singletary. He's tied more closely to Mike than Tony. Todd Bowles as DC... now that thought actually churns my bowles. lol. Yuck.

Sparano was most respected. He certainly was not DEMOTED. He became Assistant HC to Wade. I bet if you asked Sparano himself, that he would be honestly appreciative to Jerry. Jerry allowed him to groom responsibilities of being a HC.

Now if you wanna say that Sparano was never going to be the HC of the Dallas Cowboys, I'd agree. I don't think Jerry would've handed him those reigns without experience first. ...and I don't fault Jerry for that either.

I don't have a problem with you hating Jerry for the hire. The move hasn't been successful so Jerry deserves the blame. I was a huge advocate for Singletary and thought Jerry messed up big time with that. But your immaturity shows whenever you start your name calling.. "Meatball", "Tony Turnover", etc etc.

However, you are a new arrival with this Wade hate. I don't recall you talking about it at the time of the hire, or after the 12-4 season or after leading the league in sacks last year. MANY MANY MANY Cowboys fans have hated Wade for a long time, so there's no sense in trying to convince us that you've been on some island with that thought.
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Old 10-13-2009, 08:51 PM    (permalink
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Looks like we signed Allen Rossum. Good pickup, a veteran return man, had a nice year last season, and a local guy who graduated from Skyline High School the greatest HS in the state of Texas :) .
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Old 10-13-2009, 08:57 PM    (permalink
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Well, I think we've seen enough from this version of the Dallas Cowboys to safely say that they are not a good team. Its pretty amazing to look back and see that the obvious move after the 44-6 Philly debalce--FIRE WADE PHILLIPS--was completely and abjectly ignored and glossed over, all because business man Jerry wanted to be able to sell a stable product instead of make his team the best it could be.

This team is in desperate need of passion, fire and discipline. Its a perfect situation for a Bill Cowher or John Gruden type to come in and go gangbusters with. Wade was a bad hire, the fly in the ointment during a magical 2007 season that ultimately was derailed by a few bonehead plays, was a bad decision to bring back after a horrid 2008 season, and is currently a bad head coach. At no point in time have I been happy to have had him here. Aside from the Campo years and possibly the Chan Gailey hire, Wade Phillips has to go down and Jerry's worst mistake as GM of the Dallas Cowboys.
I think we've seen enough to know that its definitely not a SB caliber team. Probably not even a team that will go deep in the playoffs.

But I think the division, and a possible playoff birth are still very possible. It depends on Romo quite honestly. Even with Miles heralded performance, the concern I would have is how Romo just zones in on 1 guy and doesn't make his reads.

Ive been a big Romo supporter, but Im starting to think he's not the qb I thought he was.

He's still a good qb in my eyes though.

As for Austin himself, I wouldn't put too much weight on his performance. Trust me, I saw the Giants and Eagles play the Chiefs. They have a terrible defense. You can whatever you want to them. Steve Smith caught 10 passes on them and they never adjusted to him. Their DC is atrocious. No adjustments at all.
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Old 10-14-2009, 12:54 AM    (permalink
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lol. Parcells and Miami are what, 2-3 this year? Yeah, that is really acceptable for the Cowboys.
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Old 10-14-2009, 01:01 AM    (permalink
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lol. Parcells and Miami are what, 2-3 this year?
We have one more win, but almost anyone would agree that we have the superior talent. Also last season, they did something we did not. Went to a playoff game. So what part of that would be unacceptable to you?
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Old 10-14-2009, 01:05 AM    (permalink
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However, you are a new arrival with this Wade hate. I don't recall you talking about it at the time of the hire, or after the 12-4 season or after leading the league in sacks last year. MANY MANY MANY Cowboys fans have hated Wade for a long time, so there's no sense in trying to convince us that you've been on some island with that thought.
Was there a post I missed or is this a straw man?
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Old 10-14-2009, 02:28 AM    (permalink
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Was there a post I missed or is this a straw man?
No comment.
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Old 10-14-2009, 02:29 AM    (permalink
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Looks like we signed Allen Rossum. Good pickup, a veteran return man, had a nice year last season, and a local guy who graduated from Skyline High School the greatest HS in the state of Texas :) .
I'm excited about that. Anyone has to be better than Crayton on Punt Returns and with Austin emerging in the offense and Felix always hurt, Rossum has a chance to do what he does best. Return kicks.
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Old 10-14-2009, 02:32 AM    (permalink
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We have one more win, but almost anyone would agree that we have the superior talent. Also last season, they did something we did not. Went to a playoff game. So what part of that would be unacceptable to you?
Wow. Never expected you to ever defend Parcells. That's like a 180 from back in the day. So you're ok with the 3-4 now? Or do you still prefer the 4-3?
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Old 10-14-2009, 02:35 AM    (permalink
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lol. Parcells and Miami are what, 2-3 this year? Yeah, that is really acceptable for the Cowboys.
Parcells is having his patented 2nd year slump. He's still turned the team around from where it was when he first got there. But I'm anxious to see how this story plays out. Now that he's the GM, I don't see him running away this time... like he did when he was HC. I want to see if he can win a SB with the Fins and finally finish up a successful rebuilding project.
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Old 10-14-2009, 03:39 AM    (permalink
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What personally gives you positive memories of him and what he did for the league?
I'm still waiting for an answer to this.
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Old 10-14-2009, 07:57 AM    (permalink
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Amazing how many false strawmen are created to justify silly opinions or how people "move the goal post" in order to make their point which has nothing to do with the main point.

Al Davis subject....

Jerry Jones is not even close to Davis in accomplishment relating to putting product on the field. To argue it is a sign of ignorance.

Jerry Jones is a football marketing guy and very good at. He also spends money which is great as a fan.

Al Davis helped forge the AFL and his tenacity helped forge the merger. AL also was the guy who built (as GM) the great Raiders teams from the late 60s to the 80s. That is over 20 years of excellence....

Tony Sparano .....

So Jerry was not going to give the keys to the kingdom to a newbie coach so Sparano was OUT ..... but he did almost give the job to Garrett, denied Sparano the OC job, hired a weak HC, and put Garrett as Sparano's boss.

Hell of a way to reward an employee who performs. Nice.

If they did this to you at Starbucks you'd starting swapping the Decaf with Caf, French Vanilla with Hazlenut, and Hal/Half with Skim.

Knowing this generation, the anger and rage would be palpable ... but since Jerrah did it to Sparano, no problem.

On Miami ....

What does their record have to do with ours?

Again, intelligent people know Miami has a talent hole at WR and DB. Their OLB are OLD. The team is starting year 2 of rebuilding. Dallas is in year 7.

What excuse do Dallas fans have to explain Miami recent success and progress compared to our regression to mediocrity? And we have 13 PROBOWLERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Not saying Miami is great, but it is highlight to show just how bad Jones and Company really are .... and they are bad.
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Old 10-14-2009, 07:58 AM    (permalink
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I'm still waiting for an answer to this.
Sadly even if I FEDEX it to you, you would not get it.
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